CROSSFIT???

Crossfit has changed the way I workout. I do pay $85/mth to workout at a crossfit gym but the way I see it is that a personal trainer costs about $50-$60 per session and at a crossfit gym you get a lot of personal trainer attention (at least at my gym) so it's almost like buying a share in a personal trainer. What I like about crossfit is that it's efficient, no need to spend an hour or two in the gym when you can go all out and be done in 20-30 minutes. And the best part is the community. At my gym all workouts are class format, most classes are between 5-10 people. When people are done their workout they start cheering on the others who aren't done yet. It's not uncommon for high-fives and congrats to be passed around after a long and hard workout. I truly feel at home.

Anything works for losing fat as long as it establishes a calorie deficit. Period.

Anything works for gaining muscle as long as it provides a tension overload with sufficient volume at the muscle.

A wise man once said, "As to methods there may be a million and then some, but principles are few. The man who grasps principles can successfully select his own methods. The man who tries methods, ignoring principles, is sure to have trouble.”

Crossfit is merely one method of applying the foundational principles that fat loss and muscle gain are built upon. It just so happens that it's an extremely heavily marketed method that many people are flocking too. And truthfully, guided by the right coach, it can be a very reasonable approach.

Unfortunately, there are a lot of bad coaches and "box" owners who espouse CF methods in extremely unsafe manners. I mean, locally here I've witness time and time again olympic lifts being taught to rank novices under extreme states of fatigue, which for anyone who understands olympic lifting knows, is a huge no-no.

Like any other method though... it's about taking the good and weeding out the bad.

Glad you realized a lot of success personally... congrats!

All right, so here's my question. And, mind you, I do not claim to know much about XF; I'm just going off of what I've heard from friends on MFP and IRL like with bootcamps & such. But I've never participated in it formally myself. What appeals to me is not only being able to become fit aesthetically (ripped, whatever) and that is part of my goal, but being able to perform better in a wide variety of situations - a court, a field, a track, in the mountains, etc. This is my ultimate goal. And I'm not particularly interested in training too specifically (for lack of a better phrase). I can't train exactly how a pro basketball player would train, cuz I wanna do more than that. I can't just run sprints only, or just lift weights only, or just go hiking all the time - you get my point? So what's the best training for someone like me?

@stroutman - I think I understand some of your issues with XF - the recklessness, the lack of scientific approach... But what would you recommend for someone who wants to improve all around fitness & ability? I'm interested in not only increased size & strength, but also flexibility, coordination, lateral quickness, improved endurance, jumping, sprinting, power movements, etc. I'd call it 'functional ability' but I know there are some problems with that term as well. As of now I've been doing P90X, running, basketball, hiking (when I can in flat old Texas), and some of my own workouts on bars & rings. But I'm no expert and I'd like to take it to a next level. Would XF not be a good move?

I'm not particularly interested in paying for an expensive XF gym or trainer, but I'm not real certain another trainer in a regular gym would serve me any better, would it? And I am considering joining a gym as well since I think I've gone as far as P90X can take me.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

Good questions man. Over on my forum a while back, someone started a thread asking, "Why do you do it? Why do you train?" My reply was something along the lines of, "I want to be able to run faster, punch harder, jump higher, and climb higher than everyone else when society as we know it ends."

Of course I'm being facetious to a degree. The point is though, I'm not looking to be the most muscular guy out there. Hell, my genetics wouldn't allow for it even if I were using anabolics. I mountaineer. I mountain bike. I hike. I play flag football. Like you, I'm interested in being functionally fit.

The problem with the term functional is it has become a buzz word to mean one specific type of training, which is usually bogus. In reality, functional is context specific. What's functionally fit for a sprinter won't be functionally fit for an endurance athlete. Put differently, the development of our physical capacities must match the things we do in life.

The Crossfit mentality suggests that you can be the best at everything all at once. That's nonsense. As humans, we have a limited ability to manage stress... and the stress of training is no different. Our choices in the gym are accompanied by compromises. If we want to be the best endurance runner, we're going to have to dedicate a large volume of attention to endurance training and because of it, we're going to sacrifice strength, muscle, power, speed, etc. and vice versa.

I belong to a forum that's full of strength coaches who work with top level athletes. Recently we ran a thread on there about crossfit and I wanted to share some of the comments here. Mind you, many of these people are working with highly paid athletes. These are some of the brightest minds in the strength & conditioning field:

"Do you know one world class athlete who does crossfit? I don’t, because training to failure repeatedly outpaces the opportunity for repair."

"A better question is "Do you know any elite athlete that went through the developmental process by Crossfit?"

"Crossfit trains to mediocrity across a broad spectrum of physical traits without regard to what an actual sport demands other than their own "sport"."

