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Should I Deload my squats ?
Replies
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Right so from what I've read, I have a few things to try out. Box squats/goblet squats, adding more weight to see how that goes, using my glutes when going to the top and to go a bit shallower. I can't try the added weight for the time being, I only purchased a barbell to try and get good form on a few different exercises before upping the weight.0
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blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
You should probably go to a sports store and load up with some weight then. 2x25, 2x25, 2x10 2x5 and 2x2.5 shouldn't be too expensive and will give you a good start with 220# and you get another 2x45 as you need it and that should keep you going for awhile. Although it depends on your goals, 45# is really just spinning your wheels and you might as well do KB or DB goblet squats or even just bodyweight squats.2 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
You should probably go to a sports store and load up with some weight then. 2x25, 2x25, 2x10 2x5 and 2x2.5 shouldn't be too expensive and will give you a good start with 220# and you get another 2x45 as you need it and that should keep you going for awhile. Although it depends on your goals, 45# is really just spinning your wheels and you might as well do KB or DB goblet squats or even just bodyweight squats.
I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.0 -
blopmiyers wrote: »using my glutes when going to the top
use your glutes when going down too. turn them into the pouch on a slingshot and kind of sit down into them. that way they'll catch you at the bottom before your skeletal geometry does, and they'll already be ready to turn you around and bring you back up. only trying to engage them when you're already down there is not the best path.
it goes against everything i've ever read, but doing a few sets of front squats while i'm warming up seems to help me a lot with the glute-centric idea.
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blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
You should probably go to a sports store and load up with some weight then. 2x25, 2x25, 2x10 2x5 and 2x2.5 shouldn't be too expensive and will give you a good start with 220# and you get another 2x45 as you need it and that should keep you going for awhile. Although it depends on your goals, 45# is really just spinning your wheels and you might as well do KB or DB goblet squats or even just bodyweight squats.
I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.
That's a good plan, best of luck and enjoy the lifting! Just be careful because it's really addictive!
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canadianlbs wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »using my glutes when going to the top
use your glutes when going down too. turn them into the pouch on a slingshot and kind of sit down into them. that way they'll catch you at the bottom before your skeletal geometry does, and they'll already be ready to turn you around and bring you back up. only trying to engage them when you're already down there is not the best path.
it goes against everything i've ever read, but doing a few sets of front squats while i'm warming up seems to help me a lot with the glute-centric idea.
One point to add, for those with "lazy glutes" doing exercises like glute raise and glute bridges can really help you activate them. @Willbenchforcupcakes had this issue as well and did a lot of assistance exercises to get her glutes to activate. This might be something that the OP has to do as well.1 -
X band walks pre squatting also help0
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Wheelhouse15 wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »Here's a side angle view. Unfortunately I can't go any higher with the camera
https://youtu.be/4VaElyW2VkY
This is an interesting one to me.
At first glance I think there's a couple of things I'd attempt here.
I'd like to see you try contracting your glutes at the top of the squat prior to descending. For some people this tends to slow down the eccentric and maintain a bit more tightness.
I'd like to see you squat a bit shallower. When you get to the very bottom of the squat, which is quite deep, you're getting some lumbar rounding and additionally you also mention pain at the bottom of the squat. It's possible that simply cutting it short will alleviate that.
I'm not suggesting you start squatting above parallel -- my opinion is that you can cut a few inches of depth and still break parallel and possibly improve your overall positioning.
Your squat is decent until you bottom out and that's where it seems to get wonky.
You could also stand to improve upper back tightness but I'd go with the above stuff first IMO.
Never thought I'd see a trainer say that.
when you get to much butt wink- you lose strength and weird things start happening.
I can squat all the way down under reasonable loads- but under my heaviest it causes me to truly fail a squat- my "powerlifting" squat is much prettier and more technically correct than my "oly" squat- for this reason exactly.
I can't even see the video- but from the hip impinging issues OP mentioned- I share those- and the above things have been very helpful to my fix.
(I also squeeze at the top prior to descent to iron out hip imbalances)
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blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
you have a bar bell and no plates?- time for a new gym- you can make progress without a bar bell for sure- but if you want to learn to squat big- you need a bar and plates.
or you have fix weights? (I can't see the video) on a bar?
