Intermittent Fasting and Workouts
UncelDolan09
Posts: 22 Member
Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
1
Replies
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You can eat any time you want. Getting in sufficient nutrition, and not eating too much, is crucial.6
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kommodevaran wrote: »You can eat any time you want. Getting in sufficient nutrition, and not eating too much, is crucial.
so the whole "make sure you get good carbs and protein after you workout" is not really true?0 -
It's true, but you can wait until you get home, for instance, if that is the most practial.UncelDolan09 wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »You can eat any time you want. Getting in sufficient nutrition, and not eating too much, is crucial.
so the whole "make sure you get good carbs and protein after you workout" is not really true?0 -
kommodevaran wrote: »
It's true, but you can wait until you get home, for instance, if that is the most practial.UncelDolan09 wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »You can eat any time you want. Getting in sufficient nutrition, and not eating too much, is crucial.
so the whole "make sure you get good carbs and protein after you workout" is not really true?
ok, that's actually all I wanted to confirm. I'll just eat in the morning till early afternoon, and then fast from afternoon to next morning. Thanks!0 -
There is no reason to force a specific eating schedule. It is better to do whatever comes naturally and makes you feel "normal". You have been at this for 2 weeks so keeping things as simple and natural as possible should be your priority until you settle in. If you start skipping meals you risk being hungry and stressing your resolve and, in turn, your diet.6
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Or just don’t fast and eat when convenient since it doesn’t do anything anyways11
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UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.3 -
psychod787 wrote: »UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.
And BCAA's are pretty much worthless.
OP, there hasn't been any definitive science suggesting a benefit from timing your nutrients pre- or post- workout. If there is, the potential window (at least based on some recent reviews) suggest eating +/- 2 hrs. Albeit, it's mainly going to matter after you have already optimized your training, overall diet, and getting adequate nutrients.10 -
psychod787 wrote: »UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.
And BCAA's are pretty much worthless.
OP, there hasn't been any definitive science suggesting a benefit from timing your nutrients pre- or post- workout. If there is, the potential window (at least based on some recent reviews) suggest eating +/- 2 hrs. Albeit, it's mainly going to matter after you have already optimized your training, overall diet, and getting adequate nutrients.
That's why said the jury is still out on bcaa's. I personally never waste my money on then. Since it seems you know much more than I do, soluble fiber is broken down months intestines into long chain fatty acids, correct? Now i know some of it get used by the gut bacteria as energy, but wouldn't we always be getting some form of nutrition as long as we have something in our intestines?1 -
psychod787 wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.
And BCAA's are pretty much worthless.
OP, there hasn't been any definitive science suggesting a benefit from timing your nutrients pre- or post- workout. If there is, the potential window (at least based on some recent reviews) suggest eating +/- 2 hrs. Albeit, it's mainly going to matter after you have already optimized your training, overall diet, and getting adequate nutrients.
That's why said the jury is still out on bcaa's. I personally never waste my money on then. Since it seems you know much more than I do, soluble fiber is broken down months intestines into long chain fatty acids, correct? Now i know some of it get used by the gut bacteria as energy, but wouldn't we always be getting some form of nutrition as long as we have something in our intestines?
Not really sure the jury is all the out on BCAAs. While BCAA stimulate MPS, it certainly doesn't drive protein turnover, which is what is really wanted to build muscle. Most of the beneficial BCAA studies where done on either mice or people on very low protein subjects.2 -
psychod787 wrote: »UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.
And BCAA's are pretty much worthless.
OP, there hasn't been any definitive science suggesting a benefit from timing your nutrients pre- or post- workout. If there is, the potential window (at least based on some recent reviews) suggest eating +/- 2 hrs. Albeit, it's mainly going to matter after you have already optimized your training, overall diet, and getting adequate nutrients.
+1 on BCAAs being pretty much worthless.
Regarding the bolded, Aragon published a good research review regarding nutrient timing a few years ago in the JISSN: https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1550-2783-10-5
Excerpt from the "Practical Applications" portion of the review (emphasis added):Due to the transient anabolic impact of a protein-rich meal and its potential synergy with the trained state, pre- and post-exercise meals should not be separated by more than approximately 3–4 hours, given a typical resistance training bout lasting 45–90 minutes. If protein is delivered within particularly large mixed-meals (which are inherently more anticatabolic), a case can be made for lengthening the interval to 5–6 hours. This strategy covers the hypothetical timing benefits while allowing significant flexibility in the length of the feeding windows before and after training. Specific timing within this general framework would vary depending on individual preference and tolerance, as well as exercise duration. One of many possible examples involving a 60-minute resistance training bout could have up to 90-minute feeding windows on both sides of the bout, given central placement between the meals. In contrast, bouts exceeding typical duration would default to shorter feeding windows if the 3–4 hour pre- to post-exercise meal interval is maintained. Shifting the training session closer to the pre- or post-exercise meal should be dictated by personal preference, tolerance, and lifestyle/scheduling constraints.
