Not Sure where I fit in

LillysMomma09 · August 2017

So a little about me. I started my journey in December of 2015.
SW: 223
CW 183
H: 5'6
Age: 35
I'm super happy with what I've done so far. It's a slow process for me since I like to enjoy my weekends too much and too often. That being said I've pretty much been the same weight since October of last year. I've gone up a few and I've been as low as 177, but always seem to just to come back to around 183. That's with a losing mindset or with a maintenance mindset doesn't matter, stays the same. (give or take)
In January I decided to just be happy where I'm at but focus more on strength training and running. So I've bumped my deficit down to one pound per week. Again, weight stays about the same but I can tell a difference in my body with strength training even though the scale stays the same. The picture on the right is January, the picture on the left is 3 weeks ago, so there is a difference even with the same number on the scale.

So I guess my question is when do you know that maintenance is right for you?
I know I could lose more, but I like my curves, I don't want to lose them.
Does your body ever get to a point where it says NO MORE? With always coming back to around 183 for close to a year now I feel like this is maybe where I'm suppose to be? Idk, I just know I'm struggling with not having a clear plan. It's been lose lose lose for a year and half and these last few months I've just felt lost.

T0M_K · August 2017

There is no right or wrong answer here. If you are happy with you and you are healthy and your size isn't a detriment to your well being, then be the you you want to be and f everything and everyone else.

seltzermint555 · August 2017

I feel a little bit similarly to this.

I was in the 250-270 range for over a decade and then shot up to 307. Started losing weight w/o MFP (over several years) and got down to 270 which I thought was my body's "decided weight range".

BUT...I then lost weight using this site and got down to 166 lb. For me the CICO method worked so perfectly it was eerie, almost like clockwork. But then it started to get a little weird when I hit the 160s...didn't work so well anymore. I was/am okay with that, honestly, because I like my figure in the 160s-170s at 5'8" with large hips and bust.

And now...I have been set to 0.5 or 1 lb per week for the past two years and I basically bounce around from 170-180 lb this entire time.

Ideally I would like to be in the 160s again, or at least so ensconced in the 170s that I don't see the 180s again. There is absolutely no issue with 180-something as a "number" or size 10/12, whatever...I don't care, truly. I am active and healthy and happy. But it bugs me seeing 180-something on the scale simply because in my brain it's like "you have gained back almost 20 lb from your lowest, it's panic time".

I dunno...sorry if this doesn't really help or anything...I just feel like I can sort of relate. I never feel like maintenance quite describes my use of MFP now since I do want to go down at least a few pounds again. But after being over 250 for most of my adult life and now "maintaining" even under 200 is pretty cool, too. So I'm torn on what to define it as.

(I'm 40 by the way)

dancefit2015 · August 2017

I learned in my Psychology class last semesters that everyone's body had a "set-point", or a certain weight that it wants to be at. Our bodies work like a thermostat, if we lose weight and go below our set point, our bodies metabolisms will slow down and it will increase our appetites. If we go above our set point, our bodies will decrease our appetites and speed up our metabolisms. Our set points get higher with age and this is one of the reasons it gets harder to lose weight when you're older. Also, it is why once we get to a certain weight, it can be very hard to lose more.
I think that it's important to listen to your body and what it's telling you. If you are happy here and don't want to fight against your body, then I think it would be just fine for you to maintain here

dancefit2015 · August 2017

Also, just a thought... if your body is being stubborn and wanting to maintain (meaning you've hit your set-point), the strength training you are doing could be a great way to maintain your weight, but lose body fat, if you want to change your body composition.

ladyhusker39 · August 2017

dancefit2015 wrote: »

I learned in my Psychology class last semesters that everyone's body had a "set-point", or a certain weight that it wants to be at. Our bodies work like a thermostat, if we lose weight and go below our set point, our bodies metabolisms will slow down and it will increase our appetites. If we go above our set point, our bodies will decrease our appetites and speed up our metabolisms. Our set points get higher with age and this is one of the reasons it gets harder to lose weight when you're older. Also, it is why once we get to a certain weight, it can be very hard to lose more.
I think that it's important to listen to your body and what it's telling you. If you are happy here and don't want to fight against your body, then I think it would be just fine for you to maintain here

