is dieting really that simple?
patriciafoley1
Posts: 150 Member
I am a refugee from Diet Workshop, WW, and calorie counting plans. I've been on MFP a month. I have lost 14 pounds since June 1st when I started my diet. I'm hopeful but also filled with doubts. I'd like to believe dieting is as simple as calories in, calories burned, but I know its not and I still have deep doubts I can lose weight.
My last weight loss attempts I got stuck on a plateau and each time gave up. I got so much advice: eat less eat more, do this do that, and what I did was go off my diet and not go back to it. I'm afraid it will happen this time too.
I do love MFP. Food tracking is so easy and I weight and measure. For exercise I got a fitbit two weeks ago, and while it is a buggy frustrating device (keeps putting itself in water lock) and I can't recommend it for that reason, I've more or less gotten used to its idiosyncrasies and find it helpful in giving me an idea of what I'm burning. MFP gives me an idea through its food logging of calories, protein, fat, sodium and carbs, and even at the end of the day, will give me a little prediction of weight loss in five weeks, if I've eaten over 1000 calories.
I'm trying to stick to 1000 calories a day. I sometimes have trouble staying in my sodium goal. I also try to stay within 50 carbs a day, but that's extremely hard. Most days I'm around 70.
Exercise I try to walk the dog 3 times a day, and do three repetitions of "go you chicken fat go" and do yard work,mowing etc. So I'm getting a fair bit of exercise.
I'd like to believe losing weight is a simple matter of "calories in/calories burned" equals weight loss, but I don't entirely believe that's true. Eat too little and they say, your body's metabolism slows down and you don't lose. Eat 100 calories over, like one piece of bread a day, and you gain 10 pounds in a year. Weight seems to me like the story of the three bears, it is hard to find the chair that is just right.
Right now I'm not sure I will, but here I am trying, and hoping.
My last weight loss attempts I got stuck on a plateau and each time gave up. I got so much advice: eat less eat more, do this do that, and what I did was go off my diet and not go back to it. I'm afraid it will happen this time too.
I do love MFP. Food tracking is so easy and I weight and measure. For exercise I got a fitbit two weeks ago, and while it is a buggy frustrating device (keeps putting itself in water lock) and I can't recommend it for that reason, I've more or less gotten used to its idiosyncrasies and find it helpful in giving me an idea of what I'm burning. MFP gives me an idea through its food logging of calories, protein, fat, sodium and carbs, and even at the end of the day, will give me a little prediction of weight loss in five weeks, if I've eaten over 1000 calories.
I'm trying to stick to 1000 calories a day. I sometimes have trouble staying in my sodium goal. I also try to stay within 50 carbs a day, but that's extremely hard. Most days I'm around 70.
Exercise I try to walk the dog 3 times a day, and do three repetitions of "go you chicken fat go" and do yard work,mowing etc. So I'm getting a fair bit of exercise.
I'd like to believe losing weight is a simple matter of "calories in/calories burned" equals weight loss, but I don't entirely believe that's true. Eat too little and they say, your body's metabolism slows down and you don't lose. Eat 100 calories over, like one piece of bread a day, and you gain 10 pounds in a year. Weight seems to me like the story of the three bears, it is hard to find the chair that is just right.
Right now I'm not sure I will, but here I am trying, and hoping.
4
Replies
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I mean if you're sticking at 1000 calories a day you're going to fail at some point, yes. Too low, not sustainable. That's a recipe for stalling, binging, and regain. Nothing you do now should be something you can't do forever and it's a very short, old, woman who doesn't move that can manage on 1000 calories a day without stressing their body out, moving less in life (Not exercise just life) and having other calorie burning things their bodies do (like temperature, hair growth, nail growth) slow or stop -- -and cortisol go up, creating other issues.
But also yes, weight loss is in fact as simple as calories in, calories out. The diet industry wants to make it complicated. You can't sell 'figure out your total daily energy expenditure and eat less than that'. They CAN sell points, exercise plans, shakes, diet plans, premade diets, and pills. They also very much get a lot of repeat business by making it complicated.
