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BMI CONTROVERSY‼️🤬
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I personally think body fat percentage is a better metric for overall health and fitness. A male who is muscular may be very fit but "overweight" at 10% body fat (or a woman at 18%). Conversely, some one with less muscle may be normal BMI, but have an abundance of body fat. That's why I have a body fat goal, more so than a goal weight.0
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A woman is definitely not overweight at 18% BF (and I don't think a man is likely to be at 10%).
BF is a better measurement, but one it's hard to have an accurate number for, so BMI serves a purpose.9 -
We all know that BMI, alone, is only a basic indicator, at best.
Throw in waist to hip ratio, blood pressure, cholesterol, alcohol consumed, smoker or not, time spent moving (exercise), body fat measurements, resting heart rate, general mood, etc. and you have a much better picture.2 -
We all know that BMI, alone, is only a basic indicator, at best.
Throw in waist to hip ratio, blood pressure, cholesterol, alcohol consumed, smoker or not, time spent moving (exercise), body fat measurements, resting heart rate, general mood, etc. and you have a much better picture.
I must say, when I started my journey my resting BPM was 10 BPM more than now that I just hit normal bmi. It is still higher than most and scares me as heart attacks run in my family. I do cardio at least 90 minutes a day and my CO is in the excellent range, but still....high resting BPM.
BMI is a good base....as is a smart watch. It is a help to keep you moving but don't let the number be your be all/end all.0 -
I found this website that, in addition to BMI, calculates your body-fat (using a tape measure - not calipers) and also your ideal weight (big range though) and quite a few other things if you are adventurous.
https://www.calculator.net/
I guess the goal would be to be in the healthy range for as many of these indicators as possible.0 -
The information that you all have been posting is extremely useful. I’ve been sooooo obsessed with lowering my BMI that at one time, I was only consuming 438 calories per day in order to quickly lower my BMI from “27.59 kg/m2 (Overweight)” to what it is now at “23.45 kg/m2 (Normal)”. My highest BMI has been “30.51 kg/m2 (Obese Class I)” at age 46, 4’ 11” and 146 lbs.3
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The information that you all have been posting is extremely useful. I’ve been sooooo obsessed with lowering my BMI that at one time, I was only consuming 438 calories per day in order to quickly lower my BMI from “27.59 kg/m2 (Overweight)” to what it is now at “23.45 kg/m2 (Normal)”. My highest BMI has been “30.51 kg/m2 (Obese Class I)” at age 46, 4’ 11” and 146 lbs.
Well that is silly - and I'm sure nobody was advocating eating only 483 calories per day for extreme fast weight loss.
Yes you want to get your BMI into healthy range - but you also want to do it in a healthy way.
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Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
Did you mean "thin" or something more like "healthy and fit"? I wouldn't describe the muscular men I knew in the USAF who were above BMI yet passed the tape or dunk tests as "thin" - why does "thin" need to be the ideal for women?15 -
Get a DEXA scan. They're really helpful!0
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KrazyKrissyy wrote: »Get a DEXA scan. They're really helpful!
yes they may be for those who want that info.
For most people BMI is a good guide and they can get a good idea of their healthy weight range without getting a DEXA
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According to my BMI, I am classed as 'obese'. I am overweight but I don't think I'm obese!
One of the PTs at my gym is around 6ft and 18 stone; he compared himself to a gym member who is a similar height/weight, and they both look completely different. The PT looks fit and toned, the gym member does not.
He explained that this is because muscle weighs more, and is less dense, than fat. He also added that as I'm working out more and building muscle, the scales may not go down BUT I will look better. So, I'm going to ignore BMI and go by how I look and if I can get into that dress which is a size smaller :-)16 -
According to my BMI, I am classed as 'obese'. I am overweight but I don't think I'm obese!
One of the PTs at my gym is around 6ft and 18 stone; he compared himself to a gym member who is a similar height/weight, and they both look completely different. The PT looks fit and toned, the gym member does not.