Ok, so you're saying that even if I eat at a deficit my body won't drop the weight because I've reached a "set point"? Then tell me where does my body get my deficit from? I get eating more food and not really being in a deficit, but that's not what I'm asking. I'm curious because I've heard this before and it goes against the physical science of CICO.

dancefit2015 · August 2017

@ladyhusker39 I'm not saying it's impossible to go below or above your set point, I am just saying that your body will fight against it. Which is one of the reasons that it gets harder to lose weight for some people before they have hit their original goal weight, like these ladies have described. And for a lot of people I don't think they find it worth it to do what it takes to maintain below their bodies set points. I personally have no intention to fight against my body's natural weapons once it tells me it's time to stop losing weight.

cwolfman13 · August 2017

You can always take a diet break and re-evaluate. This can be beneficial mentally if you've been dieting awhile...also, it will help reverse adaptive thermogenesis and reset your hormones, all of which is beneficial if you want to proceed with more weight loss down the road.

Does your body ever get to a point where it says NO MORE?

Sorta yes and sorta no...and generally more of an issue when you're already lean and trying to get leaner as hormones really start to fight you. Being super lean is not something the body wants to do and is really new in regards to our evolution. This is where a lot of the minors can come into play moreso than when you have more weight to lose...

For an example, I have no issue dropping to around 15% BF and maintaining that pretty easily. I can drop to 12%, but it takes a bit more discipline on my part in regards to restricting some things I would otherwise not restrict, but it's pretty doable. Below that is really friggin' hard for me...I pretty much have to be a diet and exercise nazi and avoid fun...granted I'm 43.

Personally, I don't put much stock into set point theory...I think it mostly comes down to what you're willing to do or not do from a lifestyle standpoint, relative leanness, genetics, and age.

LillysMomma09 · August 2017

dancefit2015 wrote: »

I learned in my Psychology class last semesters that everyone's body had a "set-point", or a certain weight that it wants to be at. Our bodies work like a thermostat, if we lose weight and go below our set point, our bodies metabolisms will slow down and it will increase our appetites. If we go above our set point, our bodies will decrease our appetites and speed up our metabolisms. Our set points get higher with age and this is one of the reasons it gets harder to lose weight when you're older. Also, it is why once we get to a certain weight, it can be very hard to lose more.
I think that it's important to listen to your body and what it's telling you. If you are happy here and don't want to fight against your body, then I think it would be just fine for you to maintain here

This. This explains what's happening and has been happening since October of last year!!
It literally goes perfectly with what my body is doing. Thank you for sharing this!!

lorrpb · August 2017

Your body comes back to 183 because you are eating to maintain at that level. The body doesn't independently decide where it wants to be. But the closer you get to maintenance, the harder it is to create a deficit. Your daily deficit needs to be only 250 cals to lose .5 per week, which is recommended level with less than 20 lbs to lose. It is very easy to underestimate calories in or overestimate calories out. A few thousand fewer steps per day can wipe out that deficit fast. That's why it's so hard to lose the last few pounds. Plus when we get to that point we often want to relax our eating habits and have a few more treats, which usually results in a lower deficit. So as said above it's up to you where you feel comfortable. That said, with a good lifting program (recomp) you will likely keep/improve your curvy look even staying at the same weight or losing a few more pounds.

dancefit2015 · August 2017

@cwolfman13 I think what you said about hormones fighting to avoid getting too lean goes along with set point. As the set point is meant to be the weight where our bodies function optimally and with all of the important roles fat plays in our bodies, we won't function "optimally" if body fat gets too low.

dancefit2015 · August 2017

@LillysMomma09 I'm glad I could help

OliveGirl128 · August 2017

lorrpb wrote: »

Your body comes back to 183 because you are eating to maintain at that level. The body doesn't independently decide where it wants to be. But the closer you get to maintenance, the harder it is to create a deficit. Your daily deficit needs to be only 250 cals to lose .5 per week, which is recommended level with less than 20 lbs to lose. It is very easy to underestimate calories in or overestimate calories out. A few thousand fewer steps per day can wipe out that deficit fast. That's why it's so hard to lose the last few pounds. Plus when we get to that point we often want to relax our eating habits and have a few more treats, which usually results in a lower deficit. So as said above it's up to you where you feel comfortable. That said, with a good lifting program (recomp) you will likely keep/improve your curvy look even staying at the same weight or losing a few more pounds.

