What to do on a recomp when all your lifts stall?
dave_in_ni
Posts: 533 Member
So long story short went on a big cut 3 years ago, lost 60 lbs which took me to 170lbs at 6ft tall. Body fat was still fairly high at 20% so recomp seemed perfect.
I have ate at maintenance and lifted, progress was slow, gaining maybe a rep every other week, then after a year all stopped and I wasn’t gaining anything, I deloaded built back up same thing, I program hopped, different rep ranges no difference, this was a year ago and I’ve still not got anywhere, my weight is identical so that worked but damn all else did, my composition and body fat levels are exactly the same.
I could cut more but my lifts will drop, I could eat more but at 20% bf there is a good chance that’s going straight to fat. I think I am at the stage where I won’t gain anymore without eating more and going above maintenance
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Replies
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How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.0 -
How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
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dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?0 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
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dave_in_ni wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
Got ya... could be a recovery/volume issue. maybe drop some accessory lifts, or drop one set from each of the lifts.
Now that I am in my late 30s (40 later this month) recovery is much harder and takes longer. I make up for that by reduced volume.
our muscles repair and grow during recovery.
Also make sure you are getting adequate sleep5 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
Got ya... could be a recovery/volume issue. maybe drop some accessory lifts, or drop one set from each of the lifts.
Now that I am in my late 30s (40 later this month) recovery is much harder and takes longer. I make up for that by reduced volume.
our muscles repair and grow during recovery.
Also make sure you are getting adequate sleep
Sleep is the #1 factor in my performance.3 -
mom23mangos wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
Got ya... could be a recovery/volume issue. maybe drop some accessory lifts, or drop one set from each of the lifts.
Now that I am in my late 30s (40 later this month) recovery is much harder and takes longer. I make up for that by reduced volume.
our muscles repair and grow during recovery.
Also make sure you are getting adequate sleep
Sleep is the #1 factor in my performance.
My sleep is awful, I do not think I have ever slept a full night in my life. I fall over straight away but I wake very early, talking 3am early and unable to get back to sleep. Tried various pills and supplements for it, still wake early only I wake feeling half doped up. I’ve seen me going to bed at 1am and waking at 3-4am wide awake. There is a name for this kind of insomnia but it’s name slips my mind now.
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And overtraining can also lead to difficulty sleeping.
It would not work now if in the midst of that state - but you ever take your pulse in the morning when you wake up? Since no alarm wakeup you might not get that jolt reaction that makes it difficult to get a good reading.
I've only experienced those effects overtraining cardio, but it can happen with lifting too.
Lifting overtraining usually has me injured before I get too far along to get other effects.
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mom23mangos wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
Got ya... could be a recovery/volume issue. maybe drop some accessory lifts, or drop one set from each of the lifts.
Now that I am in my late 30s (40 later this month) recovery is much harder and takes longer. I make up for that by reduced volume.
our muscles repair and grow during recovery.
Also make sure you are getting adequate sleep
Sleep is the #1 factor in my performance.
I agree with you on the sleep thing. Most overlooked aspect in terms of growth to be sure.
OP; I'm curious what your actual goals are? Are you looking to just increase your lifts, or are you looking to put on more size? Or both?0 -
11Templars wrote: »mom23mangos wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »dave_in_ni wrote: »How much protein are you getting?.... even without lifts getting much better, if you are recomping properly you should still be able to lower your BF% slightly.
What lifting programs have you been running?
Another thing you may want to consider is changing meal timing so your recovery or energy for your workouts is better
Maybe your volume is a little too high... ie. if you are not progressing on a 5x5 routine, maybe try 3x5.
150-170g daily of protein. Programs, bigger leaner stronger, 5x5, PPL. PPL is my usual go to.
that is def enough protein... PPL is a good program, are you running it 3 times/week or 6? 6 may be too much volume and not enough recovery, but 3 may not be enough, only hitting each muscle group once.
How old are you?
how long have you been lifting?
could consider a push/pull only routine where legs are part of both days and run it 4 times/week. squats with push day, deads with pull day?
5 days, I miss a leg day, once is enough, so I do that Mon-Fri take weekends off. 38 lifting almost 3 years but the first was really spent losing weight.
Got ya... could be a recovery/volume issue. maybe drop some accessory lifts, or drop one set from each of the lifts.
Now that I am in my late 30s (40 later this month) recovery is much harder and takes longer. I make up for that by reduced volume.
our muscles repair and grow during recovery.
Also make sure you are getting adequate sleep
Sleep is the #1 factor in my performance.
I agree with you on the sleep thing. Most overlooked aspect in terms of growth to be sure.
OP; I'm curious what your actual goals are? Are you looking to just increase your lifts, or are you looking to put on more size? Or both?
I’ll be honest to look good naked, I’ve damn all interest in how much I can lift or strength, I want to build muscle, always really worked in the hypertrophy range.
