Going Vegan ?
Nano1360
Posts: 101 Member
I am just transforming my life style! It's not because I am really sorry for animals !althought if I really think where the meats comes from I will be really sorry for the animals ! It's just I have heard so many negative things about dairies, egg, and even meat ( even fish really !!!). I have a bad family history when it comes to diseases and I don't want to end up with diabetes or cancer or life long prescription drugs!!!!
so I decided to give it a go ! I want to see if I will really feel more energy and feel much better inside ! If I can really be more active living a planet based diet !!! So please if you can help me in this new journey add me and give me some beginners tips ☺️ nothing is too small since I'm really a newbie
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Hi
I am vegan. I went vegan for the animals - but have now learnt how bad meat, dairy and eggs are for both our health and the environment. If you do it properly, you will get everything you need and will feel much better. If you have facebook then I strongly suggest you join some vegan groups.
If you have any questions message me :-)
You are making a good step2 -
There is a social group on here, called Happy Herbivores, which might be helpful.1
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Pretty sure going vegan won't exempt you from diseases like cancer, diabetes, or ending up on prescription drugs but if you can achieve what you think is a balanced, healthy diet by going vegan, go for it!
You say you've read many negative things about meat, dairy, eggs. Have you looked for positive things? I can guarantee there'd be just as many positive things. What about negatives of a vegan diet? Again, I'd guarantee there'd be just as many negatives. "healthy" is subjective - whatever you do, be open to change, experimentation and to admitting that something might not be working.10 -
What you read depends highly on which sources you seek out and what you look for. There is nothing inherently wrong with dairy, eggs, meat and fish. There is nothing wrong with going vegan, either. If you do it properly, and eating a vegan diet makes you feel good and not deprived, it will be healthy. Deprivation and feeling of deprivation leads to overeating, and it's the overeating, not the foods themselves, that leads to disease. You are taking a detour, but that could turn out to be the scenic route for you.2
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Read up on nutrients commonly consumed via animal products, and figure out how to incorporate them into your diet. Calcium, protein, iron etc. can be found in plant sources (although personally as a pescetarian I struggle to get enough protein for my fitness goals from plant sources alone), but if you're not eating any animal products or fortified foods, you MUST take a B12 supplement.0
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livingleanlivingclean wrote: »Pretty sure going vegan won't exempt you from diseases like cancer, diabetes, or ending up on prescription drugs but if you can achieve what you think is a balanced, healthy diet by going vegan, go for it!
You say you've read many negative things about meat, dairy, eggs. Have you looked for positive things? I can guarantee there'd be just as many positive things. What about negatives of a vegan diet? Again, I'd guarantee there'd be just as many negatives. "healthy" is subjective - whatever you do, be open to change, experimentation and to admitting that something might not be working.
Along with this-Op have you checked out the Vegan RD yet, Ginny Messina? If not, I highly recommend her blog and books because she's a vegan but also is a RD and approaches the issue of health and veganism in a refreshing, science based way. Here's a great post to get you started-
http://www.theveganrd.com/2017/04/science-matters-for-vegans-and-everyone-else.html
I've been transitioning to a more whole foods, plant based diet that's greatly reduced/eliminated meat and dairy. However, after a lot of reading through research/opinions on both sides, I haven't been able to find anything reputable that points to a completely animal free diet being any healthier than one that still includes a bit of animal product. If you check out the Blue Zones most of them eat fish or other animal products in small amounts. But they base their diets around whole grains, veggies and fruit, beans, nuts and seeds, olives etc. From what I've seen I don't know if it's so much about what you're cutting out, but what you're adding to your diet, that makes an impact.