But seriously. Eat more. Use the MPF calorie guide. Stop undereating and setting yourself up to be sick and fail.8 -
Also, honestly - do some real research with real math and science behind it. Vet your sources but really looking into it yourself and removing much mystery and crap as possible is a good thing. Can really build confidence in the process.3
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Mechanistically speaking, at the level of physics, it *is* as simple as balancing calories in and out (with in < out for weight loss).
As a practical matter, all of the calories in and out (and the goals) are *estimates*, so there are some skills to be learned to estimate. Fortunately, close is good enough, so it's possibly to lose weight by attentive calorie counting.
In actual human bodies, calorie balance isn't static, it's dynamic.
It's *not* true that you can eat so few calories that your metabolism "breaks" and you can't lose fat any more. (If that could happen, no one would ever starve to death, or they'd be fat when they died of starvation. Sadly, many people die worldwide daily from starvation, and they're emaciated (maybe bloated belly, but skeletal otherwise) when they do so.
What is true is that if we cut calories severely, we can become fatigued (so move less, in possibly subconscious ways); and convince our body there's a famine going on, so it turns down body temperature a tiny bit, slows hair growth, and compromises health in other less-important-to-survival ways (so conserves calories by using them only for the very highest priority bodily functions). In that scenario, weight loss can be slower than expected. On top of that, the stress of undereating can cause stress-related water retention that slowly creeps up, and hides fat loss on the scale, making you think you're not losing fat when you still are. Those things are danger signs: Feeling cold, feeling weak, feeling fatigued, brittle nails, hair breaking/thinning (though those last two are usually weeks late to be a helpful warning).
On top of all of that, there can be psychological aspects that make the easy physics be hard in practice: Some of us have learned to use food as a reward, to self-sooth, to counter stress or boredom, and more. We can even subconsciously experience fatness as protective, in some cases (a way to hide, kind of). And there's more, by far, on the psychological side. That part is very very individual, and can be difficult even beyond the counting.
Even beyond that, we have comfortable habits (what we're used to eating, and activities we like to do), others things are uncomfortable/unfamiliar (new foods or exercise); and perceptions of what's "normal" for eating and exercise (what our families and friends generally do, commonly). Those affect our thinking.
Some of us say weight loss is simple (because it's just calorie balance) but not easy (because of the dynamic, psychological, habitual, and normative influences).
It's not so much the 3 bears, as finding the new habits, looking at it as a problem of averages over time, and adjusting based on results.
Just my opinions.10 -
Well, I'm walking an average of about 16000 steps a day, and some of that bumps into the cardio range, (based on fitbit) so I'm definitely moving plenty. I usually walk my dog 2-3 times a day for a couple of miles and some days I mow - with a push mower - my acre lot. I'm staying around 1000-1200 calories a day. Since I measure generally and not weigh unless its something that can''t be measured, I'm leaving a calorie cushion for the inevitable errors. But I don't think I make that many errors. And as for the difference between 1200 being sustainable and 1000 being non sustainable, there really isn't that much of a difference between the two (esp given inevitable errors) that it would make a difference between success and failure. If you are not eating calorie dense junk, 1000 or 1200 is a lot of food. And I'm drinking plenty of water.
Still I haven't lost much, if anything, in the last week or so, if anything, in spite of a daily calorie deficit. Its discouraging to see the scale not move. Exercise and dieting would be a lot easier if the scale reflected the calories in calories out, and that's with a cushion, just in case I am underestimating calories in and fitbit over estimates calories out. Which I'm sure both happens. Which is why I have left that cushion and not nearly eaten what MFP and Fitbit are estimating. So the two cases, that I'm not estimating calories correctly, or not estimating how much I'm burning, I have already set up to be as good an estimate as possible.
If it were all math and science, then the scale would have moved appropriately and it hasn't. I know I'm not the only person dealing with this problem. Its frustrating to do the right thing. I'm hopeful to see a drop in a week, but if I don't, I don't know what I can do, because as far as I'm able, I'm doing everything right.0 -
There's also the matter that you've been on MFP for a month. The human body takes time to adjust to changes and may not show exactly what you're expecting because the body is not a machine. It doesn't see that you're trying to lose weight, it just sees that it's getting less food and is adjusting by holding onto water, holding onto gas, redirecting stored nutrients, etc. There's a billion little things that could be contributing to why you haven't and won't see the results you're expecting.
