What should be my path forward? (Eating low calorie and don't feel hungry)

bp3000 · July 2018

I've been using myfitnesspal for 44 days and I've lost around 14kg (my first measurement was a day before), I'm actually 192cm and gone from 123kg (BMI 33.4) to 109kg (29.6). I've also noticed changes in waist measurement (though not tracked) from around 120cm to 113cm, belt has gone 40" to 38". I was coming from a real bad place. I'd get hungry after work and smash a pack of salt & vinegar chips (crisps) (and not a small bag but the 150g variety), every meal except breakfast had chips or mash potato, and on the weekend it wouldn't be rare to have 3 burgers over the course. I also never ate salad. So I'm psyched about the results I've achieved and really happy with my progress.

An average day (I've made my diary public):
Breakfast: One poached egg
Lunch: A slice of 5 seeds "low-carb" (not really - but best in class fibre content from what I can tell) bread with a can of tuna and an apple.
Dinner: A big piece of meat (unfortunately often beef - but I'm trying to get diversity) and some sort of vegetables (generally alternating between stir fry vegetables or greek salad).

I avoid refined sugars as much as possible (only occasionally a square of 90% dark chocolate) and potatoes (haven't had chips in weeks - including not eating them when they come as a side in the restaurant - which especially sucks as I'm cheap and paying for them). I still eat out maybe 3 - 4 times a week. I try to estimate what I've eaten but it is very possible I under report. I've also started weight training every morning to stem any muscle loss, not that I've noticed anything. I'm at the moment working with 2x 10kg Dumbbells, I do 20 lunges, 20 floor bench presses, 20 alternate bicep curls, 20 tricep extensions (with one dumbbell), 20 sumo squats (with one dumbbell) and 20 of some sort of pelvic lift without dumbbells.

The effects have been great. I feel like I'm thinking clearer, have more energy than before, and feel more mentally resilient.

THE THING IS I would tend not to fix what isn't broken and continue to drive to ideal weight but I am concerned that I'm progressively eating less and less, and I'm now down to an average of around 1300kcals. I understand that this is very close to the minimum recommended for anyone, especially a big lad like myself. However, my body isn't telling me it wants to eat more. I got such huge cravings before when I got home from work but I don't get anything near that even like yesterday when I was apparently sub-900kcals. I MEAN I HAVE NO HUNGER.

However, I have reached my milestone of moving to an overweight BMI so if I'm going to change things up I'd rather do it soon than mid on the drive to sub-100kgs.

malibu927 · July 2018

1300 calories isn't close to the minimum, it's 200 calories BELOW the minimum intake for men and over 1000 calories below what MFP gave you for a goal. Just because you don't feel hungry doesn't mean your body doesn't need the fuel and you'll probably be feeling the effects of undereating soon. If you're having trouble getting up there add in more calorie dense items...nuts, nut butters, full fat dairy, even things with added sugar (there's no reason to avoid it completely if you don't have a medical reason to) if you've met your other nutrient goals.

kimny72 · July 2018

You are losing weight incredibly fast and the smaller you get the more damage it's going to do. Strength training can't protect your muscle if your body isn't being given enough fuel to repair them.

One problem with sticking with what you're doing is that over time undereating will slow your metabolism. So as you get smaller and your weight loss slows down, you'll have to eat less and will have an even greater chance of malnutrition.

The second is that rapid weight loss generally means more muscle loss and more excess skin, which most folks wish they'd done more to avoid.

The final problem I'll bring up is that it's typical to feel great undereating until you inevitably hit the proverbial wall. And then it can take weeks to get squared away.

You don't want to get so used to undereating that you don't know how to adequately fuel your body anymore and you don't know how to eat to maintain your goal weight. For your health and ultimately your ability to keep the weight off and your satisfaction with how you look once you get to goal, you really should consider a more moderate pace.

bp3000 · July 2018

OK I'm hearing what you guys are saying, and that's the main reason I posted. But I'm a man I need some boundaries or goals. I'm worried if I go for the moderation I'll lose motivation. Like what I was thinking is would it be possible to slowly shift the focus from weight loss to more body form. Also I wouldn't be suprised as I say if my average isn't a couple of hundred kcal above what is reported due to the fact I do eat out occasionally and the difficulty in estimating.