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blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
you have a bar bell and no plates?- time for a new gym- you can make progress without a bar bell for sure- but if you want to learn to squat big- you need a bar and plates.
or you have fix weights? (I can't see the video) on a bar?
I'm slowly investing in a home gym, I've got myself a press bench, a power rack and a barbell. Like mentioned before I didn't want to get plates right away, I wanted to make sure my form was correct on a few exercises before adding weight. Also, the fact that my basement is messy doesn't help2 -
One thing that comes to mind is the recent thread posted here about doing an unweighted "Third World Squat." The lesson was that many people who had a problem doing a back squat also could not do a Third World Squat but, after they learned how to do it, they were better able to do a back squat.
So, you might want to give that a try. I'd post a link to the thread but I can't do that from my phone. If someone else doesn't post the link, I'll do it later from my desktop.
OP: Just a followup to my earlier post. Here's a link to the thread on doing Deep Body aka Third World Squats to help improve your back squat and a link to a T-Nation article on the same topic:
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10477707/deep-body-squat-a-k-a-third-world-squat-if-you-cannot-squat-or-want-to-get-proper-squat-form
https://www.t-nation.com/training/third-world-squat
Doing these can help improve your balance and hip/leg strength/flexibility which can aid in improving your back squat.
Another idea would be to do box squats, which will limit the depth of your squat and can assist in the development of strength/explosiveness from the bottom of the squat. If you do box squats, however, it is important to NOT sit on the box (just touch and go) and to NOT relax your muscles when you touch the box, in order to avoid the risk of spinal compression and injury.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/back-squats-vs-box-squats
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blopmiyers wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Lowering the weight is not technically a deload since a deload is a working rest using a much lower weight than you normally work with to give yourself a rest for a week or two. I think goblet squats or DB squats are going to be the way to go until you can adapt to the movement pattern.
A few questions though, as an 18 year old male your squats, even starting, should be far higher than the empty bar so is there some medical issue? How long have you been trying to squat? Have you been seeking help? When I was 16 I was a 100 pounds and started squatting at around 95 pounds the first week so something seems way off here.
Also, are you really 18? If you are under age then I suggest you find another site as this is not a sight for minors.
I'll be turning 19 in a few weeks. I've been "attempting" to squat for 3 months now making changes and trying out different stretches, I never really tried with more weight as I don't have any plates to put on the bar.
you have a bar bell and no plates?- time for a new gym- you can make progress without a bar bell for sure- but if you want to learn to squat big- you need a bar and plates.
or you have fix weights? (I can't see the video) on a bar?
I'm slowly investing in a home gym, I've got myself a press bench, a power rack and a barbell. Like mentioned before I didn't want to get plates right away, I wanted to make sure my form was correct on a few exercises before adding weight. Also, the fact that my basement is messy doesn't help
yeah time to go scavenge craigslist for 25's, 35's and 45's!!!1 -
One thing that comes to mind is the recent thread posted here about doing an unweighted "Third World Squat." The lesson was that many people who had a problem doing a back squat also could not do a Third World Squat but, after they learned how to do it, they were better able to do a back squat.
So, you might want to give that a try. I'd post a link to the thread but I can't do that from my phone. If someone else doesn't post the link, I'll do it later from my desktop.
OP: Just a followup to my earlier post. Here's a link to the thread on doing Deep Body aka Third World Squats to help improve your back squat and a link to a T-Nation article on the same topic:
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10477707/deep-body-squat-a-k-a-third-world-squat-if-you-cannot-squat-or-want-to-get-proper-squat-form
https://www.t-nation.com/training/third-world-squat
Doing these can help improve your balance and hip/leg strength/flexibility which can aid in improving your back squat.
Another idea would be to do box squats, which will limit the depth of your squat and can assist in the development of strength/explosiveness from the bottom of the squat. If you do box squats, however, it is important to NOT sit on the box (just touch and go) and to NOT relax your muscles when you touch the box, in order to avoid the risk of spinal compression and injury.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/back-squats-vs-box-squats
I've never heard of that as a Third World Squat before, so that's a new one for me, but I've done these before for hip mobility exercises. They really do help open up your hips.
