Bulking for beginners
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LolBroScience wrote: »arditarose wrote: »Bump. And a question.
Would it be stupid to bank calories in a bulk? I like to eat at least 2500 calories on Saturday. My maintenance calories are 1800, so I always banked a bit during the week. Obviously I'll be bulking on less than 2500 daily. Anyway, is it a bad idea?
no, you can bank calories, just make sure that your weekly average is what your surplus should be.
althought, I would be curious what @psulemon thoughts on this are.
also, if your maintenance is 1800 then your bulking calories should be 250 for 2050 a day. Don't skimp on your calories!
It's mixed feelings/personal preference, at least from the articles and research I have seen. Overall, I haven't seen any empirical evidence that would suggest one method as optimal.
Side note - I have seen several recommendations (to include that of Alan Aragon) that would suggest performance would be better optimized to have a surplus on bulking days. I would need to re-read his latest book to get a more concrete understanding around that concept.
I would say surplus on all days (although possibly a smaller surplus), if you are intent on a heavier calorie day. Just even the surplus out over the course of the week, if gaining rapidly is of worry.
What I would suggest would still provide the same surplus weekly, but maintenance on non lifting days, and (1750/3 calories) on lifting days. And then, I would eat roughly a 600 calorie surplus on S,T,R for clean bulk.
Interesting. That could work for me. Yeah, I just don't want to skimp too much during the week while I'm lifting. I want to be successful, performance wise as well as gaining muscle.
Thanks guys.0 -
Sounds like I may be doing things wrong. I’m scrawny. I’m 6’0 went from 115 lbs to 140lbs over last summer, eating healthy but no lifting whatsoever. I don’t mind fat…because honestly I had “none” to begin with.
I’m now 130, and joined a gym literally yesterday. I have very little fat, still. Wanting to get to 170’ish long term. I don’t know all the terms but I’ve been calculating 600-800 calories more than my daily recommended maintaining calorie intake, which equals to about 3750 calories, increasing as I gain weight. This gives me 1-2 pounds per week. I drink mostly milk during the day, but don’t count it towards my daily calories. I don’t care to have the perfect physique body (minimalizing fat vs muscle ratio, etc) , I literally just hate being skinny and scrawny. (Don’t worry--I don’t eat total junk all day, I get in veggies and fruits and greens too!)
My question: I understand lifting burns calories, but why wouldn’t I just start lifting and overeating at the same time? I find that lifting will make me hungrier and keep me in motivation to keep up my diet.
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jnimeskern wrote: »Sounds like I may be doing things wrong. I’m scrawny. I’m 6’0 went from 115 lbs to 140lbs over last summer, eating healthy but no lifting whatsoever. I don’t mind fat…because honestly I had “none” to begin with.
I’m now 130, and joined a gym literally yesterday. I have very little fat, still. Wanting to get to 170’ish long term. I don’t know all the terms but I’ve been calculating 600-800 calories more than my daily recommended maintaining calorie intake, which equals to about 3750 calories, increasing as I gain weight. This gives me 1-2 pounds per week. I drink mostly milk during the day, but don’t count it towards my daily calories. I don’t care to have the perfect physique body (minimalizing fat vs muscle ratio, etc) , I literally just hate being skinny and scrawny. (Don’t worry--I don’t eat total junk all day, I get in veggies and fruits and greens too!)
My question: I understand lifting burns calories, but why wouldn’t I just start lifting and overeating at the same time? I find that lifting will make me hungrier and keep me in motivation to keep up my diet.
Most of us follow the TDEE method where exercise is already include into the energy balance equation. So we eat a standard amount calories daily to figure out our try maintenance calories and then eat slightly above it. I know, for example, that I maintain on average at 3000ish calories. I know this because I love about 1 lb per week on around 2500 calories. I figured this out through tracking.
There are a bunch of TDEE calculators out there which can help provide a starting point until you track your calories for amount a month to six weeks.
All of this is a bit of trial and error, so even the best calculator will have some variation.2 -
jnimeskern wrote: »
My question: I understand lifting burns calories, but why wouldn’t I just start lifting and overeating at the same time? I find that lifting will make me hungrier and keep me in motivation to keep up my diet.
Not much experience here but I did find that once the lifting caught up I was indeed hungry. Almost 4 weeks in and I'm finding myself hungry every 3 hours or so. Coming from a guy who would skip meals over the last 5 years. As for gains. I don't think I could have got my first 5 pounds without tracking it. I used the goal thingy here on MFP. Put in my current weight plus my goal weight and it spat out a calorie number. Not sure what I burn for lifting but it's working none the less.
Good luck.
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883xlsportster wrote: »
Not much experience here but I did find that once the lifting caught up I was indeed hungry. Almost 4 weeks in and I'm finding myself hungry every 3 hours or so. Coming from a guy who would skip meals over the last 5 years. As for gains. I don't think I could have got my first 5 pounds without tracking it. I used the goal thingy here on MFP. Put in my current weight plus my goal weight and it spat out a calorie number. Not sure what I burn for lifting but it's working none the less.