Also how does this reconcile when you have mosely or whatever his name is recommending an 800 kcal diet for everyone. In my mind, yes there may be long term effects but for the period I've been doing it, surely I can sustain it another month or so and then when I should be close to 100 kg shift the focus to muscle development or something.

malibu927 · July 2018

Nobody should be recommending 800 calories for anyone unless you're under strict medical supervision. MFP won't even endorse a diet like that.

Even if you are eating more than logged, the rate you're losing at (over 5 pounds/2.5 kilograms per week) is way too aggressive. Muscle loss is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to undereating...there's also fatigue, hair loss, dry/brittle nails, hormonal imbalances, and to much more serious organ malfunctions. Why risk all that when you can slow down to a much more sustainable rate of loss?

Up your calories. Buy a food scale and start weighing everything you eat at home on it (it will help you with accuracy and you may be able to better estimate your meals out...though I would cut those down). Lift heavy (if you can, find a structured progressive program that will have you increasing how much you lift). You didn't put the weight on quickly, so it's not going to come off quickly.

livingleanlivingclean · July 2018

Your path forward should be to make yourself eat more. Undoing the affects of eating low calories (that may be happening unbeknownst to you) can take months and years to reverse.... Been there, doing that.

Eat scrambled eggs, or an omelette and cook it in butter. Add some vegies, cheese etc

Add avo to your lunch, make an actual sandwich with 2 pieces of bread. Slice your apple and put Pb on them

Add a grain or starchy carb to your dinner - rice, pasta, potato, noodles, bread etc... Cook your vegies in oil or add dressing/fat to your salad

Doesn't change much but it will make a big improvement to your intake and nutrition...

kimny72 · July 2018

I mean, you're an adult so you can do it however you want to. It all depends on your level of risk aversion. I personally wouldn't be willing to risk my health and keep my fingers crossed I didn't cause damage or end up with an ED or lots of droopy skin, but that's me.

One of the reasons yo-yo dieting is a thing is because people white knuckle it down the fast lane and hit the wall with no warning over and over and over again. All we can do is relay our experience and what we see all the time here. You have to decide how to proceed and live with the results and consequences.

try2again · July 2018

bp3000 wrote: »

I'm worried if I go for the moderation I'll lose motivation.

Think about this: weight management is not a short-term project, it is a life-long project. One of the (important) benefits of a more moderate approach is that it puts you in the best position to ease into maintenance when that time comes. Ideally, you would just need to add a few hundred calories back in for maintenance, and having had so much practice with eating a balanced diet in the portions that will be close to what you need in maintenance can help you have good success. If you're only motivated by quick results, that's going to be a problem long-term, IMO. It takes time to build good, sustainable habits, and you need to have more of a long-range view.

bp3000 · July 2018

Thanks guys. I guess my preferred approach and what I'll ultimately probably do is wait till I hit the goal I put into MFP of 108kg (which should happen sometime next week) then I'll reset and make my changes presumably with a new goal of 98kg. At that point I'll probably start to introduce some more calories to my diet. I bought a new scale that is probably *kitten* but tries to estimate my current BMR as 2368 kcal (similar to MFP anyway) so if I cut 500 kcals off that to get to 1868 kcals would that be what most recommend for weight loss? Considering I work an office/desk job. If I then introduce bike riding for some cardio 3 times a week and continue the weights that would be great right? I know it is probably still aggressive but if I keep to that then that should limit most of these long-term negatives you're talking about.

If so, where should the calories come from? I have an average deficit between what I eat now and the new goal of around 600 kcals. I'd initially close my open sandwich, an orange as a snack somewhere and add yoghurt to breakfast which would bring me up 250 kcals (approx.) on average. Could add cheese to the sandwich to bring it up to 300 kcals, though cheese and tuna isn't a favourite. If I started having almonds as a snack that probably could easily add another 100 kcals on average. Treat myself a bit more on a weekend lunch should cover the rest. Is there anything wrong with that plan?