I was actually telling a couple of my friends in the gym last night not to sit on the box when they were doing the squats that it was just a cue for your body. Since they had issues with that I suggested they try Anderson squats instead since those are a great way to gain an explosive squat out of the hole.
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lsutton484 wrote: »
That would be awesome- but yeah- I could see that being a head ache.
I suspect in 4 years or so when we buy a house- Hubs is going to consider building me a home gym- I'm not sure how I feel about it- I dearly love going to the gym. Truly. It's my "social" tax- and at 19.99/month- it's substantially cheaper than going out 2-3 times a week with my friends.
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lsutton484 wrote: »Local craigslist has a pair of 100s right now. If they didn't suck so much to move around I'd probably go get them.
Yeah, I've seen a couple of 100s offered for sale on craigslist b4 and, since I can easily start off deadlifting at 245, I considered buying them but the thought of lugging those 100 pounders around gave me pause.
The heaviest I've got are a pair of 55 bumpers that I can use w/a pair of 45s to total 100 each. Take up more room on the bar but I can't lift that much more anyway.
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blopmiyers wrote: »I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.
it sounds like you've got a good plan under way. but you'll probably be glad to own either 45's or a set of bumper plates that are the same size but weigh a lot less. for deadlift and pendlay rows it's really helpful to have the bar at the right height right from the start, so you don't confuse your muscles by teaching them a different pattern and then changing it as you get strong.
my trainer has these cool (to me) old-school plates that are all the same size and look like they're made out of crushed car tyres. they may be cheaper if you can find them, and they have the extra benefit that they won't be as harsh on a living-space floor as the metal ones are.
about adding weight right away: i know what the people who've suggested it mean. i have found that my form seems easier to 'find' when there's a little weight to work with, but i do think it'll be good to unlearn that fast-descent habit first. it's kind of a tradeoff because at the same time i find it easier to know i'm controlling the weight when there's actual weight to control.
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canadianlbs wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.
it sounds like you've got a good plan under way. but you'll probably be glad to own either 45's or a set of bumper plates that are the same size but weigh a lot less. for deadlift and pendlay rows it's really helpful to have the bar at the right height right from the start, so you don't confuse your muscles by teaching them a different pattern and then changing it as you get strong.
my trainer has these cool (to me) old-school plates that are all the same size and look like they're made out of crushed car tyres. they may be cheaper if you can find them, and they have the extra benefit that they won't be as harsh on a living-space floor as the metal ones are.
about adding weight right away: i know what the people who've suggested it mean. i have found that my form seems easier to 'find' when there's a little weight to work with, but i do think it'll be good to unlearn that fast-descent habit first. it's kind of a tradeoff because at the same time i find it easier to know i'm controlling the weight when there's actual weight to control.
Those are made of tire rubber actually. They are just training weights so usually a lot cheaper and you can find them from companies like York, Pendlay and Rogue.1 -
blopmiyers wrote: »Firstly I apologize for so many questions on here. I squat with just a 45 lb bar and find myself losing balance or only feeling it in one leg. I figured it's muscle imbalance. Should I Deload to a 30 lb bar or just start from scratch at bodyweight squats. Id hate to have to restart but this is really bothering me. I feel pain in my right leg when squatting, I only squat with my heel a bit out of shoulder width as that is the most comfortable position for me.
You might be squating wrong. The best way to have a safe squat is to literally push out your butt more and a lot of more pressure on your heels. You don't ever want to put pressure on your toes. Also if your only feeling it in one leg,you might not be thinking of the muscle either in the other leg. I know sounds silly but exercise does require some thinking process. However, if you're doing all this and it isn't helping and your starting to get some pain or at a risk of injuring yourself, best bet is yes deload but... add more reps.
I hope I helped.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Those are made of tire rubber actually. They are just training weights so usually a lot cheaper and you can find them from companies like York, Pendlay and Rogue.
i didn't even know they were still being made. mr t's stuff looks like it belongs with the Special Bar that might - just might - have been touched by doug hepburn at one point in its life.
