Mixing cookie dough by hand vs stand mixer
kshama2001
Posts: 28,052 Member
I'm not in love with my stand mixer, an ancient Sunbeam I inherited from my OH's mother. Never the less, when a recipe calls for it, I use it.
It certainly doesn't save me any time or dishes, and I hate motor noise, so I'm wondering if there are any technical reasons I should be using a stand mixer. The particular recipe uses melted butter and chocolate, so it's mainly mixing the egg and sugar and the incorporating chocolate, and I'm wondering if doing that by hand is fine. When I do mix egg and sugar by hand for other recipes, I mix that for much less time than the 2-3 minutes specified in the recipe, and I spend way less than 3-5 minutes incorporating chocolate.
BTW, these cookies are so good that after sharing a few with my neighbor she wanted to know how much I would charge her to make a batch
https://www.177milkstreet.com/recipes/dried-cherry-chocolate-chunk-cookies
It certainly doesn't save me any time or dishes, and I hate motor noise, so I'm wondering if there are any technical reasons I should be using a stand mixer. The particular recipe uses melted butter and chocolate, so it's mainly mixing the egg and sugar and the incorporating chocolate, and I'm wondering if doing that by hand is fine. When I do mix egg and sugar by hand for other recipes, I mix that for much less time than the 2-3 minutes specified in the recipe, and I spend way less than 3-5 minutes incorporating chocolate.
BTW, these cookies are so good that after sharing a few with my neighbor she wanted to know how much I would charge her to make a batch
https://www.177milkstreet.com/recipes/dried-cherry-chocolate-chunk-cookies
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Replies
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While I am still interested in the technical discussion, I've likely talked myself out of using the mixer for this batch, and also into chilling the dough for a while, inspired by seeing this meme here recently, so I won't know which variable produced the results I get. I guess I'll have to keep making these cookies
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I use my stand mixer (I have a Kitchenaid 6 qt Pro series) because I have fibromyalgia, and I can either mix the bread dough by hand or I can use the mixer and still make dinner that night. (wry smile) I have to spend my spoons wisely.7
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The biggest technical reasons I can think of is that a stand mixer may help beat the egg and sugar more thoroughly and prevent overmixing once you put in the flour.
It can be tough to beat egg and sugar "until light and fluffy" by hand, so many people just mix them until combined, which won't produce the same results. (A little bit on eggs in cookies here, since you're into the chemistry: https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/12/cookie-science-how-do-eggs-affect-my-cookies.html)
For most cookies, overmixing doesn't become a huge concern until you add the flour. Most cookie recipes, including yours, say to mix the dry ingredients "until just combined." That prevents developing too much gluten in the flour, which would make cookies flatter and tougher. It can be easier for some people to avoid overmixing using a stand mixer.
Either way, if you're happy with the process and results you're getting, then that's the most important thing
(For my two cents, if you're interested in a stand mixer, then I'd consider replacing the inherited one with one you do love unless it has sentimental value to you. Why have it take up valuable kitchen space if you don't enjoy using it?)4 -
I suspect a recipe that wants things beaten until light and fluffy is trying to incorporate air for a lighter (more tiny bubbles, more rise, less dense) finished product, i.e., more cake-y, less fudge-y texture. But in your recipe, it seems like that 2nd long beating (with the butter and chocolate) might take some air/fluffiness out of it again. (I might be wrong, because I don't do this sort of thing often enough to visualize the effect of different relative amounts of the two semi-liquids coming together in those quantities.) If, in fact, the dough becomes more voluminous rather than less on the 2nd mixing, that's an indication that there's method in this method, not just madness (or recipe-writer habit).
I think it's obvious that if this were something like sponge cake, or something that beats egg whites separately from yolks then folds lightly together, then clearly you'd want the long beating for a good product (doesn't mean it needs to be done with a mixer vs. by hand, but it will tend to take longer to get egg whites to soft peaks or whatever if mixing by hand). So, IMO the question is where your cookie dough ends up on that airy/fluffy to more dense scale, using the stand mixer vs. hand mixing.
OTOH, hand mixing adds a little NEAT to your day, especially long mixing :LOL: .
Let us know what happens with your results, OK? I'm curious!2 -
The biggest technical reasons I can think of is that a stand mixer may help beat the egg and sugar more thoroughly and prevent overmixing once you put in the flour.
