Do you think most American vegan recipes are bland, and if so...why are they like that?
Replies
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I eat a lot of plant based foods now and spices and condiments make things taste great, with little fuss
I now use salsa for a lot of things (Aldi has a fresh salsa in their cooler section that's amazing-I use it to top mushroom dishes, asparagus, in salads, on potatoes etc etc). I throw different spices with beans and rice, use different low calorie dressings as marinades for grains and veggies etc. 0 -
Thanks for some ideas for good flavors to add. Some I knew, some sound like some great new ones. Wish I could try them all as the majority sound lovely (got some food allergies that interfere with my ability to enjoy them all, sadly).
And for folks who gave some ideas for why vegan food might be bland: thank you. That's kind of what I was looking for.
Interesting point about 'why' people go vegan, and how that might affect the importance of cooking vs. the importance of ethical considerations.
And also good point about Americans and cooking and how little so many Americans, by and large, know about how to cook well without a few key ingredients. Thinking about almost everyone I know, that actually correlates pretty well. I mean, I have a few friends who are good cooks and they typically went out of their way to learn about cooking more than they were taught by their parents (not more practice cooking, but actively sought out methods and tricks of cooking a good meal that were different than what they were taught).
Everyone else I know follows recipes, but doesn't really know a lot about techniques that involve flavor, etc... They may still have good food, don't get me wrong, but take out a few ingredients, and it all falls to pieces.
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cassyblack86 wrote: »I am a vegan chef, and I'm American. And I can assure you that my food is not in the least bit bland.
Any recipes you'd recommend, then?0 -
It's not clear from your OP: Are you relatively new to vegan cooking/eating? (I know you said you've eaten mostly whole foods for quite a while; how long you've been entirely plant-based isn't as clear to me.)
I am not new to vegan cooking/eating in terms of making dishes (maybe 10 years now?) although I am not entirely plant based. Can't be, at the moment. One major hurdle (although there are more than one) is that I'm allergic to soy, and also I cannot have wheat, but have such a high sensitivity to wheat that I cannot have foods that are processed on the same equipment lines and get contaminated. So most grains, most pseudo-grains, and most legumes, nuts, and seeds are all processed on lines that process wheat. There are some brands here and there that are not, but they are typically so costly that I just can't afford to get even close to enough protein to stay healthy. My daughter is in the same boat, although my son is currently vegetarian edging toward vegan.
If I were independently wealthy, and could eat whatever I want, I'd be perfectly happy to be vegan. Don't care one way or the other about meat flavor, although umami is definitely one of the flavors that I find tricky to add to veggie based dishes (especially without soy sauce).There are a bunch of ways to add umami to plant-based dishes...
Thanks for the ideas. Many I sadly cannot use (stupid allergy and other issues, again), but my son might be able to utilize, especially the cocoa powder and seaweed. Thanks! Forgot about cocoa in things like mole and such!I'm not a recipe cook - rarely use non-baking recipes for anything other than new flavor combo ideas - so I don't know about the recipes...
i used to be a recipe cook, then stopped for a while because the family had so many allergies pop up that I just couldn't find recipes that fit, and then slowly started trying to use recipes again because I have discovered that I just cannot accurately remember flavors enough to mix them together myself well. If I try something in a recipe that goes together, I can remember that. If I have two flavors I have tried separately, though, I literally do not seem to be able to figure out if they would be good together or not on my own until I try them. If there was such a thing as 'flavor challenged,' that'd be me.
It's one reason this issue is of interest to me, because our ingredients are almost ALWAYS expensive because they have to be free of many allergens. So a recipe that is terrible is a financial blow, and not being able to tell if something will have a lot of flavor, before I make it? Really ends up being a handicap in trying to find good food!1 -
I don’t tend to cook based a lot on recipes (some, but usually only when I want something really special), but the recipes and cookbooks I’ve used have never lacked in flavor. That being said, PARTICULARLY with cooking (versus baking) there’s no hard and fast rule that you have to follow it to the letter. If something you’re making isn’t to your liking, then adjust (one of my favorite go to recipes is far too salty for my taste if I follow it exactly, so I cut the salt way back). This is why it’s good to taste along the way (pro chefs do), and season to taste as you go. Don’t be afraid of salt, especially.0
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I'm not vegan but sometimes eat vegan or vegetarian meals. I don't think the recipes I have used have been bland.
