Advice body fat reduction
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alexsusanu wrote: »...Dont want to rush much, but how long do you reckon would take me to see the abs somewhat defined ?...
However long it takes you to get around 13-15% bodyfat (depending upon genetics). That's about the point where abs usually start getting "somewhat" defined (i.e., blurry, but you can see maybe the outline of a 4-pack). There's no definitive way of saying how long that will be in terms of time - but it won't be fast, so buckle in for the long term.3 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »jseams1234 wrote: »You're over-doing the protein to no particular benefit.
Anything over 150-175-200.... is already in the plenty range.
I would personally move the rest over to carbs... especially if I was timing them to fuel my exercise!
He's cutting. During a cut you need MORE protein than you would bulking or during maintenance.
"1 gram of protein per pound of body weight (2.2 g/kg of BW) per day has been a bodybuilding rule of thumb for decades. Higher levels of protein intake, usually in the range of 1.2 – 1.5 grams per pound of body weight (2.6 – 3.3 g/kg BW) per day, are commonly recommended when “cutting” to lose fat."
I agree, 300 is probably a bit high - but then again, he didn't mention how much he weighs.
I have seen no evidence that this is true, it's just bro science as far as I can tell. You might have a slight increase in protein requirements, but I have yet to see research that suggests that any of us here actually need the .8g/lb level let alone beyond that. The basic point is that a person who is completely sedentary requires .4g/lb each day for replenishment and the most we can increase protein synthesis to is double that i.e. .8g/lb. Thoughts are that beyond that level might...,
Lyle McDonald
“So basically we have an intake continuum ranging from about 1.5 g/kg (0.68 g/lb) as a minimum for the obese non-training individual up to a high of around 3.3 g/kg (1.5 g/lb) of protein per pound of lean body mass for very lean heavily training athletes or bodybuilders with middle ground values being found in between those two extremes.”
“So that’s what I mean by ‘adequate protein on a diet’ when I use that phrase. It’s context dependent with the primary variables being body fat percentage (as this goes up, protein requirements go down), caloric intake (as caloric intake goes down, protein requirements go up and vice versa), and activity (with regular activity generally increasing protein requirements).”
https://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/protein-intake-while-dieting-qa.html/
I do tend to get lazy and just use BW and not LBM and I can see how this can be problematic for very obese individuals.
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I just made a post on slow progress....over 3.5 years. So yeah.7
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jseams1234 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »jseams1234 wrote: »You're over-doing the protein to no particular benefit.
Anything over 150-175-200.... is already in the plenty range.
I would personally move the rest over to carbs... especially if I was timing them to fuel my exercise!
He's cutting. During a cut you need MORE protein than you would bulking or during maintenance.
"1 gram of protein per pound of body weight (2.2 g/kg of BW) per day has been a bodybuilding rule of thumb for decades. Higher levels of protein intake, usually in the range of 1.2 – 1.5 grams per pound of body weight (2.6 – 3.3 g/kg BW) per day, are commonly recommended when “cutting” to lose fat."
I agree, 300 is probably a bit high - but then again, he didn't mention how much he weighs.
I have seen no evidence that this is true, it's just bro science as far as I can tell. You might have a slight increase in protein requirements, but I have yet to see research that suggests that any of us here actually need the .8g/lb level let alone beyond that. The basic point is that a person who is completely sedentary requires .4g/lb each day for replenishment and the most we can increase protein synthesis to is double that i.e. .8g/lb. Thoughts are that beyond that level might...,
Lyle McDonald
“So basically we have an intake continuum ranging from about 1.5 g/kg (0.68 g/lb) as a minimum for the obese non-training individual up to a high of around 3.3 g/kg (1.5 g/lb) of protein per pound of lean body mass for very lean heavily training athletes or bodybuilders with middle ground values being found in between those two extremes.”
“So that’s what I mean by ‘adequate protein on a diet’ when I use that phrase. It’s context dependent with the primary variables being body fat percentage (as this goes up, protein requirements go down), caloric intake (as caloric intake goes down, protein requirements go up and vice versa), and activity (with regular activity generally increasing protein requirements).”
https://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/protein-intake-while-dieting-qa.html/
I read this before, and I also believe he mentions that this is above what research actually supports. Nothing on NIH shows support for his higher end and I think he also admits this and says he believes that there are added benifits not shown.
Above your paragraph is this note:
While less data on this group is available, bodybuilders and athletes have long used a protein intake of 2.2 g/kg (1 g/lb) lean body mass as a generalized intake level and as folks get very lean, intakes of 3.3 g/kg (1.5 g/lb) of lean body mass may be required to stave off muscle loss while dieting. In some very extreme cases, such as the near protein only diet approach of my own Rapid Fat Loss Handbook even higher protein intakes may be required for very lean individuals.
He doesn't site any references here, it's just oppion, but it fits with his protein sparing diet. I have no issues with people eating above what they need, but there is no evidence that this is increases muscle synthesis or reduces muscle loss, even Lyle does not provide references here. I can only assume that he has no such data to support that either since he always sites it when it's available.
ETA: plus this is part of a protein sparing diet, which is low carb and high protein so he is replacing carbs with protein essentially. It's effective but no evidence I've seen shows that it is in anyway supperior in preserving muscle during a cut.
EDIT 2: did a bit more research though the journals and was able to find this:
"Protein needs for energy-restricted resistance-trained athletes are likely 2.3–3.1g/kg of FFM scaled upwards with severity of caloric restriction and leanness." (https://journals.humankinetics.com/doi/abs/10.1123/ijsnem.2013-0054)
I looked at other references but most seemed to have RDI vs 1g/lb comparisons or similar so weren't particularly relevant. So it seems leaness will increase but since it's based on FFM it's likely going to be pretty compariable to .8g/lb. So low grade diets in shorterm are on the low end of the scale and severe and prolongued at the higher end. I think Lyle is trying to add a large safety margin in based on what lifters have expereienced in the past. A resonable idea really for what he is trying to accomplish.