This.

STEVE142142 · August 2017

Congratulations on your success. There is no right answer there is no wrong answer it's what you feel comfortable at. What you have to remember is weight is just the number yes it does mean something but more importantly when you look at yourself in the mirror you have to like what you see.

I'll give you my perspective. Went from approximately 288 to 220. I decided how I look at 2:20 and I went into maintenance. Totally screwed it up when as low as 204. I actually flirted with going into the hundreds but I didn't like the way I look. I started lifting and for the past 10 months I've been in that 208-210 range and I currently like where I am.

LillysMomma09 · August 2017

Thanks for sharing everyone. I appreciate your thoughts on the subject.

skymningen · August 2017

About the 'set point': There might be one, but it is not set in stone. It's a hurdle to get over or under, but once you get away from it far enough in the right direction, you do not necessarily bounce back.
Mine used to be 10 kg higher than it is now. And again, I am at a point like it, just it is 10 kg lower than it would have been two years ago.
My life changed, my body, brain and microbiota adapted to the new weight. I think that point is just more or less what you are used to (mentally by eating at the maintenance for that level, metabolically and in many other ways).

whosshe · August 2017

dancefit2015 wrote: »

@ladyhusker39 I'm not saying it's impossible to go below or above your set point, I am just saying that your body will fight against it. Which is one of the reasons that it gets harder to lose weight for some people before they have hit their original goal weight, like these ladies have described. And for a lot of people I don't think they find it worth it to do what it takes to maintain below their bodies set points. I personally have no intention to fight against my body's natural weapons once it tells me it's time to stop losing weight.

Please don't use psychology to explain biology.

skymningen · August 2017

eliciaobrien1 wrote: »

dancefit2015 wrote: »

@ladyhusker39 I'm not saying it's impossible to go below or above your set point, I am just saying that your body will fight against it. Which is one of the reasons that it gets harder to lose weight for some people before they have hit their original goal weight, like these ladies have described. And for a lot of people I don't think they find it worth it to do what it takes to maintain below their bodies set points. I personally have no intention to fight against my body's natural weapons once it tells me it's time to stop losing weight.

Please don't use psychology to explain biology.

A lot of it is connected in both directions.

ItsyBitsy246 · August 2017

dancefit2015 wrote: »

@ladyhusker39 I'm not saying it's impossible to go below or above your set point, I am just saying that your body will fight against it. Which is one of the reasons that it gets harder to lose weight for some people before they have hit their original goal weight, like these ladies have described. And for a lot of people I don't think they find it worth it to do what it takes to maintain below their bodies set points. I personally have no intention to fight against my body's natural weapons once it tells me it's time to stop losing weight.

Personally, I think this is a load of crap and a half. From a psychological perspective, perhaps there are implications, but not biologically to any significant degree. I'm always open to any shared science on the topic, however. Key word: science.

skymningen · August 2017

It is weekend and I actually worked today so I am a little unwilling to do a search for publications, but generally speaking in medicine there is an effect called 'dosage response'. While it is most often depicted as a linear relationship (because it was originally used for drugs, to determine the dosage where the strength of the response would 'outweigh' the likelihood and severity of side effects), people start to look more into a similar response based on threshold.
Actually, thresholds are already used in many medications, especially ones that you might have to take every day. Those can work on the basis, that if regularly taken while keep the levels of some compound in your body over a threshold which is needed to suppress any adverse effects by an illness. Some of these have more 'wiggle space', for others your body will have severe reactions suddenly when dropping under a threshold.

