Supplements?

"Nature’s foods are complete. To make a profit, manufacturers isolate out and concentrate nutrients, like vitamins and minerals, and sell them as expensive pills. The consequence is to create serious imbalances within the workings of your cells, and then diseases follow (including cancer, heart disease, and earlier death). Don’t risk your life and waste your money on these gimmicks. The only supplement I routinely recommend is vitamin B12."

Dr. John McDougall[, M.D.

Replies

  • shaumom
    shaumom Posts: 962 Member
    edited February 2019
    I think it's important to note that first, it's pretty irrelevant whether or not 'nature's foods' are complete. It's relevant how much a person GETS of 'nature's foods,' as it were. An apple can be full of every vitamin in the world but it doesn't matter a bit unless a person EATS that apple, you know?

    Second, this matters very much because our diets today are significantly different than diets would have been before supplements existed. World-wide, human beings had vastly different diets depending on where they were. But one thing they had in common was that they tended to have a few crucial, geography-specific foods that were eaten constantly to help with nutrients that were difficult to get in their environment (like, numerous cultures from the far north had foods specifically to give them vitamin D that were not seen much in other places).

    People do not eat like that anymore. People in Alaska, for example, don't all eat walrus blubber daily to get their vitamin D (although I imagine some do, too). Instead, those that don't get their vitamin D through food take supplements for it. Because like I said before, when it comes to our health and vitamin needs, it matters much more what we eat than what is available.

    Not saying that the vitamin industry isn't going to sell us everything they can, and make us think we need every bit of it. It's a business, and they want to make money. But vitamin supplements DO serve a purpose, too.

    Although on an end note, I'd say that Dr. McDougall has also obviously not been keeping up with current research into the concerns of changing nutrient levels in our foods. Many foods picked up certain nutrients, such as minerals, from the soil. Some of these minerals haven't been added back INTO the soil, because they weren't required for the health of the plant, and after decades of farming in the same areas, some of these areas have significantly less of these minerals, and therefore the food grown ON these areas has less of these minerals too.

    So lists of how much X or Y veggie has of certain minerals may be higher than what you are actually getting, depending on how long ago the research was done, and how depleted the soil is for the food one is buying. :-/
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    I have a diagnosed vitamin D deficiency, probably because I live in a place where I have to stay indoors for a big chunk of the year. I don't consider it either a "risk" or a "waste" to supplement something that my doctor specifically recommended.
  • MichelleSilverleaf
    MichelleSilverleaf Posts: 2,029 Member
    shaumom wrote: »
    Although on an end note, I'd say that Dr. McDougall has also obviously not been keeping up with current research into the concerns of changing nutrient levels in our foods. Many foods picked up certain nutrients, such as minerals, from the soil. Some of these minerals haven't been added back INTO the soil, because they weren't required for the health of the plant, and after decades of farming in the same areas, some of these areas have significantly less of these minerals, and therefore the food grown ON these areas has less of these minerals too.

    I'd be honestly curious to see these studies. Most if not all farmers test their fields every year for soil health and to make sure the nutrients are there. Also I don't know if you've ever tried to grow anything in poor soil but speaking from experience you don't grow much of anything. I can't imagine farmers are growing the amount of crops they're growing on soil that's depleted of nutrients.
  • ccrdragon
    ccrdragon Posts: 3,220 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    It's always hilarious when someone says supplements are crap and than follows it with, except for this one supplement. Which is even more ironic that it demonstrates that certain diet styles are incomplete.

    There are several supplements that you could never get the levels eating food, that you could get with supplements. No matter how much meat you eat, you couldn't get 5g of creatine. Similarly, this would br difficult to achieve levels of L-Citruline from natural sources.

    Or the ones that start out 'all supplements are crap, but I (and only I) have access the special magical pixie dust (that is not a supplement although you take it in pill/liquid form) that will do x'.
  • dlkfox
    dlkfox Posts: 463 Member
    I've read that the reason why b12 is often deficient is because we wash our fruits and vegetables well. Apparently b12 is a common nutrient in dirt. Makes sense he would recommend a supplement for that rather than eating dirt, lol.

    B12 comes from meats and dairy. It's not in fruits, vegetables, or dirt.
  • AndOne8675
    AndOne8675 Posts: 151 Member
    I happily give.my kids breakfast cereal, lots of added vitamins in there..they aren't quite yet to the point of sitting down to bowls full of fruit and veg.
  • psychod787
    psychod787 Posts: 4,081 Member
    dlkfox wrote: »
    I've read that the reason why b12 is often deficient is because we wash our fruits and vegetables well. Apparently b12 is a common nutrient in dirt. Makes sense he would recommend a supplement for that rather than eating dirt, lol.

    B12 comes from meats and dairy. It's not in fruits, vegetables, or dirt.