"Crossfit isn't an athletic development model because it doesn't adequately develop all aspects of athleticism...period. Are there some good Crossfit affiliates out there...I'm sure and they have good coaches as well. But most seem to follow the WOD blindly from what I can tell. You can't learn proper progressions, athletic development, etc. in a weekend cert...sorry."

"crossfit didn't invent circuit training. It's a recurring trend I hear now that whenever someone throws in circuit training all of the sudden its "crossfit." Crossfit is circuit training gone ape**** with no regards to safety."

"I still firmly believe that Crossfit is a dangerous trend that hopefully will eventually go away. I hold out hope that eventually they will hurt all their clients and run out of gullible folks willing to sacrifice their bodies for a "good" workout. One wise strength coach told me that Crossfit will be like Nautilus. When I was a kid there was a Nautilus center in every town and Nautilus training was all the rage. 10 years later, it was gone. I can only hope."

"Crossfit is a Brand...and it's branded well. (no argument)
Their Brand sells the idea that they have "formulated" some type of training methodology that's revolutionary.
They have a strong following from those who benefited from their own dedication to an exercise program and gained results and now believe Crossfit is "IT"! They bring their friends and network and build comraderie within the gym which is attractive to prospective members. However their logic and workout methodology is sorry and I genuinely disagree with it. WOD is like a first-year teacher going to class with no lesson plan flying by the seat of their pants. Except the teacher had to at-least earn a degree and student-teach under a mentor for 6 months. I believe Crossfit certifications are earned in weekend.
I know 2 women (30 yrs. old; and 50 yrs. old) who have already BROKEN their wrists from falling off from a kipping pull-up to failure and 1-arm Supine TRX movement. One came from a Crossfit gym is Boston and the other from a gym in Texas. The one that broke her wrist performing a kipping pull-up was told the next day to "tough" through it. Fortunately she left and got it X-rayed and put in a cast. I train a wrestler (wrestling lessons only) who was hyped on Crossfit (a different gym) before he started with me....the kid came in mid-week and mid-season sore as he could be from 200 overhead KB swings the previous day (he had a shoulder injury that they even knew about?)....WOD's are silly and negligent. I'm discouraged to be associated with other "professionals" using this APPROACH to training. Furthermore I find the technique demonstrated on their videos horrid and their logic shallow and ignorant."

I don't share these to paint a picture of veiled hate on the XFit community. I share it to let you see some of the flaws pointed out by great minds in the field.

At the end of the day, my own training is structured based on what I'm trying to develop right now. And this changes based on my weaknesses and my goals. And when I'm not building up certain capacities, I'm at least maintaining them. As an example, right now I've no big mountain climbs scheduled and I'm not a warm weather hiker for the most part. I don't need to keep my conditioning levels high. So they're on maintenance... 2-3 brief sessions per week that are mostly steady state work.

What's prioritized right now is strength and power work. I'll have 4-5 sessions per week for this. And even within this category... certain things are being emphasized while others are being put to maintenance. For instance, I might have a lagging muscle group or movement pattern so I'll throw more volume at that and put other things on maintenance.

This exemplifies how we have a limited ability to deal with stress, so you have to divvy it up how it best meets your needs at the current time.

If I were to simply look at everything I like doing, you'd see that I enjoy endurance based stuff, pure anaerobic based stuff, and other things that are a mixture. Crossfit would run me through the ringer trying to bring everything up all at once. Based on all of the research in this field, the advice from all of the pioneers in this field, and from my own experience working with numerous athletes though, my improvements would be watered down compared to a sensibly planned/periodized approach.

That should be a start to your answer but I'm certainly open to continued conversation.

All right, so here's my question. And, mind you, I do not claim to know much about XF; I'm just going off of what I've heard from friends on MFP and IRL like with bootcamps & such. But I've never participated in it formally myself. What appeals to me is not only being able to become fit aesthetically (ripped, whatever) and that is part of my goal, but being able to perform better in a wide variety of situations - a court, a field, a track, in the mountains, etc. This is my ultimate goal. And I'm not particularly interested in training too specifically (for lack of a better phrase). I can't train exactly how a pro basketball player would train, cuz I wanna do more than that. I can't just run sprints only, or just lift weights only, or just go hiking all the time - you get my point? So what's the best training for someone like me?

@stroutman - I think I understand some of your issues with XF - the recklessness, the lack of scientific approach... But what would you recommend for someone who wants to improve all around fitness & ability? I'm interested in not only increased size & strength, but also flexibility, coordination, lateral quickness, improved endurance, jumping, sprinting, power movements, etc. I'd call it 'functional ability' but I know there are some problems with that term as well. As of now I've been doing P90X, running, basketball, hiking (when I can in flat old Texas), and some of my own workouts on bars & rings. But I'm no expert and I'd like to take it to a next level. Would XF not be a good move?