Can you post an example of some American vegan recipes you thought was really bland?
Diet recipes that have very little fat, salt or sugar can be less good tasting but that is not just vegan recipes.0 -
My plant-based dishes except vegetable soup are typically bland because I never learned how to cook (I can cook enough to eat healthy food, but not enough to be confident that I can serve other people my food and they will enjoy it). However I've eaten enough vegan food at restaurants to know that there are many flavorful vegan recipes out there.0
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Depends.
You gotta remember that Americans are the ones that put Raisins on Potato Salads.
Your food may be bland by nature...
hehehehehehe Just kidding.
I find that people who follow recipes to the letter, end up with bland dished, because the ingredients vary in quality, origin and most importantly.... The creator's taste may be different to yours.
They may like the bland taste.
I know that some people find salty, dishes i think are tasteless.
Keep in mind that Walmart iodized salt is different than Himalayan Pink Salt.
Same for Canned beans vs fresh beans. Soaking beans vs raw cooking also changes the flavor profile.
Things like that.
Dark/Black Kale is very bitter, while Cavolo Nero is sweeter. The difference is where they're grown.
So, to summarize. If you follow a recipe and it sucks, try changing some things around.
Adding more salt, adding fresh garlic, Herbs etc.
Take notes and who knows, maybe you'll find your groove.
I find cooking to be a very relaxing process.4 -
You gotta remember that Americans are the ones that put Raisins on Potato Salads.
I have never seen or heard of potato salad with raisins. Gross. Who does that?
I think you are right that everyone has different tastes and when you cook you should adjust seasonings to match your own tastes. If you are used to eating more spice, fat, sugar, salt or fresh herbs, etc and trying out diet vegan recipes it might seem very bland because it is missing something you are used to.2 -
Depends.
You gotta remember that Americans are the ones that put Raisins on Potato Salads.
Your food may be bland by nature...
hehehehehehe Just kidding.
Where is that a thing. I've lived in the US all my life, and never seen it.
That said, although raisins on potato salad sounds disgusting, are raisins supposed to be evidence of bland cooking? I've seen lots of Sicilian recipes that use them in various ways, and my understanding is that that's due to influence from the middle east, where they are used in a variety of dishes.
I don't like plain raisins or raisins in dessert foods, but I will use them, as well as other dried fruits in plenty of quite flavorful savory dishes that tend to have these inspirations (some of my tagine dishes, for example).
Re recipes, I can't ever bring myself to follow them to the letter, and couldn't cook from them regularly. I tend to use them as inspiration. However, I think how good they are depends on source and it may be likely that people who don't really know how to cook or are beginners and feel they must cook from recipes also seek out really easy recipes that happen to be not well vetted and are bland.
I also suspect, as others have said, that lots of people who go 100% plant based are thinking about it from a health perspective (or ethical, but I think the ethical people are more likely to also care about taste) and so find recipes on a site that isn't really about taste, like Forks Over Knives. Also, a lot of those sites are really anti fat (including nuts, olives) and anti salt and I also think may believe that food being bland is positive, as one of their things is that 100% plant based causes weight loss, deals with food addiction (sigh), etc.5 -
Depends.
You gotta remember that Americans are the ones that put Raisins on Potato Salads.
Your food may be bland by nature...
hehehehehehe Just kidding.
I have never seen raisins on a potato salad. I think that might be just some Americans that you know. It's not a common thing anywhere I've lived.1 -
"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc 2 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
I've been watching SNL more lately...since Alec Baldwin became a regular. Never saw that skit though, or noticed raisins on potato salad in Walmart and Publix, although I wasn't looking.1 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
It's a common thing among white people in the Midwest, that's the joke.1 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
Interesting. I live in the midwest (Chicago). My parents were both from the midwest, and I've never seen it, so I don't think it's all that common. I've bought potato salad at various local grocery stores (never looked at food at a Walmart -- it's been years since I've even been in one --and never been to a Publix at all) and browsed potato salad recipes plenty of times (I like German style best, or other kinds without mayo), and haven't seen it. I have seen raisins in chicken salad.
