Phytates in plants?

Mellouk89
Mellouk89 Posts: 469 Member
edited March 2021 in Food and Nutrition
Assuming our diet is rich in whole grains and other plant-based foods shoud we worry at all about anti-nutrients? I hear phytates have health benefits but they also prevent the absorbtion of certain minerals like iron, calcium, zinc..etc

Should we try to limit those at all?

Replies

  • dmkoenig
    dmkoenig Posts: 299 Member
    Here's a posting from harvard.edu. Basically, the takeaway is if you eat a varied diet, not to worry. There are a lot of factors that play into the anti-nutrient impact, so it's not necessarily a certainty there will be a negative effect. You can also soak and or sprout seeds and legumes prior to use. If you are eating a healthy plant-based diet (not just fries and starches) you will be way ahead of the game compared to 90% of the population. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/anti-nutrients/#:~:text=Oxalates in green leafy vegetables,interfere with normal nutrient absorption.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 46,196 Member
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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  • Mellouk89
    Mellouk89 Posts: 469 Member
    edited March 2021
    dmkoenig wrote: »
    Here's a posting from harvard.edu. Basically, the takeaway is if you eat a varied diet, not to worry. There are a lot of factors that play into the anti-nutrient impact, so it's not necessarily a certainty there will be a negative effect. You can also soak and or sprout seeds and legumes prior to use. If you are eating a healthy plant-based diet (not just fries and starches) you will be way ahead of the game compared to 90% of the population. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/anti-nutrients/#:~:text=Oxalates in green leafy vegetables,interfere with normal nutrient absorption.

    From what I saw phytates are antioxidants and have many benefits, i'm skeptical about limiting grains and other foods high in phytates.

    But for the vegans it may be a concern, and it seems they aren't told that a diet high in foods containing anti-nutrients could be detrimental.

    And then we have “health experts“ who recommend soaking grains everytime you eat them, or to downright avoid foods high in phytic acid.
  • Mellouk89
    Mellouk89 Posts: 469 Member
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Don't you take into consideration fiber and the potential health benefits of phytic acid?
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 25,626 Member
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Don't you take into consideration fiber and the potential health benefits of phytic acid?

    There is a two gram difference in fiber between 100 g cooked white rice vs brown rice. I can easily make that up with 40 g of blueberries.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 46,196 Member
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Don't you take into consideration fiber and the potential health benefits of phytic acid?
    In rice NO. The difference in equal amounts of fiber is minimal and would have little to no impact at all. And white rice TASTES way better to me and is easier to add to just about any dish without changing the dishes flavor.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    dmkoenig wrote: »
    Here's a posting from harvard.edu. Basically, the takeaway is if you eat a varied diet, not to worry. There are a lot of factors that play into the anti-nutrient impact, so it's not necessarily a certainty there will be a negative effect. You can also soak and or sprout seeds and legumes prior to use. If you are eating a healthy plant-based diet (not just fries and starches) you will be way ahead of the game compared to 90% of the population. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/anti-nutrients/#:~:text=Oxalates in green leafy vegetables,interfere with normal nutrient absorption.

    From what I saw phytates are antioxidants and have many benefits, i'm skeptical about limiting grains and other foods high in phytates.

    But for the vegans it may be a concern, and it seems they aren't told that a diet high in foods containing anti-nutrients could be detrimental.

    And then we have “health experts“ who recommend soaking grains everytime you eat them, or to downright avoid foods high in phytic acid.

    Look at large scale studies of vegan health outcomes. There's absolutely no evidence that eating plants is harming us, so I'm not sure what you'd like us to be told.

    All the talk about "anti-nutrients" is purely speculative. From what we see from real world results of vegans and non-vegans who frequently eat plants, there's no evidence that we're being harmed by this.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,039 MFP Moderator
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    dmkoenig wrote: »
    Here's a posting from harvard.edu. Basically, the takeaway is if you eat a varied diet, not to worry. There are a lot of factors that play into the anti-nutrient impact, so it's not necessarily a certainty there will be a negative effect. You can also soak and or sprout seeds and legumes prior to use. If you are eating a healthy plant-based diet (not just fries and starches) you will be way ahead of the game compared to 90% of the population. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/anti-nutrients/#:~:text=Oxalates in green leafy vegetables,interfere with normal nutrient absorption.

    From what I saw phytates are antioxidants and have many benefits, i'm skeptical about limiting grains and other foods high in phytates.

    But for the vegans it may be a concern, and it seems they aren't told that a diet high in foods containing anti-nutrients could be detrimental.