I'm not particularly interested in paying for an expensive XF gym or trainer, but I'm not real certain another trainer in a regular gym would serve me any better, would it? And I am considering joining a gym as well since I think I've gone as far as P90X can take me.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

Good questions man. Over on my forum a while back, someone started a thread asking, "Why do you do it? Why do you train?" My reply was something along the lines of, "I want to be able to run faster, punch harder, jump higher, and climb higher than everyone else when society as we know it ends."

Of course I'm being facetious to a degree. The point is though, I'm not looking to be the most muscular guy out there. Hell, my genetics wouldn't allow for it even if I were using anabolics. I mountaineer. I mountain bike. I hike. I play flag football. Like you, I'm interested in being functionally fit.

The problem with the term functional is it has become a buzz word to mean one specific type of training, which is usually bogus. In reality, functional is context specific. What's functionally fit for a sprinter won't be functionally fit for an endurance athlete. Put differently, the development of our physical capacities must match the things we do in life.

The Crossfit mentality suggests that you can be the best at everything all at once. That's nonsense. As humans, we have a limited ability to manage stress... and the stress of training is no different. Our choices in the gym are accompanied by compromises. If we want to be the best endurance runner, we're going to have to dedicate a large volume of attention to endurance training and because of it, we're going to sacrifice strength, muscle, power, speed, etc. and vice versa.

I belong to a forum that's full of strength coaches who work with top level athletes. Recently we ran a thread on there about crossfit and I wanted to share some of the comments here. Mind you, many of these people are working with highly paid athletes. These are some of the brightest minds in the strength & conditioning field:

"Do you know one world class athlete who does crossfit? I don’t, because training to failure repeatedly outpaces the opportunity for repair."

"A better question is "Do you know any elite athlete that went through the developmental process by Crossfit?"

"Crossfit trains to mediocrity across a broad spectrum of physical traits without regard to what an actual sport demands other than their own "sport"."

"Crossfit isn't an athletic development model because it doesn't adequately develop all aspects of athleticism...period. Are there some good Crossfit affiliates out there...I'm sure and they have good coaches as well. But most seem to follow the WOD blindly from what I can tell. You can't learn proper progressions, athletic development, etc. in a weekend cert...sorry."

"crossfit didn't invent circuit training. It's a recurring trend I hear now that whenever someone throws in circuit training all of the sudden its "crossfit." Crossfit is circuit training gone ape**** with no regards to safety."

"I still firmly believe that Crossfit is a dangerous trend that hopefully will eventually go away. I hold out hope that eventually they will hurt all their clients and run out of gullible folks willing to sacrifice their bodies for a "good" workout. One wise strength coach told me that Crossfit will be like Nautilus. When I was a kid there was a Nautilus center in every town and Nautilus training was all the rage. 10 years later, it was gone. I can only hope."

"Crossfit is a Brand...and it's branded well. (no argument)
Their Brand sells the idea that they have "formulated" some type of training methodology that's revolutionary.
They have a strong following from those who benefited from their own dedication to an exercise program and gained results and now believe Crossfit is "IT"! They bring their friends and network and build comraderie within the gym which is attractive to prospective members. However their logic and workout methodology is sorry and I genuinely disagree with it. WOD is like a first-year teacher going to class with no lesson plan flying by the seat of their pants. Except the teacher had to at-least earn a degree and student-teach under a mentor for 6 months. I believe Crossfit certifications are earned in weekend.
I know 2 women (30 yrs. old; and 50 yrs. old) who have already BROKEN their wrists from falling off from a kipping pull-up to failure and 1-arm Supine TRX movement. One came from a Crossfit gym is Boston and the other from a gym in Texas. The one that broke her wrist performing a kipping pull-up was told the next day to "tough" through it. Fortunately she left and got it X-rayed and put in a cast. I train a wrestler (wrestling lessons only) who was hyped on Crossfit (a different gym) before he started with me....the kid came in mid-week and mid-season sore as he could be from 200 overhead KB swings the previous day (he had a shoulder injury that they even knew about?)....WOD's are silly and negligent. I'm discouraged to be associated with other "professionals" using this APPROACH to training. Furthermore I find the technique demonstrated on their videos horrid and their logic shallow and ignorant."

I don't share these to paint a picture of veiled hate on the XFit community. I share it to let you see some of the flaws pointed out by great minds in the field.

At the end of the day, my own training is structured based on what I'm trying to develop right now. And this changes based on my weaknesses and my goals. And when I'm not building up certain capacities, I'm at least maintaining them. As an example, right now I've no big mountain climbs scheduled and I'm not a warm weather hiker for the most part. I don't need to keep my conditioning levels high. So they're on maintenance... 2-3 brief sessions per week that are mostly steady state work.