Should mention on the sleep things it’s 3.50am and I’m awake.0 -
jamesmiclee wrote: »Maybe you need more rest? Over training is a thing. I usually get stronger if I take time off, which is weird. but yep. It happens.
I agree with this. I occasionally take a week off from lifting and I come back to the gym stronger.
Sleep and stress levels can also affect your lifts.0 -
OP I feel your pain. For nearly 2 years I was waking at about 4AM and that was it for the night. With work, kids and training I was turning into a wreck - not seeing progress as I'd liked, and picking up minor injuries and strains (although I am 10 years older than you so...)
I eventually did some research on Histamine levels in 40+ years men and found that some of us have a naturally high level. [Histamine is the compound responsible for the 'rouse' from sleep signal in the brain - as well as 'hay fever'/allergy responses - who knew right?]. So, I looked at foods that contain Histadine (which apparently raises histamine levels once in the body) to see if I could cut any out of my diet but I'll leave you to do your own research and draw your own conclusions as I'll probably get Woo'd for this post anyways.
My N=1 experience was that if I took the tiniest sip of Piriton (allergy medicine in UK) before bed, I slept through until about 6AM most mornings. I felt a little groggy/hungover but I did this every now and again when I was just too exhausted for words. A couple of nights of more hours sleep seemed to do me the world of good. Recently it's got much better and I occasionally sleep until my alarm at 6:45am! without Piriton/booze :-)
Best of luck, mate - sleep is 33% of your training needs so don't overlook its importance.4 -
DanSanthomes wrote: »OP I feel your pain. For nearly 2 years I was waking at about 4AM and that was it for the night. With work, kids and training I was turning into a wreck - not seeing progress as I'd liked, and picking up minor injuries and strains (although I am 10 years older than you so...)
I eventually did some research on Histamine levels in 40+ years men and found that some of us have a naturally high level. [Histamine is the compound responsible for the 'rouse' from sleep signal in the brain - as well as 'hay fever'/allergy responses - who knew right?]. So, I looked at foods that contain Histadine (which apparently raises histamine levels once in the body) to see if I could cut any out of my diet but I'll leave you to do your own research and draw your own conclusions as I'll probably get Woo'd for this post anyways.
My N=1 experience was that if I took the tiniest sip of Piriton (allergy medicine in UK) before bed, I slept through until about 6AM most mornings. I felt a little groggy/hungover but I did this every now and again when I was just too exhausted for words. A couple of nights of more hours sleep seemed to do me the world of good. Recently it's got much better and I occasionally sleep until my alarm at 6:45am! without Piriton/booze :-)
Best of luck, mate - sleep is 33% of your training needs so don't overlook its importance.
Interesting, I have some Piriton in the cupboard, It could be worth a try at least.1 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »Interesting, I have some Piriton in the cupboard, It could be worth a try at least.
Yeah, give it a go - tiny bit though (as my Doctor suggested too).
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It's been my experience personally and from those I train that is almost always a lack of volume at the correct dose of stress that is the cause of a stall.
A PPL falls into this category, especially if it is a LP.
If the goal is strength or hypertrophy the controlling factor is adequate volume dosed correctly.
One does not get stronger from not progressively overloading at the correct dose, one either stalls or experiences loss of strength.
I highly suggest more advanced programming from what you are currently using that incorporates regulation. My preferred method is the use of regulation id RPE.
Managing your fatigue from internal load and of course external load is extremely important. RPE will help accomplish this.
I advice finding a way to apply the correct amount if stress by searching better programming or hiring a coach that can help you.
Good luck with training.
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I’ll be honest to look good naked, I’ve damn all interest in how much I can lift or strength, I want to build muscle, always really worked in the hypertrophy range.
Should mention on the sleep things it’s 3.50am and I’m awake.
Good honest answer. we can work with that.
One thing that gets overlooked by many, especially men over 40: Have you had your Free Testosterone Levels checked? It's always worth getting looked at to see if your levels are where they should be.
If you are consistent with your diet, and your lifting, then things should fall into place. In my personal experience, most ppl aren't lifting anywhere near the intensity that they should be, and they fail to mix things up appropriately. I switch my routine up every 10 weeks, however, I'm in more of a "sculpting" mode. Working on my deficits mostly.
I can send you what I personally am doing right now in terms of lifts. @Chieflrg obviously knows what he's talking about as well.
Good luck,
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Dont focus so much in the weight you’re lifting. Pay more attention to how hard you squeeze and contract the muscle being worked And every now and then go heavy. I’ve seen max gains doing this.0
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Step 1: Stop recomping. Bulk and cut cycles are waaaay more efficient to get to where you want to be than recomping ever can be. Some people can't get over the psychological hurdle of gaining weight as a means to an end, and thus can't bulk properly, but if you can see it through, you'll be much happier in the end, and you'll get there much faster.1
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