Carb and Sugar are the same? Help me to understand...
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proasian36
Posts: 1 Member
Hello, I am trying my best to ask a question about the relationship between carb and sugar.
My carb intake is 180 g, while my sugar intake is 40 g according to the food diary. I am not sure what formula the MFP uses to calculate the total carb. BTW, I don't eat any sweet treats, but the sugar is counted when I eat fruits and vegetables.
Questions: Is the sugar intake supposed to be in the carb? Or is it "added" sugar to the carb?
Formula A: 40 g of sugar + 140 g of complex carb = 180 g of total carb
Formula B: 180 g of complex carb + 40 g of sugar = 220 g of total carb
Please help me to understand how that works so I don't mess up my diet progress. Thank you!
My carb intake is 180 g, while my sugar intake is 40 g according to the food diary. I am not sure what formula the MFP uses to calculate the total carb. BTW, I don't eat any sweet treats, but the sugar is counted when I eat fruits and vegetables.
Questions: Is the sugar intake supposed to be in the carb? Or is it "added" sugar to the carb?
Formula A: 40 g of sugar + 140 g of complex carb = 180 g of total carb
Formula B: 180 g of complex carb + 40 g of sugar = 220 g of total carb
Please help me to understand how that works so I don't mess up my diet progress. Thank you!
1
Replies
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The sugar is part of the carbohydrate, but unless you have a medical reason to limit sugars, and particularly in your situation where it's mainly coming from fruit and veg, you don't need to worry about it. Many people swap the sugar column to something more useful, like fibre.
Recommendations for sugar limits are based on added sugar, and while I believe that's now part of nutritional labelling in the US, the vast majority of MFP database entries don't distinguish.8 -
What Nony said.
Carbs include sugar and sugar includes both added and intrinsic sugar. There's no worry about intrinsic sugar,and recs about limiting added or free sugars are about, well, added sugar. Reasons have to do with ease of adding cals (in part because added sugar is often paired with added fats, a point not mentioned enough) and that they could crowd out more nutrient dense foods. Focus on what you do want to eat -- sufficient protein, fiber, veg, and some fruit and healthy fats, and you will be fine.5 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.0
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Pretty much any molecule ending in -ose is a carbohydrate. Glucose, fructose, sucrose, lactose are all "sugars" and are found naturally in foods, along with some added. They are neither inherently good nor bad ... they just are and the body easily process them into energy (at varying levels between the more simple and complex sugars).
Where things get into "good" and "bad" is when looking at nutrition in both terms of other macros and micros, rate at which foods are digested and absorbed, etc between different foods. A pixie stick and small to medium orange have similar sugar levels but greatly differ in total nutrition, fiber, absorption rate, etc. It takes looking beyond just the sugar/carb numbers to determine which is the more appropriate food for a person in a given situation.
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I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.12 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.2 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.
🙄🙄🙄
Yeah.... I'm just craving plain boiled potatoes or apples... sheesh...4 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.
Not every carb breaks down the same or as quickly. I have science to prove this below in case you are curious about how it works. Multiple family members are diabetic, so I’ve done my research on this one (used to have a quick reference list posted on the fridge lol)
So no, a potato and plain old sugar will not have the same affect on your insulin level.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/325586
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Like all squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares, all sugars are carbohydrates but not all carbohydrates are sugars.
There is a fundamental problem with trying to use MFP logs to keep track of sugar. First, there is no recommended limit for sugars naturally occurring in foods. The only recommendation is to limit "added sugar." Added sugars are found in manufactured foods and show up as ingredients in those foods. For example, high fructose corn sugar, cane juice, maltose, dextrose, cane syrup solids, etc. are all sugars. This site provides a list of sugars that are added to foods by manufacturers but it is not all of them: https://www.virtahealth.com/blog/names-for-sugar
MFP's software does not distinguish between these added sugars and those naturally found in things like fruit. Thus, you cannot use MFP software to assess whether you are eating too many added sugars.
If you have diabetes, your endocrinologist may suggest that you control your consumption of carbohydrates in general but not eliminate them. It also may be suggested that you avoid simple carbohydrates and sugars that cause spikes in blood sugar numbers. You can't use MFP software to do this. You can only learn about types of carbohydrates and choose what you eat accordingly. For example, a candy and a bowl of blueberries may have the same number of carbohydrates and even the same sugar numbers yet the blueberries are a far better choice for those trying to control their blood sugar. The fiber in fruits slows digestion of their sugars. Candies, as simple sugars, are digested very rapidly and can spike blood sugar.
For most people who don't have diabetes, avoiding added sugars and eating a well-balanced diet that includes carbohydrates for about half of calories is a good recommendation.5 -
Sugar is just a subset of carbohydrates. Carbohydrates are sugar, starch, and fiber. So yes...sugar is a simple carbohydrate, starch is a complex carbohydrate, and fiber is a complex carbohydrate.4
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janejellyroll wrote: »
I explained it scientifically, but science doesn’t agree with what bubus05 was claiming. 🤷🏻♀️
Maybe they’ll come back and review the science so that they understand the difference between low and high GI carbs.4 -
Dogmom1978 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I explained it scientifically, but science doesn’t agree with what bubus05 was claiming. 🤷🏻♀️
Maybe they’ll come back and review the science so that they understand the difference between low and high GI carbs.
I didn't mean these concepts couldn't be described scientifically, it's just I don't think there is a valid, evidence-based way to explain the specific claims that our bodies process all carbohydrates identically or that eating carbohydrates will cause you to store fat automatically.2 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.
An insulin response to carbohydrates is how your body is supposed to work...and no, it doesn't tank your blood sugar, it levels it off to normal. That insulin response is how your body delivers energy to every cell in your body...it's not some evil thing.
