"it takes the body one year to adapt to a new weight"

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  • psychod787
    psychod787 Posts: 4,088 Member
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    Mari22na wrote: »
    This is accurate. It can take 2-3 years before the body quits fighting so hard against you. Extreme dieting and overrestriction has proven to be completely unsuccessful for maintaining a major weight loss. With striatal dopamine D2 receptors that are low to begin with and many feeling the body has recovered once the weight has been released...that's only the beginning. You are in for the fight of your life to balance and maintain. 'Satiety levels are way off'. 100% correct. If you start increasing the food reward threshold over weeks or months or years you begin digging a much deeper hole. Every extreme weight loss and dieting excursion has consequences with the metabolism. Going slow is the only answer for the appetite control center located in brain and not the stomach to heal, catch up, balance and recover.

    Well... I guess I am screwed.....
  • psychod787
    psychod787 Posts: 4,088 Member
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    Mari22na wrote: »
    No. You are not. You're on the right track. Maintaining a major weight releasing can be brutal but after 2 years the fight lessens as the brain quits fighting so hard against you. Stay the course.

    Not even WLS, weight loss surgery can bypass the appetite control center located in the brain. We can remove a stomach and still not permanently fix broken metabolisms and satiety control. One of the biggest mistakes is to start dieting in our youth. This messes with everything and it can create a lifelong struggle with .

    So a lean bulk is a bad idea?
  • Johnd2000
    Johnd2000 Posts: 198 Member
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    I maintained for a year, after losing a little over 50lbs, by eating normally and just having 1 or 2 “hungry days” a week, whenever I gained a couple of kg. A hungry day is no breakfast, lunch, or snacks (aiming for around 800 cals). I wouldn’t recommend it, but it worked for me when I didn’t know better.

    I started using MFP in January this year, primarily to track macros and find what my true maintenance cals should be. I still haven’t worked out the latter, as my exercise levels keep changing.

    I don’t call it a diet. It’s just managing my weight and nutrition. I still eat all the things I ate when I was 26kg+ heavier.
  • Diatonic12
    Diatonic12 Posts: 32,344 Member
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    Lean bulking happens at different rates for men and women. Beginners aka Beginners Growth Spurt can actually get away with more calories than those who've been lifting heavy things for a long time. Alrighty then, without too much overthinking it, you simply eat more calories on your training days and less on your days off. But don't over-restrict your calories on off days because there will be blowback for that.

    It's a balancing act and a bit a cr@pshoot but 500 calories more for workout/training days is a rule of thumb. Lean bulking is gaining muscle with minimal fat. This is going to take a lorra, lorra time and will require so much patience with yourself. Slow is better for everything. Isn't that the way.
  • psychod787
    psychod787 Posts: 4,088 Member
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    Mari22na wrote: »
    Lean bulking happens at different rates for men and women. Beginners aka Beginners Growth Spurt can actually get away with more calories than those who've been lifting heavy things for a long time. Alrighty then, without too much overthinking it, you simply eat more calories on your training days and less on your days off. But don't over-restrict your calories on off days because there will be blowback for that.

    It's a balancing act and a bit a cr@pshoot but 500 calories more for workout/training days is a rule of thumb. Lean bulking is gaining muscle with minimal fat. This is going to take a lorra, lorra time and will require so much patience with yourself. Slow is better for everything. Isn't that the way.

    I got nothing but time! I have been at a lean bulk since January, late December. Tending up1.2-1.5. Average calorie overage as of today is 75-100 cals a day. Low and slow. I am just wondering, if this will make it harder for my brain to adapt?
  • Diatonic12
    Diatonic12 Posts: 32,344 Member
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    Nope. You, are on the right track. When you pull the rug out from underneath the brain too quickly the brain rebels. You're not going to have those hunger pains/pangs/pings and you will have energy for your workouts.

    I've never made the same mistakes twice but about 10 or 12 times just to be sure. Mistakes are painful but years down the road you can call them experience. You get excited when you start to see bulk which can be another excuse to eat whatever you want and rationalize once again. Don't think quick weight loss, don't think like dieters, go slow and lean bulking will be yours.
  • CarvedTones
    CarvedTones Posts: 2,340 Member
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    Mari22na wrote: »
    Lean bulking happens at different rates for men and women. Beginners aka Beginners Growth Spurt can actually get away with more calories than those who've been lifting heavy things for a long time. Alrighty then, without too much overthinking it, you simply eat more calories on your training days and less on your days off. But don't over-restrict your calories on off days because there will be blowback for that.

    It's a balancing act and a bit a cr@pshoot but 500 calories more for workout/training days is a rule of thumb. Lean bulking is gaining muscle with minimal fat. This is going to take a lorra, lorra time and will require so much patience with yourself. Slow is better for everything. Isn't that the way.