Good luck.
How much have you gained in 4 weeks?
I also am tracking with MFP. It keeps me hungry as its a sort of "high score" - getting to that calorie number. In the 16-17 hours that I am awake per day, I figure i need 200 calories per hour.
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jnimeskern wrote: »883xlsportster wrote: »
Not much experience here but I did find that once the lifting caught up I was indeed hungry. Almost 4 weeks in and I'm finding myself hungry every 3 hours or so. Coming from a guy who would skip meals over the last 5 years. As for gains. I don't think I could have got my first 5 pounds without tracking it. I used the goal thingy here on MFP. Put in my current weight plus my goal weight and it spat out a calorie number. Not sure what I burn for lifting but it's working none the less.
Good luck.
How much have you gained in 4 weeks?
I also am tracking with MFP. It keeps me hungry as its a sort of "high score" - getting to that calorie number. In the 16-17 hours that I am awake per day, I figure i need 200 calories per hour.
The amount of muscle that can be gained in 4 weeks for males is going to range form 1-2 lbs. The rest would be fat, glycogen/water, food in your GI track or lean body mass (outside of muscle). And as you become more advanced, that number will taper off.0 -
jnimeskern wrote: »How much have you gained in 4 weeks?
I was 129 on Dec 12. I am now 135.1 today so that makes it 6. Mind you I don't log my weight till Saturday. For my age and goals I'm pretty happy with it.
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Sorry if I haven't seen it but can someone point me towards some good recipes for bulking please. And snack options! I need to do better prep for food and currently strolling around the supermarket wondering what to buy. What's the basics?? Help!0
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SteveyStar2016 wrote: »Sorry if I haven't seen it but can someone point me towards some good recipes for bulking please. And snack options! I need to do better prep for food and currently strolling around the supermarket wondering what to buy. What's the basics?? Help!
Did you read item #4 in the first post of the thread? He put forth some suggestions on what to eat there.0 -
SteveyStar2016 wrote: »Sorry if I haven't seen it but can someone point me towards some good recipes for bulking please. And snack options! I need to do better prep for food and currently strolling around the supermarket wondering what to buy. What's the basics?? Help!
Ice cream , Oreos, fatty cuts of meat, bagels, rice, pasta, etc; just make sure you hit micros and macros0 -
bumping0
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I am not trying to bulk, i am trying to lean up and reduce my fat % to about 15% or lower but i want to get ripped, i have no idea how to manage it. Should i think about sliming for 3 days and bulking for 1 day on a 4 day cycle or what?0
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spiderman2214 wrote: »I am not trying to bulk, i am trying to lean up and reduce my fat % to about 15% or lower but i want to get ripped, i have no idea how to manage it. Should i think about sliming for 3 days and bulking for 1 day on a 4 day cycle or what?
How did you come up with the idea of this 3 day, 1 day cycling of dieting? Guys, is this a real thing? If so I'd be curious to know how that works? For your goals, I would just say cut? Why don't you just do a consistent caloric deficit while maintaining a decent heavy lifting program and high protein intake for muscle preservation? I don't see how 3 days of deficit and 1 day of bulking would work?1 -
To cut down on @ndj1979's self promotion
I thought I would give this a bump.
Looks like there's a goodly few new bulkers around too.
Cheers, h.0 -
Hello I am a young tall man looking to gain a lot of wait fast. Can anyone tell me what exercises to do and what and when I should eat? Thanks a ton!0
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Did you read my op?owen_lindstrom wrote: »Hello I am a young tall man looking to gain a lot of wait fast. Can anyone tell me what exercises to do and what and when I should eat? Thanks a ton!
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I am going to go ahead and put some information here that I see asked a lot about bulking.
I would also highly recommend that everyone read the below link:
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10049766/bulking-a-complete-guide-for-beginners/p1 < it used to be a sticky but I don't know what happened to it.
Clean bulk VS dirty bulk. Please note that a clean bulk has absolutely nothing to do with eating clean. Clean bulk means that you want to minimize fat gains, and are shooting for a 250 calorie surplus, or just about a .5 pound per week gain. Dirty bulk refers to those that want to pack on a lot of weight fast, and do not care so much about fat gain. Typically, this would be about a 500 calorie surplus, and looking for a one to two pound gain per week.
Once the rate of gain has been determined do the following:
1. If you are using TDEE method then just increase your calories by 250, 500, etc, over maintenance and eat to that number. If you are using MFP method then set MFP to gain x amount of weight per week.
2. Take starting measurements of waist, arms, chest, shoulders, and thighs. Also, plan on taking measurements about every two to three weeks to track progress.
3. Marcros should be .6 to .8 grams of protein per pound of body weight; .45 grams of fat per pound of body weight; fill in rest with carbs.
4. Make sure that you meet micronutient needs and eat nutrient dense foods like vegetables, rice, fish, chicken, etc. However, there is nothing wrong with filling in your calories with calorie dense foods like ice cream, cookies, bagels, chips, etc. I mean if you are bulking then you should eat the foods you enjoy, right? Please note that I am NOT saying eat 100% oreos, twinkies, ice cream, and pizza.
