How do you feel about fleece?

While I'm still trying to wrap my head around fleece not coming from sheep, here's something on recycling plastics that made me think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fiu9GSOmt8E&t=2s

Plastic is in everything, from the clothes we wear to the water we drink. John Oliver explains how plastics are harming the planet, why recycling isn’t the solution you think it is, and why fixing the problem will be up to not just consumers, but corporations and policymakers.

This discussion reminds me of the conversation I had with the sales clerk at the ski store when buying clothing for this new adventure of mine a year ago (learning to downhill when pushing 60): “Cotton is death”. He was referring to being outside in the cold when it gets wet, believable, if not a bit scary-sounding. Thinking about my new gear, I would guess that it is all synthetic, even my socks, as wool was ruled out due to allergy reasons.

I was unaware of fleece being bad for the environment and bought my first (and only) fleece item (zip-up shirt/jacket) about a year ago. It is so soft and warm. I seriously doubt I will buy more now with this knowledge, but I’m trying to make sense with the knowledge that a lot of clothing is made from petroleum products.

As an aside, in my first career as an engineer, it was not possible for us to manufacture our plastic parts with more than 30% regrind (ground-up plastic from the runners—material which is melted to make the parts but not part of the actual parts). Regrind is just not identical to virgin material in several ways, dimensional control being foremost, at least with our applications. Although I am aware of how recycled materials can be used, I’ve always wondered where all of it is being used with so much plastic being recycled these days.

Synthetic fleece? Well I hate the feel of almost any synthetic against my skin and prefer natural fibers. However, with that said I do have a couple of synthetic fleece jackets--2 different weights that go over natural clothing. I've had them for over 25 yrs. I seldom wash them because they are on top and just don't get dirty or smelly. Natural fibers are washed frequently. I often think of the trade-off--energy (wash machine) and soap.

I look at it as the plastic bag problem. A law was finally passed, here in Italy, and all plastic grocery bags must be bio-friendly and break down quickly in a landfill. People were encouraged to bring their own recyclable shopping bags from home, and I do. The "Powers That Be" have to find better alternatives and eliminate the culprit from the market. That seems to work. Most people will do what they can to help the environment if they are pointed in the right direction. If you just layer on the guilt and expect people to figure it out on their own, we won't get anywhere.

NorthCascades wrote: »

I saw an article about this yesterday, turned "Comfort Catastrophe."

https://www.gearpatrol.com/style/g37610270/fleece-jackets-microplastics/

I'm glad people care about this, it affects our children and will affect theirs too, and a lot of other living things.

I've been hand washing my fleece since learning this. Probably uses more water but I'm certain treating it a lot more gently releases less micro plastic.

Jeebus! The prices on those pullovers.

I'll keep my $1 Eddie Bauer thrift store find...but I don't like it well enough to pay over $100 for a new one!

I don’t own any fleece, it always felt like styrofoam against my skin *cringe* I don’t even like handling it but sometimes can’t avoid it (some of my patients wear fleece so I occasionally have to). Over the years I’ve slowly replaced most of my everyday wardrobe with biodegradable plant/animal fibers and I like the feel and drape of those so much better so continue to move in that direction. My workout clothes are made of synthetics for better performance during exercise/sweating. They are slinky materials and I can tolerate those but once my workout is done I can’t wait to get out of those clothes as soon as I can though!

There are so many things like that (fleece) -- that can be positive or negative. Concrete is one. Same with aggregates (rock for building homes/building/roads). You need them, but cement (which is an important part of concrete production) is responsible for like 10% of the world's greenhouse gasses.

Bill Gates has a start up that is trying to use solar, not fossil fuels, to fuel cement production, but it's a long way off.

People always *kitten* when there's a sand and gravel pit permit near their area. Every home, on average, has well over 2 tons of aggregate in it. And it's ungodly heavy. So, people don't want aggregate pits near their home, but they are OK with transporting it across country??

There is a lot of give and take. But your post reminded me I needed new reusable produce bags, so I just ordered some. With all the produce I buy, that's way more impact than whether or not I have fleece (not a fan, BTW).

Synthetic fabrics, including fleece, have evolved a lot in the last couple decades.

I think the primary concern that many people have with fleece right now as regards microplastics is that they seem to release them with every wash. I don't know that this is true with other synthetic fabrics. I have a number of different technical fleece garments and undergarments. I bought them before this issue was known about, at least widely. I will be looking for other options when I replace them if there's better options. I rarely wash my SCUBA undergarment (for my drysuit for 45 degree water). I have an undergarment for my paddling drysuit I'd like to retire; it's "fleece," but is actually made from Rayon. That's why it's not that warm. And Rayon is made from trees. I've used that under my SCUBA drysuit for water in the upper 50s and lower 60s. There may be other options; I'd like to find out if they also shed microplastic.

Wearing wet cotton will cool you off faster than wearing nothing. In a Wilderness First Aid class, I remember learning about an experiment where, if I recall correctly, the investigators took two otherwise equivalent glasses of water and put a wet cotton cover over one. It cooled faster. If it's hot out, this can be a good thing. If it's cold out it can be deadly.

