Adding weight training and still lose weight ?

FlexJackson
FlexJackson Posts: 19 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
So I've lost 90 pounds and I've actually enjoyed living in the skin I'm in for the past 3 years or so. But I want to add some muscle to my frame.

Currently I eat 1300 calories a day to continue to lose weight weekly and have a 3500 calorie cheat day once a week. The cheat day is the carrot that keeps me motivated to never go over my calories.

But I'm about to start weight training and I know I will need to eat more if I hope to carry around more muscle. My question is how many more calories should I eat. The workout I will be doing I assume will burn about 300 to 400 calories a day so I was thinking of bumping my calories up to 1800 a day. I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol. So in closing how many more calories should I add to my diet to support muscle growth ?

Replies

  • ElizabethKalmbach
    ElizabethKalmbach Posts: 1,415 Member
    edited November 2019
    In order to give you reasonable advice, you're going to need provide the fine people here with important details like your height, weight, current rate of loss that the 1300 calories/day are producing, current activity level, and other important details that may come up.
  • nighthawk584
    nighthawk584 Posts: 2,023 Member
    edited November 2019
    you're right...1300 calories is not near enough! 1500 is bare min for a man. I'm down 80 plus and sitting at 197 lbs, 6'1" , age 54 and exercise every day rotating between cardio and weight training and consume around 1900 calories BEFORE exercise. I eat back all my exercise calories. I plan on upping that base of 1900 even more.
  • firef1y72
    firef1y72 Posts: 1,579 Member
    I'm a 5'1" female and I lost weight (while strength training) eating a hell of a lot more than 1300 Calories. Unless you are very overweight there is no way you are going to build muscle on such a big deficit. I eat around 2000 Calories a day when losing weight and lost 150lb doing that. Recomping (losing fat while gaining muscle) takes a long time, with consistent strength training while keeping your deficit really small (think 250Cal a day or 1/2lb a week)
  • BrianSharpe
    BrianSharpe Posts: 9,248 Member
    You will get stronger with strength training but will not put on any appreciable muscle mass when eating at a deficit. People don't get big by accident. Depending on your height and current weight 1800 cal may just be your maintenance. It becomes a bit of trial and error. All I can really suggest is match closely for weight gain and adjust accordingly (depending on the intensity of your workouts it's not unusual to see fluctuations of several pounds as your body stores water as part of the recovery process).

  • Justin_7272
    Justin_7272 Posts: 341 Member
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.
  • FlexJackson
    FlexJackson Posts: 19 Member
    ElizabethKalmbach wrote: »
    In order to give you reasonable advice, you're going to need provide the fine people here with important details like your height, weight, current rate of loss that the 1300 calories/day are producing, current activity level, and other important details that may come up.

    I'm 6'2, 230lbs
  • FlexJackson
    FlexJackson Posts: 19 Member
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.
  • ElizabethKalmbach
    ElizabethKalmbach Posts: 1,415 Member
    ... 1300 calories is NOT ENOUGH to keep you going. How fast are you losing weight at 1300 calories? 1300 calories is not sustainable for a person of your stature. It's potentially very unsafe, especially considering the fact that from your profile image, it looks like you have a fairly physical job, that potentially burns that 1300 calories down to a REALLY unsafe deficit.

    Even at a sedentary office job, eating a NET calorie goal of 1500 calories/day would have you losing nearly 2 lbs per week. The TDEE for a man your size just sitting around behind a desk and never working out is 2400 calories. At 230 lbs, I don't see you needing to lose more than 40 or so lbs, so you should probably consider eating 2000 net calories per day for a loss rate of a pound a week and that STILL means you need to eat back exercise calories.

    Has a doctor TOLD YOU that there's something special and peculiar about your metabolism? I have PLENTY of conditions that should be affecting mine, from thyroid disorder to anemia, and all the prescriptions to prove it, but NONE OF THEM are slowing my metabolism down that much. I'm 5'4, 158 lbs and losing a pound or so a week eating 1800 calories.