I also agree that nutrient timing is of far less importance than other considerations, as depicted in Eric Helms' Nutrition Pyramid:
3 -
psychod787 wrote: »UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
The so called anabolic window, is really kinda a myth. It's more like an anabolic door per say. 2-4 hours post work outs. If you are really worried, take some BCAA's I think the jury is still out on if it is "breaking" a fast, but most are under 30 cals a serving. Wanted to add one last thing, remember it can take up to 12 hours post meal to her call the nutrients digested, so in reality, you might not be fasted at your workouts. All this is just from what on have read.
And BCAA's are pretty much worthless.
OP, there hasn't been any definitive science suggesting a benefit from timing your nutrients pre- or post- workout. If there is, the potential window (at least based on some recent reviews) suggest eating +/- 2 hrs. Albeit, it's mainly going to matter after you have already optimized your training, overall diet, and getting adequate nutrients.
+1 on BCAAs being pretty much worthless.
Regarding the bolded, Aragon published a good research review regarding nutrient timing a few years ago in the JISSN: https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1550-2783-10-5
Excerpt from the "Practical Applications" portion of the review (emphasis added):Due to the transient anabolic impact of a protein-rich meal and its potential synergy with the trained state, pre- and post-exercise meals should not be separated by more than approximately 3–4 hours, given a typical resistance training bout lasting 45–90 minutes. If protein is delivered within particularly large mixed-meals (which are inherently more anticatabolic), a case can be made for lengthening the interval to 5–6 hours. This strategy covers the hypothetical timing benefits while allowing significant flexibility in the length of the feeding windows before and after training. Specific timing within this general framework would vary depending on individual preference and tolerance, as well as exercise duration. One of many possible examples involving a 60-minute resistance training bout could have up to 90-minute feeding windows on both sides of the bout, given central placement between the meals. In contrast, bouts exceeding typical duration would default to shorter feeding windows if the 3–4 hour pre- to post-exercise meal interval is maintained. Shifting the training session closer to the pre- or post-exercise meal should be dictated by personal preference, tolerance, and lifestyle/scheduling constraints.
I also agree that nutrient timing is of far less importance than other considerations, as depicted in Eric Helms' Nutrition Pyramid:
Eric Helms.... my first introduction into proper nutrition. His book was a gift about a year ago from a lifter friend of mine. We are all different on how we react to nutritional timing and what kind of work out we are doing. I can walk or hike for hours fasted. When it comes to lifting. I do a higher rep range with a rpe on most of my lifts of 9, not quite to full failure but with maybe one in the tank on my compounds, to complete failure with drop sets on isolation movements. Anyways, you would have to pick me up off the floor if I did that fasted. op, nothing magical about IF, I really hate to call it that, more of time restricted eating. You do you. Don't be afraid to try different things. Find what works best for you. I think we should never be too dogmatic about anything. Just MHO....2 -
The best exercise time and routine is the one that you will actually follow.
The best diet scheme is likewise one that you will follow.
IF is most likely a pretty benign diet plan. It does not limit what you eat except for the timings that you eat. The timings are not all that drastic, especially on the 8 hr feed and 16 hour fast scheme. A lot of people who regularly miss breakfast and don't snack after supper will follow this just without calling it a fancy name and spouting some weak science about the benefits.
If your purpose on eating well and exercising is to achieve a healthy weight and a suitable degree of fitness, just stick to the basics. Get a good night’s sleep, eat a well-balanced diet, just not too many calories, and get a variety of exercises, some cardo, some flexibility and some strength work.
There is no major bullet, no magic diet, and no magic exercise that will do it for you in 3 minutes a day or less. It takes a complete commitment to watching what you eat, planning for a balanced but calorie reduced diet and getting sufficient exercise.
All this fancy stuff about keto, IF or the grapefruit diet are just smoke screens, or marketing gimmicks.
Try a variety of exercise times and workouts until you find the combination that you will do and stick to, mix it up a little for variety and perhaps you will find some workout you like better.
Try a variety of diet systems and timings of eating. Everyone is different, everyone has different schedules both internal and external that they need to satisfy. As long as you have a good mix of foods for your micro nutrients and watch the total for CICO you will do OK.
If you are an Olympic caliber athlete then the fine refinements that one diet and exercise scheme will give you, might be worth it but for the majority of the people in the world (99.99% of us) just eating right, not too little not too much, getting a good mix of exercises, not too little not too much is what results in the weight we want, the body we want and a healthy life. Also if you are an elite athlete then you are getting your information and guidance from paid professionals and not from random strangers on the internet.
Just right, not too little , not too much. I think I’ll call it the Goldilocks Diet and Exercise plan, get some B list celebrity to be my spokesman and make a fortune designing diets and exercise plans that anyone can get for free simply by surfing the net for a while. After all if you don’t pay a fortune for the book and the membership in the program and learn the secret handshake then it cannot be a good diet and exercise plan can it?
2 -
I just started the intermittent fasting. I eat between 1 and 9 but I don’t workout until about 6. I wish I could workout in morning but I am at work. I actually get a better workout when I don’t eat first.
