Open discussion on the minds ability to influence the physical body......
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cwolfman, I won't quote your long post - but yes you have summed up what I was trying to say earlier - along with a real life example of , IMO, the right sort of encouragement for children
Similar to my fictional one of how I would handle child's ' famous ballerina' dream
which also goes along the lines of Ann's incremental model - make goals in steps or increments and revise/adapt as you go.0 -
The other thing: I've been thinking about the whole "menopause and weight gain" subject that pops up in these boards all the time. It seems there's a connection between prevailing (wrong) world-wisdom: "You've reached the age of menopause, now the fat deposits will settle in your midsection." I think this can have a very real physical effect on women without them even trying to think about it too much... they accept it as a foregone conclusion, and the weight gain happens. Definite mind/body fulfillment, or something close to it.
Yes we can do self fulfilling prophesies on ourselves - the mind isnt directly affecting the weight loss, but the actions or lack of actions that come from a self belief obviously can.3 -
I know I can reduce mild pain signals in my body if I focus on it. Having sciatica, there are times I can feel it pulse down my leg, but if I concentrate on NOT feeling it, the pulses go away. I'm also good at focusing on warming up parts of my body. Many times I've felt cold, I would sit and focus on warming say my chest area and later can touch it (others have too) and it's significantly warmer after a few minutes.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness for 35+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I used to use pain transference when I was doing martial arts (as a different take on this thread) and it definitely worked. The pain signals from one area can be used to cancel out another pain, especially when you concentrate on it.
An easy example: go down into a wide and deep squat (legs 2-3 shoulder widths apart) and pretty soon your legs will burn and hurt. Then stick your arms straight out to the side and do small circles one way, then the other, then big circles. Soon your arms will burn like anything and hey presto! No leg pain! 🤣 (also a good mental technique for breaking boards).1 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »But, if I'm 40, living in my Mom's basement still.... well, maybe it's time to move on from that dream of being a famous writer.
Lol, yeah please don’t do that.
The reason some manifestations are realized is because someone not only thought about it but worked hard for it (this is the part I feel is missing from everyone’s manifesting definition). In no way does this mean mooch off your poor mother. Also, I’m not a huge fan of the word manifest but it was the topic I was responding to.
I don't think the "work hard" part is being missed. All of this needs to be be tempered by certain realities, the mind and hard work can't overcome everything...IMO, it's fairly limited. Manifestation and hard work aren't going to make someone an elite pro athlete (as an example) without inate athletic ability among other things that is far and away above their peers. One cannot manifest becoming an astronaut and realize that simply by hard work. They would need an inate intellectual aptitude as well as inate physical characteristics. Not everyone can do anything they put their minds to because certain people have inate abilities and/or characteristics that go well beyond anything working hard can achieve.
For as long as I can remember, both of my boys have wanted to be soccer stars and play Premiere League or play for Team USA in the World Cup. I never told them that they couldn't, nor did I ever tell them that if they work hard enough they could. We simply enrolled them in soccer and they've been playing since age 3 (youngest) and 5 (oldest). When they became old enough they wanted to try out for competitive club and that was there first real look at actual competition to make a team and their first realization that there were boys there same age who were incredibly athletically gifted, well beyond just putting in the work.
They're 11 and 13 now. They are both really good athletes but not great athletes and both have realized that they don't have the inate athleticism of an elite, professional athlete. They still play club and both boys also play for their school and have adopted more reasonable and attainable goals where soccer is concerned. My oldest is in 8th grade and his goal for this season was to make the high school varsity team...he didn't do that (was pretty improbable for 8th grade), but he did make the high school JV team rather than returning to the middle school team. My youngest plays for the middle school team and they both talk about how in a few years they will be re-united on the varsity team and how they will dominate together (not completely unreasonable given their skill and their division). It wouldn't even be terribly shocking to me if they played at the collegiate level, but they both realize playing English Premiere or playing in the World Cup isn't realistic and is on an entirely different level and have since shifted their thoughts on what they want to do when they are grown. Oldest is interested in sports medicine and being an athletic trainer for MLS soccer or some other sport and the youngest is interested in aeronautical engineering (like his granddad)...both of which they have an inate aptitude for.
I never said Manifestation and hard work are going to make someone an elite pro athlete. I don’t believe this and never said it. Who am I to say what anyone is or isn’t capable of? I’m not qualified, that’s for sure. And honestly, most of us aren’t, so it’s important to remember that.
My first post was explaining what people’s perspective of Manifesting is, which is “believe it and it will come true”. And I said the reason why “some” of those perceived manifestations “worked” (and why people think manifestation is real) was because they not only believed in themselves but worked their *kitten* off to make it happen. Then I used Jim Carrey as an example of those that claim manifesting works, meanwhile having an insane work ethic. Which, if you think about it, is pretty misleading.