You could be affected by dehydration, stress, illness, sun exposure, hormonal imbalances, shifts in your environment, nutritional deficiencies, muscle recovery, sodium intake, sugar, dietary intolerances, increased/decreased animal product consumption, medications, etc... I could go on for a while.
As for the 1000 vs. 1200 argument: Have you ever calculated your basal metabolic rate (BMR)? This is the amount of energy you consume just by existing. Not getting up and walking, not exercising, not stretching, just maintaining normal bodily functions. Eating less calories than this value for a prolonged period of time can be dangerous. It's fine every once in a while, but doing it too regularly can hurt you.
For future reference, it's a lot easier to know if something is reasonable if you provide your age, height, and gender. Men usually need more calories than women, taller people need more calories than shorter, younger than older... Any information you can provide about yourself will lead to better responses.0 -
I totally understand your analogy of the three bears and, I believe that in a way, you're correct. Each person finds what methods/calories/macros/deficits/exercise etc work for them. For sure it may not be the first choice, and may take adjusting, tweaking, experimenting until you get it "just right" (like Goldilocks, heh)
But as said above in the other replies, in the end, it does come down to calories in/out. BUT..I also think there are factors that can amplify, or conversely, slow down the loss.
For example...if I spent my 1200 calories on a bottle of wine and a bag of flaming hot cheetos before bed, I'd likely feel crappy the next day, be lacking nutrition, be dehydrated, and not feel like exercising (even if I forced myself to). However, if I used 1200 calories to consume a few eggs scrambled with avocado and tomato, a tuna lettuce wrap, big handful of almonds, and salmon with sweet potato and broccoli for dinner... my body is going to be happily filled with my electrolytes on track, I'll likely have energy, exercise, fed my cells/muscles etc. So..in each case...1200 went in but...they were certainly not equally spent, so to speak.
Also, "when" you eat can help. I'm a huge fan of intermittent fasting, the easiest form being to consume all of your calories in an 8 hour window. (my husband does noon to 8pm) He hasn't changed the calories "in or out" very much but, he's down 20 pounds in 5 weeks. (he has about 50 pounds total to lose) So, still is calories in calories out but just scheduling them differently and I'd encourage anyone to give it a try.
Last thing I wanted to say is the scale is just one tool and...it can vary so much!! One day, I decided to weigh myself throughout the day to watch the changes. Right out of bed, 170. Drank water/coffee..171. Ate breakfast, more water..171.8. Pooped...170.9. ...and the day went on. The next morning, I was 169.5. Our bodies constantly fluctuate a few pounds and, please don't get discouraged if you haven't seen a change in a week! Fitbit should give you a weight "trend" line which will help smooth out the ups and downs.1 -
weight loss IS all math and all science, but it's not necessarily linear.
for example, some days your body will hold onto more water, other days it won't, so you may have lost a pound of fat but since you're holding an extra pound of water, your scale won't move. also if you exercise more heavily - walking up more hills or stairs, for example - your body will have more water in the areas that have worked more than usual. so again, you might have lost fat but the scale won't move.0 -
where does fitbit give a weight trend line? MFP tells you how much you'll weigh in five weeks "if every day were like today" - and I wish it would do it based upon a month's records, not just a day, to get a better sense - but I haven't found any app that gives a prediction.
For pete's sake, I'm not looking at the scale solely to expect an immediate result - I'm looking to see if what I'm doing is going to get me where I want to go in the long run, which means I'm looking to see if I'm no the right track in the short run. If the scale doesn't move, I don't know if I'm eating too much, or what.