    Tighten up your logging. Weigh your food so that you know without a shadow of a doubt how many calories you're eating. If you're drastically different from what is predicted by TDEE or NEAT calorie calculations for weight loss, see a doctor and get the underlying medical condition that is causing the problem treated. Starving yourself to death is not going to resolve the underlying problem, and honestly, it's much easier to know what the problem is and take your meds, rather than struggling when you don't have to.
  • jeffjeff85
    jeffjeff85 Posts: 118 Member
    FlexJackson wrote: »

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.

    Dont let em wind ya up Flex. There are some round here so busy knowing stuff you cant tell them anything.
    You absolutely can build muscle.while losing total body weight. Your body will learn to burn (use) fat stores more efficiently, converting that to the energy you need (basically the whole idea of 'keto').
    It's the standard response in this neck of the woods that if you arent dropping weight consistently then you "must be" eating.more than you say. Its bullspit, but still repeated at every turn.
    But, a little common sense is required. If you are interested in fitness knowledge, would you REALLY look for it from someone whose chief claim to fame is that they dropped 100+ lbs of body fat?
    Not endorsing anybody, but look up Jeff at athleanx on YouTube. Lots of info on nutrition, training, and the WHY of both from a very fit guy with education in anatomy, kinesiology, chemistry ....
  • jeffjeff85
    jeffjeff85 Posts: 118 Member
    Now, you "could" watch them line up to disagree with the above and rant, or you could realize that if you're burning more than you're taking in, you lose weight.
    And exercise.is better way to lose weight than simply not eating (youll lose weight, but not the weight you want to lose).
  • Sharon_C
    Sharon_C Posts: 2,132 Member
    Go with trial and error. Up your calories by a few hundred. See how you feel. If it works, then stay there. If not, then adjust up or down depending on your goal and how you feel.
  • Justin_7272
    Justin_7272 Posts: 341 Member
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.

    Are you weighing your food? I expect not.

    People's bodies are the same in that 3500 calories is a pound. You're not special and you don't "hold on" more than anyone else.

    I didn't think it was a big deal to weigh my food, until I did. It's a common mistake to underestimate intake and overestimate caloric burn. Seriously, no big deal.

    The worst you can do is lie to yourself about it, then blame it on scientificly-debunked theories (e.g. low metabolism, aggressively storing fat).

    If you've been tracking for 4 years, believe you're at a defecit, and are struggling to lose weight at 1300 calories, 6'2" 230lbs you are eating FAR more than 1300 calories. You need to seriously reevaluate.
  • gemiller87
    gemiller87 Posts: 135 Member
    edited November 2019
    I'm going to jump in on this thread with a very DIFFERENT opinion. First off, i'm not recommending what i'm doing, I know its against the vast majority of medical advice.

    I'm 6'6" starting weight of around 335-350 last December, currently at 238, with really starting in late march at 335 with counting/monitoring progress and a slower burn rate of 1-2.5 a week and a goal of 225 by end of year which i'm hoping to hit sooner. I've been sustaining a notable amount of weight loss as you can see by these numbers. The last couple months i've been in the 3-4+lb loss a week range and have been seeing minor gains strength training.

    No one here is wrong in saying you will see way better progress at maintenance or small bulk calorie counts BUT it's about priority. Can you add strength training while maintaining a deficit? My experience has been yes. I started with all body weight exercises and recently added a few more. I've been for a couple months now doing sit ups, pushups, squats, planks and recently added pull up program (still working on that success mark here with a negatives program) and bench press and bar curl. I'm seeing progress across the board.

    Will progress be exponentially improved upon switching to a small bulk or maintenance count or even .5lb a week loss, yes. But it's about priority for me. I will hit this goal weight hell or high water first, since thats my primary marker post. I'm eating at a deficit against a 2lb a week calorie count and not eating back in for exercise. I'm finding my daily is regularly 1200-1600 with some days close to 2000 before exercise. My calculated 2lb a week rate is 2010ish. All that rambling said the reality is I'm finding small gains in strength training which is good enough for me for the next handful of weeks until I hit goal weight.

    Pick your priority and focus on it while working on the other goal. If weight loss is your goal continue cutting and start strength training anyway, just don't expect major gains. If strength is the goal go to a calorie count that will sustain good strength progress and monitor weight loss and adjust on the fly for it. Thats my worthless .02c when accounting for the "this guys an idiot and his personal experience don't matter" tax thats about to come from the rest of the replies LOL!