He explained that this is because muscle weighs more, and is less dense, than fat. He also added that as I'm working out more and building muscle, the scales may not go down BUT I will look better. So, I'm going to ignore BMI and go by how I look and if I can get into that dress which is a size smaller :-)
No muscle doesn’t weigh more and is less dense...it is denser than fat so a lb of muscle takes up less room than a lb of fat...8 -
I found a cool visualizer website. Enter your height/weight M/F...and see what the computer visualizer says you look like. It is 3D so you can rotate the visualizer around. I had a fun time with this making me taller, shorter, lighter, heavier :-)
http://www.bmivisualizer.com/
and just for fun, here are examples of body fat percentages
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We all know that BMI, alone, is only a basic indicator, at best.
Throw in waist to hip ratio, blood pressure, cholesterol, alcohol consumed, smoker or not, time spent moving (exercise), body fat measurements, resting heart rate, general mood, etc. and you have a much better picture.
Are you talking about physical health more broadly or about being overweight/obese?
In terms of the latter, the waist hip ratio and fat percentage, ok but the rest of those? General mood isn't a great indicator of physical health (it is a good indicator of mental health, but that's not what we're talking about from what I can tell). Yes there are some conditions that can cause symptoms of depression, but I doubt the majority of people who report having depression have those symptoms that can be traced to a different condition.
In terms of being at a healthy weight, ones blood pressure and cholesterol can both be in a normal/healthy range while that person is still overweight (my blood pressure was 112/72 on Thursday - I'm still overweight), they can also be in an unhealthy range while someone is at a healthy weight. Resting heart rate has a lot to do with how much cardio one does (mine hovers around the high 50s/low 60s). And then alcohol consumption, smoking, and lets throw in drug use don't necessarily have anything to do with weight (health yes).
Again, I'm not sure if you're talking about physical health more broadly or whether or not someone is overweight. It wasn't especially clear to me. I could see both being true. If we're talking about general physical health I agree with most of what you've said. The exception, of course, being "general mood" - one can be physically healthy, fit, and a healthy weight, and still have crippling mental health issues.1 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
How do you know that they were deemed overweight? Did you have their height and weight?6 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
How do you know that they were deemed overweight? Did you have their height and weight?
Yes, I work in the medical field so I take a lot of people's heights and weights of various age groups.4 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
Did you mean "thin" or something more like "healthy and fit"? I wouldn't describe the muscular men I knew in the USAF who were above BMI yet passed the tape or dunk tests as "thin" - why does "thin" need to be the ideal for women?
I mean healthy and fit. For me thin means healthy and fit and in the normal BMI range. I see anyone in the healthy BMI range as thin, healthy and fit.
I don't mean "skinny" when I say thin, I mean fit and healthy looking, as in not overweight or fat. Maybe I use thin in a different way than others do. I wouldn't call someone underweight thin, I would say "skinny/unhealthy". Didn't mean to say anything saying women should be skinny I didn't mean to imply that!3 -
paperpudding wrote: »KrazyKrissyy wrote: »Get a DEXA scan. They're really helpful!
yes they may be for those who want that info.
For most people BMI is a good guide and they can get a good idea of their healthy weight range without getting a DEXA
Sorry but I have to disagree. According to BMI, I'm currently several pounds away from being overweight. However, people always assume I'm a whopping 25-30 pounds less than I really am.
149 pounds. 5'6. Thigh gap, 25 in waist, and a size 2-4. My BMI is 24. This is why I urge DEXA scanning.
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Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
Did you mean "thin" or something more like "healthy and fit"? I wouldn't describe the muscular men I knew in the USAF who were above BMI yet passed the tape or dunk tests as "thin" - why does "thin" need to be the ideal for women?
I mean healthy and fit. For me thin means healthy and fit and in the normal BMI range. I see anyone in the healthy BMI range as thin, healthy and fit.
I don't mean "skinny" when I say thin, I mean fit and healthy looking, as in not overweight or fat. Maybe I use thin in a different way than others do. I wouldn't call someone underweight thin, I would say "skinny/unhealthy". Didn't mean to say anything saying women should be skinny I didn't mean to imply that!
