Anyone else on a low protein diet?
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pcw65
Posts: 31 Member
OK, I confess... I knew the title would raise some hackles and get people ready to put me straight but before you do so, please bear in mind context. My desire for a low protein diet is not about anything other than trying to manage an existing disease which reacts to protein intake levels.
If I did not have the disease I would have zero focus on reducing protein.
So, I have a slightly different battle to some in that I am also having to manage a kidney disease which requires me to control certain macros, specifically protein and potassium.
I have a BMR of 1985 and TTEE of 2300 and so I am targeting a 2200 calorie intake with 400-500 calories of exercise daily. I hope that all sounds reasonable.
An increased protein intake puts stress on kidneys and thereby increase urea nitrogen levels (BUN). So, I am working to keep my protein levels close to 85mg/day (which I make 15%, 2300*15% = 345/4 = 85) as opposed to the 140-150 I have been achieving of late.
I started on my weight loss journey 3-4 weeks ago and am down 16 pounds with about another 20 to go but I am trying to do it as gently, on the kidneys, as possible. In now tracking all my foods I am seeing that my protein (and potassium) intake is high and so I am now targeting 20-30mg per meal.
If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
If I did not have the disease I would have zero focus on reducing protein.
So, I have a slightly different battle to some in that I am also having to manage a kidney disease which requires me to control certain macros, specifically protein and potassium.
I have a BMR of 1985 and TTEE of 2300 and so I am targeting a 2200 calorie intake with 400-500 calories of exercise daily. I hope that all sounds reasonable.
An increased protein intake puts stress on kidneys and thereby increase urea nitrogen levels (BUN). So, I am working to keep my protein levels close to 85mg/day (which I make 15%, 2300*15% = 345/4 = 85) as opposed to the 140-150 I have been achieving of late.
I started on my weight loss journey 3-4 weeks ago and am down 16 pounds with about another 20 to go but I am trying to do it as gently, on the kidneys, as possible. In now tracking all my foods I am seeing that my protein (and potassium) intake is high and so I am now targeting 20-30mg per meal.
If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
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Replies
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I would guess (and I’ll defer to anyone with more experience) that something with medium fat, medium sugar/carb and low protein would probably work. Ultimately Weight loss is about calories in vs calories out.
Your problem will be that portion sizes are going to be fairly small due to the high amount of calories per gram for fat/sugar/carbs compared to protein. You may find that satiation is an issue so try to bulk up on fibrous fruits and veg to stay full since you don’t have protein to do that job.
And for definite aim for a very very slow loss. High deficits are going to end up with significant muscle loss since you aren’t maintaining your protein stored by eating protein.0 -
OK, I confess... I knew the title would raise some hackles and get people ready to put me straight but before you do so, please bear in mind context. My desire for a low protein diet is not about anything other than trying to manage an existing disease which reacts to protein intake levels.
If I did not have the disease I would have zero focus on reducing protein.
So, I have a slightly different battle to some in that I am also having to manage a kidney disease which requires me to control certain macros, specifically protein and potassium.
I have a BMR of 1985 and TTEE of 2300 and so I am targeting a 2200 calorie intake with 400-500 calories of exercise daily. I hope that all sounds reasonable.
An increased protein intake puts stress on kidneys and thereby increase urea nitrogen levels (BUN). So, I am working to keep my protein levels close to 85mg/day (which I make 15%, 2300*15% = 345/4 = 85) as opposed to the 140-150 I have been achieving of late.
I started on my weight loss journey 3-4 weeks ago and am down 16 pounds with about another 20 to go but I am trying to do it as gently, on the kidneys, as possible. In now tracking all my foods I am seeing that my protein (and potassium) intake is high and so I am now targeting 20-30mg per meal.
If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
Is the existing disease called PKU? I have that.0 -
GrumpyHeadmistress wrote: »I would guess (and I’ll defer to anyone with more experience) that something with medium fat, medium sugar/carb and low protein would probably work. Ultimately Weight loss is about calories in vs calories out.
Your problem will be that portion sizes are going to be fairly small due to the high amount of calories per gram for fat/sugar/carbs compared to protein. You may find that satiation is an issue so try to bulk up on fibrous fruits and veg to stay full since you don’t have protein to do that job.
And for definite aim for a very very slow loss. High deficits are going to end up with significant muscle loss since you aren’t maintaining your protein stored by eating protein.
Many thanks. I had set my calorie intake at @2300 and found the weight just dropping off me. I lost 9 pounds in the first week which I know is just nuts. I doubt there is such a thing as easy pounds but if so, I lost them that week. Things have slowed since then but even so I dropped 4 pounds the next week and 3 the 3rd week. Bear in mind this was all with a relatively high protein intake so I am fairly comfortable that the loss was not a significant amount of muscle. Even at 80mg/day protein that is sufficient for muscle growth.
