Sugar addiction
Replies
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jpcampbell74 wrote: »
Silly, poorly conducted junk science mockumentary which was widely panned by actual scientists and has no bearing upon anybody who eats a reasonable, moderate diet. It's very typical of the binary thinking associated with sugar intake these days, though - either you've recognized it as the devil and cut it completely out of your diet, or you're sitting on the couch shoveling it down by the spoonful. No chance there could possibly be a reasonable middle ground somewhere in the huge chasm between those two extremes.1 -
Jabbarwocky wrote: »Just found this article and thought it was interesting. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2892765/ I must admit, at this point I'm beginning to wonder if its the artificial sweetener as much as the person.
" Several large scale prospective cohort studies found positive correlation between artificial sweetener use and weight gain. The San Antonio Heart Study examined 3,682 adults over a seven- to eight-year period in the 1980s [18]. When matched for initial body mass index (BMI), gender, ethnicity, and diet, drinkers of artificially sweetened beverages consistently had higher BMIs at the follow-up, with dose dependence on the amount of consumption. Average BMI gain was +1.01 kg/m2 for control and 1.78 kg/m2 for people in the third quartile for artificially sweetened beverage consumption."
This is from the link above and if you think about it, those who are choosing artificial sweeteners are trying to lose weight. They are trying to lead healthier lives compared to those with lower BMI's who, presumably, are already doing so. Obviously not an earth shattering truth but at least food for thought.
See that word "correlation"? Correlation isn't the same thing as causation.
Let me do another exercise in correlation and see if it works for you: I see a lot of obese people exercising, therefore exercising makes you obese.
Make sense? Are you good with taking that correlation as causation, or are there maybe other factors behind that conclusion which might bear consideration?4 -
hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???4 -
hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people just eating it straight from the bag???
The funny thing is that many of the sweet foods people claim they're "addicted" to also contain plenty of fat. I haven't seen anybody complaining that they just can't quit chewing on sugar cane, or licking the powdered sugar off donuts.4 -
hayleyf6051 wrote: »Thank you all! Your replies are so helpful. I didn't mean to start the soda debate. My main craving is sugar in sweets/chocolate. Will get a plan of action together!
do you also have the same cravings for bread, fruit, and vegetables?
I don't, no.
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hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people just eating it straight from the bag???
The funny thing is that many of the sweet foods people claim they're "addicted" to also contain plenty of fat. I haven't seen anybody complaining that they just can't quit chewing on sugar cane, or licking the powdered sugar off donuts.
Cosign1 -
estherdragonbat wrote: »NikkiiBaby68 wrote: »Diet soda can actually cause you to gain weight...just fyi. Studies on this...This is why i eat healthy carbs including white potatoes and bananas. Sugar cravings could be cause by a deficiency etc. I have never been a huge chocolate person but i love my peppermint candy. lol. I really at this point dont crave sugar anymore...I have been without it for so long. I would request your doc do a complete blood draw and check for mineral and vitamin deficiency. Just some thoughts.
I've dropped close to 40 lbs in 4 months having at least a litre of diet soda daily. Just saying.
Down 50lbs over here while drinking 4+cans of diet soda a day. I also normalized a prediabetic glucose number
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jpcampbell74 wrote: »hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
YES! Cut out sugar in ALL forms, including fruit. Also stay away from artificial sweeteners. No more bread, pasta, rice, potato corn ect. Protein, Fat, Green Veggies. And PLENTY of water. You will have the low carb 'flu' for a few days. After that you will not miss sugar at all.
Good luck!
Didn't you mention in another thread that you've only been at this since around December? Come back in 5 years and let us know how it's going ie how realistic your plan actually is for the long term (as in 20, 30, 40+ years).3 -
Why not? They contain sugar...hayleyf6051 wrote: »hayleyf6051 wrote: »Thank you all! Your replies are so helpful. I didn't mean to start the soda debate. My main craving is sugar in sweets/chocolate. Will get a plan of action together!
do you also have the same cravings for bread, fruit, and vegetables?
I don't, no.
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Why not? They contain sugar...hayleyf6051 wrote: »hayleyf6051 wrote: »Thank you all! Your replies are so helpful. I didn't mean to start the soda debate. My main craving is sugar in sweets/chocolate. Will get a plan of action together!
do you also have the same cravings for bread, fruit, and vegetables?
I don't, no.
I'm not sure...
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Run an experiment on yourself. Drink artificial sweetener and eat in a 500 calorie deficit and see if you lose weight. I am 99.99% sure that you will.