It can be tough to beat egg and sugar "until light and fluffy" by hand, so many people just mix them until combined, which won't produce the same results. (A little bit on eggs in cookies here, since you're into the chemistry: https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/12/cookie-science-how-do-eggs-affect-my-cookies.html)
For most cookies, overmixing doesn't become a huge concern until you add the flour. Most cookie recipes, including yours, say to mix the dry ingredients "until just combined." That prevents developing too much gluten in the flour, which would make cookies flatter and tougher. It can be easier for some people to avoid overmixing using a stand mixer.
Either way, if you're happy with the process and results you're getting, then that's the most important thing
(For my two cents, if you're interested in a stand mixer, then I'd consider replacing the inherited one with one you do love unless it has sentimental value to you. Why have it take up valuable kitchen space if you don't enjoy using it?)
Thanks!
Re the bolded - my kitchen is small and I have ingredients and equipment spread all over the house, which is very inefficient but good for NEAT My unloved stand mixer lives in a closet shelf in the spare bedroom. (In my office I have two sizes of slow cookers and three different sized Dutch ovens.)
I've been thinking of adding a Kitchen Aid stand mixer to my Christmas list for some time, but last year got a bigger Dutch oven and the year before a bigger food processor.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »The biggest technical reasons I can think of is that a stand mixer may help beat the egg and sugar more thoroughly and prevent overmixing once you put in the flour.
It can be tough to beat egg and sugar "until light and fluffy" by hand, so many people just mix them until combined, which won't produce the same results. (A little bit on eggs in cookies here, since you're into the chemistry: https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/12/cookie-science-how-do-eggs-affect-my-cookies.html)
For most cookies, overmixing doesn't become a huge concern until you add the flour. Most cookie recipes, including yours, say to mix the dry ingredients "until just combined." That prevents developing too much gluten in the flour, which would make cookies flatter and tougher. It can be easier for some people to avoid overmixing using a stand mixer.
Either way, if you're happy with the process and results you're getting, then that's the most important thing
(For my two cents, if you're interested in a stand mixer, then I'd consider replacing the inherited one with one you do love unless it has sentimental value to you. Why have it take up valuable kitchen space if you don't enjoy using it?)
Thanks!
Re the bolded - my kitchen is small and I have ingredients and equipment spread all over the house, which is very inefficient but good for NEAT My unloved stand mixer lives in a closet shelf in the spare bedroom. (In my office I have two sizes of slow cookers and three different sized Dutch ovens.)
I've been thinking of adding a Kitchen Aid stand mixer to my Christmas list for some time, but last year got a bigger Dutch oven and the year before a bigger food processor.
I support getting a Kitchenaid AND a Dutch oven AND a food processor 0 -
AND a bigger kitchen1
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Hi there, I bake a lot!! And I’m known for my cookies especially, the biggest difference I have found is the ingredients evenly distribute using a mixer much much much better. Also beating the eggs and sugar together is much better using a mixer. Overall it makes my cookies fluffier and tastier. I also suggest chilling your dough before baking.
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I suspect a recipe that wants things beaten until light and fluffy is trying to incorporate air for a lighter (more tiny bubbles, more rise, less dense) finished product, i.e., more cake-y, less fudge-y texture. But in your recipe, it seems like that 2nd long beating (with the butter and chocolate) might take some air/fluffiness out of it again. (I might be wrong, because I don't do this sort of thing often enough to visualize the effect of different relative amounts of the two semi-liquids coming together in those quantities.) If, in fact, the dough becomes more voluminous rather than less on the 2nd mixing, that's an indication that there's method in this method, not just madness (or recipe-writer habit).
I think it's obvious that if this were something like sponge cake, or something that beats egg whites separately from yolks then folds lightly together, then clearly you'd want the long beating for a good product (doesn't mean it needs to be done with a mixer vs. by hand, but it will tend to take longer to get egg whites to soft peaks or whatever if mixing by hand). So, IMO the question is where your cookie dough ends up on that airy/fluffy to more dense scale, using the stand mixer vs. hand mixing.
OTOH, hand mixing adds a little NEAT to your day, especially long mixing :LOL: .
Let us know what happens with your results, OK? I'm curious!