I eat quite a lot of carbs as many of my meals are plant based...it doesn't cause me to have hunger or cravings. A baked potato keeps me pretty full up for quite awhile. I often eat oats for breakfast and I'm perfectly fine until lunch.
The problem isn't the insulin response...that is your body functioning normally as it should and there's no reason to try to stop it. The issue is when there is an inadequate insulin response that doesn't sufficiently lower blood sugar levels as in type II diabetics or no insulin response as in type I diabetics...a lack of insulin response means they need to take insulin for them to function normally...10 -
janejellyroll wrote: »Dogmom1978 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I explained it scientifically, but science doesn’t agree with what bubus05 was claiming. 🤷🏻♀️
Maybe they’ll come back and review the science so that they understand the difference between low and high GI carbs.
I didn't mean these concepts couldn't be described scientifically, it's just I don't think there is a valid, evidence-based way to explain the specific claims that our bodies process all carbohydrates identically or that eating carbohydrates will cause you to store fat automatically.
Sorry, I was being sarcastic and it doesn’t come across properly in text sometimes lol. I was agreeing that the science would NOT show that every single carb you ingest will spike your blood sugar as that person was suggesting. They claimed that science would support what they said without providing the science. The science directly contradicts their claim.
The part about them coming back and reading the article was not sarcastic. I enjoy learning new things and always hope to find others who want to expand their knowledge.
Carbs are not the enemy and the more people who learn that, the better 😊1 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.
Dogmom did.
WIth her explanation, I'd underscore that our blood sugar response in practice depends not just on the individual food, but on the total situation. To give a silly but true example: If, having not eaten for a while, I eat a heaping blob of jam all by itself, that sugar can become available in my body faster than if I put the same amount of jam on a nice dense piece of higher-protein, whole-grain, high-fiber bread with some nice sunflower seeds in it (even though the bread, too, will have some carbs).
Not everyone has terrible cravings if they eat carbs/sugar (even eating those all by themselves). If you do, then managing your carb intake will probably be helpful. But it's certainly not a universal "just how bodies work". That, even though marketing intense "diet gurus" will do their best to convince you that carbs are evil, and insulin a demon. (Without insulin, we'd die. Maybe it has some redeeming qualities?)
As an aside, a plain cooked potato has been identified, in research, as one of the foods most commonly found to be filling/sating. How would that be, if potatoes are carbohydrates and carbohydrates universally and necessarily cause hunger and cravings?7 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body.
But again, sugar isn't one thing and carbs another. Carbs is a big tent that in the US includes fiber, starch, and sugar. And non sugary carb-based foods can include highly refined foods like white bread or things like plain potatoes, whole grains, and beans. More sugary carb-based foods can include something like pop as well as fruit. Vegetables are largely carbs and include a kind of sugar.A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels.
I find these odd examples, as both are typically about half fat, so are not really properly referred to as "carbs" if one wants to communicate effectively. Cake also has starch (a different kind of carb, specifically refined flour) as well as sugar. Potato chips are starch plus oil plus salt (typically).
I would not agree that these foods in moderate are going to "spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels." Indeed, if one is not insulin resistant, they will not (even setting aside the vagueness of "extreme levels").If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
As others have explained, this is not accurate. One cannot store net fat in a calorie deficit, and we actually store fat (which these foods contain plenty of) more easily than carbs in an calorie surplus.6 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body.
But again, sugar isn't one thing and carbs another. Carbs is a big tent that in the US includes fiber, starch, and sugar. And non sugary carb-based foods can include highly refined foods like white bread or things like plain potatoes, whole grains, and beans. More sugary carb-based foods can include something like pop as well as fruit. Vegetables are largely carbs and include a kind of sugar.A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels.
I find these odd examples, as both are typically about half fat, so are not really properly referred to as "carbs" if one wants to communicate effectively. Cake also has starch (a different kind of carb, specifically refined flour) as well as sugar. Potato chips are starch plus oil plus salt (typically).
I would not agree that these foods in moderate are going to "spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels." Indeed, if one is not insulin resistant, they will not (even setting aside the vagueness of "extreme levels").If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
As others have explained, this is not accurate. One cannot store net fat in a calorie deficit, and we actually store fat (which these foods contain plenty of) more easily than carbs in an calorie surplus.
But.... but... Dr. Fung said,"carbs make you fat and all this "calorie" business is all an alien conspiracy to make it easier to take over the earth!"8 -
I think what is important here is that both will have the same effect on the body. A chocolate cake or a bag of potato chips will both spike the body's insulin level to extreme levels. If one's insulin level is high the body will switch to fat storing mode, not what we want. For me it is not how they differ technically they do, as much as what each will do to your body. In that they are essentially the same.
That is just not how it works. Also, what is your definition of spiking insulin to extreme levels?
There are some semantic difference in how fast and where some sugar are metabolized but its only worth noting those if you are doing nutrient timing for exercise reasons.
Not really how it works. There are many studies how unlikely carbs will store as fat. In fact, its less than 10% of the time and more often closer to 3%. What carbs happen to do is supress fat oxidation which allows for fatty acids to store more easily. If you want to know how more about it, research de novo lipogenesis.
Also, as noted the composition of nutrients will determine how fast and how long blood sugar will rise. Fibber, fat or protein all slow absorption. This will reduce the amount of blood sugar and insulin released. Let's not forget that insulin drives nutrients into cells (a natural physiological response). And unless you have BS or Insulin issue, then it's a non concern.
And this doesn't even get into the conversation of athletic performance, building muscle and recovery. All of which benefit highly from carbs.
I lost 47 lbs a decade ago on a high carb diet (220 to 173) and kept it off for years. I am down another 10 lbs on a cyclical ketogenic diet.6
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