Dont have to. Have been drinking diet soda and coffee with sweet & low in it for years. Didnt stop when I restarted this in late January but have lost almost 15 pounds. I know I can lose weight while consuming them, I'm more concerned about whether they are having an affect on me and encouraging sugar cravings.
I wonder if people who are trying to lose weight switch to diet soda because it's pounded into us that soda with sugar causes weight gain. So they switch to diet without changing anything else, and continue to gain unless all their calorie surplus was in the soda. That would be one way to account for correlation.
Exactly what I was thinking.0 -
Look_Its_Kriss wrote: »
The clipped out piece you have pasted does not give us any indicators of what these people were also consuming outside of the soda. On a page back i made a post about me at 252 pounds ordering 3 double big mac meals... i know from context that a lot of people might of thought i was being sarcastic but i actually used to order 3 double big mac meals, large fries with each and 2 chocolate shakes and then order a large diet soda... The diet soda was not the reason my BMI was up in the 40's.. It was the calories i was consuming, that one meal.. and that wouldn't of been all i ate that day was probably a good 5000 calories.
There are links within the article. I haven't had the chance to read them yet so dont know for sure. I dont think your being sarcastic. When I was younger it was no big deal for me to eat an entire large pan pizza by myself, eat two or three burgers in a meal, or eat 20 or 30 sliders from White Castle in one setting. This just highlights the problem I'm having right now which is sorting through all the misinformation and psuedo-science while trying to find facts.0 -
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gebeziseva wrote: »Then just drink diet soda (in arbitrary amounts). No sugar in it.
There is aspartame in diet soda just as bad for you. Just because something does not have sugar doesn't make it good for you.
Would say its all mind over matter. You are the one holding yourself back. One less each day,week,month etc. Or one hour at a time. If have to '15 more minutes a today, then another 30 the next
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Look_Its_Kriss wrote: »
Maybe as people we are spending far too much time trying to find a solid scientific solution to why we are who we are right now. There used to be a time i wanted to know why i binge eat every single day. At this point i think im content just being medicated for it.. I mean don't get me wrong, it would be super neat to have science suddenly prove this X thing is wrong with my brain and thats why i binge eat but i'd be wasting all my time trying to dig up answers instead of just finding my current solution and then tackling my weight issue until they finally did assuming there is one.
My brain fascinates me though.. i mean if i am up too late at night i can clearly tell when the medication has worn off compared to when it's still going.. the chatter my brain goes through about food is pretty much constant, most times its really imperative that i go to bed and go to sleep because if i stay awake too long while the chatter starts i know that my reasoning will soon be outdone by the noise.
maybe some day they will have a reason for my brain lol.. maybe not.
Oh, I'm not seeking a scientific solution. I know what to do. I was just curious about this. As I stated in a previous post, since I started seriously working out several weeks ago my cravings have lessened. I have no idea if its the working out, the fact that I've made it a point to stay away from sweets lately, or any one of a thousand other random factors.
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sassiesaxaphone_89 wrote: »gebeziseva wrote: »Then just drink diet soda (in arbitrary amounts). No sugar in it.
There is aspartame in diet soda just as bad for you. Just because something does not have sugar doesn't make it good for you.
Would say its all mind over matter. You are the one holding yourself back. One less each day,week,month etc. Or one hour at a time. If have to '15 more minutes a today, then another 30 the next
Wrong. If you care to know the actual science about aspartame without all the woo and fearmongering, here is a great analysis of it by an actual biochemist here on MFP: http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1308408/why-aspartame-isnt-scary/p12 -
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@Look_Its_Kriss I was never that bad with soda although at one point in my life it wasn't unusual for me to go through almost a 12 pack of Mountain Dew a day. At this point, my wife and I make a 12 of caffeine free diet coke (seems COMPLETELY pointless without the caffeine doesn't it?!?!) last a week and we're even cutting back from there. Congratulations on getting healthier!! I've had several diabetic friends who didn't lose the weight and ended up losing limbs and dying much younger than they should have so that is a big motivation for me.
To the OP, sorry that the thread got derailed. Hopefully your question was answered.0 -
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hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
Personally, I absolutely believe that puppies are addictive. Clearly you have not spent enough time around them. You should definitely go to an adoption center this weekend and hang out with some puppies.
However, you're missing my point here. Science tells us that it MAY be addictive. I do agree with you that we need human trials, the problem is that with mice, you can literally take 50 specimens from the same cohort of rats, feed them identical diets their entire life, and then change the one variable you are wanting to test. Its a "pure" method of research. Humans are a lot more difficult. It's hard to control for genetic predispositions, whether or not they were breast or bottle fed, or what they ate as children/young adults. It would be a lot easier if we could just do scientific testing on 3 month old babies, but obviously that's a terrible idea.