I like a lot of what Dr. Joel Fuhrman has to say about this whole thing-he advocates a whole foods, plant based diet for the health benefits, but he acknowledges that there's no reputable research currently available that shows that a diet without any animal product has better outcomes than one that still includes small amounts of meat. His books Eat to Live and The End of Dieting are both great reads and walk through the positives of focusing on a whole foods, plant based diet, but he also talks about how it doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing. I'm following his plan right now and I still eat a serving of fish every week, as well as some beef and dairy. But the bulk of my food now comes from plants
eta: going a bit further about the Blue Zones-there's one vegetarian group that's made the list, but within that group there's a small sub-group of pescetarians. The sub-group that still includes a bit of fish in their diets have even better longevity of life outcomes than their vegetarian counterparts. This is interesting because they're both a part of the same community and would be similar in other aspects, (it's a SDA group in CA).2 -
And you would need to be careful and not eat all those fruits and veggies that are on those "bad" lists, the ones that are not organic and that are being sprayed with chemicals.4
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150poundsofme wrote: »And you would need to be careful and not eat all those fruits and veggies that are on those "bad" lists, the ones that are not organic and that are being sprayed with chemicals.
Organic fruits and veggies are still sprayed with chemicals...5 -
Good to know, thanks0
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Being vegan is an ethical choice - it's the very essence of the word. And being vegan alone does not mean a person will automatically be healthy. It's not difficult to eat an unbalanced vegan diet, just like with a lot of standard diets.
So, if you don't feel "sorry" for other animals, rather than going vegan - in whatever way you understand that - you may want to consider trying plant-based, in which you focus on incorporating a lot of plants of different varieties. That carries no ethical connotations and eating a wider variety of plants would be good for a lot of people, from a nutritional standpoint.8 -
I'm pretty sure you mean vegetarian, right? Doesn't vegan mean you don't use non-food items that come from animals, don't wear leather, don't use products tested on animals, etc?
I don't think being vegetarian or vegan will protect you from any of the stuff you mentioned. Maintaining a healthy weight, getting plenty of exercise, and eating a nutrient rich diet would be far more important.
But if you want to try it, give it a shot! There are a number of vegetarians and vegans active here, and the group was mentioned upthread. Have fun and good luck!3 -
I'm not really a name snub !0
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I'm not really a name snub !
I'm guessing that was directed at me? It's not about being a snob, but words have meaning, and my understanding is that a vegetarian doesn't eat animal products, and a vegan doesn't use anything that came from or caused harm to an animal. You can call yourself whatever you want, I was just not clear based on your post. I would never want to label myself as something I'm not so I thought it was worth mentioning.6 -
I'm not really a name snub !
Words have meaning. We label ourselves and others label each other. Being able to communicate effectively is important. It's not about being a snob. A lot of people don't understand the difference between vegan, vegetarian or plant-based. It's important not just for those who label themselves, but even for others so that one knows what a person eats if they go to a restaurant and ask for vegan options or go to a friends house for dinner, etc.
Kimny is essentially correct in her description, though generally in the U.S. vegetarian often seems to mean lacto-ovo vegetarian (a person who eats eggs and dairy, but no other animal products). I don't know what the common connotation is in other countries. Vegan is very specific (and even with that, there's still a spectrum within it).
This is only meant as clarification, since you didn't seem clear on the meaning - which is not unusual! So please don't take offense.5 -
I'm not really a name snub !
I'm guessing that was directed at me? It's not about being a snob, but words have meaning, and my understanding is that a vegetarian doesn't eat animal products, and a vegan doesn't use anything that came from or caused harm to an animal. You can call yourself whatever you want, I was just not clear based on your post. I would never want to label myself as something I'm not so I thought it was worth mentioning.
That's not actually true.
Yes, many vegans avoid ALL animal products, both dietary and otherwise, but a vegan diet is a diet that avoids all animal products. This includes meat and fish, but also other products that necessitate the killing of the animal, like gelatine, cochineal and rennet, as well as products that come from animals such as dairy, eggs and honey. In recent years I've noticed a trend towards using the term 'plant-based', as mentioned above, for someone who doesn't consume meat, dairy or eggs for health rather than ethical reasons (and may or may not eat honey), but has no qualms about wearing leather. However, a person who eats a plant-based diet and wears a leather jacket could still accurately be described as following a vegan diet.
Veganism can be viewed as a subset of vegetarianism, which also includes lacto vegetarianism, ovo vegetarianism, and lacto-ovo vegetarianism. Pescetarianism/pesco vegetarianism and pollo vegetarianism may also be included, although there's some debate on that matter (pescetarians eat fish and pollo vegetarians eat fish and poultry, so although both groups exclude some meat they do consume animal flesh).
