Faster cardio or not, what’s your opinion!
Replies
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Cardio in an of itself is not going to catabolize your muscles unless you are not fueling yourself enough or getting enough protein (Too large of a deficit and inadequate protein) or not doing proper strength training.
No need to major in the minors.
BCAA's or just Leucine will not hurt, and the risk vs reward factor is on its side. I mean cardio for me is a must, 4 days a week, 130 minutes, always after my weight training. So my glycogen levels are most likely fully depleted after an hour push, pull, or legs workout. So I really believe that it's a great idea to supplement with Leucine or a BCAA product, to be on the safe side. This is a muscle building forum, so the goal is to make gains.
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GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
BCAA's or just Leucine will not hurt, and the risk vs reward factor is on its side. I mean cardio for me is a must, 4 days a week, 130 minutes, always after my weight training. So my glycogen levels are most likely fully depleted after an hour push, pull, or legs workout. So I really believe that it's a great idea to supplement with Leucine or a BCAA product, to be on the safe side. This is a muscle building forum, so the goal is to make gains.
130 minutes of cardio when you are trying to gain muscle seems like a huge waste of calories, spending it on cardio instead of growth? Unless you are bulking while training for an endurance event, that amount of cardio seems counter productive to your goals.5 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
BCAA's or just Leucine will not hurt, and the risk vs reward factor is on its side. I mean cardio for me is a must, 4 days a week, 130 minutes, always after my weight training. So my glycogen levels are most likely fully depleted after an hour push, pull, or legs workout. So I really believe that it's a great idea to supplement with Leucine or a BCAA product, to be on the safe side. This is a muscle building forum, so the goal is to make gains.
An hour of strength training isn't going to put any significant dent in your glycogen stores. That's just a broscience myth from bodybuilders who don't like cardio!
Two hours of intense cardio yes, an hour of strength training, absolutely not.
If you have ever hit the wall (running) or bonked (cycling) you would know all about it - it's unmistakable.
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GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
BCAA's or just Leucine will not hurt, and the risk vs reward factor is on its side. I mean cardio for me is a must, 4 days a week, 130 minutes, always after my weight training. So my glycogen levels are most likely fully depleted after an hour push, pull, or legs workout. So I really believe that it's a great idea to supplement with Leucine or a BCAA product, to be on the safe side. This is a muscle building forum, so the goal is to make gains.
I disagree. They hurt the wallet with no benefit. If you read the research above, you would know it is more than clear that BCAAs are useless. So taking them does nothing to "be on the safe side". Cause science.5 -
130 minutes of cardio when you are trying to gain muscle seems like a huge waste of calories, spending it on cardio instead of growth? Unless you are bulking while training for an endurance event, that amount of cardio seems counter productive to your goals.
I'm in a 500+ caloric surplus a day, goal is to get bigger but minimize body fat as much as possible.
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An hour of strength training isn't going to put any significant dent in your glycogen stores. That's just a broscience myth from bodybuilders who don't like cardio!
Two hours of intense cardio yes, an hour of strength training, absolutely not.
If you have ever hit the wall (running) or bonked (cycling) you would know all about it - it's unmistakable.
I eat very light before going to the gym, normally a PB&J sandwich with 1.5 scoops of my pre workout. I do a push, pull, legs. So I'm burning tons of calories.. I go heavy on my first exercise for each body part, normally in the 4-6 rep range, with 2-3 minutes between sets. After the first exercise of each body part, its fast rest periods, 30-45 seconds, in the higher rep range, 10-12 sometimes 12-15. Then after my hour workout, 30 minutes of HIIT. I burn close to 600 calories every time I step in the gym, and I consume about 3,300 calories a day.
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GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
I eat very light before going to the gym, normally a PB&J sandwich with 1.5 scoops of my pre workout. I do a push, pull, legs. So I'm burning tons of calories.. I go heavy on my first exercise for each body part, normally in the 4-6 rep range, with 2-3 minutes between sets. After the first exercise of each body part, its fast rest periods, 30-45 seconds, in the higher rep range, 10-12 sometimes 12-15. Then after my hour workout, 30 minutes of HIIT. I burn close to 600 calories every time I step in the gym, and I consume about 3,300 calories a day.
600 cals isn't anywhere close to causing any issues with your glycogen stores which could easily total 2,000 cals - and you aren't burning exclusively glycogen anyway. The carbs you eat are also adding to your fuel.
