Cut or Intermittent fasting?
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gratiansin
Posts: 28 Member
Hi to everyone!
I decided that I should lose some fat, maybe 4-6 or 8 weeks challenge and after that, focus on lean bulking.
I just don't know what will work better, IF or just Cut daily calories.
Waiting for advices!
I decided that I should lose some fat, maybe 4-6 or 8 weeks challenge and after that, focus on lean bulking.
I just don't know what will work better, IF or just Cut daily calories.
Waiting for advices!
3
Replies
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It doesn’t matter. Calories are what matter, not what time you eat them.
Intermittent fasting can be a useful strategy if it helps you with satiety or adherence (it does for me), but otherwise there are no additional benefits for weight loss.11 -
Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.10 -
It doesn’t matter. Calories are what matter, not what time you eat them.
Intermittent fasting can be a useful strategy if it helps you with satiety or adherence (it does for me), but otherwise there are no additional benefits for weight loss.
Thank you for your opinion sir.
I'm just worried if I don't eat at right time I'm going to feel like a zombie at work.
Plus I've seen IF diets are way more complicated , food can spike insulin level as the first meal of the day.
7 -
Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.10
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Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!1 -
Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.
Thank you I really appreciate, I'm eating 6 times a day right now, and I do like this schedule plus all this information confuses me. Probabily I should go in calorie deficit for a while to test it out, and later IF .
The thing that confused me about IF is that I know breakfast is very important and also training in the morning may need some energy , or post workout food is required so muscles can get the nutrients . How can I manage this ?2 -
gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).10 -
gratiansin wrote: »Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.
Thank you I really appreciate, I'm eating 6 times a day right now, and I do like this schedule plus all this information confuses me. Probabily I should go in calorie deficit for a while to test it out, and later IF .
The thing that confused me about IF is that I know breakfast is very important and also training in the morning may need some energy , or post workout food is required so muscles can get the nutrients . How can I manage this ?
Breakfast is not necessarily very important. I don't eat until about 5 pm because of my schedule. I was doing IF before IF was a "thing" and didn't even know it. I also gained weight on it, maintained, and lost on it. I also work out fasted. Try it and see how it goes. It may work for you, or it may not.6 -
gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).
Understood, how about calories, if I'm going to lose fat, I should be in deficit just like in a mini cut ? And as I plan to do 16:8, I need to eat 2500 maybe ( need to re calculate ) I'm confused about carbs and when to eat and what.
My schedule is 6am to 2pm work then straight to gym , so my first meal would be at 2:15pm as pre workout , what I'm going to eat to not spike the insulin .
Been reading about sugar and carbs are really bad , but definitely I need some carbohydrates as energy for my training.4 -
musicfan68 wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.
Thank you I really appreciate, I'm eating 6 times a day right now, and I do like this schedule plus all this information confuses me. Probabily I should go in calorie deficit for a while to test it out, and later IF .
The thing that confused me about IF is that I know breakfast is very important and also training in the morning may need some energy , or post workout food is required so muscles can get the nutrients . How can I manage this ?
Breakfast is not necessarily very important. I don't eat until about 5 pm because of my schedule. I was doing IF before IF was a "thing" and didn't even know it. I also gained weight on it, maintained, and lost on it. I also work out fasted. Try it and see how it goes. It may work for you, or it may not.
5 pm wow, impressive!
How did you manage to work while starving ?0 -
gratiansin wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).
Understood, how about calories, if I'm going to lose fat, I should be in deficit just like in a mini cut ? And as I plan to do 16:8, I need to eat 2500 maybe ( need to re calculate ) I'm confused about carbs and when to eat and what.
My schedule is 6am to 2pm work then straight to gym , so my first meal would be at 2:15pm as pre workout , what I'm going to eat to not spike the insulin .
Been reading about sugar and carbs are really bad , but definitely I need some carbohydrates as energy for my training.
You’re wasting your time and effort for nothing worrying about carbs and insulin, unless you’re diabetic or have some medical condition where they matter.
Eat a reasonably balanced/nutritious diet on whatever time schedule fits you best. If you want to lose weight you need to be in a calorie deficit regardless of whatever else you’re doing.10 -
gratiansin wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).
Understood, how about calories, if I'm going to lose fat, I should be in deficit just like in a mini cut ? And as I plan to do 16:8, I need to eat 2500 maybe ( need to re calculate ) I'm confused about carbs and when to eat and what.
My schedule is 6am to 2pm work then straight to gym , so my first meal would be at 2:15pm as pre workout , what I'm going to eat to not spike the insulin .
Been reading about sugar and carbs are really bad , but definitely I need some carbohydrates as energy for my training.
You’re wasting your time and effort for nothing worrying about carbs and insulin, unless you’re diabetic or have some medical condition where they matter.
Eat a reasonably balanced/nutritious diet on whatever time schedule fits you best. If you want to lose weight you need to be in a calorie deficit regardless of whatever else you’re doing.
Sounds enough fair ! Thanks a lot sir, have a wonderful day/evening!0 -
Didn’t read through all these but saw insulin and IF and already knew what to say....