I hadn't considered portion size changing with reduced protein. It is something I will need to look out for.
Also, I might increase my intake as I want to slow the rate of loss. If I lose 3 pounds this week it would be 20lb over 4 weeks which I know is way too much.
I am using an Apple watch which monitors my total calories. I don't know how accurate it is but I do see a deficit of 500-1000/day, taking into account exercise and other activity.
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OK, I confess... I knew the title would raise some hackles and get people ready to put me straight but before you do so, please bear in mind context. My desire for a low protein diet is not about anything other than trying to manage an existing disease which reacts to protein intake levels.
If I did not have the disease I would have zero focus on reducing protein.
So, I have a slightly different battle to some in that I am also having to manage a kidney disease which requires me to control certain macros, specifically protein and potassium.
I have a BMR of 1985 and TTEE of 2300 and so I am targeting a 2200 calorie intake with 400-500 calories of exercise daily. I hope that all sounds reasonable.
An increased protein intake puts stress on kidneys and thereby increase urea nitrogen levels (BUN). So, I am working to keep my protein levels close to 85mg/day (which I make 15%, 2300*15% = 345/4 = 85) as opposed to the 140-150 I have been achieving of late.
I started on my weight loss journey 3-4 weeks ago and am down 16 pounds with about another 20 to go but I am trying to do it as gently, on the kidneys, as possible. In now tracking all my foods I am seeing that my protein (and potassium) intake is high and so I am now targeting 20-30mg per meal.
If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
Is the existing disease called PKU? I have that.
Oh, or perhaps Chronic Kidney. That'd make more sense0 -
Seems like if you went to a vegan diet it would be pretty easy to stay =< 15% protein while staying full due to the bulk of plant based foods. Your library system probably has vegan cookbooks and Whole Foods is one of many sites with recipes: https://www.wholefoodsmarket.com/recipe/search/ ?f[0]=field_special_diet:158786
Normally I suggest to new vegans they make legumes the backbone of their diet for the protein, but you may need to keep an eye on them.
Do let us know what your nephrologist says re animal proteins v vegetable proteins making a difference from a renal perspective.
I met hundreds of vegans during my three years living in yoga retreat centers. I didn't know all of them personally, but the ones I did were happy, healthy, and fit on way lower protein than what I personally like to eat.1 -
I'm not low protein, but my close friend has been for years, aiming for 10-15 percent of calories from protein. She likes recipes by Furhman and Ornish. Mind you, both these guys are extreme vegan, kinda crazy doctors, BUT they publish some good recipes. I've particularly enjoyed the soups she makes. And fyi, she eats insane amounts of food due to all the veg in everything she makes. She's naturally slim so I can't really comment on how it affects weight loss. But i thought if you're looking for food ideas that might be a good place to look
Just a shame they are only vegan recipes 
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I'm not low protein, but my close friend has been for years, aiming for 10-15 percent of calories from protein. She likes recipes by Furhman and Ornish. Mind you, both these guys are extreme vegan, kinda crazy doctors, BUT they publish some good recipes. I've particularly enjoyed the soups she makes. And fyi, she eats insane amounts of food due to all the veg in everything she makes. She's naturally slim so I can't really comment on how it affects weight loss. But i thought if you're looking for food ideas that might be a good place to look Just a shame they are only vegan recipes
I don't know if Furhman identifies as vegan, but Ornish does not. His recommended diet plan includes fish oil supplements and Furhman's books include plans for people who want to eat animal products.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »I'm not low protein, but my close friend has been for years, aiming for 10-15 percent of calories from protein. She likes recipes by Furhman and Ornish. Mind you, both these guys are extreme vegan, kinda crazy doctors, BUT they publish some good recipes. I've particularly enjoyed the soups she makes. And fyi, she eats insane amounts of food due to all the veg in everything she makes. She's naturally slim so I can't really comment on how it affects weight loss. But i thought if you're looking for food ideas that might be a good place to look Just a shame they are only vegan recipes
I don't know if Furhman identifies as vegan, but Ornish does not. His recommended diet plan includes fish oil supplements and Furhman's books include plans for people who want to eat animal products.
Interesting. I guess she misled me on their philosophies. Thanks for the info!0 -
Thanks everyone. I kinda suspected vegan would be a good candidate. Shame as I do so much like meat.
Maybe I will try to steer into a situation whereby it is 50/50. Have meat as a treat etc. I tried some vegan food when over in Ibiza last year and to be fair it wasn't bad. They had a BLT made from beets which I swear was 90% as good as the real thing0 -
Just to clarify someone saying eating more carbs = more calories, protein and carbs have the same calories per gram.