Wool has evolved a lot too. Fibers like Merino are comfortable even next to the skin, and they last a long time. They resist the stink of some synthetics, but can smell like a wet dog under some circumstances. I remember an old polypro top I had for kayaking that when I pulled off my drytop I would have to hold my breath. It was some kind of combination of ammonia and cat pee smell. Awful. I remember on one trip where we were paddling daily from a base camp (car camping, not going multi days down a river) I would hang my stuff up on a line each afternoon. I would watch vultures circle above. I figured they were thinking "I don't know what that is, but it HAS to be dead." I have two pairs of 25-year-old Merino undergarments made for cycling that I use for general purposes. Warm, but not too warm. Breathes. Only smells like wet dog, not dead things swimming in cat pee. But moths eat wool. Well, their larvae do. Synthetics don't get eaten by bugs. Rayon will dissolve in alcohol....

I've been picking up used synthetic layers from a second hand shop. They work for their intended purpose. I really would love to know if they shed microplastic. If so, I need to look for other options.

mtaratoot wrote: »

I have two pairs of 25-year-old Merino undergarments made for cycling that I use for general purposes. Warm, but not too warm. Breathes. Only smells like wet dog, not dead things swimming in cat pee. But moths eat wool. Well, their larvae do. Synthetics don't get eaten by bugs. Rayon will dissolve in alcohol....

I also love wool. Real wool.

Moths do eat it, this is true. But it can be repaired. Really easily, too, if you’re not too worried about how it looks.
A little more attention to detail and it’s possible to mend wool invisibly.

As for rayon, the fact that it melts in a fire scares the be jimmy’s outta me.

kshama2001 wrote: »

RunsWithBees wrote: »

I don’t own any fleece, it always felt like styrofoam against my skin *cringe* I don’t even like handling it but sometimes can’t avoid it (some of my patients wear fleece so I occasionally have to). Over the years I’ve slowly replaced most of my everyday wardrobe with biodegradable plant/animal fibers and I like the feel and drape of those so much better so continue to move in that direction. My workout clothes are made of synthetics for better performance during exercise/sweating. They are slinky materials and I can tolerate those but once my workout is done I can’t wait to get out of those clothes as soon as I can though!

This makes me wonder if you have problems with patients wearing clothes reeking of fabric softener.

I will be so happy when we move next month to a house far enough away from others that I will never have to smell neighbors doing their laundry from within my house if the windows are open or be prevented from being in my yard because of the reek of fabric softener while their dryer is going.

How did you know?! I hate hate hate the smell of fabric softener, it’s so gross and cloying to my senses I am actually allergic to some perfumes and fragrance ingredients, those scented garbage bags are the worst, my throat starts swelling before I even notice the smell. But I also suspect I might be somewhere on the autism spectrum because I do have some very specific sensory overload issues when it comes to certain textures (like fleece), smells (like fabric softener, baby corn, lavender, cigarette smoke) and certain sounds. There are other clues in my life that make me suspect this also but never been officially diagnosed so don’t know for sure.

NorthCascades wrote: »

It's interesting to see how some folks in here hate the way fleece wears, or feels against their skin. I used to be in that group. I found the stuff to be too warm and not breathe, I would sweat with almost any exertion and it would feel clammy, like wearing a plastic bag. It's great for going to the store on a rainy day, walking on flat ground, or something like that but not much more. Then I got a grid fleece, brushed and exquisitely soft, very breathable, quick drying, and after years I finally understood what the fuss is about.

The fuss over polyester fleece in my world is because it is cheap and warm.
And I can’t fault people who wear it for those reasons.

I feel like there’s a class aspect in these fads to cancel certain fabrics. I prefer merino wool base layers but only only one because I can’t afford it - recently got one on sale. For the price of one decent merino base layer I could buy six fleece ones. It’s definitely a first world privilege to afford to be outraged about other people not buying luxury fibers.

NorthCascades wrote: »

MargaretYakoda wrote: »

NorthCascades wrote: »

MargaretYakoda wrote: »

NorthCascades wrote: »

It's interesting to see how some folks in here hate the way fleece wears, or feels against their skin. I used to be in that group. I found the stuff to be too warm and not breathe, I would sweat with almost any exertion and it would feel clammy, like wearing a plastic bag. It's great for going to the store on a rainy day, walking on flat ground, or something like that but not much more. Then I got a grid fleece, brushed and exquisitely soft, very breathable, quick drying, and after years I finally understood what the fuss is about.

The fuss over polyester fleece in my world is because it is cheap and warm.
And I can’t fault people who wear it for those reasons.

I have a lot of merino base layers hanging in my closet, from SmartWool, Icebreaker, Minus33, etc. Also polyester and blended ones. For what it's worth, it's been years since I wore any of the merino ones, because they don't keep me as comfortable. I get sweaty hiking up hill, they absorb and hold too much moisture, they never dry, and the feeling against the skin of even ultrafine merino is less pleasant than the poly stuff.

For context, in sitting here writing this in a cashmere sweater. Soft clothes delight me.

I think, once I hit my goal weight, I want a cashmere sweater.

My favorite actually came from Goodwill. It was $20 which is a lot for them, but looked like it had never been worn, and it turns out if I could find that one brand new it would have been $400. So I can't recommend thrift stores enough.

The other great thing about thrift store cashmere is you don't mind beating it up. It's getting cold, I need to plant some spring bulbs soon, stuff like that.

Cashmere sheds more than Polar fleece, but it's shedding goat hair, which fully breaks down.

I know sometimes who collects second hand cashmere items, rehabilitates them, and holds a trunk sale every other year or so. I think I’ll message them in a few months.