Forward lean on squat

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  • Squidgeypaws007
    Squidgeypaws007 Posts: 1,012 Member
    edited January 2018
    I'm not sure if anyone has said this, but the anatomy of a squat is different for different people depending on internal and external hip rotation and the flexibility of your hips, hammies and ankles.

    I'd totally go with going lighter and focusing on keeping the back straight but have you tried different foot placement (e.g. wider/narrower/feet facing in-out-forward)?

    ETA: r.e. the flexibility - are you stretching pre-squat? If not could be worth adding in some time to specifically stretch the lower posterial chain :)
  • jjpptt2
    jjpptt2 Posts: 5,650 Member
    I'm hesitant to go down the "your form is off" rabbit hole without a video/pictures. Optimal form varies depending on an individual's bone/joint structure. Additionally, there is a big difference between form that isn't optimal and form that is bad/dangerous.

    Without a video, I'd say that if you feel in control of the weight with your body under the bar, and grounded through your feet, then you're probably mostly right. Perhaps you just need to be a little more hip-centric, especially coming out of the hole?

    Is there another trainer from whom you can get a second opinion? Or can you post a vid at some point?
  • jjpptt2
    jjpptt2 Posts: 5,650 Member
    Have you tried front squats? Having the weight in front of you forces you to be more upright. Trying a few reps/sets with light weight might help you determine if it's a mobility issue or a technique issue.
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  • canadianlbs
    canadianlbs Posts: 5,199 Member
    jessef593 wrote: »
    Or focus on the main movements. I see all these people trying 1 legged. 1 armed movements. Making hardly any strength or size gains

    sure, but they may not be going for strength or size gains.
  • hoppgeorge
    hoppgeorge Posts: 368 Member
    I recently had a similar experience. I stripped all the weight offof the bar and started from scratch. I work on mobiliy and i record my sets and watch them as i rest. Maybe not ideal, but it is helping me. Plus, the couple that called my attentiion to what i was doing wrong are gracious enough to watch one of my sets every couple of days. I guess in that respecti am lucky. Good luck to you! I hope you find something that helps. And dont use running shoes
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    edited January 2018
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  • hoppgeorge
    hoppgeorge Posts: 368 Member
    I wish i had a good answer. I recorded my deadlifts too and realized i needed to tweak my form. So i pulled some weight off. Again. I am lucky to have some accomplished people around to help. Do you have any trainers around that can actually help? I know it personally sucks to check your pride, and weight on the bar, at the door lol.
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  • mreichard
    mreichard Posts: 235 Member
    MistressSara wrote: »
    hoppgeorge wrote: »
    I recently had a similar experience. I stripped all the weight offof the bar and started from scratch. I work on mobiliy and i record my sets and watch them as i rest. Maybe not ideal, but it is helping me. Plus, the couple that called my attentiion to what i was doing wrong are gracious enough to watch one of my sets every couple of days. I guess in that respecti am lucky. Good luck to you! I hope you find something that helps. And dont use running shoes

    Ok, New can of worms:

    The rest of my lifts are fine and progressing. If I drop the weight on squats, do I run the risk of creating an imbalance? Does it mean I should drop the weight on DLs too? That would make me unhappy. :'(

    I've dropped weight and re-tooled my squat many times. I've also deloaded deadlifts to work on form. The two were independent for me. Periodic deloads are built into every program I know of, and they are exercise-specific.

    As for forward lean, I'd watch Mark Rippetoe's squat video on low bar squats. I could never do anything with high-bar squats, and would always get pushed forward by the weight so I ended up doing a good morning as I was squatting. Switched to low bar squats and eliminated that problem.

    I'd pick and choose who you get advice from -- some people who apparently don't know low bar squat form get really upset when they see someone more leaned forward doing low bar squats. I had a guy run over and get behind me in the squat rack uninvited to try to spot me mid set, then when I racked the bar tell me I should never squat that way. When I asked him if he'd ever heard of low-bar squats, he admitted he hadn't.
  • Unknown
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    edited January 2018
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  • shor0814
    shor0814 Posts: 559 Member
    jjpptt2 wrote: »
    I'm hesitant to go down the "your form is off" rabbit hole without a video/pictures. Optimal form varies depending on an individual's bone/joint structure. Additionally, there is a big difference between form that isn't optimal and form that is bad/dangerous.

    Without a video, I'd say that if you feel in control of the weight with your body under the bar, and grounded through your feet, then you're probably mostly right. Perhaps you just need to be a little more hip-centric, especially coming out of the hole?