I know livingleanlivingclean is suggesting starchy carbs added to dinner, what is the value of this? I haven't read anything that suggests anything good about starchy carbs but it hasn't been my focus tbh. Even though the research says it doesn't matter, if anything I'd want to distribute my calories to earlier in the day.

singingflutelady · July 2018

I'm currently malnourished and underweight because of health issues and let me tell you it isn't at all fun it pleasurable. I was feeling ok (other than my disease symptoms) until Monday. That is when I had to give up my daily walk as I felt like I was going to die. Deficiency symptoms we're only sporadic but now I am feeling dizzy, muscle cramps, neuropathy, brain fog, heat intolerant, exhausted etc all the time. I NEVER FEEL HUNGRY but I'm "starving" (BMI is 16.9). I wouldn't go by if you are hungry or not when you are losing weight so quickly.

livingleanlivingclean · July 2018

bp3000 wrote: »

Thanks guys. I guess my preferred approach and what I'll ultimately probably do is wait till I hit the goal I put into MFP of 108kg (which should happen sometime next week) then I'll reset and make my changes presumably with a new goal of 98kg. At that point I'll probably start to introduce some more calories to my diet. I bought a new scale that is probably *kitten* but tries to estimate my current BMR as 2368 kcal (similar to MFP anyway) so if I cut 500 kcals off that to get to 1868 kcals would that be what most recommend for weight loss? Considering I work an office/desk job. If I then introduce bike riding for some cardio 3 times a week and continue the weights that would be great right? I know it is probably still aggressive but if I keep to that then that should limit most of these long-term negatives you're talking about.

If so, where should the calories come from? I have an average deficit between what I eat now and the new goal of around 600 kcals. I'd initially close my open sandwich, an orange as a snack somewhere and add yoghurt to breakfast which would bring me up 250 kcals (approx.) on average. Could add cheese to the sandwich to bring it up to 300 kcals, though cheese and tuna isn't a favourite. If I started having almonds as a snack that probably could easily add another 100 kcals on average. Treat myself a bit more on a weekend lunch should cover the rest. Is there anything wrong with that plan?

I know livingleanlivingclean is suggesting starchy carbs added to dinner, what is the value of this? I haven't read anything that suggests anything good about starchy carbs but it hasn't been my focus tbh. Even though the research says it doesn't matter, if anything I'd want to distribute my calories to earlier in the day.

They add calories - which you need to do.. They are more calorie dense than non starchy vegetables..... They taste good? There is nothing wrong with carbs. They don't make you fat unless you're eating so many that they consistently put you over maintenance calories, but that applies to any macronutrient.

When you eat your calories makes not one jot of difference (besides personal preference). I prepped for bodybuilding comps eating most of my calories (including starchy carbs and dessert) after 730 every night.

kommodevaran · July 2018

Your weight record says you have had a daily deficit of 2227 calories, and that's a lot.

People (want to) do extreme things because they need to feel like they're doing something, and like others to see that they're not lazy and have willpower. But the real challenge is to accept that successful weight management comes from small, daily efforts, imperceptible to you, and invisible to others, for the rest of your life. In many ways, going from one extreme to another, is easier than finding a middle ground. But that's what you need to do in order to not swing back to your old habits. A moderate lifestyle does indeed have boundaries. You get to set them yourself, to your own preference, but they work, if you stick to them.

The value of adding starch to your meals, is that it makes your food taste better. The value of this is that you'll want to stick to your new diet. The value of that is that you'll be keeping the weight off, and not hate your life, at the same time. What I would call a win-win. You can also get a win-win from cooking and eating more at home - more variety, you can control your portions better, and you don't have to pay for foods you don't eat.

try2again · July 2018

kommodevaran wrote: »

In many ways, going from one extreme to another, is easier than finding a middle ground.

That's a profound statement, and not just as it applies to weight loss. And it really sums up the bulk of the posts we see here in the forums.

Hamsibian · July 2018

singingflutelady wrote: »

I'm currently malnourished and underweight because of health issues and let me tell you it isn't at all fun it pleasurable. I was feeling ok (other than my disease symptoms) until Monday. That is when I had to give up my daily walk as I felt like I was going to die. Deficiency symptoms we're only sporadic but now I am feeling dizzy, muscle cramps, neuropathy, brain fog, heat intolerant, exhausted etc all the time. I NEVER FEEL HUNGRY but I'm "starving" (BMI is 16.9). I wouldn't go by if you are hungry or not when you are losing weight so quickly.

I also lost a ton of weight due to health issues. I was malnourished, emaciated, freezing, half my hair fell out, I had absolutely no energy (couldn't walk to the next room without needing to sit down), very depressed and anxious, hormones were totally out of whack, and I developed osteoporosis.

I still had no appetite at 16 BMI, but I had to force myself to eat because I was starving my body. I'm still dealing with some of the health consequences from that loss 2.5 years later.

What should be my path forward? (Eating low calorie and don't feel hungry)

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