Some people do seem to have a harder time controlling themselves around sugar than others. Personally, I think it has to do more with the reward center than a true physiological addiction, but the outcome is the same regardless, some people just want way too much sugar, and too much of anything is rarely a good thing (except, again, puppies).
My point is that you can't say something is or is not addictive when the reality is that we just don't know. No one has yet to accept OR reject the null hypothesis here. More research is needed. In the meantime, there is a growing body of evidence that shows that sugar may not be as "safe" as we once thought and that it, like everything else, should be consumed in moderation.0 -
You're not a victim or out of control .. it is all in your power. You don't have to go cold turkey.. just be honest with yourself.. some people know they do best with hard and fast rules like "totally quitting today!" others rather ween and balance.
For my sweet tooth I like a square of dark chocolate like 85% .. it satisfies my sweet tooth.. is lower in sugar and calories than milk chocolate and has heart health benefits. yet.. My latest love is the Fiber One Brownie. I eat one a day.. 90 calories.. chocolatey ...and it does keep me full with the fiber. I'm never tempted to eat more than one.1 -
@Look_Its_Kriss I said a loooooong time ago when I switched to diet soda that I'd NEVER drink a caffeine free soda because it would make it pointless! Just an old joke for me. We actually talked about getting a soda stream last night but, at least for now, we cant really justify paying $70 or more for something that its sole purpose is to inject CO2 into water.
Its odd that you had that fight with doctors. When my father was diagnosed as diabetic the FIRST thing his doctor did was started harping on him about diet and losing weight. As a matter of fact, the nutritionist I see is through the local diabetes center and the centers overall focus on treatment, taking into consideration the individual of course, is to encourage eating right and losing weight. Guess it all depends on where you are.
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hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
Personally, I absolutely believe that puppies are addictive. Clearly you have not spent enough time around them. You should definitely go to an adoption center this weekend and hang out with some puppies.
However, you're missing my point here. Science tells us that it MAY be addictive. I do agree with you that we need human trials, the problem is that with mice, you can literally take 50 specimens from the same cohort of rats, feed them identical diets their entire life, and then change the one variable you are wanting to test. Its a "pure" method of research. Humans are a lot more difficult. It's hard to control for genetic predispositions, whether or not they were breast or bottle fed, or what they ate as children/young adults. It would be a lot easier if we could just do scientific testing on 3 month old babies, but obviously that's a terrible idea.
Some people do seem to have a harder time controlling themselves around sugar than others. Personally, I think it has to do more with the reward center than a true physiological addiction, but the outcome is the same regardless, some people just want way too much sugar, and too much of anything is rarely a good thing (except, again, puppies).
My point is that you can't say something is or is not addictive when the reality is that we just don't know. No one has yet to accept OR reject the null hypothesis here. More research is needed. In the meantime, there is a growing body of evidence that shows that sugar may not be as "safe" as we once thought and that it, like everything else, should be consumed in moderation.
in other words, you have no proof.1 -
hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
Personally, I absolutely believe that puppies are addictive. Clearly you have not spent enough time around them. You should definitely go to an adoption center this weekend and hang out with some puppies.
However, you're missing my point here. Science tells us that it MAY be addictive. I do agree with you that we need human trials, the problem is that with mice, you can literally take 50 specimens from the same cohort of rats, feed them identical diets their entire life, and then change the one variable you are wanting to test. Its a "pure" method of research. Humans are a lot more difficult. It's hard to control for genetic predispositions, whether or not they were breast or bottle fed, or what they ate as children/young adults. It would be a lot easier if we could just do scientific testing on 3 month old babies, but obviously that's a terrible idea.
Some people do seem to have a harder time controlling themselves around sugar than others. Personally, I think it has to do more with the reward center than a true physiological addiction, but the outcome is the same regardless, some people just want way too much sugar, and too much of anything is rarely a good thing (except, again, puppies).
My point is that you can't say something is or is not addictive when the reality is that we just don't know. No one has yet to accept OR reject the null hypothesis here. More research is needed. In the meantime, there is a growing body of evidence that shows that sugar may not be as "safe" as we once thought and that it, like everything else, should be consumed in moderation.
Not interested in a full debate, but look for what else rats and mice respond to. It's not just sugar.
They have similar responses to fat and cafeteria diets.