Googling brought up a few sweeter, allegedly "Southern style" recipes as the first hits for raisins in potato salad (after all the stuff about the skit and the meme). (Looking, Publix seems to be a primarily southern store, and while Walmart is all over it started in the south -- I think this is more of a southern thing or white southern thing than midwestern.)
Anyway, this article is consistent with how I think of potato salad: https://www.epicurious.com/recipes-menus/how-to-make-potato-salad-without-a-recipe-article
No raisins mentioned.
So clearly this raisin thing is a calumny! More seriously, I think raisins in a potato salad sounds disgusting, but more because sweeter potato salad sounds unpleasant to me and they don't really seem to go. But people eat lots of stereotypical things I don't like so shrug. Maybe it's a thing somewhere.
Bigger issue, sorry for missing the joke, went right over my head! I haven't watched SNL regularly for years, so unless someone shares a sketch with me I won't have seen it.1 -
rheddmobile wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
It's a common thing among white people in the Midwest, that's the joke.
Also a lifelong Midwestern white person: Never heard of it, let alone saw or tasted it.2 -
rheddmobile wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
It's a common thing among white people in the Midwest, that's the joke.
Also a lifelong Midwestern white person: Never heard of it, let alone saw or tasted it.
Well possibly your friends have good taste!
My husband’s mom is from Indiana and it’s a thing there. A very bad thing.1 -
rheddmobile wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
It's a common thing among white people in the Midwest, that's the joke.
Also a lifelong Midwestern white person: Never heard of it, let alone saw or tasted it.
Well possibly your friends have good taste!
My husband’s mom is from Indiana and it’s a thing there. A very bad thing.
I have an adventurous palate and like raisins in savory food, but the thought of them in potato salad makes me shudder.2 -
Can you post an example of some American vegan recipes you thought was really bland?
Sure. :-) I'm just gonna grab a couple I've tried in the last couple of months. Both my son and I found these bland enough that it just wasn't that great. Edible, mind you, but just...kinda bleh.
1. coconut lime tofu with soba noodles - https://www.chefdehome.com/recipes/691/buckwheat-soba-noodles-with-coconut-lime-tofu (can't copy and paste the ingredients from the site) Seemed like it would have a lot of flavor, but it really didn't.
2. Or thai red curry with vegetables
Again, I looked at the ingredients and thought it seemed like it would be nice, but it was just kind of bland, like there wasn't nearly enough flavor for all the veggies involved. :-/
Ingredients
3 Carrots
2 cloves Garlic
1 tbsp Ginger, fresh
1 1/2 cups Kale, packed
1 Orange or green bell pepper, yellow
1 Red bell pepper
1 White onion, chopped (about 1 cup), small
1 can Coconut milk, regular
2 tbsp Thai red curry paste
1 Pinch Salt
1 tbsp Coconut oil or olive oil
1/2 cup Water
1 1/2 teaspoons coconut sugar or turbinado (raw) sugar or brown sugar
1 tbsp Tamari or soy sauce
2 tsp Rice vinegar or fresh lime juice
serve over: 1 1/4 cups Jasmine rice or long-grain brown rice, brown
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Can you post an example of some American vegan recipes you thought was really bland?
Sure. :-) I'm just gonna grab a couple I've tried in the last couple of months. Both my son and I found these bland enough that it just wasn't that great. Edible, mind you, but just...kinda bleh.
1. coconut lime tofu with soba noodles - https://www.chefdehome.com/recipes/691/buckwheat-soba-noodles-with-coconut-lime-tofu (can't copy and paste the ingredients from the site) Seemed like it would have a lot of flavor, but it really didn't.
