Abstinence
Replies
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oh you mean the total who fail to keep all the weight off in general, I thought you were implying abstinence was the reason 80% of people regained their weight. Actually I am trying to remember the numbers, but something like 60% regain all the weight after 6 years. 40 regain some, but not all. I think some regain is normal on a maintenance diet. I wish they kept better statistics...1
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Portion control and try and be in the ballpark of macros0
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That you were diagnosed with BED should be up front in your original post, OP. It's like a trick question.6
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maureenkhilde wrote: »jennifer_417 wrote: »Possible?
Sure, with enough determination, I suppose.
But why? You can maintain great health and healthy weight while indulging in moderation.
Not arguing at all. But this is literally easier said than done. I fall in the category I do not think that the frozen desserts are evil or bad. I just have issues controlling my intake. So I decided what was best for me.
Yet, I can and do buy the treats my husband likes, as he is neither a diabetic, or have a weight issue. So I buy the cookies he likes, and it is not that I intensely dislike them, but I can reason to myself, not yours leave alone. Just like in a week or so I will be doing some Christmas baking of fruit bread that I send to family, but I never eat.
I have overcome a few foods that I used to have issues with. But the whole frozen ice cream, and frozen yogurt. Still a big work in progress for me. And I really get where the OP is coming from.
I totally agree, and I'm not trying to say it's easy. Weight loss is tough and it takes making lots of hard choices.
All I mean is that abstaining entirely from all unhealthy foods isn't necessarily any easier.2 -
Overeaters Anonymous is a good place for this sort of abstinence.1
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I do SMART Recovery. I have found it helpful.
I think I am going to try abstinence for now and sort of experiment. On foods where it doesn't work then maybe I can try moderation.
I think this year I will only buy one carton of eggnog- I LOVE eggnog- and that's it for the season.2 -
For myself personally regarding abstinence, I would say that if something is "food," it isn't inherently unhealthy and that's not the reason that I would choose to abstain from it. For example, I'm considering abstaining from certain foods, but not because I consider them to be inherently unhealthy. Rather, these are foods that I personally am unable to manage at least at this time. When I try to eat them in moderation, I experience stress as I attempt to eat them in moderation and often I fail to do so and I eat way too much of them. Until and unless I figure out a way to manage these foods, abstinence may be the way to go.jennifer_417 wrote: »I totally agree, and I'm not trying to say it's easy. Weight loss is tough and it takes making lots of hard choices.
All I mean is that abstaining entirely from all unhealthy foods isn't necessarily any easier.
To put it simply, if there is a box of cookies in the house, it is in fact easier for me to not eat any of them than it is to eat just two or three of them. I know this may sound odd, but it's true.8 -
In many cases, I don't find abstinence that hard.
For example, about 20 years ago, I decided to eat pescatarian. I don't find it hard at all to never eat beef, pork, poultry, etc.
2 years ago I was diagnosed with GERD. I now abstain (or at least severely limit) spicy foods, deep fried foods, carbonated beverages, caffeine, tomatoes, citrus, raw onions & bell peppers, and many other foods. It's not that hard.
I cannot eat snack cakes in moderation, so I just abstain. Maybe someday I will be able to moderate them, but I can also never eat them again and I'll be fine with that too.3 -
The key is portion and self control. If you can master self control and portions you can eat whatever you want. I have a stash of candy in my room and every day I let myself eat a little. I’m still losing weight because I make sure to watch how much of everything I eat. For candy it’s half a serving. On Sunday sometimes I’ll let myself eat a full serving, but most of the time I choose not to. I find I enjoy treats more when I limit myself.2
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IAmWomanHearMeRoar15 wrote: »I do SMART Recovery. I have found it helpful.
I think I am going to try abstinence for now and sort of experiment. On foods where it doesn't work then maybe I can try moderation.
I think this year I will only buy one carton of eggnog- I LOVE eggnog- and that's it for the season.
SMART Recovery was super helpful for me when I had a problem with alcohol 20 years ago. I abstained for a while, and now I can moderate, although it's been months since I had a drink so I wouldn't even call it drinking moderately.