@AnnPT77 there was no change from the batch I made previously with the stand mixer. I did mix the egg and sugar by hand for two minutes, but did the second mix just until incorporated, which was for considerably less time than 3-5 minutes. I wanted them to look like the "chilled for 24 hour" cookies above, but they did not. IDK whether this was due to them only being chilled 9 hours, or it being not a chocolate chip cookie recipe.
Hmm, the first picture is from the website and my cookies don't look like that - they are sunken like the "both" or "granulated sugar" pictures. I almost followed the recipe exactly the first time - the exception was that instead of using brown sugar, I used white sugar and molasses. Next time, I might go back to the stand mixer and use the brown sugar.
The cookies taste fantastic and I am not a professional baker so this is just a fun intellectual exercise.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »I suspect a recipe that wants things beaten until light and fluffy is trying to incorporate air for a lighter (more tiny bubbles, more rise, less dense) finished product, i.e., more cake-y, less fudge-y texture. But in your recipe, it seems like that 2nd long beating (with the butter and chocolate) might take some air/fluffiness out of it again. (I might be wrong, because I don't do this sort of thing often enough to visualize the effect of different relative amounts of the two semi-liquids coming together in those quantities.) If, in fact, the dough becomes more voluminous rather than less on the 2nd mixing, that's an indication that there's method in this method, not just madness (or recipe-writer habit).
I think it's obvious that if this were something like sponge cake, or something that beats egg whites separately from yolks then folds lightly together, then clearly you'd want the long beating for a good product (doesn't mean it needs to be done with a mixer vs. by hand, but it will tend to take longer to get egg whites to soft peaks or whatever if mixing by hand). So, IMO the question is where your cookie dough ends up on that airy/fluffy to more dense scale, using the stand mixer vs. hand mixing.
OTOH, hand mixing adds a little NEAT to your day, especially long mixing :LOL: .
Let us know what happens with your results, OK? I'm curious!
@AnnPT77 there was no change from the batch I made previously with the stand mixer. I did mix the egg and sugar by hand for two minutes, but did the second mix just until incorporated, which was for considerably less time than 3-5 minutes. I wanted them to look like the "chilled for 24 hour" cookies above, but they did not. IDK whether this was due to them only being chilled 9 hours, or it being not a chocolate chip cookie recipe.
Hmm, the first picture is from the website and my cookies don't look like that - they are sunken like the "both" or "granulated sugar" pictures. I almost followed the recipe exactly the first time - the exception was that instead of using brown sugar, I used white sugar and molasses. Next time, I might go back to the stand mixer and use the brown sugar.
The cookies taste fantastic and I am not a professional baker so this is just a fun intellectual exercise.
I don't have a formula, but I'm quite certain you need many more minutes of hand mixing to get the equivalent of one minute of machine mixing. Beatin egg whites to peaks or whipping cream takes much longer by hand IME. Probably the beater's tireless mechanical advantage makes even more of a time difference with a thicker batter.
You're right that sugar (or its substitutes) are structural ingredients in cookies (and some other baked goods).
Kitchen science is fun! 😋2 -
I spent the first 40 years of baking without a stand mixer and nobody in my family (Mom and both grandmas who all were incredible bakers) ever had one. When making cookies, I learned to cream the butter and eggs with a hand mixer and then stirred in the dry ingredients by hand. I got a stand mixer when I was around 50.
My paternal grandma was famous for her lemon meringue pie and my maternal grandma was famous for her angel food cake. Both of them started making these before they had electricity so they had to beat the egg whites by hand.3 -
A mixer, stand or hand, incorporates more air into your batter/dough. This might be why your cookies are sunken. I'd give it another try using the mixer, for the minutes listed in the recipe, and see how they turn out. And do chill them, recipes that call for chilling will almost always flatten if not chilled long enough.
As for getting a stand mixer? I simply love my Kitchen Aide! I never used a stand mixer until I was in my 50's, like @earlnabby, but once I tried my old recipes that I used to make with a hand mixer, I was sold, lock, stock and barrel! Can't walk away from a hand mixer to prep the next step, but you can with a stand mixer. 😉0 -
poisonesse wrote: »A mixer, stand or hand, incorporates more air into your batter/dough. This might be why your cookies are sunken. I'd give it another try using the mixer, for the minutes listed in the recipe, and see how they turn out. And do chill them, recipes that call for chilling will almost always flatten if not chilled long enough.