2. Or thai red curry with vegetables
Again, I looked at the ingredients and thought it seemed like it would be nice, but it was just kind of bland, like there wasn't nearly enough flavor for all the veggies involved. :-/
Ingredients
3 Carrots
2 cloves Garlic
1 tbsp Ginger, fresh
1 1/2 cups Kale, packed
1 Orange or green bell pepper, yellow
1 Red bell pepper
1 White onion, chopped (about 1 cup), small
1 can Coconut milk, regular
2 tbsp Thai red curry paste
1 Pinch Salt
1 tbsp Coconut oil or olive oil
1/2 cup Water
1 1/2 teaspoons coconut sugar or turbinado (raw) sugar or brown sugar
1 tbsp Tamari or soy sauce
2 tsp Rice vinegar or fresh lime juice
serve over: 1 1/4 cups Jasmine rice or long-grain brown rice, brown
Hmm. Looking at the recipe that looks like more than enough spices and aromatics for the volume of other food, plus vinegar and lime for sourness, salt and soy for salty, and tamari plus soy for umami. Not a whole lot of oil, which carries flavors... how it's prepared could make some difference, but honestly I'd be surprised too if this turned out bland! I guess it must depend on how it's cooked.0 -
rheddmobile wrote: »Can you post an example of some American vegan recipes you thought was really bland?
Sure. :-) I'm just gonna grab a couple I've tried in the last couple of months. Both my son and I found these bland enough that it just wasn't that great. Edible, mind you, but just...kinda bleh.
1. coconut lime tofu with soba noodles - https://www.chefdehome.com/recipes/691/buckwheat-soba-noodles-with-coconut-lime-tofu (can't copy and paste the ingredients from the site) Seemed like it would have a lot of flavor, but it really didn't.
2. Or thai red curry with vegetables
Again, I looked at the ingredients and thought it seemed like it would be nice, but it was just kind of bland, like there wasn't nearly enough flavor for all the veggies involved. :-/
Ingredients
3 Carrots
2 cloves Garlic
1 tbsp Ginger, fresh
1 1/2 cups Kale, packed
1 Orange or green bell pepper, yellow
1 Red bell pepper
1 White onion, chopped (about 1 cup), small
1 can Coconut milk, regular
2 tbsp Thai red curry paste
1 Pinch Salt
1 tbsp Coconut oil or olive oil
1/2 cup Water
1 1/2 teaspoons coconut sugar or turbinado (raw) sugar or brown sugar
1 tbsp Tamari or soy sauce
2 tsp Rice vinegar or fresh lime juice
serve over: 1 1/4 cups Jasmine rice or long-grain brown rice, brown
Hmm. Looking at the recipe that looks like more than enough spices and aromatics for the volume of other food, plus vinegar and lime for sourness, salt and soy for salty, and tamari plus soy for umami. Not a whole lot of oil, which carries flavors... how it's prepared could make some difference, but honestly I'd be surprised too if this turned out bland! I guess it must depend on how it's cooked.
It could depend on things like the brand of curry paste you used, or the amount of salt, or how long the aromatics were cooked, or how fresh the veggies were, and of course your own tastes and what you're used to eating. A "pinch" of salt plus a tablespoon of tamari wouldn't be enough salt for my husband. I would be eating happily and he'd be going back for the salt shaker!2 -
They both look okay to me. I'm willing to make them within the week and report back on how they taste or modifications based on taste (with the understanding that I am a white person in Chicago, so may inherently have no taste).
Agreed it could have to do with veggie quality, and it's out of season for everything.1 -
They both look okay to me. I'm willing to make them within the week and report back on how they taste or modifications based on taste (with the understanding that I am a white person in Chicago, so may inherently have no taste).
Agreed it could have to do with veggie quality, and it's out of season for everything.
I would love if you could do that try these recipes out and let me know - both my son and I are from the southwest, and also spend a lot of time in California with friends who are from various parts of Asia (and used to feed us) and are used to eating foods with a lot of spices, so...maybe that has something to do with it too? Perhaps I just need more flavor/spices for personal preference and never quite realized.
Because, like for the second recipe, the veggies were fresh (I tend to go to organic grocers or farmers markets) and I tried to cook the aromatics longer, but the other veggies just enough to be a good texture and color. I always use tamari for soy sauce, so that's a bit more intense, get a rice vinegar that's imported from Japan, use that Thai Kitchen brand red curry paste (added a bit more than requested in the recipe), cooked the curry paste a little bit early on in the oils to give it more flavor, etc...
But again - it was really just kinda bland tasting to me and my son when we were done. We ended up adding enough salt until it was more tolerable, but...yeah, just wasn't great. :-(0 -
They both look okay to me. I'm willing to make them within the week and report back on how they taste or modifications based on taste (with the understanding that I am a white person in Chicago, so may inherently have no taste).