It's quite likely your BED treatment person will also use a cognitive behavioral approach.
They should be familiar with this book, which was available in my library system, so perhaps yours as well:
The Beck Diet Solution: Train Your Brain to Think Like a Thin Person
Can thinking and eating like a thin person be learned, similar to learning to drive or use a computer? Beck (Cognitive Therapy for Challenging Problems) contends so, based on decades of work with patients who have lost pounds and maintained weight through Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT). Beck's six-week program adapts CBT, a therapeutic system developed by Beck's father, Aaron, in the 1960s, to specific challenges faced by yo-yo dieters, including negative thinking, bargaining, emotional eating, bingeing, and eating out. Beck counsels readers day-by-day, introducing new elements (creating advantage response cards, choosing a diet, enlisting a diet coach, making a weight-loss graph) progressively and offering tools to help readers stay focused (writing exercises, to-do lists, ways to counter negative thoughts). There are no eating plans, calorie counts, recipes or exercises; according to Beck, any healthy diet will work if readers learn to think differently about eating and food. Beck's book is like an extended therapy session with a diet coach. (Apr.)4 -
missysippy930 wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »Probably why over 80% of people fail at keeping the weight off, myself included. It is a long term commitment and not east to abstain for life.
80% might be a little high... lol, but agreed, on top of the biological drive to regain and environment. It is not easy at all.
Actually, it’s probably a higher percent, according to some statistics, for people keeping the weight off five years or more. Pretty dismal thought, I realize.
I'm looking for some other stats I used to have but find this article downright depressing, I can't find their sources so I'll keep searching.
https://slate.com/technology/2015/03/diets-do-not-work-the-thin-evidence-that-losing-weight-makes-you-healthier.html
"You’ll likely lose weight in the short term, but your chance of keeping if off for five years or more is about the same as your chance of surviving metastatic lung cancer: 5 percent. And when you do gain back the weight, everyone will blame you. Including you."
"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
"People who lose weight often see their blood sugar improve, but that’s likely an effect of calorie reduction rather than weight loss. Type 2 diabetics who have bariatric surgery go into complete remission after only seven days, long before they lose much weight, because they’re eating only a few hundred calories a day."
Depressing article, biased. No need to bother doing anything according to this, just succumb, throw in the towel and give up. I know the stats are grim, I know all of that but I'm not giving up.
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"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
That's BS. Or I'm in the 3%. Lost 80ish pounds in 2007-08.
Still at 21-22 BMI 12 years later.6 -
cmriverside wrote: »"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
That's BS. Or I'm in the 3%. Lost 80ish pounds in 2007-08.
Still at 21-22 BMI 12 years later.
last figure I saw was 85% failure rate. Congrats on your continued success! I'm 16 lbs from maintenance.1 -
nighthawk584 wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
That's BS. Or I'm in the 3%. Lost 80ish pounds in 2007-08.
Still at 21-22 BMI 12 years later.
last figure I saw was 85% failure rate. Congrats on your continued success! I'm 16 lbs from maintenance.
Thank you. By far the hardest part was that first time I went into Maintenance after having lost 65 pounds which put me at 155. I had a very hard time in that first year, yo-yoing all over the place by 15 pounds - up/down. I can see why people would just give up. I had to lose ten pounds AGAIN. That was the most I've put back on and that was brutal. I had to - I had already gotten rid of my fat clothes.
That put me at 155. It was comfortably inside my healthy weight range at 5'8". The last 15 pounds I lost later...like a few years later and it was equally difficult. Two pounds down, one back up for NINE flippity flippin' months before I got to 140 finally, where I am now. I was hungry. So I guess I can't really say I lost 80 pounds in 07-08, but I'm 80 pounds lighter than I was then and I haven't gained any back after that first year.
Not losing that weight ever. again.
I hope.
I don't envy you that last 16. I hope it goes smoothly.4 -
cmriverside wrote: »"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
That's BS. Or I'm in the 3%. Lost 80ish pounds in 2007-08.
