It can’t all be calories in/out
Replies
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It is calories in and out but also insulin resistance. Many people who consume a lot of sugars become insulin resistant so their body stores excess sugars as fat because the break down in their metabolism. While others who have a good response to insulin in their metabolism can get away with with processed sugar and foods. Eventually people who get away with the junk food end up having it catch up to them when they get older.84
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Calories in is a measure of energy intake. Calories out is a measure of energy expended. When they are equal, your fat stores remain virtually constant. When intake>expended, fat stores increase. When intake<expended, fat stores decrease.
Energy In = Energy Out + Energy Stored (Energy stored can be negative, positive or zero). You cannot create energy. You can add it in the form of food and burn or store it. There are no other options.
This is a law that you cannot break. Genetics, various conditions and all of that plus your movement/metabolism all affect the expended side of the equation. If you were to have 2 people virtually identical in age/height/weight/gender/fitness, and caloric intake, same macros, etc., chances are you would have two different burn rates, even if they did everything the same. (But in reality, they really aren't doing everything the same because there are complexities in your body process that may vary).
But, no matter what, it absolutely all the time every time is about energy balance. It's always calories in v. calories out. It's just not easy to discern the differences on the calories out side. That's why you start out with a calories in estimate and adjust over time to find out what your own metabolism looks like.11 -
azzeazsaleh5429 wrote: »Eventually people who get away with the junk food end up having it catch up to them when they get older.
What does this mean?15 -
There are other things besides thyroid output that affect metabolism. Brown fat, mitochondria, bone and muscle mass. But the question is how much do these things affect metabolism, and are there "naturally thin" people. There is no evidence that I have found that these things have such a huge effect that they hinder weight loss or weight gain. As already stated, you can have no thyroid output whatsoever, and at most this affects metabolism by only 5%. This was an eye opener for me. I am hypo and in the past "blamed my glands" for my weight problem. My Dr. told yes it could be, if my glands weighed a hundred pounds.13
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collectingblues wrote: »estherdragonbat wrote: »kimondo666 wrote: »ofc above link is CICO for healthy people, hyperthyroidism, or hypothyroidism affect gains - lose weight situation too.
By about 5%.
And *only* if the thyroid condition isn't treated adequately.
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?3 -
Some cars are more efficient than others, but they all only run as long as they have fuel. Gasoline in = miles down the road. The human body is a heat engine as well. CI=CO. Some bodies may be a bit more efficient, but not enough to matter within the context of this discussion.13
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collectingblues wrote: »If someone only saw how I ate on the weekends in a deficit they would assume it's up to genetics or high metabolism. I will eat pancakes, waffles, three bowls of pasta, pizza, dessert, a fair share of wine.. sometimes wings and ribs.
While I do have a higher than average calorie goal (I am always moving) I don't eat how I do on the weekend during the day when no one is around. Snack is usually a protein shake, lunch is a chicken salad etc.
Yup. Some of my colleagues think I eat all of the time -- I've gotten some work teasing about my snacks.
What they *don't* see is that my eating habits are like those of a toddler: frequent small amounts of food. They may see me grabbing a mini candy bar at work, or a snack-sized bag of Fritos, but they *don't* see the fact that I've got a whopping 200 calories at breakfast, a small dinner, and that I'm working out 7 days a week.
Me too. I bring breakfast and lunch to work, but eat them in small increments throughout the day. People walk into my office and often marvel that I'm eating again. They don't know how I can eat so much and not get fat. Well, I'm eating my maintenance of 1700 cals. I also take a walk on my lunch break every day (by myself), take the stairs rather than the elevator (never see anyone else on the stairs), and am constantly up and down and walking around rather than doing everything by phone/email.
Heck, most of us were wrong about what we ourselves were eating before we started logging, it's easy to get the wrong impression of how someone else eats and burns calories!
And I eat a pretty even mix of stereotypically "healthy" whole foods and convenience foods like pizza, treats, fast food, etc. Lost weight as expected based on my calories and maintaining for a couple of years doing the same.10 -
Comparison is the thief of joy...