Oh, and it's an Eric Helms study, time to look on his site!
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I agree about the probable safety margin. I’m paranoid about losing my gains so “safety margin” gives me the tinglies. 2
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jseams1234 wrote: »I agree about the probable safety margin. I’m paranoid about losing my gains so “safety margin” gives me the tinglies.
Nothing wrong with safety margins!
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https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257350851_A_Systematic_Review_of_Dietary_Protein_During_Caloric_Restriction_in_Resistance_Trained_Lean_Athletes_A_Case_for_Higher_Intakes
Just downloaded so not sure it’s findings but wanted to save it for later.0 -
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257350851_A_Systematic_Review_of_Dietary_Protein_During_Caloric_Restriction_in_Resistance_Trained_Lean_Athletes_A_Case_for_Higher_Intakes
Just downloaded so not sure it’s findings but wanted to save it for later.
Same results as I gave above. If you are an already lean monster dieting hard for competition you might need that 1.5g/lb but most people are still well below the .8g/lb number.
I think this might be the exact same research I linked but only on another site.0 -
@Wheelhouse15 , I think the promotion of increased protein intake is for either the increased TEF, satiety or some misunderstanding of the 'better safe than sorry' mentality some have, eg Lyle MacDonald.
I agree with you that the bulk of evidence suggests that anything more than 1kg per lb of bodyweight is going to have no further tangible impact unless is is based on personal dietary preference - or is in a deficit so severe that catabolism could become a real concern (eg RFL diet protocol). Neither is likely here.
OP, no-one can really answer your question on how long it will take to get lean enough to 'see abs'. That is going to be an educated guess at best, and will be contingent on dietary adherence, your body's level of adaptation, changes in activity levels, where you store and lose fat more abundantly etc etc.
However, if you are in the low 20%s now at 90kg, and you continue to lose at a somewhat steady rate (remembering that fat loss is not a linear process), then you should see some sort of decent definition when you hit the 80kg mark (likely in about 4-5 months at a similar rate).3 -
1) you are over 22% bodyfat
2) You need consistency and patience
Keep up what you’re doing for 12-20 more weeks and report back.3 -
1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!11 -
Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.5 -
Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.
7. Poster should take his own advice!4 -
Davidsdottir wrote: »Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.
7. Poster should take his own advice!
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Davidsdottir wrote: »Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.
7. Poster should take his own advice!
The sad part is that there are so many posters that post poor and even dangerous advice and have no clue how bad it really is because they haven't really learned proper lifting technique or theory. Brophessors teach them and they pass it along like it's gossple without even bothering to do any research.
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Hey, how about low-carbs diets like keto?3
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NatalieOsya wrote: »Hey, how about low-carbs diets like keto?
Low carb/keto won't do anything for fat loss that any other diet/macro split won't do with equivalent calories, except make you drop a couple pounds of water weight. There's nothing miraculous about keto, despite how it's being touted nowadays.4 -
NatalieOsya wrote: »Hey, how about low-carbs diets like keto?
Keto/low carb diets have not shown any metabolic advantage for fat loss in any of the many studies done on the subject.2 -
Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
For #4 - DO NOT leave everything on the floor! No one likes to re-rack someone else's weights! :laugh:
For the rest, I defer to @mmapags.Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.
4 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
For #4 - DO NOT leave everything on the floor! No one likes to re-rack someone else's weights! :laugh:
For the rest, I defer to @mmapags.Muscle_Glutton wrote: »1. Know your body type. Judging by your picture I would say endomorph.
2. Know your daily calorie expenditure. Basically how many calories you burn a day.
3. If you're planning on losing weight then you need to be at a calorie deficit. Find a macro calculator and find out how many calories it suggests you consume a day and subtract by 100-200. This will be tough and suck but you'll see results faster. Remember exercise makes up of on 30% of the results you get, the rest is nutrition.
4. When in the gym leave everything on the floor. Go as hard as you can as fast as you can. If your workout normally takes 1 1/2 hours try finishing it in 1 hour and once you do that add workouts so that you're finishing a 2 hour workout in 11/2 hours.
5. Be constant. The moment you stop doing anything routinely you build bad habits and all your hard work goes to waste.
6. Workout as much as you can. I hate hearing that people don't have the time to workout and exercise. Not saying you are but the truth of the matter is they are not willing to make sacrifices for the results they want. I hit everybody part twice a week exept legs and shoulders because of how my workout is made. THE MORE SACRIFICES YOU MAKE TO GET TO YOU GOAL THE FASTER YOU'LL GET THERE!!
7. Educate yourself. The more you learn the easier it'll be to understand why curtain methods work and why others do not.
I really hope anything that I listed will help you along your path of training. And best of luck to you on your journey!
So much nope mixed in with a couple of good elements.
1. No such thing as Somatypes. Long debunked.
2. Good
3. About 50/50. Deficit should be driven by current weight and ideal rate of loss given the goal. Exercise is not 30% of weight loss.
4. Nonsense
5. Habits are good. The rest is not absolute.
6. Nonsense. Work/ Rest cycle is critical. The exercise is work, the muscle grow in the rest. Fat loss is calorie deficit and not working out. The idea is not to get there fast. It's to do it right.
7. Good but unspecific with no recommendations.
Wrong! Reracking others' weights is my warm-up
1
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