Still at 21-22 BMI 12 years later.
I call BS as well. @cmriverside , believe it or not, you are a heroine to people like me. I say that "success" is contextual. The media LOVES to report that people regain all their lost weight be cause.... DRUM ROLL..... It makes people feel good and makes good sales. The negative always sells. If we look at people who lose weight. Many regain some, some gain all, some overshoot, only a small amount maintain all. So, I believe the numbers are screwed up. Take me. I lost 200+. Maintained it all for two years. Was just in bad shape and have sense regained 20, with 20 to go. Does that make me a failure because I regained some weight? The media would lead you to believe that. If we look at the... oh god help me for bringing this up..... The Biggest Losers season 8 folks, the media would have you believed they gained all there weight back. Some did..... many did not. There was a wide range of people who kept off various amounts of weight loss. Though, as an average from the group it was over 10% of BW change, so by many experts expectations, sustained weight loss. AND who ever had the fortitude to disagree that there IS A BIOLOGICAL DRIVE to regain.... Post up.... I will be more that happy to send you study after study that points to it....1 -
Diatonic12 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »Probably why over 80% of people fail at keeping the weight off, myself included. It is a long term commitment and not east to abstain for life.
80% might be a little high... lol, but agreed, on top of the biological drive to regain and environment. It is not easy at all.
Actually, it’s probably a higher percent, according to some statistics, for people keeping the weight off five years or more. Pretty dismal thought, I realize.
I'm looking for some other stats I used to have but find this article downright depressing, I can't find their sources so I'll keep searching.
https://slate.com/technology/2015/03/diets-do-not-work-the-thin-evidence-that-losing-weight-makes-you-healthier.html
"You’ll likely lose weight in the short term, but your chance of keeping if off for five years or more is about the same as your chance of surviving metastatic lung cancer: 5 percent. And when you do gain back the weight, everyone will blame you. Including you."
"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
"People who lose weight often see their blood sugar improve, but that’s likely an effect of calorie reduction rather than weight loss. Type 2 diabetics who have bariatric surgery go into complete remission after only seven days, long before they lose much weight, because they’re eating only a few hundred calories a day."
Depressing article, biased. No need to bother doing anything according to this, just succumb, throw in the towel and give up. I know the stats are grim, I know all of that but I'm not giving up.
Yes, type @ dm is very sensitive to caloric changes. Its also very sensitive to how much BF you carry. By all rights I am a type 2. Though, if you looked at my current labs, done last week with regain, a1c is 5.5......... The less BF you carry, the less insulin you body needs to cover the glucose load. There are multiple studies that go out to 6 years. As a whole, most people maintained some of their weight loss. Oh, people have lower insulin after weight loss. First is because they need less insulin DT less body mass and the second backs up my statement about the biologic drive to regain. Many people fail to note that Insulin is a SATIETY hormone......0 -
It depend on what you class as unhealthy food. For example, some people believe that milk is unhealthy due to the amount of fat it has and (if I'm correct) vegans don't drink or eat dairy products for that reason. So I'm afraid, I don't think you'll get an answer you could go by unless you just don't eat at all. Everything is bad for you to a degree such as fruit which is high in natural sugars but it's not about the food being unhealthy, it's about eating it in moderation. For example, a takeaway is high in fat, sugars and carbs but if you had one once in a blue moon and exercised after it, there wouldn't be too much cause for alarm. It's the same with butter products etc that contain cholesterol; you don't get blockages caused by cholesterol by using such products moderately, you would have to seriously abuse the product for it to have an adverse effect.
The above are just my opinions and/or point of view. I don't mean any offence and I apologise if I do cause offence.1 -
It depend on what you class as unhealthy food. For example, some people believe that milk is unhealthy due to the amount of fat it has and (if I'm correct) vegans don't drink or eat dairy products for that reason. So I'm afraid, I don't think you'll get an answer you could go by unless you just don't eat at all. Everything is bad for you to a degree such as fruit which is high in natural sugars but it's not about the food being unhealthy, it's about eating it in moderation. For example, a takeaway is high in fat, sugars and carbs but if you had one once in a blue moon and exercised after it, there wouldn't be too much cause for alarm. It's the same with butter products etc that contain cholesterol; you don't get blockages caused by cholesterol by using such products moderately, you would have to seriously abuse the product for it to have an adverse effect.