Cathy0 -
I would eat around 8-9a to stop eating around 4-5p. So that you keep energy throughout the day!0
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Someone suggested that I could try I.F., I usually go with calorie counting with a lower carb intake. If I incorporate I.F. , I see the benefit being that I start fasting after dinner, I don't snack at night after dinner, and, if I wait until lunch to break my fast, my crappy basic lunch tastes better .3
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imaproudmomma wrote: »I would eat around 8-9a to stop eating around 4-5p. So that you keep energy throughout the day!
Depends on how your body is making it's energy. I've been doing IF since February of this year and my schedule is to eat in the afternoon/evening. I started on 16:8 eating lunch at noon and then stopping my feeding at 8:00p but it's morphed a bit and I won't eat until 2:00p-3:00p now and I've shortened my eating window. My energy levels during the day are MUCH more stable than when I wasn't doing IF. When you eat your body puts energy resources into digestion which is why you often feel tired after eating a meal. IF means you're eating larger meals as your eating window is shorter than someone not doing IF but you still want to eat all your calories for the day (restricted cal diet or not) which can enhance the effect. By eating later you're using fat as your fuel and your energy level is more stable.3 -
UncelDolan09 wrote: »Hi everyone,
I started eating in a calorie deficit about 2 weeks ago, and have been thinking about taking it into an intermittent fasting (IF) routine. The question I asked myself is, what's the best time window for a 16/8 fast, combined with my workouts. I can only workout in the morning (around 6am), and so I am wondering whether I should eat between let's say 5:30 and 1:30, or just later in the day (e.g. 1pm-9pm).
I know that if you want to keep muscle, the nutrients you're getting around your workout are crucial, thus I want to make sure I eat during the right time window.
Thanks!
You can fast for how long you want. The format many people like is 16:8 (16 hours of fasting/8 hours of feeding window)...When I do IF occasionnally, I just start eating until I am so hungry that I can't take another minute longer, so if I am hungry after 14 hours of fasting, I'll eat starting then. There is no official rule and in the end, it doesn't matter really.3 -
pinggolfer96 wrote: »Or just don’t fast and eat when convenient since it doesn’t do anything anyways
*ding* There's the answer.
3 -
There are plenty of studies that show some fasting has positive results. Especially in regards to controlling type II diabetes. The eat anything and anytime you feel like it seems to be the recipe for some significant health issues.11
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BlackTimber wrote: »There are plenty of studies that show some fasting has positive results. Especially in regards to controlling type II diabetes. The eat anything and anytime you feel like it seems to be the recipe for some significant health issues.
I don't think anyone is saying eat anything anytime, it all comes down to CICO. If you restrict your eating for 16 hours in the day you will not snack during that time. A couple big meals at either end of your 8 hour window with a smaller one in the middle will usually result in less calories than snacking or grazing throughout the day.
It is the calorie deficit that makes the weight loss difference not the timings.
There are studies that show the opposite of what you claim on Type 11 Diabetes
https://newatlas.com/intermittent-fasting-causes-diabetes-debate/54685/
Gives no information on the actual study.
https://www.endocrineweb.com/news/diabetes/59292-intermittent-fasting-harmful-someone-type-2-diabetes
Uses only 41 part8icipants with significantly different ages between the two groups with no information that the researchers attempted to control for age difference. Also significant differences in time since diagnosis and the medications that the participants were taking and again no information that the researchers attempted to control for these differences.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/may/20/fasting-diets-raise-risk-of-diabetes
No detailed information on the study being quoted as the source.
Most studies quoted in popular literature lack sufficient information in the news articles to adequately determine how valid they are and often the studies themselves are flawed and of not much use. They simply lack the necessary rigorous scientific approach to support the claims being made about the results.
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BlackTimber wrote: »There are plenty of studies that show some fasting has positive results. Especially in regards to controlling type II diabetes. The eat anything and anytime you feel like it seems to be the recipe for some significant health issues.
Yea, because I am here decaying and dying despite having excellent blood work, no health issues and have been succesfully bulking and cutting for the past 5 years despite eating whenever I want as long as I hit my macros.3 -
The only real benefit imho to IF is allowing you to eat larger meals during that short period of time. For some people they need to feel extra full to be satisfied, so starving for 2/3 of the day works better for them, and it also allows them to stay within their calorie goal easier. That's really the only benefit of which I am aware. I, personally, hate starving for 2/3 of my day, so I eat on average 5 sometimes 6 smaller meals a day, or 4 small 1 larger meal. I simply stay within my calorie goal and hit my macros whenever possible. I can still lose weight, decrease body fat, or gain weight if that's what I want, I simply don't have to starve to do it. There are likely some medical conditions that might favor intermittent fasting, I just don't know of any. No matter how you time your meals, you won't lose fat if you don't stay at a calorie deficit.4
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BlackTimber wrote: »There are plenty of studies that show some fasting has positive results. Especially in regards to controlling type II diabetes. The eat anything and anytime you feel like it seems to be the recipe for some significant health issues.
Ah, yes. Those are the only two options available to us. We either do structured IF or we eat anything, anytime. Great framing here.3
This discussion has been closed.
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