Without any qualifier, "vegetarian" refers to lacto-ovo vegetarianism. This means that a person does not eat any products that require the animal to be killed (meat, fish, gelatine, cochineal, rennet, etc.), but eats both dairy and eggs. Lacto vegetarians exclude eggs but eat dairy, while ovo vegetarians exclude dairy but eat eggs.
Given that the OP mentioned dairy and eggs, I'm assuming she's planning on following a vegan/plant-based diet.
tl;dr: Vegetarians eat animal products, vegans don't.0 -
I've been thinking about it too... gonna try to cut back on meat and dairy first and see how it goes0
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I'm not really a name snub !
I'm guessing that was directed at me? It's not about being a snob, but words have meaning, and my understanding is that a vegetarian doesn't eat animal products, and a vegan doesn't use anything that came from or caused harm to an animal. You can call yourself whatever you want, I was just not clear based on your post. I would never want to label myself as something I'm not so I thought it was worth mentioning.
That's not actually true.
Yes, many vegans avoid ALL animal products, both dietary and otherwise, but a vegan diet is a diet that avoids all animal products. This includes meat and fish, but also other products that necessitate the killing of the animal, like gelatine, cochineal and rennet, as well as products that come from animals such as dairy, eggs and honey. In recent years I've noticed a trend towards using the term 'plant-based', as mentioned above, for someone who doesn't consume meat, dairy or eggs for health rather than ethical reasons (and may or may not eat honey), but has no qualms about wearing leather. However, a person who eats a plant-based diet and wears a leather jacket could still accurately be described as following a vegan diet.
Veganism can be viewed as a subset of vegetarianism, which also includes lacto vegetarianism, ovo vegetarianism, and lacto-ovo vegetarianism. Pescetarianism/pesco vegetarianism and pollo vegetarianism may also be included, although there's some debate on that matter (pescetarians eat fish and pollo vegetarians eat fish and poultry, so although both groups exclude some meat they do consume animal flesh).
Without any qualifier, "vegetarian" refers to lacto-ovo vegetarianism. This means that a person does not eat any products that require the animal to be killed (meat, fish, gelatine, cochineal, rennet, etc.), but eats both dairy and eggs. Lacto vegetarians exclude eggs but eat dairy, while ovo vegetarians exclude dairy but eat eggs.
Given that the OP mentioned dairy and eggs, I'm assuming she's planning on following a vegan/plant-based diet.
tl;dr: Vegetarians eat animal products, vegans don't.
A perfect example of why words and meanings are important. Plant-based could mean no animal products or some animal products (hence the term "based"), but has no ethical connotation. Veganism does have an ethical connotation and saying "vegan diet" is misleading as to the term in general, and leads to others trying to co-opt the term. Regardless, clearly even in this thread the labels mean something different to different people, and this shows the importance of trying to use terms correctly, OP.
But, sorry to partially derail. Labels are important, but at the end of the day, eat a well-balanced diet and otherwise maintain a healthy lifestyle and you'll be ahead of the curve.4 -
Whoops, sorry to stir the pot! I have always been under the impression that while vegetarian was a moving target, vegan had a clear and specific definition
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Whoops, sorry to stir the pot! I have always been under the impression that while vegetarian was a moving target, vegan had a clear and specific definition
I would still say you really are essentially correct. But, this thread is an example of why conversation is important - so there are no misunderstandings! Yes, there are variations within your understanding, but still overall correct. "Strict vegetarian" used to basically mean "vegan diet" (no ethical connotations), but when vegetarianism started expanding across cultures and started to have variations, veganism was coined. Today, it does carry an ethical connotation, but as I said still has its own variations (especially regarding honey and white sugar as well as the rigidity with which one avoids all forms of animal products). And now we have plant-based, which I think is even better for separating vegan/vegetarian/plant-based.3 -
I'm not really a name snub !