The above are just my opinions and/or point of view. I don't mean any offence and I apologise if I do cause offence.
Vegans don't drink milk because it is an animal product. It's not about healthy or unhealthy. People choose it from an ethical perspective. While a vegan lifestyle can be healthy, it's quite possible to get obese while eating a vegan diet.6 -
To answer the original question, yes, Some People do abstain from eating certain foods. My husband gave up donuts and now he does not eat sweets. He does not binge eat. I don’t know much about eating disorders so I don’t know if that would be an option for you.2
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psychod787 wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »"In reality, 97 percent of dieters regain everything they lost and then some within three years. Obesity research fails to reflect this truth because it rarely follows people for more than 18 months. This makes most weight-loss studies disingenuous at best and downright deceptive at worst."
That's BS. Or I'm in the 3%. Lost 80ish pounds in 2007-08.
Still at 21-22 BMI 12 years later.
I call BS as well. @cmriverside , believe it or not, you are a heroine to people like me. I say that "success" is contextual. The media LOVES to report that people regain all their lost weight be cause.... DRUM ROLL..... It makes people feel good and makes good sales. The negative always sells. If we look at people who lose weight. Many regain some, some gain all, some overshoot, only a small amount maintain all. So, I believe the numbers are screwed up. Take me. I lost 200+. Maintained it all for two years. Was just in bad shape and have sense regained 20, with 20 to go. Does that make me a failure because I regained some weight? The media would lead you to believe that. If we look at the... oh god help me for bringing this up..... The Biggest Losers season 8 folks, the media would have you believed they gained all there weight back. Some did..... many did not. There was a wide range of people who kept off various amounts of weight loss. Though, as an average from the group it was over 10% of BW change, so by many experts expectations, sustained weight loss. AND who ever had the fortitude to disagree that there IS A BIOLOGICAL DRIVE to regain.... Post up.... I will be more that happy to send you study after study that points to it....
See, people will even disagree that I'm a Hero. **Stands in Wonder Woman pose**
It may be that we are biologically driven to eat, but we are also biologically driven to stop eating when full if we're getting decent nutrition and are at a healthy weight. Honestly, look at my next post, I was all over the place in year One. I think everything is out of whack hormonally once someone becomes overweight, during weight loss, and in that whole first year post weight loss.
Granted I still had the psychological problem with food. I hadn't really addressed that part. I didn't even know I had that and I was white-knuckling my weight loss and wrangling my body into submission but I hadn't recovered fully from my long term over eating, not emotionally and not habitually. (I know you'll get that.) It's fairly easy to lose weight if it just takes a few months. It's long term that's the sticky wicket and really that got a lot easier in time as well.
I don't believe it was entirely because of biological imperative that I struggled to maintain at first, I believe it was also a thinking problem compounded by messed up body systems (hormones) due to my former obesity - but then I'm not going to post any studies. It was difficult in that first year after weight loss, really difficult.
We don't talk enough about this stuff IRL so why would the media? People would rather eat all the delicious food available than to have to change. I get that. It's a huge shift to make and people fight you at every turn. We'd rather say, "Oh, that poor person, look he gained it all back pass the chips." It's a way to rationalize our own bad decisions and we looooooooove to feel superior at our 200 pounds, even if that is overweight. "I'm not that bad."
I have a few people I'm friendly with who are in the 300-400 pound range who have known me fat and not fat. Other than right after my weight loss no one is quizzing me about this so it's not really my place to talk about my experience and I'm certainly not getting into preaching with acquaintances. That never ends well. Now I have the benefit of successful long term maintenance, hindsight and time but no one really sees me as that fat woman anymore. I pray that I can hold on to that. I think I can.2
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