Anyway, the easiest thing to do would be to lower meat and dairy intake, those are going to be your biggest sources of protein.
I would also encourage you to eat more, you’re really losing faster than is ideal for what you have to lose and that will stress your body, something someone with chronic illness needs to be avoiding. You’re not massively obese so the risks of being overweight or not outweighed by the risks of losing too quickly.1 -
Thanks everyone. I kinda suspected vegan would be a good candidate. Shame as I do so much like meat.
Maybe I will try to steer into a situation whereby it is 50/50. Have meat as a treat etc. I tried some vegan food when over in Ibiza last year and to be fair it wasn't bad. They had a BLT made from beets which I swear was 90% as good as the real thing
It's also better for the planet to eat less red meat
If you were happy with a BLT made from beets, then you are a great candidate for a plant based diet.0 -
VintageFeline wrote: »Just to clarify someone saying eating more carbs = more calories, protein and carbs have the same calories per gram.
Anyway, the easiest thing to do would be to lower meat and dairy intake, those are going to be your biggest sources of protein.
I would also encourage you to eat more, you’re really losing faster than is ideal for what you have to lose and that will stress your body, something someone with chronic illness needs to be avoiding. You’re not massively obese so the risks of being overweight or not outweighed by the risks of losing too quickly.
Thanks I I totally agree with you on the weight loss angle. I am upping my intake and will aim for MAYBE 1 pound a week moving forward. I am honestly shocked it fell off so fast considering my intake.
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GrumpyHeadmistress wrote: »I would guess (and I’ll defer to anyone with more experience) that something with medium fat, medium sugar/carb and low protein would probably work. Ultimately Weight loss is about calories in vs calories out.
Your problem will be that portion sizes are going to be fairly small due to the high amount of calories per gram for fat/sugar/carbs compared to protein. You may find that satiation is an issue so try to bulk up on fibrous fruits and veg to stay full since you don’t have protein to do that job.
And for definite aim for a very very slow loss. High deficits are going to end up with significant muscle loss since you aren’t maintaining your protein stored by eating protein.
Many thanks. I had set my calorie intake at @2300 and found the weight just dropping off me. I lost 9 pounds in the first week which I know is just nuts. I doubt there is such a thing as easy pounds but if so, I lost them that week. Things have slowed since then but even so I dropped 4 pounds the next week and 3 the 3rd week. Bear in mind this was all with a relatively high protein intake so I am fairly comfortable that the loss was not a significant amount of muscle. Even at 80mg/day protein that is sufficient for muscle growth.
I hadn't considered portion size changing with reduced protein. It is something I will need to look out for.
Also, I might increase my intake as I want to slow the rate of loss. If I lose 3 pounds this week it would be 20lb over 4 weeks which I know is way too much.
I am using an Apple watch which monitors my total calories. I don't know how accurate it is but I do see a deficit of 500-1000/day, taking into account exercise and other activity.
I am actually working on the opposite issue (trying to raise my protein) in part because I prefer a high-fat, low-portion diet. If you think that would work for you it might help keep your protein low, but it's definitely not satiating for everyone.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »I'm not low protein, but my close friend has been for years, aiming for 10-15 percent of calories from protein. She likes recipes by Furhman and Ornish. Mind you, both these guys are extreme vegan, kinda crazy doctors, BUT they publish some good recipes. I've particularly enjoyed the soups she makes. And fyi, she eats insane amounts of food due to all the veg in everything she makes. She's naturally slim so I can't really comment on how it affects weight loss. But i thought if you're looking for food ideas that might be a good place to look Just a shame they are only vegan recipes
I don't know if Furhman identifies as vegan, but Ornish does not. His recommended diet plan includes fish oil supplements and Furhman's books include plans for people who want to eat animal products.
He doesn't. He prefers the nutritarian term and is fine with occasional animal products.
He does say it's important to keep protein, especially from animals, on the low-ish side, so that would fit this thread.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »I'm not low protein, but my close friend has been for years, aiming for 10-15 percent of calories from protein. She likes recipes by Furhman and Ornish. Mind you, both these guys are extreme vegan, kinda crazy doctors, BUT they publish some good recipes. I've particularly enjoyed the soups she makes. And fyi, she eats insane amounts of food due to all the veg in everything she makes. She's naturally slim so I can't really comment on how it affects weight loss. But i thought if you're looking for food ideas that might be a good place to look Just a shame they are only vegan recipes
I don't know if Furhman identifies as vegan, but Ornish does not. His recommended diet plan includes fish oil supplements and Furhman's books include plans for people who want to eat animal products.