I would argue that fit is very different than being in the normal BMI range. Healthy? Well my BMI is 27.8 and I'm pretty sure all of my medical doctors would deem me physically healthy if we look at this holistically. I'm also, fit if we're talking about cardiovascular fitness. I personally know number of people who don't fall into the normal BMI (and not because they are especially muscular) range but are definitely fit.
This point is of course totally moot if, by your definition, someone can't be thin if they aren't healthy, fit, and in the normal BMI range - that is to say, all three of those things have to be true. Then again I also know people who are in the normal BMI range and are not at all healthy or fit (and the people I'm thinking of would agree with me).
TL:DR - thin appears to be a social construct.9 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Personally, I find that BMI is generally a good guideline for the majority of people, but I did just have a case yesterday where I was affected by my BMI. I scheduled an upcoming shoulder surgery for mid January, and when doing so, I was forced to also schedule a pre-op physical based solely on the fact that my BMI puts me slightly into the overweight range. If I was in the normal range I would not have had to pass a physical. I am 6'2" 197 lbs and my bodyfat % is sub 10%. I was aware that I am 3-4 lbs into the overweight category but it never bothered me until yesterday when my surgeons office insisted I schedule a physical based only on my BMI. I don't have a problem with BMI being used as a guideline for people, but I think that strictly enforcing these guidelines just like what happened to me yesterday is ridiculous. Doctors offices, and insurance companies do need to recognize that there will be outliers and need to have secondary measures in place in those cases(height to waist ratio or whatever). With that being said, I believe that most people who think they are outliers actually are not, and sometimes people need to be honest with themselves and realize that they are larger than they should be.
I think BMI is far more accurate for women. I have rarely ever seen a women who was "overweight" yet still looked thin, but have seen plenty of muscular men who shouldn't be deemed overweight.
Did you mean "thin" or something more like "healthy and fit"? I wouldn't describe the muscular men I knew in the USAF who were above BMI yet passed the tape or dunk tests as "thin" - why does "thin" need to be the ideal for women?
I mean healthy and fit. For me thin means healthy and fit and in the normal BMI range. I see anyone in the healthy BMI range as thin, healthy and fit.
I don't mean "skinny" when I say thin, I mean fit and healthy looking, as in not overweight or fat. Maybe I use thin in a different way than others do. I wouldn't call someone underweight thin, I would say "skinny/unhealthy". Didn't mean to say anything saying women should be skinny I didn't mean to imply that!
I would argue that fit is very different than being in the normal BMI range. Healthy? Well my BMI is 27.8 and I'm pretty sure all of my medical doctors would deem me physically healthy if we look at this holistically. I'm also, fit if we're talking about cardiovascular fitness. I personally know number of people who don't fall into the normal BMI (and not because they are especially muscular) range but are definitely fit.
This point is of course totally moot if, by your definition, someone can't be thin if they aren't healthy, fit, and in the normal BMI range - that is to say, all three of those things have to be true. Then again I also know people who are in the normal BMI range and are not at all healthy or fit (and the people I'm thinking of would agree with me).
TL:DR - thin appears to be a social construct.
Of course there are exceptions etc I was just saying in general I imagine thin as someone who is in healthy BMI range and doesn’t look overweight. And I meant healthy as in healthy BMI. If you wanted me to go into depth for every single term that’s ridiculous and a waste of time and is besides the point I was trying to make.
Geez you people are reading way too much into words. Everyone seems to have a different interpretation and view on the differences so it doesn’t really matter. I never said you can’t be one of the three or all three or anything I was just trying to explain the way I see things, not make an all inclusive definitive definition for every single term. And I’m not even saying my interpretation is correct, I was just trying to explain what it is to explain that I did not mean to say the ideal women should be at the low end of the BMI.
My point was to say most women at an overweight BMI look overweight more so than men at the same overweight BMI.7
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