Balancing weight loss and heavy lifting for beginners

1. A calorie deficit is the only way to lose weight at all, so no, there's nothing else you can do to make weight loss happen - if you're not maintaining a calorie deficit, you will not lose weight, regardless of whatever else you're doing or not doing, end of story. To your actual question, though, it is not necessary or indeed helpful to jog during rest periods - if you want to get some cardio in, do it after you're done lifting, or on non-lifting days.

2. I'm no expert, just a fellow obese woman who likes picking up heavy things and putting them back down again, but (1) if you're actively trying to lose, you are in all likelihood not making any muscular gains (how could you be? you're already eating at a deficit, what's your body going to build the muscle out of if it's already having to dip into its savings to pay the energy bills?) and (2) I think, especially for women, "noob gainz" come down more to us not actually knowing how strong we are, where our actual "baseline" is. I know I tend to err on the side of going way too light the first time I try a new exercise, or the first time doing something I haven't done for a long time, because I don't want to injure myself. Maybe you're deadlifting 135lbs by week 2 because you could always do that, and just never had a reason to try before you learned how to do it safely. I welcome anyone who does actually know anything about this to correct me, I'm always up for learning a new thing and I make absolutely no claims of expertise in physiology, exercise science, or weightlifting in general.

3. I'm focusing more on the weight loss piece than building strength right now; when I get closer to goal I'm going to dive into recomp. I'm incorporating strength training into my life now because (1) I like doing it and it makes me happy, (2) I'm 30 and have a family history of osteoporosis and arthritis, so I want to keep muh bones strong and healthy as long as I can and I know resistance training is important for that, and (3) I do want to be physically stronger and more muscular, but I can wait to be less fat first before shifting gears to really focus on that third goal.

Great job doing it now rather than later.
Once you get up in weight and tap out your existing muscles for what they can do - you'll be in unique situation compared to goal weight for actually gaining some muscle much easier. Which is to say it's not easy, but hey, might as well get what you can now when it'll be about impossible later.

1 - Don't try to maximize weight loss - take a reasonable deficit from what you burn in total for the day. If exercise adds to that total, it counts. Lifting doesn't burn a ton, and it may remain a short workout, so it may not really add on much, but I'd get in habit of logging it since it does count.
If you find the eating goal even with exercise calories added on is too little, either decrease the deficit or get more active.

2 - Reasonable deficit (for amount of fat to lose), enough protein for your LBM, and resistance training - 3 legs that allow retaining what you got.

3 - This will be your testing - when is eating best, how close to bedtime for workout or food, ect. That type of stuff varies so make notes to reference later since the effects may not be quick enough to associate to changes that were made.

4 - I'll leave to others as no req for books - just some good youtubers like Nippard, Biolayne, athleanX. McDonald for article reading very in depth if desired.

@nossmf that makes a lot of sense. I would say that even untrained men are more likely to have attempted to pick up heavy things unassisted before doing it on purpose for exercise, though - the average man likely has more data to inform his decision of where to start with lifting in terms of weight than the average woman. Although plenty of women hoik 40lb toddlers into the air without batting an eye, but somehow a squirmy human with a constantly changing center of balance isn't considered "a weight" the way some iron discs stuck together with an aluminum bar is.

I am not "experienced," but new to lifting myself. That said, I found it interesting you said you are finding it really easy doing Stronglifts. I just thought it worth mentioning that gains, as I understand it, come from lifting heavy (e.g. you can only do between 5-12 reps per set). I believe Stronglifts has you do 5 if I am remembering correctly. But if you are not finding that hard, it sounds like you need to be lifting heavier.

Again, I am new myself, so someone else may chime in and say I am wrong. And I won't debate it. I am just mentioning what I have come across in my research. When I started, I added weight to each set until I found the heaviest I could handle for between the above mentioned reps, and then I made that my starting weight beginning the next workout. When I hit 10 reps per set, I add weight. I do not find my workouts easy. I break a sweat, and they are hard, although I do enjoy lifting - thank god cause I hate (HATE) cardio.

I am doing the same thing you are btw. I saw all the same "wish I had done this earlier" stuff.. I am 270lb and trying to lose fat and gain muscle at the same time. I do 20 minutes of mild cardio before my weight workout. It is just walking, so I don't feel it effects my workout, but it gives me a warm up, gets me an hour and half of cardio a week which is needed for overall health, and while diet is most important for loss, it will bump up my calorie burn a little as well.

If you are really wanting to understand the science aspects. I will mention Jeff Nippard as a source. He has a youtube channel and delves deep into all the old and new research on lifting. He always sites his sources which is awesome.
https://youtube.com/user/icecream4PRs

thatminivanlife wrote: »

nossmf wrote: »

Muscles may seem to be getting bigger, but usually early on this is more a matter of existing muscle swelling slightly from use and the sudden influx of water/nutrients for recovery, as well as a melting away of the fat surrounding the muscle. Actual muscle growth requires an increase in calories, which runs completely counter to your desired outcome of losing weight.

Of course, exceptions exist to every rule, and some people may in fact gain muscle mass while they are losing fat, but how that happens is beyond me.

This makes sense! Maybe the anomalies who can do that are able to metabolize food to repair and grow muscle tissue while using stored energy for basic metabolic stuff.

Do you know if increasing strength in existing muscle tissue increases BMR, or is that only increased by the growth of new muscle tissue? (Or am I way off here? I'm trying to figure this all out because it keeps my brain busy while I'm building these new habits.(

I think primarily it's mass gain that can increase BMR (and that not by very much, plus it's oh-so slow). I wouldn't expect an effect on BMR from increasing neuromuscular adaptation (that's the better recruitment/use of existing muscle fibers). Researchers nowadays seem to think a pound of muscle at rest burns around 4 calories *per day* more than a pound of fat (which is also metabolically active) . . . that's not much. And it takes weeks to months to gain a pound of muscle mass, under the best of conditions. (Calorie deficit = not the best of conditions, sadly.)