By the way if you really thought glycogen depletion was an issue then you would eat carbs surely!
Hint - it's why sport energy drinks are loaded with glucose.
Hint 2 - carbs are also muscle sparing.
You really do need to review your information sources.8 -
The only time I do fasted cardio is in the summer when I primarily ride in the early morning during the week to beat the heat...then I have breakfast pretty much right after.1
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600 cals isn't anywhere close to causing any issues with your glycogen stores which could easily total 2,000 cals - and you aren't burning exclusively glycogen anyway. The carbs you eat are also adding to your fuel.
By the way if you really thought glycogen depletion was an issue then you would eat carbs surely!
Hint - it's why sport energy drinks are loaded with glucose.
Hint 2 - carbs are also muscle sparing.
You really do need to review your information sources.
+1 This^6 -
trigden1991 wrote: »There are conditions and protocols that use fasted cardio to increase fat metabolism however they are pointless for 99% of the general population. Have a read of Lyle McDonalds, stubborn fat protocols.
@trigden1991 Are we talking it makes fat loss more efficient/faster or it can actually have an effect on alpha-receptor stubborn fat in very lean individuals? I think I may have to give his book a read just, even just for more knowledge.0 -
600 cals isn't anywhere close to causing any issues with your glycogen stores which could easily total 2,000 cals - and you aren't burning exclusively glycogen anyway. The carbs you eat are also adding to your fuel.
By the way if you really thought glycogen depletion was an issue then you would eat carbs surely!
Hint - it's why sport energy drinks are loaded with glucose.
Hint 2 - carbs are also muscle sparing.
You really do need to review your information sources.
Alright well first off, I train in the afternoon. I have breakfast which is mostly fats and protein, then before my workout I get some carbs. I don't like to eat a lot and go to the gym, it has a negative effect on my training. Fast digesting carbs, slow digesting carbs, little fat, little protein... I just never felt great at the gym if I consumed more than like 200 calories. I only went to school for nutrition science... But thanks
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Listen, if you're panting and your heart is racing, your body is most likely using more energy. Where does it get this energy? From carb stores in the glycogen in your liver (leftover from yesterday or today or whatnot). Once this runs out, your body accesses fat (this is grade 12 biology by the way, i'm currently taking it). So, what do you want? Less energy used or more energy used? Which one makes your heart race more, pump more blood for more oxygen, etc. Logically, it's the faster pace
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I prefer Fasted, but I usually dont have time in the mornings, so I run in the evenings, usually after dinner.
ETA: once my runs get longer, I will not do fasted runs on my long runs, Im training for my 3rd Marathon, and once I get over 8 miles, I cant do it fasted.1 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
Alright well first off, I train in the afternoon. I have breakfast which is mostly fats and protein, then before my workout I get some carbs. I don't like to eat a lot and go to the gym, it has a negative effect on my training. Fast digesting carbs, slow digesting carbs, little fat, little protein... I just never felt great at the gym if I consumed more than like 200 calories. I only went to school for nutrition science... But thanks
Time to get your text books out then I would suggest.7 -
Time to get your text books out then I would suggest.
Yeah, good one7 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
I'm in a 500+ caloric surplus a day, goal is to get bigger but minimize body fat as much as possible.
So a few things. Your surplus size controls fat gains... Not your cardio and strength training split. So if you want to minimize fat gains, have a small surplus.
Also, BCAAs are the equivalent of having a match without the wood for a fire. So you can start protein synthesis, but it wont drive protein turnover.6 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
Alright well first off, I train in the afternoon. I have breakfast which is mostly fats and protein, then before my workout I get some carbs. I don't like to eat a lot and go to the gym, it has a negative effect on my training. Fast digesting carbs, slow digesting carbs, little fat, little protein... I just never felt great at the gym if I consumed more than like 200 calories. I only went to school for nutrition science... But thanks
You could've fooled me with the amount of broscience you've been writing since your first post.6 -
stevencloser wrote: »
You could've fooled me with the amount of broscience you've been writing since your first post.
I'm in hella shape, that's all that matters. Bro8 -
Listen, if you're panting and your heart is racing, your body is most likely using more energy. Where does it get this energy? From carb stores in the glycogen in your liver (leftover from yesterday or today or whatnot). Once this runs out, your body accesses fat (this is grade 12 biology by the way, i'm currently taking it). So, what do you want? Less energy used or more energy used? Which one makes your heart race more, pump more blood for more oxygen, etc. Logically, it's the faster pace
12th grade biology? How old are you? 18 I hope...