What's prioritized right now is strength and power work. I'll have 4-5 sessions per week for this. And even within this category... certain things are being emphasized while others are being put to maintenance. For instance, I might have a lagging muscle group or movement pattern so I'll throw more volume at that and put other things on maintenance.

This exemplifies how we have a limited ability to deal with stress, so you have to divvy it up how it best meets your needs at the current time.

If I were to simply look at everything I like doing, you'd see that I enjoy endurance based stuff, pure anaerobic based stuff, and other things that are a mixture. Crossfit would run me through the ringer trying to bring everything up all at once. Based on all of the research in this field, the advice from all of the pioneers in this field, and from my own experience working with numerous athletes though, my improvements would be watered down compared to a sensibly planned/periodized approach.

That should be a start to your answer but I'm certainly open to continued conversation.

Well stated. I have seen similar conclusions and opinions on other professional forums. Sometimes I enjoy looking at the crossfit videos and picking up an idea or two for some new compound exercises. But it's an unfortunate fact of the fitness business that too often people are not satisfied with solid, scientifically-based, focused training programs. They feel compelled to develop workout ideas into a cultlike group that becomes centered around tribal loyalty and dogmatic purity.

I appreciate the responses here. And no apology necessary, SHBoss, your questions are similar to mine too.

I get it that I need to realize that I can only 'effectively' focus on a few things at a time. So I'll need to just be kinda picky as to what I'm going to spend my energy & time on improving, while just hoping to maintain in some other areas. So, I'm probably done with P90X & will do a more traditional (3 days of) weight lifting at a gym instead, and I just can't give up running all together so maybe just once or twice a week.

bump

had a number of emails lately asking for my opinions on CF

I know the initial post was done long time ago, but thought I would share a great article with you about CrossFit: http://www.fastcompany.com/1771136/crossfit-where-navy-seals-and-pregnant-soccer-moms-get-ripped

I started my journey in January and I have never been phsycially active with sports or any type of athletic program my whole life. I began CrossFit for a social experience as our friends had a gym. My first workout was a total of 4 minutes and I was hooked. My husband and my three kids ages, 17, 13 and 10 all participated from day 1. The program can be scaled to meet each clients fitness level I think it is important to find a gym where the trainers do make that a priority as there are affiliate gyms that push harder therefore injuries can occur. I can tell you, that I have seen many ripped men who have done their own work outs and "appear" to be in the best shape and the WOD's have kicked their butt. They do not encourage you to go in and lift as much weight as you can, in fact my husband is strong and he can lift A LOT of weight, he had a mental struggle as they told him to drop to a lower weight as he has to work on his form. Many battles later, he listened and now he has great form and able to increase his weight. Anyone who lifts can appreciate that achievement. As far as a total work out, if you think this gym is only about lifting weights forget it, it isn't, do you know I have gone in to do a WOD and it was to do a 5k, yep that is just cardio! I am 34 I thought I would need hip relacement by the time I was 40 due to Rheumatoid Arthritis, I have a terrible lowered backa nd have been taken away by ambulance before because of it, and I am stronger then I ever have been, I no longer have to take medications and most improtant I am not in pain!

In reference to the gentleman who comments on the "cultlike" atmosphere, I will not like those of us who do love and have the passion do joke that we drank the CrossFit Kool-aid, and I will tell you why, it has nothing to do with the trainers or the cost, or by our egos, (as if you knew me you would no, I do not have that) (www.poweredbycrossfit.net) It is because we all have our own journey, we all started somewhere, sure my starting point maybe at a different place then yours, but to each of us it has it's own meaning.

It is about personal best, I hope you read my bog to see what it really has been about and how for the first tie in my life I belong, and I have no reason to belong with these people, they ripped, I am not. I have lost 30lbs with 50lbs mroe to go, I do know I have always wanted to do a "boy" push up my whole life and I know that feeling when I did my first one, the other members of the gym share in that, they celebrate with you on your triumphs and they feel your pain at each work out.

CrossFit, is growing leaps and bounds and if you think it is just marketing, it isn't, if you think because it is a cult, it isn't. It is because it is much greater it makes you believe in yourself, you can't get that at another gym.

Steve -

I can entirely respect your view just the same. From years of of trying different things and failing miserably, I have come to the realization that differnt things work for different people. CrossFit, might be the answer for me and my family, but respect that you have different views. I think for me people need to find what works for them. We all have opinions, it is part of our make up.

I just feel saddened for those CrossFit trainers that do care about their clients to be brought down by those others that do not take their clients wellbeing into consideration. As most people do rely on them for guidance. I would love for you to watch a video, it is clear there are some good ones out there.

Best of luck to you!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GR52X5XdOD0&feature=channel_video_title