    This. The whole McDougal diet is plant based. Hence why you might want a b12 supplement. Unless you have a digestive disorder or some kind of anemia, b12 is kinda worthless. Imho
  • COGypsy
    COGypsy Posts: 695 Member
    I happily give.my kids breakfast cereal, lots of added vitamins in there..they aren't quite yet to the point of sitting down to bowls full of fruit and veg.

    Lol--I'll be 45 in a month and I'm not quite to the point of sitting down to bowls of fruit and veg! I often make my dessert a bowl of cereal, partly because it's vitamin fortified!
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    psychod787 wrote: »
    dlkfox wrote: »
    I've read that the reason why b12 is often deficient is because we wash our fruits and vegetables well. Apparently b12 is a common nutrient in dirt. Makes sense he would recommend a supplement for that rather than eating dirt, lol.

    B12 comes from meats and dairy. It's not in fruits, vegetables, or dirt.

    This. The whole McDougal diet is plant based. Hence why you might want a b12 supplement. Unless you have a digestive disorder or some kind of anemia, b12 is kinda worthless. Imho

    It's can also be useful for people over 60, they make up a pretty large proportion of the population with a B12 deficiency because our ability to process it can diminish with age.
  • fitnessgirlsam
    fitnessgirlsam Posts: 1 Member
    What’s the best pre workout
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 25,284 Member
    ccrdragon wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    It's always hilarious when someone says supplements are crap and than follows it with, except for this one supplement. Which is even more ironic that it demonstrates that certain diet styles are incomplete.

    There are several supplements that you could never get the levels eating food, that you could get with supplements. No matter how much meat you eat, you couldn't get 5g of creatine. Similarly, this would br difficult to achieve levels of L-Citruline from natural sources.

    Or the ones that start out 'all supplements are crap, but I (and only I) have access the special magical pixie dust (that is not a supplement although you take it in pill/liquid form) that will do x'.

    Marketing 101 ;)
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 25,284 Member
    I have a diagnosed vitamin D deficiency, probably because I live in a place where I have to stay indoors for a big chunk of the year. I don't consider it either a "risk" or a "waste" to supplement something that my doctor specifically recommended.

    Ditto to the diagnosed Vit D deficiency plus I'm also anemic and would have to eat liver all day long to get the iron I need and that's just not going to happen.
  • RelCanonical
    RelCanonical Posts: 3,883 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    ccrdragon wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    It's always hilarious when someone says supplements are crap and than follows it with, except for this one supplement. Which is even more ironic that it demonstrates that certain diet styles are incomplete.

    There are several supplements that you could never get the levels eating food, that you could get with supplements. No matter how much meat you eat, you couldn't get 5g of creatine. Similarly, this would br difficult to achieve levels of L-Citruline from natural sources.

    Or the ones that start out 'all supplements are crap, but I (and only I) have access the special magical pixie dust (that is not a supplement although you take it in pill/liquid form) that will do x'.

    Marketing 101 ;)

    As someone who has worked in digital marketing for seven years, a lot of the content on websites is emotionally-charged jargon written by people who don't actually know what they're talking about and write it because they were told to do so and they don't want to lose their jobs. I say this who has written emotionally-charged jargon and all I have is a bachelor's degree in marketing and I have a house and cat to feed.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 37,887 MFP Moderator
    What’s the best pre workout

    Its a loaded question. But if you want a properly dosed one, PEScience and Legion Pulse are the two that are dosed correctly for L-Citruline and Beta Alanine.
  • bellaa_x0
    bellaa_x0 Posts: 1,062 Member
    What’s the best pre workout

    @fitnessgirlsam Megawatt V2 from 1st Phorm is great - I'm using the Lemonade flavor right now
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 40,105 Member
    Sorry...I'm not buying that a Men's Once a Day multi vitamin is going to give me heart disease or cancer, etc.

    I take a multi vitamin, fish oil, 2000 IU vitamin D, turmeric, and plant sterols and stanols. I think I'll be ok.
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 25,284 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    ccrdragon wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    It's always hilarious when someone says supplements are crap and than follows it with, except for this one supplement. Which is even more ironic that it demonstrates that certain diet styles are incomplete.

    There are several supplements that you could never get the levels eating food, that you could get with supplements. No matter how much meat you eat, you couldn't get 5g of creatine. Similarly, this would br difficult to achieve levels of L-Citruline from natural sources.

    Or the ones that start out 'all supplements are crap, but I (and only I) have access the special magical pixie dust (that is not a supplement although you take it in pill/liquid form) that will do x'.

    Marketing 101 ;)

    As someone who has worked in digital marketing for seven years, a lot of the content on websites is emotionally-charged jargon written by people who don't actually know what they're talking about and write it because they were told to do so and they don't want to lose their jobs. I say this who has written emotionally-charged jargon and all I have is a bachelor's degree in marketing and I have a house and cat to feed.

    @RelCanonical I sent you an email.