    I always wondered about this idea of eating for training. Depending on what you eat, the digestion times vary dramatically as far as when it will be available as fuel or raw material for the body to use.
  • ITUSGirl51
    ITUSGirl51 Posts: 192 Member
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    Mari22na wrote: »
    Good, because I like warriors who are willing to fight against our old norms. It takes true grit. I know how to do this solo and I know how to encourage myself to keep going but I just decided to make a connection with others on this forum. Falling back into our old habits will get us nowhere good. It can all come undone in the blink of an eye. The days roll into months and years. I've made a stand, drawn my line in the sand. I haven't got time for all of that pain. Finding our way happens one meal at a time. Every meal is our next reset. Mental and physical. Keep fighting for it, ITUSGirl51. Doing what we've always done will get us what we've always gotten.

    Thank you for the encouragement!
  • annaskiski
    annaskiski Posts: 1,212 Member
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    With regard to popular diets:
    "
    Historically, most have ignored any distinction between body weight and body fat (or even addressed body composition at all) although this is changing in recent years. In many cases, this is probably deliberate as rapid water weight losses in the first few days of many types of diets (especially carbohydrate restricted diets) make it look as if the diet has some metabolic advantage or is working more effectively than it is.

    These types of books, even the good ones, are generally written in the same fashion and some of the messages they give can lead dieters down a dangerous path. They usually start out by saying that calories don't matter, that calorie restricted diets don't work in the long term before proceeding to demonize some single nutrient as the cause of obesity (in rarer cases the lack of a certain nutrient may be blamed). This could be dietary fat, sugar or carbohydrates in general. In recent years, High-Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS) has been blamed as the cause of obesity. The book will argue that by removing the nutrient, weight/ fat loss will occur easily without hunger or calorie restriction.


    Lyle McDonald. The Women's Book (Kindle Locations 5688-5691). Lyle McDonald.
  • wenrob
    wenrob Posts: 125 Member
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    I’m thinking maybe your previous history plays a part. I’ve been obese only once in my life and when I finally lost that weight I found maintenance for the first 4ish years fairly easy. Before that I would sometimes drift up to overweight here and there. I would self correct and then just drift back down again. About four years after my big loss I had an extremely stressful year where I just didn’t care and gained 20+ pounds. I let it go on for another year before I set myself straight and lost an additional 16lbs. About 10lbs of that has really been a battle the last couple of years. I really have to work at keeping it off where the previous 67 or so seemed easy for years. I have yet to figure out the ‘why’ of it.
  • psychod787
    psychod787 Posts: 4,088 Member
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    annaskiski wrote: »
    With regard to popular diets:
    "
    Historically, most have ignored any distinction between body weight and body fat (or even addressed body composition at all) although this is changing in recent years. In many cases, this is probably deliberate as rapid water weight losses in the first few days of many types of diets (especially carbohydrate restricted diets) make it look as if the diet has some metabolic advantage or is working more effectively than it is.

    These types of books, even the good ones, are generally written in the same fashion and some of the messages they give can lead dieters down a dangerous path. They usually start out by saying that calories don't matter, that calorie restricted diets don't work in the long term before proceeding to demonize some single nutrient as the cause of obesity (in rarer cases the lack of a certain nutrient may be blamed). This could be dietary fat, sugar or carbohydrates in general. In recent years, High-Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS) has been blamed as the cause of obesity. The book will argue that by removing the nutrient, weight/ fat loss will occur easily without hunger or calorie restriction.


    Lyle McDonald. The Women's Book (Kindle Locations 5688-5691). Lyle McDonald.

    What is strange about this is, in the Biggest loser study, the contestants lost 80% + weight from fat mass and less than 20% came from lean mass. Though, I think some of the numbers are flawed as far as reading their metabolisms, total predicted TDEE came out nearly perfect per Kevin Hall's model. That tells me it does have a lot to do with fat cells and leptin.
  • annaskiski
    annaskiski Posts: 1,212 Member
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    The issue is that lean mass is far harder to recover than fat. So while fat also plays a role, the body's hormone levels provoke an 'eat' response until the lean mass is also recovered, which is long after the 'old' body fat percentage is reached.

    Hence, the hunger signals stay high long after the person even regains their old weight. Without vigilance on calorie counting, the person ends up at a higher weight, and higher body fat percentage.
  • annaskiski
    annaskiski Posts: 1,212 Member
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    In one study, the total drop in TDEE was 500 calories per day there was only a 3-5% adaptive decrease in RMR present (31). This amounts to perhaps 40-70 calories per day and again changes in RMR really aren't responsible for the large scale changes that are occurring. Adaptive changes in the other components have not been studied to a great degree but it is likely that they are maintained to one degree or another. Certainly the motivation and ability to exercise can increase when food intake is raised and it's possible that NEAT will recover or increase once the person is no longer active dieting. But the fact remains that TDEE will always be reduced with some degree of the adaptive component still being present. At least some increase in hunger and appetite is also usually seen although, once again, it will be less than during the period of active dieting since more food is being eaten and at least some hormonal recovery will have occurred.

    Lyle McDonald. The Women's Book (Kindle Locations 3237-3243). Lyle McDonald.

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