Food is pleasurable, of course. That doesn't mean it's addictive as a substance. Some people have issues with eating itself, and I'm in the camp that believes they're behavioral and can be addressed with the types of interventions used to address behavioral "addictions".
Coming back to a point that was made upthread, I overate, at various times in my life not just sugar (I swore I was a carb/sugar addict, in fact). When I gave those up, and I turned to food, I ate nuts, hard boiled eggs, egg salad, chicken legs -- all in indiscriminate portions, sometimes driving to the store (bundling up 2 kids and dragging them with me) to get the necessary supplies to feed the need. I just ate. Salty, sweet, fatty? It didn't matter.
Just a ramble and some food (heh) for thought.3 -
hayleyf6051 wrote: »Hi,
I'm a massive sugar addict. I can't go several hours without sugar or diet soda. I want to get some control back. Any ideas? Is cold turkey best?
your not addicted to sugar because sugar is not an addictive substance.
Sir, the world is not black and white and your viewpoint is not exactly correct. Sugar stimulates the exact same reward receptors as drugs (like cocaine) do. Additionally, we have mouse model studies that prove that under some conditions, the mouse can actually become addicted to sugar.
Sugar MAY be an addictive substance or it MAY not. More research is needed.
Please do not peddle medical or nutritional advice if you have no intention of citing sources or being accurate.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23719144
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
Lol that is all you have? Two studies on dopamine centers? You get the same response from petting puppies , so are you saying puppies are addictive now too???
Find me a non rat study with human trials that shows linkage between sugar and addiction. Until then I stand by my original assertion that sugar is not addictive.
If sugar is so addictive why aren't people addicted to fruit???
Personally, I absolutely believe that puppies are addictive. Clearly you have not spent enough time around them. You should definitely go to an adoption center this weekend and hang out with some puppies.
However, you're missing my point here. Science tells us that it MAY be addictive. I do agree with you that we need human trials, the problem is that with mice, you can literally take 50 specimens from the same cohort of rats, feed them identical diets their entire life, and then change the one variable you are wanting to test. Its a "pure" method of research. Humans are a lot more difficult. It's hard to control for genetic predispositions, whether or not they were breast or bottle fed, or what they ate as children/young adults. It would be a lot easier if we could just do scientific testing on 3 month old babies, but obviously that's a terrible idea.
Some people do seem to have a harder time controlling themselves around sugar than others. Personally, I think it has to do more with the reward center than a true physiological addiction, but the outcome is the same regardless, some people just want way too much sugar, and too much of anything is rarely a good thing (except, again, puppies).
My point is that you can't say something is or is not addictive when the reality is that we just don't know. No one has yet to accept OR reject the null hypothesis here. More research is needed. In the meantime, there is a growing body of evidence that shows that sugar may not be as "safe" as we once thought and that it, like everything else, should be consumed in moderation.
Nobody is saying sugar can't be psychologically addictive. Anything can be psychologically addictive. Gambling, for example. People have ended up dead because of gambling addictions.
What we're refuting is that sugar is physically addictive, like cocaine or alcohol. It's not. The 'withdrawal' symptoms some associate with not eating sugar is caffeine withdrawal, or 'low carb flu', or it's your blood sugar levels regulating themselves. It's not addiction withdrawal.2 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »Here's a thing.
I get sugar cravings if I eat a lot of sugar. At the time they feel irresistible (which they are not). The sugar also increases my hunger.
If I reduce sugar a bit, these effects go away in a week or two.
That's reduce it a bit. Not cut it out and certainly not cut out carbs in general. I eat a small amount of chocolate most days. I usually have cereal or toast for breakfast. I had a brownie with my lunch today. I'm not eating six chocolate bars a day but neither am I a sugar monk. I have no cravings for sugar at the moment. Sometimes I feel like I'd like something sweet, but I'm not compelled. Just because I cut back a little bit.
You see, it is not always necessary to take the extreme approach. Sometimes a small change can make a big difference. Sometimes the small change works better.
Also, just because your brain tells you that you need need need something right now, doesn't mean you actually have to obey that. How often do you pee yourself in public? Even if you really really need it? Exactly. Control comes with practice.
Lol, love your "don't pee in public" analogy
You're right - being toilet trained is a practiced, learned behavior.
I had good luck with reducing sugar as well, and the cravings also went away for me. I find the cognitive behavioral techniques that I learned in Smart Recovery/Rational Recovery to be useful. I had to learn them, and practice them.0 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »Also, just because your brain tells you that you need need need something right now, doesn't mean you actually have to obey that. How often do you pee yourself in public? Even if you really really need it? Exactly. Control comes with practice.
Have you been following me again?0
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