Get off my lawn!
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GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
I'm in hella shape, that's all that matters. Bro
Not for giving other people advice. Not by a long shot.7 -
Although slow cardio occupies my body and mind when slowly munching snacks threatens.0
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stevencloser wrote: »
Not for giving other people advice. Not by a long shot.
+1. Standard logical fallacy. I somehow managed to get in good shape, so I should dispense broscience advice. I forget who said it but it was basically that some people get in good shape despite their methods.6 -
I guess I now work out in a fasted state as I wake up at 5, I. The gym by 530. I eat breakfast after I get back home at 700.
I do find that strength and endurance suffer. Is it Morning? Is it fasted state? Don’t know. Don’t really care. Does feel good when I go on a Saturday or Sunday afternoon and blast a new PB.0 -
+1. Standard logical fallacy. I somehow managed to get in good shape, so I should dispense broscience advice. I forget who said it but it was basically that some people get in good shape despite their methods.
Yeah, no hard work, no sacrifice, no discipline. All luck, and I just happened to get in great shape. Crazy...5 -
stevencloser wrote: »
Not for giving other people advice. Not by a long shot.
People should take just 1 class, and that's how to listen.6 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
Yeah, no hard work, no sacrifice, no discipline. All luck, and I just happened to get in great shape. Crazy...
Following all that broscience, maybe you worked way harder than necessary. Or maybe, you had superior genetic potential. Whatever. That doesn't lend credibility to your posts.
PS: Don't throw your shoulder out with all the patting yourself on the back.9 -
Following all that broscience, maybe you worked way harder than necessary. Or maybe, you had superior genetic potential. Whatever. That doesn't lend credibility to your posts.
PS: Don't throw your shoulder out with all the patting yourself on the back.
I believe it does, I'm proud of everything I have accomplished. I have pride my man, I'm sorry if I come off arrogant. But, that's just me. I give advice for what has worked for me, I'm now 180 pounds, single digit body fat, maybe not anymore because I'm in a pretty significant surplus.. but I was always skinny, could never gain weight, so forget about muscle. I'm just here to help, everybody is an expert now a days with different opinions. So, I accept that. People will choose who they want to take advice from, and that's it6 -
GainsLevelIncreased wrote: »
I believe it does, I'm proud of everything I have accomplished. I have pride my man, I'm sorry if I come off arrogant. But, that's just me. I give advice for what has worked for me, I'm now 180 pounds, single digit body fat, maybe not anymore because I'm in a pretty significant surplus.. but I was always skinny, could never gain weight, so forget about muscle. I'm just here to help, everybody is an expert now a days with different opinions. So, I accept that. People will choose who they want to take advice from, and that's it
You know there a people who make the science of nutrition and fitness their life's work and are very good at it. People like Lyle McDonald, Layne Norton, James Krieger, Alan Aragon, Brad Shoenfeld. They focus on research.
Given a choice, I will read them and listen to them every time. They are the proven experts. Most of what you have recommended does not agree with the ideas these people have published. Why should anyone listen to you when these resources are available?
Most of the people who have pushed back on you in this thread did you with good reason. You will choose to believe what you like. A suggestion though. A little less arrogance and pride and a little more reading and learning from credible resources might be in your best interests.
There are people who have posted disputing your ideas who have accomplished just as much as you have in terms of fitness and health. Food for thought.9 -
You know there a people who make the science of nutrition and fitness their life's work and are very good at it. People like Lyle McDonald, Layne Norton, James Krieger, Alan Aragon, Brad Shoenfeld. They focus on research.
Given a choice, I will read them and listen to them every time. They are the proven experts. Most of what you have recommended does not agree with the ideas these people have published. Why should anyone listen to you when these resources are available?
Most of the people who have pushed back on you in this thread did you with good reason. You will choose to believe what you like. A suggestion though. A little less arrogance and pride and a little more reading and learning from credible resources might be in your best interests.
There are people who have posted disputing your ideas who have accomplished just as much as you have in terms of fitness and health. Food for thought.
Thanks for the advice, good day mate2 -
Doesn’t make a difference as I’ve done fasted cardio then lift. Now I lift then do fasted cardio, I’ve notice my heart rate is up and burn more calories post lift0
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