He doesn't. He prefers the nutritarian term and is fine with occasional animal products.
He does say it's important to keep protein, especially from animals, on the low-ish side, so that would fit this thread.
Thanks!0 -
An increased protein intake puts stress on kidneys and thereby increase urea nitrogen levels (BUN). So, I am working to keep my protein levels close to 85mg/day (which I make 15%, 2300*15% = 345/4 = 85) as opposed to the 140-150 I have been achieving of late.
I started on my weight loss journey 3-4 weeks ago and am down 16 pounds with about another 20 to go but I am trying to do it as gently, on the kidneys, as possible. In now tracking all my foods I am seeing that my protein (and potassium) intake is high and so I am now targeting 20-30mg per meal.
You mean g, not mg. It's understandable, just thought you could eliminate some possible confusion in the future.
16 lb down in 3-4 weeks is a REALLY aggressive rate of loss unless a whole bunch was water weight in the first week. I would be concerned that you might want to raise calories, as too low is not a great idea for muscle loss which is going to be more of a concern as the protein is lower.If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
You can do what people who struggle to make their protein goals do --
For example (as another poster mentioned) when I'm eating mostly plant-based I tend to come in lower protein compared to my normal goals and have to work to avoid that. So having meals without meat/eggs/dairy can help (although whole eggs aren't super high protein unless you eat a bunch of them).
A lot of people who have issues have low protein meals -- for example, oats and nuts and full fat milk or almond milk and fruit at breakfast, or lots of other options. Pasta or rice with vegetables for lunch, with only a small amount of meat if any would be good.
Your issue will be calories, and for that you will want to add some other sources of fat (nuts and nut butter, olive oil, avocado, etc.) and probably more starchy carbs if they are not too filling for you. Snacks might also help with calories, and things like full fat yogurt, fruit, bread/cereal/granola bar, nuts, might be good options.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »
You mean g, not mg. It's understandable, just thought you could eliminate some possible confusion in the future.
16 lb down in 3-4 weeks is a REALLY aggressive rate of loss unless a whole bunch was water weight in the first week. I would be concerned that you might want to raise calories, as too low is not a great idea for muscle loss which is going to be more of a concern as the protein is lower.If anyone has tips how they handled a low protein diet I am all ears.
Oh, and I have yet to get an answer as to whether animal proteins v vegetable proteins make a difference from a renal perspective but I am asking that the next time I talk to my nephrologist.
You can do what people who struggle to make their protein goals do --
For example (as another poster mentioned) when I'm eating mostly plant-based I tend to come in lower protein compared to my normal goals and have to work to avoid that. So having meals without meat/eggs/dairy can help (although whole eggs aren't super high protein unless you eat a bunch of them).
A lot of people who have issues have low protein meals -- for example, oats and nuts and full fat milk or almond milk and fruit at breakfast, or lots of other options. Pasta or rice with vegetables for lunch, with only a small amount of meat if any would be good.
Your issue will be calories, and for that you will want to add some other sources of fat (nuts and nut butter, olive oil, avocado, etc.) and probably more starchy carbs if they are not too filling for you. Snacks might also help with calories, and things like full fat yogurt, fruit, bread/cereal/granola bar, nuts, might be good options.
Many thanks for the input.
Oops, yes g not mg. Mea culpa.
Yes, I have increased my input to 2400+/day and am monitoring daily for the next few days to ensure I am not losing. I will aim to be stable for the next week to let things settle and then gently reduce to give a 3k deficit over a week. The thing is though, it isn't like I had a silly low intake. I am genuinely shocked at how fast the weight went. I do agree with all that say it was too much, too fast and it was never my intention to lose that much. I have been stable at @213-214 for the last 4-5 days so things seems to have already improved in that regard.
I kinda guessed (feared!! ) that vegan/beans/nuts would be suggested. I think this is the way to go with a smaller % of animal protein. The pasta/vegetable with small amount of meat is also a good suggestion, thanks.
Another complication which I didn't mention is something called purines. I suspect most haven't come across them but they are in most foods. Some foods are low in purines, some high. Eating high purine foods (oily fish, beer, many types of meat, mushrooms, some veggies) causes an increase in uric acid which leads to gout for those with CKD as the kidneys lose their ability to filter uric acid from the system. I do think introducing a high % of non-animal protein is the answer though as vegetable purines have less of an impact than animal purines. Beer is horrible in relation to purines ad hence many times leads to a gout attack.
I really feel for those that have numerous allergies like gluten (my wife for example) as it really makes it an uphill battle.
Thanks to all for your input, much appreciated.3
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