Agreed it could have to do with veggie quality, and it's out of season for everything.
I would love if you could do that try these recipes out and let me know - both my son and I are from the southwest, and also spend a lot of time in California with friends who are from various parts of Asia (and used to feed us) and are used to eating foods with a lot of spices, so...maybe that has something to do with it too? Perhaps I just need more flavor/spices for personal preference and never quite realized.
Because, like for the second recipe, the veggies were fresh (I tend to go to organic grocers or farmers markets) and I tried to cook the aromatics longer, but the other veggies just enough to be a good texture and color. I always use tamari for soy sauce, so that's a bit more intense, get a rice vinegar that's imported from Japan, use that Thai Kitchen brand red curry paste (added a bit more than requested in the recipe), cooked the curry paste a little bit early on in the oils to give it more flavor, etc...
But again - it was really just kinda bland tasting to me and my son when we were done. We ended up adding enough salt until it was more tolerable, but...yeah, just wasn't great. :-(
Totally forgot about this post, sorry. Will make them soon.0 -
I find that a legit Thai curry paste (from Thailand) will make a huge difference in a curry like this. Quite frankly, the one in most grocery stores, Thai Kitchen, is quite bland compared to some other ones that are more authentic, like Mae Ploy brand. Also, authentic Thai uses Palm sugar, not brown sugar or Turbinado. Also, Galangal doesn't quite taste like Ginger. They are different and similar. Even the lime juice is an Americanized version of distressed Kaffir Lime leaves, which you can get online or at some specialty grocery stores.
I'm pretty serious about my curry. I also like Choakoh Coconut milk better than Thai Kitchen, that makes a big difference. Actually, Kroger's canned Coconut Milk is even better than Thai Kitchens.1 -
Short answer: No. I season my food.1
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rheddmobile wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »"Raisins in potato salad" comes from a Saturday Night Live sketch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzMzFGgmQOc
Thank you... I was about to reply with the same skit.
I thought more people watched SNL.
And BTW... My sister in law, from OHIO, makes it with raisins.
Walmart and Publix sell them with and without raisins.
This is a common thing... or so i thought.
It's a common thing among white people in the Midwest, that's the joke.
Also a lifelong Midwestern white person: Never heard of it, let alone saw or tasted it.
same1 -
I also wanted to mention (my daughter is vegetarian but not vegan) that some curry pastes have shrimp paste, so you have to really read the labels. You might be able to add Vegan Fish Sauce instead to give it some more seafood saltiness.0
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MikePfirrman wrote: »I find that a legit Thai curry paste (from Thailand) will make a huge difference in a curry like this. Quite frankly, the one in most grocery stores, Thai Kitchen, is quite bland compared to some other ones that are more authentic, like Mae Ploy brand. Also, authentic Thai uses Palm sugar, not brown sugar or Turbinado. Also, Galangal doesn't quite taste like Ginger. They are different and similar. Even the lime juice is an Americanized version of distressed Kaffir Lime leaves, which you can get online or at some specialty grocery stores.
I'm pretty serious about my curry. I also like Choakoh Coconut milk better than Thai Kitchen, that makes a big difference. Actually, Kroger's canned Coconut Milk is even better than Thai Kitchens.
Hey, thanks for letting me know how it compared; that is very helpful. Sadly, I cannot use other curry paste that I have found so far. :-( We have folks in the family who are celiacs and so we can't use processed sauces or pastes that aren't gluten free, and the Thai kitchen curry paste one is the only one I've found. And coconut milk, we've got some sulfite allergic folks, so we have to go with brands that don't have added sulfites, which knocks out a lot of the true Asian brands.
I think I'll have to try and make it myself sometime, but phew, there are sauces that go IN the paste that I'll likely have to make myself, too. One has to suffer for good flavor, LOL. But at least I can get a better gauge of how flavorful I can try for, so again, thanks.
Thankfully, we have a handle on the veggies and fresh seasonings, at least! Have an enormous Asian market here where you can get palm sugar, galangal, lime leaves, and so on. Just can't use much of their processed stuff, like many of the noodles, dried and ground spices (most cheaper imported versions have wheat processing issues), most of the pre-made sauces of any kind...
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