Insulin has nothing to do with weight gain/ loss....it’s a nutrient driver.
And as far as IF, it’s an eating schedule....it is irrelevant to body composition....8 -
As others have said, you are worrying about factors that don't matter in a healthy individual. Figure out what you prefer and works best for you schedule and performance and do that. Carbs and sugar are not bad. It all depends on the overall context of your diet. Insulin is not a bogey man. Of course it spikes after you eat. It needs to in order to transport the nutrients to the cells. If it didn't, you'd die. The chart below spells out the hierarchy for nutrition for training.
http://www.rumermorleypt.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Nutrition-pyramid.jpg5 -
As others have suggested, you are overcomplicating this and putting way too much energy worrying about things (meal timing, carbs, sugar) that have little to no importance beyond how well they support your lifestyle and ability to adhere to your calorie goal.
You say you are already thin. You need to decide whether your ultimate goal is (A) to be at current weight with lower body fat percentage or (B) to put on some weight with as much of it muscle as possible, so you end up with a lower body fat percentage at a higher weight.
Then you need to determine your maintenance calories, either from existing data if you've been tracking your calories for a while, or by using an online calculator like the one here on MFP (in which case you would "eat back" your exercise calories) or from a TDEE calculator elsewhere on the Internet (in which case you would not "eat back" your exercise calories). MFP is probably better if your exercise routine varies a lot from week to week.
If your ultimate goal is (A) to be at current weight with lower body fat percentage, the simplest thing is to do a recomp: Eat at maintenance, get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in).
If your ultimate goal is (B) to put on some weight with as much of it muscle as possible, so you end up with a lower body fat percentage at a higher weight, since you're already thin, personally I would go straight to the bulk, but if you want to do a short cut first, then aim for 200 to 300 cals below maintenance calories (still eating back exercise calories if you got your maintenance level on MFP -- you can just tell MFP you want to lose a half pound per week, and it will give you the number to aim for), get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in). The reason for the small deficit is that it helps minimize the amount of lean mass you lose as you lose weight. You want to lose fat, not lean mass.
When you decide to start bulking, aim for 200 to 300 cals above maintenance calories (still eating back exercise calories if you got your maintenance level on MFP -- you can just tell MFP you want to gain a half pound per week, and it will give you the number to aim for), get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in). The reason for the small calorie surplus is that it helps minimize the amount of fat you gain as you gain weight. You want to gain muscle, not fat.3 -
gratiansin wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).
Understood, how about calories, if I'm going to lose fat, I should be in deficit just like in a mini cut ? And as I plan to do 16:8, I need to eat 2500 maybe ( need to re calculate ) I'm confused about carbs and when to eat and what.
My schedule is 6am to 2pm work then straight to gym , so my first meal would be at 2:15pm as pre workout , what I'm going to eat to not spike the insulin .
Been reading about sugar and carbs are really bad , but definitely I need some carbohydrates as energy for my training.
What the hell have you been reading?!
Whatever it is it is leading you up the garden path.
No sugar isn't bad. What is confusing about carbs? Why are carbs bad? Fruit, vegetables and grains are bad for what reason precisely?
Why do you think you have to be the slightest concerned about insulin? Do you have some diagnosed medical condition? Why "spike" and not "rise"? Your insulin is supposed to rise and fall, it's a good thing.
14 -
gratiansin wrote: »musicfan68 wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.
Thank you I really appreciate, I'm eating 6 times a day right now, and I do like this schedule plus all this information confuses me. Probabily I should go in calorie deficit for a while to test it out, and later IF .
The thing that confused me about IF is that I know breakfast is very important and also training in the morning may need some energy , or post workout food is required so muscles can get the nutrients . How can I manage this ?
Breakfast is not necessarily very important. I don't eat until about 5 pm because of my schedule. I was doing IF before IF was a "thing" and didn't even know it. I also gained weight on it, maintained, and lost on it. I also work out fasted. Try it and see how it goes. It may work for you, or it may not.
5 pm wow, impressive!
How did you manage to work while starving ?
I'm not starving. I drink coffee in the morning which keeps me from being hungry most of the day. I'm also busy and don't have time to eat until after work.
You are way overthinking everything.2 -
musicfan68 wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »musicfan68 wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Eat whenever works best for your lifestyle. Calories will determine weight loss. Insulin is largely irrelevant unless you’re diabetic, the body knows what it’s doing when it comes to hormonal balance.
Thank you I really appreciate, I'm eating 6 times a day right now, and I do like this schedule plus all this information confuses me. Probabily I should go in calorie deficit for a while to test it out, and later IF .
The thing that confused me about IF is that I know breakfast is very important and also training in the morning may need some energy , or post workout food is required so muscles can get the nutrients . How can I manage this ?
Breakfast is not necessarily very important. I don't eat until about 5 pm because of my schedule. I was doing IF before IF was a "thing" and didn't even know it. I also gained weight on it, maintained, and lost on it. I also work out fasted. Try it and see how it goes. It may work for you, or it may not.
5 pm wow, impressive!