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canadianlbs wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Those are made of tire rubber actually. They are just training weights so usually a lot cheaper and you can find them from companies like York, Pendlay and Rogue.
i didn't even know they were still being made. mr t's stuff looks like it belongs with the Special Bar that might - just might - have been touched by doug hepburn at one point in its life.
LOL might be that old!
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Yeah I'm no expert but that lumbar curve at the bottom looks like it may not be helping you in the pain department. Look for Althean x's video on YouTube about "but wink" or a posterior pelvic tilt at the bottom of your squat. I am going to be redundant though and rephrase others' advice. Start with goblet squats to get a feel for proper form and helping to keep your chest more upright in the hole. Second, when squatting with the bar, be more slow and controlled with your descent; squeeze your glutes prior to initiating the movement (this always helps me) and work to find the natural bottom of your squat.0
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Wheelhouse15 wrote: »canadianlbs wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.
it sounds like you've got a good plan under way. but you'll probably be glad to own either 45's or a set of bumper plates that are the same size but weigh a lot less. for deadlift and pendlay rows it's really helpful to have the bar at the right height right from the start, so you don't confuse your muscles by teaching them a different pattern and then changing it as you get strong.
my trainer has these cool (to me) old-school plates that are all the same size and look like they're made out of crushed car tyres. they may be cheaper if you can find them, and they have the extra benefit that they won't be as harsh on a living-space floor as the metal ones are.
about adding weight right away: i know what the people who've suggested it mean. i have found that my form seems easier to 'find' when there's a little weight to work with, but i do think it'll be good to unlearn that fast-descent habit first. it's kind of a tradeoff because at the same time i find it easier to know i'm controlling the weight when there's actual weight to control.
Those are made of tire rubber actually. They are just training weights so usually a lot cheaper and you can find them from companies like York, Pendlay and Rogue.
Which is why commercial gyms seem to opt for bumpers over Olympic plates. Also, most of those tend to be kilo plates, which can be confusing for amuricans. Don't want some fool warming up with the 25kg plates on each side thinking they're in lbs1 -
maranarasauce93 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »canadianlbs wrote: »blopmiyers wrote: »I was planning on buying plates as soon as I finished cleaning my basement. I have a power rack to set up, and would like that added safety before putting on weight if that makes sense. I was hoping to do Stronglifts when all was clean and my form was good.
it sounds like you've got a good plan under way. but you'll probably be glad to own either 45's or a set of bumper plates that are the same size but weigh a lot less. for deadlift and pendlay rows it's really helpful to have the bar at the right height right from the start, so you don't confuse your muscles by teaching them a different pattern and then changing it as you get strong.
my trainer has these cool (to me) old-school plates that are all the same size and look like they're made out of crushed car tyres. they may be cheaper if you can find them, and they have the extra benefit that they won't be as harsh on a living-space floor as the metal ones are.
about adding weight right away: i know what the people who've suggested it mean. i have found that my form seems easier to 'find' when there's a little weight to work with, but i do think it'll be good to unlearn that fast-descent habit first. it's kind of a tradeoff because at the same time i find it easier to know i'm controlling the weight when there's actual weight to control.
Those are made of tire rubber actually. They are just training weights so usually a lot cheaper and you can find them from companies like York, Pendlay and Rogue.
Which is why commercial gyms seem to opt for bumpers over Olympic plates. Also, most of those tend to be kilo plates, which can be confusing for amuricans. Don't want some fool warming up with the 25kg plates on each side thinking they're in lbs
LOL, that true, but you can usually buy training Olympic plates in pounds as well. The big difference between training and competition weight is the tolerances but I think there is also more drop testing on the comp plates as well. I just wish my gym had a real Oly lifting bar rather than the standard bars because the whip makes the lifts a bit easier and smoother.1 -
Just a little update. I started doing third world squats about 10 minutes daily as suggested by @sgt1372 it still is difficult to do but I'll keep at it. I've also started to actually squeeze my glutes and stopped dive bombing. I'm going a bit shallower and not noticing any pain whatsoever. Here's a update vid
https://youtu.be/1nj0uWM3WsE 1
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