Here's a speculation, though: I'd bet that people who are stronger (even through neuromuscular adaptation alone) will find it easier and more fun to do physical things in general, so will tend to move more throughout their day . . . and that *does* burn calories.

In terms of burning more calories, think not only about exercise, but about putting more movement in your day in a variety of ways: That can really add up. Lots of ideas in this thread:

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10610953/neat-improvement-strategies-to-improve-weight-loss/p1

Mr. Heybales is right, you shouldn't just be doing more stuff to lose weight faster and faster: You want to lose weight at a sensible rate, create sustainable *habits* of moving more in a diversity of happy ways (exercise and daily life stuff), fuel your actual activity level and get good nutrition . . . that's the route to maximizing your maintenance calories in the long run, in addition to keeping as much existing muscle as you can through strength training (and maybe even adding some muscle mass along the way even during weight loss, though that part isn't guaranteed).

If Heybales disagrees with anything I just typed above, believe Heybales! 😉

I run contrary to many here. I don’t record gym sessions because my feeling is they are so stop and go I probably don’t burn many calories. I do record everything else: intentional walks, mat classes, etc.

As far as reading suggestions, honey, you are on the mother lode right here.

Read the stickies at the top of each section. Go back several pages and read threads that sound interesting.

I’ve learned a ton here, and it’s been in a fun, supportive, gossipy format. A book on diet or working out would have me sacked out. This is just so much more immediate and digestible.

thatminivanlife wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

I think primarily it's mass gain that can increase BMR (and that not by very much, plus it's oh-so slow). I wouldn't expect an effect on BMR from increasing neuromuscular adaptation (that's the better recruitment/use of existing muscle fibers). Researchers nowadays seem to think a pound of muscle at rest burns around 4 calories *per day* more than a pound of fat (which is also metabolically active) . . . that's not much. And it takes weeks to months to gain a pound of muscle mass, under the best of conditions. (Calorie deficit = not the best of conditions, sadly.)

Here's a speculation, though: I'd bet that people who are stronger (even through neuromuscular adaptation alone) will find it easier and more fun to do physical things in general, so will tend to move more throughout their day . . . and that *does* burn calories.

In terms of burning more calories, think not only about exercise, but about putting more movement in your day in a variety of ways: That can really add up. Lots of ideas in this thread:

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10610953/neat-improvement-strategies-to-improve-weight-loss/p1

Mr. Heybales is right, you shouldn't just be doing more stuff to lose weight faster and faster: You want to lose weight at a sensible rate, create sustainable *habits* of moving more in a diversity of happy ways (exercise and daily life stuff), fuel your actual activity level and get good nutrition . . . that's the route to maximizing your maintenance calories in the long run, in addition to keeping as much existing muscle as you can through strength training (and maybe even adding some muscle mass along the way even during weight loss, though that part isn't guaranteed).

If Heybales disagrees with anything I just typed above, believe Heybales! 😉

Thank you (and everyone else here) for dropping all your knowledge! I read (I think in Atomic Habits) something along the lines of "If you fall in love with the habits, results will come." I've been trying to focus on that through this. I'd rather lose the times as slow but make it permanent rather than lose it fast but struggle at maintenance because the habits aren't sustainable. Because of that, I'm trying to look forward to what I can do now to work on the habits that are going to carry me furthest, even when I struggle with dips in motivation.

IMO, that's the kind of thinking that makes people much more likely to succeed. Go, you!

thatminivanlife wrote: »

Do you have any recommendations about books (I love books) that would give me more information about good ways to reach my goals (lose weight, feel good, look better naked)?

I HIGHLY recommend Renaissance Diet 2.0 from Renaissance Periodization. Their Renaissance Woman is also excellent. They also have books on hypertrophy and habit-building that may be right up your alley.

Beyond those, the Muscle & Strength Pyramids from 3DMJ (there are 2 - one for training & one for diet).

Brad Schoenfeld just published an update to his MAX Muscle book that, while it's not necessarily the type of programming that I personally use, is definitely solid.

I'm not a woman, but I was very morbidly obese. 2 years ago I was almost 400 pounds, and I started with a diet change first and foremost before I did any exercise. Once I got my eating under control, and made the commitment to avoid all processed and fast foods and keep my diet mostly whole foods, the weight started coming off very quickly. You have to be in a calorie deficit to lose weight. There's no way around it.

After a month, I noticed I had more energy and I started walking. Just walking, nothing else. I could only do about 10 minutes before I was too tired, but I kept doing a little more every day (when I first started, I would get winded just going to the bathroom). Before long, I was walking 1 mile, then 2, then 3. That was when I started adding resistance training 3 days a week, but still keeping my cardio and my diet in check. Starting slow like that allowed me to develop the habits I still have today. I never started out heavy lifting, I did light weight for more reps and gradually worked my way up. Since I got a shoulder injury last year, I still keep my weights on the lighter side, but opt for more reps to failure.

My advice as a formerly super obese person is to start slow when it comes to exercise, and I'd actually advise AGAINST heavy lifting right now. Your risk of injury at the moment is the highest it ever will be. The best thing you can do is clean your diet up, work through the triggers of binge eating (if you have it. I had binge eating disorder and had to make some pretty tough changes), and just start by walking. Just moving around when you're morbidly obese is more than enough of a workout. Trust me me on this. You're likely carrying an extra person in weight. Your body is going to get a sufficient workout if it's moving.

No matter how big you are, those little changes will make a HUGE difference. I promise.