As for basal metabolic rate, calories burned, I'm relying on fitbit for that. Yesterday was a mowing day, so according to fitbit I burned 3222 calories, had 371 zone minutes, walked 7.34 miles, with 17,306 steps. And I ate about 1200. the day before was a non mowing day I walked, 5.48 miles, burned 2669 calories, took 12995 steps, and had 118 zone minutes. Today so far according to fitbit I've burned 1825 calories, walked 3.3 miles, with 7776 steps and had 167 zone minutes. and I've eaten about 500 calories.0 -
patriciafoley1 wrote: »where does fitbit give a weight trend line?
I have the app on my phone, and when I open Fitbit, it shows my "today" screen (heartrate, sleep, steps etc) at the bottom is a weight and if you click it, it should take you to the next screen where your trend chart will be.
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I also agree when you eat seems to help. If I have a late (healthy) snack, I'm less likely to see a drop the next morning than if I stopped eating at 7 pm. But I tend to be a late eater (don't like to eat in the morning) so I often eat breakfast very late, lunch at three and dinner after nine. That works well for me logistically, but I don't think it works as well for the scale. The days that I am satisfied with lunch and don't bother to eat dinner, I am more likely to see a scale drop. I am trying to eat relatively low carb, I find it hard to do 50 but I generally am under 100, more likely 70.0
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There is nothing I enjoy quite so much (this point is sarcasm, I enjoy it 0%) - in dogs, weight loss, or anything else in life - stubbornly continuing to insist on doing something that IS NOT WORKING. They're not seeing results, they're getting nowhere, nothing is happening and my gosh they're going to keep doing it. That method they've decided on, that isn't working, is the hill they will die on!
Even more fun when they're doing that while telling people who ARE having success and have proof of it, that what they are saying is absolutely not right, can't be right, must be wrong.
Why are people like this?
Oh and more general FYI: Yes, eating later will give you a higher scale weight. There's still more food and glycogen in your system than if you stop eating earlier. Not a thing to do with the fat on your body.2 -
patriciafoley1 wrote: »I also agree when you eat seems to help. If I have a late (healthy) snack, I'm less likely to see a drop the next morning than if I stopped eating at 7 pm. But I tend to be a late eater (don't like to eat in the morning) so I often eat breakfast very late, lunch at three and dinner after nine. That works well for me logistically, but I don't think it works as well for the scale. The days that I am satisfied with lunch and don't bother to eat dinner, I am more likely to see a scale drop. I am trying to eat relatively low carb, I find it hard to do 50 but I generally am under 100, more likely 70.
You need to look at your weight trend, not individual weigh-ins. The fact that you weigh less when you haven't eaten later in the day has nothing to do with fat loss and everything to do with food waste etc in your system. So don't pay attention to that.
When you eat is important only in as far as it can influence how satiated you feel. If your léger eating later on the day, just eat later in the day, don't eat earlier just to 'cheat' the scale.
You've lost 14lbs in 5 weeks, that's a lot. And now you've experienced a stall of one week and already you think something's wrong? Well yes, something is wrong to me, but not what you think. Stalls are normal. The weight you've lost so far ombined with how little you are eating and how active your are, tells me your approach is not sustainable.
If you want to lose weight, get to your goal and keep it off long-term, you need to slow down, be patient and take a more sustainable approach towards durable change.
PS you don't need to eat low carb to lose weight. If you find it hard, do something else.1 -
Oh and FYI, I lose weight pretty steadily (though no longer quickly since I'm well within a normal BMI now) on 1600 calories a day and I only weigh 140 lbs. If I'm active and not laid up with an injury (as in now) more like 2000 (though I will cop to a higher than the average calorie burn on a daily basis). It's great. I get to eat, have energy and not have my hair fall out.0
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I have the fitbit app on my apple phone, but it doesn't show weight. The last item on the today lineup is the sleep score. Is that because I do my weight checkin on MFP and not on fitbit? I enter food water, weight, on MFP and so far have just used the fitbit to track daily calories burned, steps, exercise, so I don't have to guestimate the entering on MFP. I got MFP first, and only after a couple of weeks got the fitbit just for that. I'd like to see a trend, it would help me when the scale isn't moving.0
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For weight trends, there are the apps Libra or Happy Scale depending on your phone OS.1
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