I often have to remind my husband that I cannot eat as much as he does or I will gain weight at an alarming rate. He's a big dude - 5'11" and 250lbs of mostly muscle, not a lot of body fat. At that, he works an active job, so can easily maintain around 3000 calories a day. If he wants to lose weight, he just drops down to 2500... which is STILL more than I can eat and even maintain on. He often thinks that I am starving myself just because I eat so much less than he does. I'm obese, if I was starving myself, I would not be!7 -
briittanyxxoo wrote: »collectingblues wrote: »estherdragonbat wrote: »kimondo666 wrote: »ofc above link is CICO for healthy people, hyperthyroidism, or hypothyroidism affect gains - lose weight situation too.
By about 5%.
And *only* if the thyroid condition isn't treated adequately.
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?
Correct. As long as you are adequately treated, it's exactly the same as anyone else.
I've been hypo/have Hashimoto's for 32 years, and as long as my meds are in line, my weight loss is *exactly* what my deficit predicts it should be.14 -
briittanyxxoo wrote: »
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?
That's correct. I don't have a thyroid, but I lost weight at the expected rate and with no greater effort than a normal person.10 -
azzeazsaleh5429 wrote: »It is calories in and out but also insulin resistance. Many people who consume a lot of sugars become insulin resistant so their body stores excess sugars as fat because the break down in their metabolism.
Insulin resistance makes it harder to store sugar (which starch is broken down into too) as fat, because insulin is part of the process of doing that.
Typically if you eat a mixed diet and don't overeat enormously you won't be storing much sugar as fat anyway, as it's easier for the body to use the sugar for immediate energy and to store the fat as fat (energy for the future). But that has no bearing on whether you gain weight or not, that's calories.
Consuming carbs doesn't cause insulin resistance, typically it's a combination of genetics and being overfat (what is a problematic level of overfatness depends on genetics, and I say overfat since it can happen at a normal BMI, although it's a lot more common with obesity, and I think some things like steroids can make it more likely too).13 -
briittanyxxoo wrote: »collectingblues wrote: »estherdragonbat wrote: »kimondo666 wrote: »ofc above link is CICO for healthy people, hyperthyroidism, or hypothyroidism affect gains - lose weight situation too.
By about 5%.
And *only* if the thyroid condition isn't treated adequately.
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?
Not significantly, no.3 -
azzeazsaleh5429 wrote: »It is calories in and out but also insulin resistance. Many people who consume a lot of sugars become insulin resistant so their body stores excess sugars as fat because the break down in their metabolism. While others who have a good response to insulin in their metabolism can get away with with processed sugar and foods. Eventually people who get away with the junk food end up having it catch up to them when they get older.
Please stop reading Fung. Correlation does not imply causation34 -
I am a small person (both short and in my ideal BMI range, which is “small” to many people). I moved and took a new job in the same month as I reached my goal weight after losing 100 pounds. Most people I see every day don’t know my history. They think I am either naturally small, or am small because I’m a runner. They sometimes think that because I love food in general and chocolate in particular, I can eat “junk” because I’m either an athlete or just have a fast metabolism.
Those people don’t know that I spent most of my life up to this point being obese. They don’t know that my sweets, like everything else I eat, are carefully planned to fit into my maintenance calories. They don’t even know I track all my food, since I have no reason to tell everyone about it. They’re usually shocked when they hear about my weight loss.
You don’t know everything about another person’s history or what they do when you’re not around.25 -
briittanyxxoo wrote: »collectingblues wrote: »estherdragonbat wrote: »kimondo666 wrote: »ofc above link is CICO for healthy people, hyperthyroidism, or hypothyroidism affect gains - lose weight situation too.
By about 5%.
And *only* if the thyroid condition isn't treated adequately.
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?
I have severe hypothyroidism, correctly treated (not over-treated) and lost weight just like anyone else . . . except that I burn noticeably more calories daily than MFP predicts, even when I give it accurate inputs.
That has nothing to do with hypothyroidism, but if treated hypothyroidism were weight loss doom, it wouldn't be very likely to happen.
To the OP: If I burn more calories than the average person, by your thinking I should be naturally thin, right? Nah. I spent decades being obese, despite working out 6 days most weeks, and even competing as a masters athlete while obese for over a decade. A few hundred extra daily calories is easy to eat . . . and even out-eat. Trust me. "Naturally thin" people, by and large, just move more and eat less, in some combination.7 -
I got a part time job at McDonald's when I was 16. I used to eat at least 3 McDonald's a week and I lost a lot of weight. It didn't matter that I was eating a lot of junk. I couldn't drive so walked everywhere, I did hockey and judo, and I did at least 16 hours a week on my feet at work plus school which I walked to and from. It really was just calorie in Vs calories out.