    EDIT: Also adding in that I do agree with other posters, you're not eating 1300 calories and not losing weight at your height and weight numbers. Even with your 3500 cheat day weekly thats still only 1615 average daily. That's well in weight loss range.
  • quiksylver296
    quiksylver296 Posts: 28,439 Member
    http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10634517/you-dont-use-a-food-scale/p1
  • jeffjeff85
    jeffjeff85 Posts: 118 Member
    jeffjeff85 wrote: »
    Now, you "could" watch them line up to disagree with the above and rant, or you could realize that if you're burning more than you're taking in, you lose weight.
    And exercise.is better way to lose weight than simply not eating (youll lose weight, but not the weight you want to lose).

    I rest my case .... 8 'disagree' that if you burn more calories than you consume you will lose weight. And that's people who claim to track calories 😂
  • FlexJackson
    FlexJackson Posts: 19 Member
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.

    Are you weighing your food? I expect not.

    People's bodies are the same in that 3500 calories is a pound. You're not special and you don't "hold on" more than anyone else.

    I didn't think it was a big deal to weigh my food, until I did. It's a common mistake to underestimate intake and overestimate caloric burn. Seriously, no big deal.

    The worst you can do is lie to yourself about it, then blame it on scientificly-debunked theories (e.g. low metabolism, aggressively storing fat).

    If you've been tracking for 4 years, believe you're at a defecit, and are struggling to lose weight at 1300 calories, 6'2" 230lbs you are eating FAR more than 1300 calories. You need to seriously reevaluate.

    Come on man. I'm not lying to myself about anything. I've lost 90lbs. I know my body at this point. I started weight my food very early in starting my weight loss. Not a single calories goes into my body without me know. I know my body at this point. I don't struggle at all to lose weight at 1300 calories. It's just when I do 1500 I just don't drop any weight. Would be cool if you actually answered the question of a good calorie count for muscle growth and maintaining it like I originally asked.
  • FlexJackson
    FlexJackson Posts: 19 Member
    ElizabethKalmbach wrote: »
    ... 1300 calories is NOT ENOUGH to keep you going. How fast are you losing weight at 1300 calories? 1300 calories is not sustainable for a person of your stature. It's potentially very unsafe, especially considering the fact that from your profile image, it looks like you have a fairly physical job, that potentially burns that 1300 calories down to a REALLY unsafe deficit.

    Even at a sedentary office job, eating a NET calorie goal of 1500 calories/day would have you losing nearly 2 lbs per week. The TDEE for a man your size just sitting around behind a desk and never working out is 2400 calories. At 230 lbs, I don't see you needing to lose more than 40 or so lbs, so you should probably consider eating 2000 net calories per day for a loss rate of a pound a week and that STILL means you need to eat back exercise calories.

    Has a doctor TOLD YOU that there's something special and peculiar about your metabolism? I have PLENTY of conditions that should be affecting mine, from thyroid disorder to anemia, and all the prescriptions to prove it, but NONE OF THEM are slowing my metabolism down that much. I'm 5'4, 158 lbs and losing a pound or so a week eating 1800 calories.

    Tighten up your logging. Weigh your food so that you know without a shadow of a doubt how many calories you're eating. If you're drastically different from what is predicted by TDEE or NEAT calorie calculations for weight loss, see a doctor and get the underlying medical condition that is causing the problem treated. Starving yourself to death is not going to resolve the underlying problem, and honestly, it's much easier to know what the problem is and take your meds, rather than struggling when you don't have to.

    I weight my food. I know exactly how many calories that I take in. Doctor says there's nothing wrong with me but he would like me to eat atleast 1600 calories and he would like me to lose more than 40 more pounds like you said yourself.

    However I refuse to gain or stump my weight loss so I will continue to eat 1300 calories a day until I add in my workout routine. Am I hungry 6 days a week ? Yes I am but as long as I got my cheat day as my light at the end of the tunnel I am fine.