So generally, thresholds exist in our biological setup. The body is a very complex system. When your metabolism changes, that could well have the effect to get you under some threshold where your body will try to counter-regulate and you might very well jump around at some weight for longer than usual because for some reason the change your metabolism needs to make to stay consistently under it is more severe and more countered than your usual, continuous changes during weight loss (or gain). And like people do have different BMRs for various reasons, they would also have different threshold, so not everyone stalls at the same point (and some do not have this problem at all).

Wow, I am tired. Excuse me if that was confusing, it sounded easy in my head.

deputy_randolph · August 2017

I didn't really totally believe in a "set point" until recently. My body "wants" to weigh 137lbs.

Back when I was a "cardio queen," I got down to 123lbs (size 6ish). If I loosened up on my diet and cut back on cardio, I would creep up to 137lbs (size 8-10).

When I started lifting heavy and still did pretty serious amount of cardio, I dropped back to 123lbs (size 2 this time). I cut back on amount of cardio, started lifting more intensely; my weight crept up 14lbs...I'm at 137lbs again. However, I'm a size 4 at 137 this time instead of the 8+ range.

See my point? I could be a "skinny fat" 137 OR a built/leanish 137...my body wants to be 137. In both situation, 137 has seemed to be maintainable.

ETA: there are probably both biological AND psychological factors at play for me. 137 might not be biologically 100% set in stone; it might be my psychological upper limit for my weight.

countcurt · August 2017

cwolfman13 wrote: »

I can drop to 12%, but it takes a bit more discipline on my part in regards to restricting some things I would otherwise not restrict, but it's pretty doable. Below that is really friggin' hard for me...I pretty much have to be a diet and exercise nazi and avoid fun...granted I'm 43.

Personally, I don't put much stock into set point theory...I think it mostly comes down to what you're willing to do or not do from a lifestyle standpoint, relative leanness, genetics, and age.

This.

Sometimes we forget that just because we can attain a certain weight doesn't mean we can maintain it.

Rusty740 · August 2017

I don't mean this in a mean spirited way, but I want to tell you the truth. You are overweight and you do have a higher risk of health problems as a result and you are totally capable about doing something about it and you can still have curves and be healthy. Let's not confuse "curves" with "I'm ok within being unhealthy because I don't think I can do it". You CAN and should do it and I'm disappointed nobody has really been blunt with you on this post.

Now about your set-points. There is a reputable theory called the set-point theory that thinks our bodys like to be at a certain body fat %, personally it makes total sense, but Mike Israetel at Temple University thinks that set-points can be changed when we stay at a certain weight for a period of time. It sounds to me like there are hormonal or other mechanisms that take a long time to change, then when they do, they exert pressure to stay at the same weight. Anyhow, my guess is that at some point in your past you spent a long period of time around 183 lbs.

I see that you've tried to lose 2 lbs per week and been successful, that's great, well done, but it's really hard to maintain this type of deficit. I'd turn into a zombie and want to eat my kids after awhile. The point is, by reducing your deficit to 1 or 0.5 lbs per week and tracking the hell out of it, you will be both successful at losing weight and happy doing it.

I'm really sorry to be a bit harsh, but I just thought it was needed. You can do it, you're body will fight you back, but you are in control.

ALG775 · August 2017

Any weight you lose and keep off will help you improve your health-even if you don't meet the "magical" normal bmi.
Why not stay where you are for now and see what happens with your recomp.
You can always decide to lose more later if you like.

kokonani · August 2017

So if everyone has a set point, I wonder what mine is. I am trying to maintain at 115 lbs, but I keep losing eating 1600-1900 calories. I am at 113lbs now, 5'4". So my set point is that low? Set point sounds like BS to me.. CICO sometimes seems that way also.. I think it's a bunch of factors that affect everybody differently..

WilmaValley · August 2017

I've been reading about set points so this is very interesting. Thanks!

kellywrae · August 2017

Actually Set Ponit is biology and has been researched and peer reviewed as such. Read Secrets From the Eating Lab: The Science of Weight Loss... by Traci Mann PhD. She is the Dr. That heads up the University of Minnesota's Health and Eating Lab. Or Google The Mann Lab. Her studies are all done scientifically and peer reviewed. The information is enlightening.