    And then we have “health experts“ who recommend soaking grains everytime you eat them, or to downright avoid foods high in phytic acid.

    Look at large scale studies of vegan health outcomes. There's absolutely no evidence that eating plants is harming us, so I'm not sure what you'd like us to be told.

    All the talk about "anti-nutrients" is purely speculative. From what we see from real world results of vegans and non-vegans who frequently eat plants, there's no evidence that we're being harmed by this.

    Every single meta analysis on plants has shown positive impacts to metabolic health and all cause mortality. It's only the carnivore crowd that is pushing that speculation... similar to the early ketogenic crown suggesting that carbs where bad.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    edited March 2021
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    dmkoenig wrote: »
    Here's a posting from harvard.edu. Basically, the takeaway is if you eat a varied diet, not to worry. There are a lot of factors that play into the anti-nutrient impact, so it's not necessarily a certainty there will be a negative effect. You can also soak and or sprout seeds and legumes prior to use. If you are eating a healthy plant-based diet (not just fries and starches) you will be way ahead of the game compared to 90% of the population. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/anti-nutrients/#:~:text=Oxalates in green leafy vegetables,interfere with normal nutrient absorption.

    From what I saw phytates are antioxidants and have many benefits, i'm skeptical about limiting grains and other foods high in phytates.

    But for the vegans it may be a concern, and it seems they aren't told that a diet high in foods containing anti-nutrients could be detrimental.

    And then we have “health experts“ who recommend soaking grains everytime you eat them, or to downright avoid foods high in phytic acid.

    Look at large scale studies of vegan health outcomes. There's absolutely no evidence that eating plants is harming us, so I'm not sure what you'd like us to be told.

    All the talk about "anti-nutrients" is purely speculative. From what we see from real world results of vegans and non-vegans who frequently eat plants, there's no evidence that we're being harmed by this.

    Every single meta analysis on plants has shown positive impacts to metabolic health and all cause mortality. It's only the carnivore crowd that is pushing that speculation... similar to the early ketogenic crown suggesting that carbs where bad.

    From what I've observed online nutrition advice has a real tendency to fall into speculation. There's a lot of "if this is true, then that is true, and that's why you should never eat [x]."

    So it isn't that phylates aren't real, it's just that at some point you have to pair speculation with observing real life results and how these things behave in the context of actual human diets and health outcomes. You can't just begin with a single fact and spin it into a whole set of dietary recommendations.

    (Carnivores frequently do this sort of thing, but really it's everywhere, including among people who use the same process to tell people that animal protein will kill them dead or that if you eat a Subway sandwich your intestines are now made of yoga mats).
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 40,894 Member
    edited March 2021
    Mellouk89 wrote: »
    Assuming our diet is rich in whole grains and other plant-based foods shoud we worry at all about anti-nutrients? I hear phytates have health benefits but they also prevent the absorbtion of certain minerals like iron, calcium, zinc..etc

    Should we try to limit those at all?

    Meh...I've never really observed or even heard about any real world issues here in regards to people having actual nutrient deficiencies as a result of eating foods containing phytates. This is one of those things that I chalk up to being pretty irrelevant in the context of an overall healthy and varied diet. I certainly eat plenty of whole grains, legumes, lentils, and other plant matter and have never had any issues with any kind of malnutrition.

    I'd wager that more people have nutrient absorption issues related to alcohol consumption than they doing eating some whole grain toast and their beans and rice.
  • nooshi713
    nooshi713 Posts: 4,842 Member
    edited March 2021
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    I’m also a white rice fan. I eat rice frequently. Brown rice is higher in arsenic than white rice. Also, Bruce Lee was a fan of white rice. That’s my excuse! 😋
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 46,196 Member
    nooshi713 wrote: »
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    One of the reasons I prefer white rice over brown rice.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    I’m also a white rice fan. I eat rice frequently. Brown rice is higher in arsenic than white rice. Also, Bruce Lee was a fan of white rice. That’s my excuse! 😋
    And what's funny is I get comments of "WTF" from "clean eaters" who apparently bust their *kitten* in the gym and then ask me what I eat to stay muscular and trim.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png




  • rosebarnalice
    rosebarnalice Posts: 3,485 Member
    As an herbivore, legumes and the cabbage family are prominent in my diet. I have bloodwork about every 6 months and my only vitamin deficiencies are Vitamin D and calcium- both very common for women my age (nearly 60)-- and for which I take supplements.