I'm guessing that was directed at me? It's not about being a snob, but words have meaning, and my understanding is that a vegetarian doesn't eat animal products, and a vegan doesn't use anything that came from or caused harm to an animal. You can call yourself whatever you want, I was just not clear based on your post. I would never want to label myself as something I'm not so I thought it was worth mentioning.
That's not actually true.
Yes, many vegans avoid ALL animal products, both dietary and otherwise, but a vegan diet is a diet that avoids all animal products. This includes meat and fish, but also other products that necessitate the killing of the animal, like gelatine, cochineal and rennet, as well as products that come from animals such as dairy, eggs and honey. In recent years I've noticed a trend towards using the term 'plant-based', as mentioned above, for someone who doesn't consume meat, dairy or eggs for health rather than ethical reasons (and may or may not eat honey), but has no qualms about wearing leather. However, a person who eats a plant-based diet and wears a leather jacket could still accurately be described as following a vegan diet.
Veganism can be viewed as a subset of vegetarianism, which also includes lacto vegetarianism, ovo vegetarianism, and lacto-ovo vegetarianism. Pescetarianism/pesco vegetarianism and pollo vegetarianism may also be included, although there's some debate on that matter (pescetarians eat fish and pollo vegetarians eat fish and poultry, so although both groups exclude some meat they do consume animal flesh).
Without any qualifier, "vegetarian" refers to lacto-ovo vegetarianism. This means that a person does not eat any products that require the animal to be killed (meat, fish, gelatine, cochineal, rennet, etc.), but eats both dairy and eggs. Lacto vegetarians exclude eggs but eat dairy, while ovo vegetarians exclude dairy but eat eggs.
Given that the OP mentioned dairy and eggs, I'm assuming she's planning on following a vegan/plant-based diet.
tl;dr: Vegetarians eat animal products, vegans don't.
A perfect example of why words and meanings are important. Plant-based could mean no animal products or some animal products (hence the term "based"), but has no ethical connotation. Veganism does have an ethical connotation and saying "vegan diet" is misleading as to the term in general, and leads to others trying to co-opt the term. Regardless, clearly even in this thread the labels mean something different to different people, and this shows the importance of trying to use terms correctly, OP.
But, sorry to partially derail. Labels are important, but at the end of the day, eat a well-balanced diet and otherwise maintain a healthy lifestyle and you'll be ahead of the curve.
My bad. My understanding was that 'vegan diet' was the no-animal-product equivalent of the term 'vegetarian diet'. At any rate, I agree with you on the use of the term plant-based to distinguish between people who avoid all animal products and by-products for ethical reasons and those who choose to eat primarily/entirely plants for health reasons.0 -
Kim ! Ok I can't seem to post a whole sentence ! Wierd app ! I am sorry I didn't meant to come as offensive ! I did write a whole paragraph 3 times without success to post the whole thing ! In essence regardless of philosophy of vegan VS. Planet based diet they eat same foods ! So I wanted some pointers of how vegan/ planet based people maintain a good and balanced macros while avoiding meat / diaries and eggs! I hardly can eat leather belt for my lunch0
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If looking 15 years older and sick is your goal, go nuts. You couldn't pay me to go vegan.3
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Veganbaum... I'm sorry but what one wears is hardly a matter in a health and diet forum ! Name have meanings in context ! In this diet context what planet based people eat is same as what vegan eat ! It's easier to get guild lines from people ! For whatever reason we trying to share same dishes ! And what we eat rather than how we feel about what we eat was my main question!0
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mrsnattybulking wrote: »If looking 15 years older and sick is your goal, go nuts. You couldn't pay me to go vegan.
It sounds like you have met ignorant vegans, I know vegans who are in excellent health.2 -
Kim ! Ok I can't seem to post a whole sentence ! Wierd app ! I am sorry I didn't meant to come as offensive ! I did write a whole paragraph 3 times without success to post the whole thing ! In essence regardless of philosophy of vegan VS. Planet based diet they eat same foods ! So I wanted some pointers of how vegan/ planet based people maintain a good and balanced macros while avoiding meat / diaries and eggs! I hardly can eat leather belt for my lunch
No worries. I just wanted you to know that if you call yourself vegan, a lot of people will assume there is an ethical motivation beyond food.