Even now it looks like I eat a lot but in reality I eat a lot of low calorie stuff all day long and leave about 1000 calories for dinner and pudding. People at work don't understand how I don't stop eating all day when they see me eating another 80kcal snack and my family/friends don't understand how I can eat such big meals at home and maintain a normal BMI.10 -
briittanyxxoo wrote: »collectingblues wrote: »estherdragonbat wrote: »kimondo666 wrote: »ofc above link is CICO for healthy people, hyperthyroidism, or hypothyroidism affect gains - lose weight situation too.
By about 5%.
And *only* if the thyroid condition isn't treated adequately.
So having treated hypothyroidism wont affect weight loss any different than any one else?
I read a PhD thesis on that topic quite a while ago, and the consensus was that the 'metabolism' doesn't repair itself and those max 5% reduction remain. However, 5% is not a lot, and you can't lose even more if your condition worsens. Plus, if you're treated properly you have more energy, you are more likely to move around, to fidget (fidgetting gets reduced when you feel low on energy, and even that burns some calories), feel less hungry, are more likely to work out, etc...1 -
collectingblues wrote: »If someone only saw how I ate on the weekends in a deficit they would assume it's up to genetics or high metabolism. I will eat pancakes, waffles, three bowls of pasta, pizza, dessert, a fair share of wine.. sometimes wings and ribs.
While I do have a higher than average calorie goal (I am always moving) I don't eat how I do on the weekend during the day when no one is around. Snack is usually a protein shake, lunch is a chicken salad etc.
Yup. Some of my colleagues think I eat all of the time -- I've gotten some work teasing about my snacks.
What they *don't* see is that my eating habits are like those of a toddler: frequent small amounts of food. They may see me grabbing a mini candy bar at work, or a snack-sized bag of Fritos, but they *don't* see the fact that I've got a whopping 200 calories at breakfast, a small dinner, and that I'm working out 7 days a week. Me too. I bring breakfast and lunch to work, but eat them in small increments throughout the day. People walk into my office and often marvel that I'm eating again. They don't know how I can eat so much and not get fat. Well, I'm eating my maintenance of 1700 cals. I also take a walk on my lunch break every day (by myself), take the stairs rather than the elevator (never see anyone else on the stairs), and am constantly up and down and walking around rather than doing everything by phone/email.
Heck, most of us were wrong about what we ourselves were eating before we started logging, it's easy to get the wrong impression of how someone else eats and burns calories!
And I eat a pretty even mix of stereotypically "healthy" whole foods and convenience foods like pizza, treats, fast food, etc. Lost weight as expected based on my calories and maintaining for a couple of years doing the same.
Oh yes! I trained my colleagues to think that I'm eating all the time! I'm just in the kitchen with a tiny cookie and enjoy it so that people see it. Eat a wafer bar at my desk every day, share recipes etc... one person already wonders how I manage to be so thin 3 -
Running2Fit wrote: »My husband is one of those people who can seemingly eat whatever he wants and not gain weight. But he’s on his feet all day at work, he’s a fidgeter - he’s always moving, he tends to forget to eat at work so comes home and hasn’t eaten all day, he stops eating when he’s full, he doesn’t eat out of boredom. And his weight does shift - it’s just not noticeable on his frame. He gained 10 lbs over the holidays and he just distributes his weight very evenly so he didn’t even go up a pant size. And of course when he goes back to his normal routine he loses it.
Yes, people who have Thanksgiving dinner with my skinny mom marvel about her "fast metabolism." What they don't see is that she is very active and frequently skips meals, so when she does eat, it is a big meal, for which she has plenty of calories for due to her activity level.4 -
My husband is like this. Probably looks like he eats like a pig. BUT, sometimes he also doesn’t eat almost anything. So depends on if you were with him all day every day to truly get an accurate picture.
Also, the guy doesn’t sit still. Literally. Not even when he’s sleeping. 😒4
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