How did you manage to work while starving ?
I'm not starving. I drink coffee in the morning which keeps me from being hungry most of the day. I'm also busy and don't have time to eat until after work.
You are way overthinking everything.
Out of curiosity do you work out in the mornings? A high-calorie burn first thing and nothing to eat for many hours afterwards would be unsustainable to some and I was under the impression that protein within 2 hours was advantageous for muscle repair.2 -
gratiansin wrote: »gratiansin wrote: »Why is it one or the other?
You do realise that you can lose, gain or maintain weight while doing IF?
If IF helps you cut calories (and it sounds like you do want to cut calories) then go for it. On the other hand if it makes a calorie deficit harder to sustain for you then don't.
Interesting, I only notice the fat losing side of IF, never knew it is possible to maintain weight or gain doing like this.
But basically I only did dirty bulking and mini cuts. And I was thinking why should I look 6monts fat and 6 focusing on cutting (as example) when I can do lean bulk and gain weight and look good in the same time.
My body is skinny fat, I gained some muscle mass but also a lot of fat, all I want is to get rid of some percentage of fat and then just lean bulk.
Thank you for answer by the way sir!
You're welcome.
I did an unusual form of IF when losing weight and tried the more familiar 16:8 style while maintaining - my weight tracked my calorie balance as you would expect. Should you over-eat during your eating window you will gain weight
BTW - you are misunderstanding the role of insulin, it's supposed to rise when you eat. That's totally normal and how your body should work. Don't over complicate things or you may lose sight of your real priorities to reach your goal (calories, a good nutritious diet eaten at a time that personally suits you and effective training).
Understood, how about calories, if I'm going to lose fat, I should be in deficit just like in a mini cut ? And as I plan to do 16:8, I need to eat 2500 maybe ( need to re calculate ) I'm confused about carbs and when to eat and what.
My schedule is 6am to 2pm work then straight to gym , so my first meal would be at 2:15pm as pre workout , what I'm going to eat to not spike the insulin .
Been reading about sugar and carbs are really bad , but definitely I need some carbohydrates as energy for my training.
What the hell have you been reading?!
Whatever it is it is leading you up the garden path.
No sugar isn't bad. What is confusing about carbs? Why are carbs bad? Fruit, vegetables and grains are bad for what reason precisely?
Why do you think you have to be the slightest concerned about insulin? Do you have some diagnosed medical condition? Why "spike" and not "rise"? Your insulin is supposed to rise and fall, it's a good thing.
Well it was some articles about IF, and as the first meal of the day or last meal is bad to eat carbs or sugar.
Can't guarantee it is true but it was an idea I've been reading.
Cheers for answer sir!0 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »As others have suggested, you are overcomplicating this and putting way too much energy worrying about things (meal timing, carbs, sugar) that have little to no importance beyond how well they support your lifestyle and ability to adhere to your calorie goal.
You say you are already thin. You need to decide whether your ultimate goal is (A) to be at current weight with lower body fat percentage or (B) to put on some weight with as much of it muscle as possible, so you end up with a lower body fat percentage at a higher weight.
Then you need to determine your maintenance calories, either from existing data if you've been tracking your calories for a while, or by using an online calculator like the one here on MFP (in which case you would "eat back" your exercise calories) or from a TDEE calculator elsewhere on the Internet (in which case you would not "eat back" your exercise calories). MFP is probably better if your exercise routine varies a lot from week to week.
If your ultimate goal is (A) to be at current weight with lower body fat percentage, the simplest thing is to do a recomp: Eat at maintenance, get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in).
If your ultimate goal is (B) to put on some weight with as much of it muscle as possible, so you end up with a lower body fat percentage at a higher weight, since you're already thin, personally I would go straight to the bulk, but if you want to do a short cut first, then aim for 200 to 300 cals below maintenance calories (still eating back exercise calories if you got your maintenance level on MFP -- you can just tell MFP you want to lose a half pound per week, and it will give you the number to aim for), get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in). The reason for the small deficit is that it helps minimize the amount of lean mass you lose as you lose weight. You want to lose fat, not lean mass.
When you decide to start bulking, aim for 200 to 300 cals above maintenance calories (still eating back exercise calories if you got your maintenance level on MFP -- you can just tell MFP you want to gain a half pound per week, and it will give you the number to aim for), get plenty of protein, and lift heavy things (i.e., do progressive resistance training, with adequate rest/recovery days built in). The reason for the small calorie surplus is that it helps minimize the amount of fat you gain as you gain weight. You want to gain muscle, not fat.
Impressive. Well I always was skinny fat type , skinny arms legs chest back but fat around belly.
Been bulking over time , I did a sort of mini cut and then I was satisfied with body fat , and again went to bulking phrase .
Now my body fat is high percentage and all I desire is to lose more than before be almost shreded, so I can see my and and lateral abs, and focus on lean bulk. (Ps. I was counting my daily carbs, my only mistake was that even on rest day I was eating same amount of calories, maybe that's one of the reason I gain fat so fast)
Appreciate your answer !!
0
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