I am by no means vegan, but I would suspect you will need to focus on getting enough protein with stuff like tofu, tempeh, seitan, beans and lentils, and try to get a wide variety of veggies. If you poke around on the Food and Nutrition board, you'll find a lot of posts with tips and suggestions for a healthy veg diet as well.1 -
so I decided to give it a go ! I want to see if I will really feel more energy and feel much better inside ! If I can really be more active living a planet based diet !!! So please if you can help me in this new journey add me and give me some beginners tips ☺️ nothing is too small since I'm really a newbie
1: Don't under eat -- as you increase the portion of your diet which contains vegetables, it's easy to under eat without realizing it. Fortunately, mfp makes it pretty easy to solve that problem. If you find you're often full but have a lot of calories to go until your daily calorie cap, try to add more things like rice, potatoes, legumes, etc into your diet.
2: If you're struggling with what to eat, here's a reasonable start: http://www.theveganrd.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/7-Habits-slides-Portland-Maine-2016.pdf
3: Address nutrition requirements, either via diet (if possible) or supplements. This post http://www.theveganrd.com/2010/11/recommended-supplements-for-vegans.html is a start.2 -
Okay, that's a new one. I thought it was sex, drugs and rock 'n' roll that did that!mrsnattybulking wrote: »If looking 15 years older and sick is your goal, go nuts. You couldn't pay me to go vegan.
I can assure you, I don't look 15 years older; in fact, people consistently think I'm 5-10 years younger than I am. I had a teenager think I was a uni student last night. I'm 31! Mind you, I think that it has sod all to do with my diet, and its got more to do with genetics and a certain immaturity of manner. Oh, and eschewing the drugs and the rock 'n' roll. That helps.
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Veganbaum... I'm sorry but what one wears is hardly a matter in a health and diet forum ! Name have meanings in context ! In this diet context what planet based people eat is same as what vegan eat ! It's easier to get guild lines from people ! For whatever reason we trying to share same dishes ! And what we eat rather than how we feel about what we eat was my main question!
Actually, saying you're plant based doesn't automatically mean you've completely eliminated animal products from your diet, just that the majority of your food is from plants. I eat a mostly whole foods, plant based diet for the possible long term health benefits, but I'm not a vegetarian because I still eat a bit of fish and beef. However, since 90+ percent of my diet is plant foods the label plant based would be appropriate. But, even if I eliminated all animal products from my diet it would never be appropriate for me to label myself a vegan. The term vegan means a very specific thing and diet is only a small part of that.
Another label that's more popular for a plant based diet is Flexitarian-one who mostly eats plant based foods but still includes a bit of animal products.
eta: edit for clarity
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Kim ! Ok I can't seem to post a whole sentence ! Wierd app ! I am sorry I didn't meant to come as offensive ! I did write a whole paragraph 3 times without success to post the whole thing ! In essence regardless of philosophy of vegan VS. Planet based diet they eat same foods ! So I wanted some pointers of how vegan/ planet based people maintain a good and balanced macros while avoiding meat / diaries and eggs! I hardly can eat leather belt for my lunch
If your posts are getting cut off, I'm guessing it's probably because you're using phone emojis that aren't compatible.... If you use them, text after it disappears when you post. If you're on your phone, only use the available mfp emojis1 -
livingleanlivingclean wrote: »Kim ! Ok I can't seem to post a whole sentence ! Wierd app ! I am sorry I didn't meant to come as offensive ! I did write a whole paragraph 3 times without success to post the whole thing ! In essence regardless of philosophy of vegan VS. Planet based diet they eat same foods ! So I wanted some pointers of how vegan/ planet based people maintain a good and balanced macros while avoiding meat / diaries and eggs! I hardly can eat leather belt for my lunch
If your posts are getting cut off, I'm guessing it's probably because you're using phone emojis that aren't compatible.... If you use them, text after it disappears when you post. If you're on your phone, only use the available mfp emojis
Thats probably whats happening! thanks!!!0
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