LillysMomma09 · September 2017

Rusty740 wrote: »

I don't mean this in a mean spirited way, but I want to tell you the truth. You are overweight and you do have a higher risk of health problems as a result and you are totally capable about doing something about it and you can still have curves and be healthy. Let's not confuse "curves" with "I'm ok within being unhealthy because I don't think I can do it". You CAN and should do it and I'm disappointed nobody has really been blunt with you on this post.

Now about your set-points. There is a reputable theory called the set-point theory that thinks our bodys like to be at a certain body fat %, personally it makes total sense, but Mike Israetel at Temple University thinks that set-points can be changed when we stay at a certain weight for a period of time. It sounds to me like there are hormonal or other mechanisms that take a long time to change, then when they do, they exert pressure to stay at the same weight. Anyhow, my guess is that at some point in your past you spent a long period of time around 183 lbs.

I see that you've tried to lose 2 lbs per week and been successful, that's great, well done, but it's really hard to maintain this type of deficit. I'd turn into a zombie and want to eat my kids after awhile. The point is, by reducing your deficit to 1 or 0.5 lbs per week and tracking the hell out of it, you will be both successful at losing weight and happy doing it.

I'm really sorry to be a bit harsh, but I just thought it was needed. You can do it, you're body will fight you back, but you are in control.

Thank you for telling me the "truth", however I don't feel you can tell someone they are overweight by a number without seeing them for yourself. I do not feel that I'm overweight. I'm more healthy now then I have ever been in my entire life. But again, thank you for telling me the truth.

cwolfman13 · September 2017

dancefit2015 wrote: »

@cwolfman13 I think what you said about hormones fighting to avoid getting too lean goes along with set point. As the set point is meant to be the weight where our bodies function optimally and with all of the important roles fat plays in our bodies, we won't function "optimally" if body fat gets too low.

But your hormones don't really start fighting you in the way I described until you're really lean...for most guys, that's single digit BF%...for women that would be in the teens.

SueSueDio · September 2017

LillysMomma09 wrote: »

Thank you for telling me the "truth", however I don't feel you can tell someone they are overweight by a number without seeing them for yourself. I do not feel that I'm overweight. I'm more healthy now then I have ever been in my entire life. But again, thank you for telling me the truth.

There's no doubt that you've done great work in getting your weight down and are certainly looking fitter and healthier - and clearly feeling it too! Well done.

I think what @Rusty740 is getting at is the BMI scale. I know that people will say, "But it doesn't apply to everyone!", which is true, but I believe that for a majority of people it's a fairly good indicator of a suitable weight range for one's height. At 183lbs you're near the top of the "overweight" category - I know because I'm also 5'6", and 186lbs would put us into "obese" territory. These may not be words we like, but they are medical terms for what we are at those weights.

For us, 154lbs is the top of the "normal" range for our height - a range which goes down to 115lbs and can still be healthy, so it does take account of smaller/larger frame sizes. I finally reached that point for the first time in May, after nearly 18 months (started at 217lbs), and have managed to maintain 151-154lbs for the past 3 months without creeping back over the "overweight" border. I'd like to lose a bit more, but I'm going to wait until after my birthday to start up my deficit again!

My point is that it can be done. I was over 200lbs for years. I don't particularly believe that the body has a "set point", but it's possible that the mind does. If you're comfortable at your current weight, feel fit and healthy enough to do the things you want to do, and don't feel that you want to restrict your intake any further, by all means stay at this weight for a while and see how it goes. If your doctor is at all concerned about your health, or if you're unable to do the things you want to, then you might wish to consider losing a bit more at some point. The choice is yours!

seltzermint555 · September 2017

I think most doctors would take one look at LillysMomma09 and say "yes, this woman is at a healthy and normal weight" and wouldn't be one tiny bit concerned about the scale and BMI stats in great detail. Just my opinion.

Not Sure where I fit in

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