    Is there another trainer from whom you can get a second opinion? Or can you post a vid at some point?

    This is one of the better points made. How tall you are and your proportions change advice given. Short torso and long femurs require a more exaggerated lean. Without a video there isn't much that can be said.

    Don't let the "form police" lead you down a dangerous path. In fact there are lots of "form police" trying to "correct" world record holding squatters in their YouTube videos. Look up Layne Norton's squat videos, you might see some similarities.

    My use of "form police" refers to nobody in this thread but they are out there and they sometimes work in gyms.
  • Cherimoose
    Cherimoose Posts: 5,208 Member
    MistressSara wrote: »
    If I drop the weight on squats, do I run the risk of creating an imbalance? Does it mean I should drop the weight on DLs too?

    Nope, just add in split squats or the leg press and you'll be good to go.

    By the way, if you feel upper back pain on squats, there's a good chance your deadlift form is not as tight as you think.

    If you're not comfortable posting a video (despite showing your face in your profile) try emailing it to the person who started this thread. He knows squat. :+1:


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    edited January 2018
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  • shor0814
    shor0814 Posts: 559 Member
    edited January 2018
    MistressSara wrote: »
    Ok, I recorded a video. I look & sound like a dork but I'll put it up if anyone can tell me how. I have no teenagers. I'd rather not do a YouTube link.

    I think you can put it on YouTube without making it fully public and still post the link here.

    https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/157177?co=GENIE.Platform=Desktop&hl=en
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    edited January 2018
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  • jessef593
    jessef593 Posts: 2,272 Member
    canadianlbs wrote: »
    jessef593 wrote: »
    Or focus on the main movements. I see all these people trying 1 legged. 1 armed movements. Making hardly any strength or size gains

    sure, but they may not be going for strength or size gains.

    Aside from working around an injury or improving upon imbalances(which almost no average joe gym goer knows how to do.) why would you want to do something that is less functional, can actually create imbalances(people tend to start with and do more reps on their dominant side)? I’ve found it’s generally because people are trying to earn badass points in the gym. Out of all the serious lifters I’ve trained with (record holding power lifters/competitive bodybuilders) the only one who ever suggested unilateral movements was the one attempting to look edgy, would ask random people to do a photo shoot of him during a set, and thought kai green is all natural and just knows a lot.

    So someone not very knowledgeable. If you CAN and aren’t limited by injury or some other issue. You should always focus on compound movements no matter your reason in the gym. Be it progression, maintenance, regression.

  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    Based on your video, I see what looks like a lack of bracing in your abs during the squat. You have some excess arch and that may be driving the forward lean as much as anything. You have anterior pelvic tilt which exacerbates things. None of these are glaring flaws—I had to watch the video numerous times.

    Here is an article that I think might be appropriate:

    https://www.t-nation.com/training/lift-big-by-bracing-not-arching

    BTW, kudos for putting up the video. Not always easy to do.
  • deputy_randolph
    deputy_randolph Posts: 940 Member
    You have the bar basically at the same spot I had the bar before I had to lower it. Low bar might help.

    Google "low bar squat position;" I don't know how to post a link, but you should immediately be able to see the difference in bar position.
  • watts6151
    watts6151 Posts: 905 Member
    Nice video here

    https://youtu.be/ZlHgCnIxsJY
  • Okiludy
    Okiludy Posts: 558 Member
    You could be doing something closer to a low bar squat that has less of an upright position at the bottom.

    https://youtu.be/vmNPOjaGrVE
  • shor0814
    shor0814 Posts: 559 Member
    MistressSara wrote: »
    https://youtu.be/5jQK6vrYZJM

    Certainly nothing crazy wrong with your squat just a bit too far forward, bar should be in line with the mid-foot. I see 2 options.

    1. You lean a bit too far in your setup, stand more upright, brace hard and squat without changing your lean position. You hold your angle pretty well as is, just a bit too far forward to start.
    2. Lower the bar to the spine of the scapula (tighten your back to make a "shelf") and use the same lean. Brace hard again and just do what you are doing.

    #1 will be easier if you don't have a rack, #2 will probably feel more natural for you if you do have a rack to get the bar in position.
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    edited January 2018
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  • bbell1985
    bbell1985 Posts: 4,571 Member
    I'm going to start introducing my lifts in my form videos now.
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  • bbell1985
    bbell1985 Posts: 4,571 Member
    MistressSara wrote: »
    bbell1985 wrote: »
    I'm going to start introducing my lifts in my form videos now.

    Did I do that wrong?

    It's cute. Kind of funny. Just made me laugh. You don't have to say anything lol.
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