    As far as my work active. It's hard to explain. Some days I'm driving all day other days I'm going alot of climbing up and down laters and carrying 40lbs steel hoses so my activity level goes from high to sedentary day to day.
  • Courtscan2
    Courtscan2 Posts: 499 Member
    edited November 2019
    I think everyone is missing the 3500 cheat day you have each week, which means your average calories per day for the week are just above 1600 - which is within the realms of acceptable. If want to add some muscle then by all means, add a few hundred calories per day and see how you go. If you are in a very modest deficit, you should be able to build some muscle as a weight training "newbie" with a bit of extra fat to burn. You've found what has worked for you in the past, I'm sure you can figure out how to adjust your routine for your new goals through some trial and error. Good luck to you.
  • MikePTY
    MikePTY Posts: 3,814 Member
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.

    Are you weighing your food? I expect not.

    People's bodies are the same in that 3500 calories is a pound. You're not special and you don't "hold on" more than anyone else.

    I didn't think it was a big deal to weigh my food, until I did. It's a common mistake to underestimate intake and overestimate caloric burn. Seriously, no big deal.

    The worst you can do is lie to yourself about it, then blame it on scientificly-debunked theories (e.g. low metabolism, aggressively storing fat).

    If you've been tracking for 4 years, believe you're at a defecit, and are struggling to lose weight at 1300 calories, 6'2" 230lbs you are eating FAR more than 1300 calories. You need to seriously reevaluate.

    Come on man. I'm not lying to myself about anything. I've lost 90lbs. I know my body at this point. I started weight my food very early in starting my weight loss. Not a single calories goes into my body without me know. I know my body at this point. I don't struggle at all to lose weight at 1300 calories. It's just when I do 1500 I just don't drop any weight. Would be cool if you actually answered the question of a good calorie count for muscle growth and maintaining it like I originally asked.

    Are you currently losing less than half a pound a week? That is the only way you would not lose any weight on 1500 a day, considering that would raise your total weekly calorie intake by 1200 calories, which is about a third of a pound. My guess is you are losing more than 0.35 pounds a week, so going to 1500 doesn't make you stop losing weight. You could see a short term water weight stall, but that doesn't have anything to do with fat loss.
  • Justin_7272
    Justin_7272 Posts: 341 Member
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    Justin_7272 wrote: »
    FlexJackson wrote: »
    I don't want to bump them up to high because my body likes to aggressively store any extra calories I consume as fat and I have a slow metabolism so I have had to be aggressive on my body to lose weight as I'm sure alot of guys reading this see me say I eat 1300 calories and day and say "wtf" lol.

    To be blunt, this doesn't make sense scientifically; "aggressively storing fat" is not a thing, and slow metabolism is a common excuse. You're likely eating more than you think.

    To try to answer your question, 2lbs of muscle is the accepted max a male can grow in a month. If you have adequate protein (at least 1g/lean body mass) you should aim for around 4lbs/month max with the understanding you're going to gain some fat when bulking.

    I've been tracking my meals and calories for the pass 4 years so I know for a fact that I'm not eating more than I think. I don't know about "Scientifically" but people's bodies are not the same and one person's body could like to hold on to days more than someone else's indefinitely.

    Are you weighing your food? I expect not.

    People's bodies are the same in that 3500 calories is a pound. You're not special and you don't "hold on" more than anyone else.

    I didn't think it was a big deal to weigh my food, until I did. It's a common mistake to underestimate intake and overestimate caloric burn. Seriously, no big deal.

    The worst you can do is lie to yourself about it, then blame it on scientificly-debunked theories (e.g. low metabolism, aggressively storing fat).

    If you've been tracking for 4 years, believe you're at a defecit, and are struggling to lose weight at 1300 calories, 6'2" 230lbs you are eating FAR more than 1300 calories. You need to seriously reevaluate.
    Would be cool if you actually answered the question of a good calorie count for muscle growth and maintaining it like I originally asked.

    Protein is considered king when it comes to muscle maintenance and muscle growth. It's much easier to grow muscle with a caloric surplus than defecit. Max lean body mass growth is 2lbs/month. You're going to gain some fat as well, so bulking suggestion is maintenance +500 calories per day while consuming at least 1g protein/LBM.

    That being said, even with eating 1500 calories a day and a 3500 cheat day, that still equates to roughly 1800 per day, which should be well below maintenance for you. So again, if you are maintaining at your current intake you're either a) lying to yourself about intake/expenditure or b) defying science.

    It's not meant to be a personal attack; it's constructive feedback to try to help you reach your goal. Best of luck.

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