5. If you are new to lifting then you should identify a structured lifting program like all pro beginner, strong lifts, new rules of lifting, starting strength, etc, and run said program. If you are not new to lifting then you can run whatever program you have been running, just make sure that it has progressive over load built into it.
6. I would recommend using a food scale and accurately tracking your intake through faithful logging; however, this may not be necessary for all.
7. Note, that just because you increase your calories by 250 that this does not mean that you will immediately start gaining a half pound per week, you may have to keep bumping up calories until you start gaining. Also, as you gain weight you are going to need to bump up your intake, as your TDEE is going to be higher at 175 pounds, then it was at 170 pounds.
8. Fat gain is inevitable (just like judgement day LOL). You need to accept that if you are going to bulk then you are going to gain fat. For most the ratio is about 1:1, so for every ten pounds that you gain then you will gain five pounds of fat and five pounds of muscle. The fat gain ratio is a little higher for females than males, but I don't have an exact number on that..I would assume 1.25:.75 fat gain to muscle for females, but that may be wrong.
This post assumes that you have already determined that your body fat is low enough to bulk. For males it is recommend to bulk at sub 15% body fat; for females that range is about 18-20%. < These are just ranges and everyone is going to be a little different.
I am putting this on here in regards to Mr.M27 who is banned from the forums, and tried to keep the gaining forum "broscience" and "pseudoscience" free….he also taught me a lot about what I know about bulking/cutting/lifting, etc….
When body fat % is recommended to indicate it's time to switch to another route from bulking.0 -
This is a practical question from me, a noob to lifting, about the bulk/cut cycle.
The occasion of this question is that I have reached a body fat hydrostatically measured at less than 15%, my weight is in the 'Healthy' BMI for my height by a slim margin, and I have reached my goal trouser size.
As I've lost weight, I've discarded my fat clothes.
If I undertake a clean bulk, as defined earlier in this discussion, how much bulk should I expect to add before initiating the subsequent cut? Should I keep my most recently 'undergrown' trousers?0 -
SteveyStar2016 wrote: »Sorry if I haven't seen it but can someone point me towards some good recipes for bulking please. And snack options! I need to do better prep for food and currently strolling around the supermarket wondering what to buy. What's the basics?? Help!
Depends on what you like to eat. For during my work shift, I prepare eggs (WHOLE), you can even prepare French toast if you like that, gives you all 3 macros, protein, fat, and carbs. Bring protein powder, and Nature Valley Protein Chewy bars. Two of them are 380 cal total and have about 20 g of Protein. Carnivore Meal replacement has Protein and Carbs per serving (2 scoops). PB is great and easy to eat, I eat it out of the jar sometimes, every serving of PB is about 2 tablespoons so approx. 2 scoops with standard size spoon if you're not using food scale That's 190 cal per serving. For carbs, the nature valley bars have carbs too. Bannanas are about 110 cal. Then when you get home make a nice steak dinner with potatoes or rice. What do you think?1 -
JeromeBarry1 wrote: »This is a practical question from me, a noob to lifting, about the bulk/cut cycle.
The occasion of this question is that I have reached a body fat hydrostatically measured at less than 15%, my weight is in the 'Healthy' BMI for my height by a slim margin, and I have reached my goal trouser size.
As I've lost weight, I've discarded my fat clothes.
If I undertake a clean bulk, as defined earlier in this discussion, how much bulk should I expect to add before initiating the subsequent cut? Should I keep my most recently 'undergrown' trousers?
In a recent post, it was pointed out that a 1:1 ratio is reasonable in terms of muscle to fat gain. From that and a little math, you can figure out how many pounds you can gain before you reach an undesirable BF %. That's the trigger point for your cut.0 -
Just to verify, the 1:1ratio is applicable to men only?
Do you know the ratio for women?
Cheers, h.1 -
middlehaitch wrote: »Just to verify, the 1:1ratio is applicable to men only?
Do you know the ratio for women?
Cheers, h.
You are correct. That ratio is for males.3 -
middlehaitch wrote: »Just to verify, the 1:1ratio is applicable to men only?
Do you know the ratio for women?
Cheers, h.
For females it is like 1.25 to .75 fat to muscle, I believe1 -
Thanks guys. I had it in my head that it was something like a 1/3-2/3 p-f split but had no idea where I had found that number.
Cheers, h.0 -
Should i take 20% or 25% from fat and rest of carbohydrates for bulking lean.
My bodytype is ectomorph😁.0 -
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Any bulking bros here in 2022?1
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I'm 55, looking to gain 20kgs, wish me luck!1
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Welcome to the club, @RohanRathore8838! Just remember to keep the gain slow-paced, so much of it can be muscle without the excess fat which just needs to be trimmed off later. Trust me, a slow bulk with little/no trimming is a lot more fun than a supersonic bulk followed by abject misery of deep trimming later.1
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