As for getting a stand mixer? I simply love my Kitchen Aide! I never used a stand mixer until I was in my 50's, like @earlnabby, but once I tried my old recipes that I used to make with a hand mixer, I was sold, lock, stock and barrel! Can't walk away from a hand mixer to prep the next step, but you can with a stand mixer. 😉
I got in on a deal where I got a free second bowl engraved with my name and my choice of one attachment (IIRC it was the 75th anniversary of Kitchen Aid). Having the second bowl is really handy for some of my recipes which require whipping the egg whites and folding them into the batter. I can do the whites in one bowl and the batter in the other. Yes, I fold by hand since using the mixer will break down the air bubbles. I also have a meringue that needs to be whipped for about 10 minutes so it is nice to set the mixer and let it run.0 -
Sometime I'll try using a stand mixer. I used to own a hand crank egg beater - haven't used it in a while. Have one of those little handheld mixers. I turned it on once to see if it worked. Keep forgetting to try using it. Depending on the need, I rely on a whisk, a heavy metal spoon with substantial handle, and a wooden flat spoon for my heavy mixing. That wooden paddle/spoon is really handy for mixing stiff doughs or incorporating ingredients for a cheesecake and it gives your arms a nice little workout.0
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Sometime I'll try using a stand mixer. I used to own a hand crank egg beater - haven't used it in a while. Have one of those little handheld mixers. I turned it on once to see if it worked. Keep forgetting to try using it. Depending on the need, I rely on a whisk, a heavy metal spoon with substantial handle, and a wooden flat spoon for my heavy mixing. That wooden paddle/spoon is really handy for mixing stiff doughs or incorporating ingredients for a cheesecake and it gives your arms a nice little workout.
I always used a wooden spoon when baking cookies as a teen. It was perfect to whack my brothers when they tried to snitch cookie dough.2 -
Remember, every recipe is a description of how one cook got consistent results they loved. It doesn’t mean that no other method will work or give good results. If you’ve gotten good results before with hand mixing, then go for it. The worst that can happen is a less than perfect batch of cookies that everyone will still eat!3
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poisonesse wrote: »A mixer, stand or hand, incorporates more air into your batter/dough. This might be why your cookies are sunken. I'd give it another try using the mixer, for the minutes listed in the recipe, and see how they turn out. And do chill them, recipes that call for chilling will almost always flatten if not chilled long enough.
As for getting a stand mixer? I simply love my Kitchen Aide! I never used a stand mixer until I was in my 50's, like @earlnabby, but once I tried my old recipes that I used to make with a hand mixer, I was sold, lock, stock and barrel! Can't walk away from a hand mixer to prep the next step, but you can with a stand mixer. 😉
Well, the first batch of cookies were sunken as well, and for those I used the stand mixer exactly as described.
This recipe does not call for chilling.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »poisonesse wrote: »A mixer, stand or hand, incorporates more air into your batter/dough. This might be why your cookies are sunken. I'd give it another try using the mixer, for the minutes listed in the recipe, and see how they turn out. And do chill them, recipes that call for chilling will almost always flatten if not chilled long enough.
As for getting a stand mixer? I simply love my Kitchen Aide! I never used a stand mixer until I was in my 50's, like @earlnabby, but once I tried my old recipes that I used to make with a hand mixer, I was sold, lock, stock and barrel! Can't walk away from a hand mixer to prep the next step, but you can with a stand mixer. 😉
Well, the first batch of cookies were sunken as well, and for those I used the stand mixer exactly as described.
This recipe does not call for chilling.
If your cookies are sinking, add a small amount of cornstarch or substitute powdered sugar (which is basically superfine sugar with cornstarch added). I never had shortbread sink since I started doing this after seeing the tip on America's Test Kitchen.1 -
I like a stand mixer, though I don't bake often, because I can walk a way/reach for another ingredient or open something without stopping the mixing process.0
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There is no question in my mind (and I do a lot of baking) that I would not bake without my mixer. I love kitchenAid and they have many different sizes. The mini size is great because its light and takes up a little less space. Although, it has less power so you have to crank up the speed sometimes. I think with a mixer you can be more productive and I find I am more patient. The mixer does the work to cream and fluff!0
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