That being said I enjoyed your back story which I find incredibly interesting. You sound like a great dad and I certainly wish you all the best. Makes me kind of want to do everything all over again. Not because I regret where I am, but because the journey can be so amazing.
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@collinsje1
Great topic, and though most of it has been covered fairly well by others I'm going to add something that I haven't noticed much.
Firstly, I want to acknowledge the many view of how much (or how little) the mental game and manifestation/will can do. In some instances quite a lot, in other instances, very little. Even with the most positive mindset in the world most can't alter certain medical conditions, at best they might make coping with it better. And even with a crap mindset, we can all overcome some simple hurdles that we might have thought would be tougher.
What I haven't seen mentioned much shocks me, and might be the cause of some of the disagreements or semantics arguments people seem to be having. And that is that our individual mindsets can alter all of these things. It's not just a "one size fits all" thing. This doesn't mean that one person is wrong. Deep down inside we are all wired differently, and that impacts what has positive or negative impacts on us.
I will say, without doubt, that for me personally I've never accomplished many things I didn't have confidence that I could do. Those things that I did accomplish with that mindset were either easier than I thought, or I just didn't motivate myself to really want to accomplish. On the flip side, the hardest things I've accomplished in my life were goals that I internalized and was sure I could accomplish, even if there were some bumps along the way.
I've also found that sometimes mental roadblocks can be eliminated by others. Though I'm usually pretty self motivated and people telling me I can't will just motivate me more, there are times I've simply taken an approach with expectations too high, or expected goals to always come with hard work applied. But there is a point where sometimes we don't see the forest through the trees, and just the right motivation or confidence from others, or a nudge in the right direction, clears your view and you can progress again. So for me, I've found that the general rule of surrounding yourself with the right group of people doesn't always help, but if you find that person that gives you just the right guidance it can be huge.
But the right person that helps me get through something might not be the same person that can do it for you. It's just like a diet or anything else, we have to understand that humans are complex creatures and we all thrive on different things at times.
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The danger of posting here.. is how the innocent intent of a thought is disected to death .. and the poster is nailed to a cross. Sorry.. i said "nailed to a cross". .it most likely offends someone who thinks i'm either denouncing religion or promoting it. Just using it as a casual saying..
However. ... attitude is everyting.. and i think manifesting a goal and adding behviors and actions to make it happen.. is the secret.. at least for me.4 -
To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.0 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?0 -
I can speak to the power of the mind from my perspective of being in a psychotic state. If I touched the color pink, say on a printed rose on a bed sheet, it would actually burn my skin. No blisters were raised but the sensation was exactly the same as if I had touched a hot stove. Additionally one of the voices in my head that put me on a diet actually made the cashews I was eating taste moldy so I couldn’t eat them. All due to a chemical unbalance in my brain. Fascinating.9
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elisa123gal wrote: »The danger of posting here.. is how the innocent intent of a thought is disected to death .. and the poster is nailed to a cross. Sorry.. i said "nailed to a cross". .it most likely offends someone who thinks i'm either denouncing religion or promoting it. Just using it as a casual saying..
However. ... attitude is everyting.. and i think manifesting a goal and adding behviors and actions to make it happen.. is the secret.. at least for me.
The original poster actually asked for all opinions. He didn't just want to be agreed with, he genuinely wanted to hear what everyone thought. Frankly, I applaud him. Differences of opinion are healthy and necessary. We would be better off if more people here understood that, and didn't choose to feel attacked every time someone doesn't agree with them. We all have our own thoughts, and that's ok.6 -
sollyn23l2 wrote: »elisa123gal wrote: »The danger of posting here.. is how the innocent intent of a thought is disected to death .. and the poster is nailed to a cross. Sorry.. i said "nailed to a cross". .it most likely offends someone who thinks i'm either denouncing religion or promoting it. Just using it as a casual saying..
However. ... attitude is everyting.. and i think manifesting a goal and adding behviors and actions to make it happen.. is the secret.. at least for me.
The original poster actually asked for all opinions. He didn't just want to be agreed with, he genuinely wanted to hear what everyone thought. Frankly, I applaud him. Differences of opinion are healthy and necessary. We would be better off if more people here understood that, and didn't choose to feel attacked every time someone doesn't agree with them. We all have our own thoughts, and that's ok.
The world would be a pretty boring place if we all agreed on everything and didn't have our own opinions on things. Plus, I personally feel that looking at things from other people's point of view is how we grow socially.2 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?
Because it was the obverse or some other high-falutin' logical term of what you enumerated.0 -
I believe that the mind is very powerful. It can help you manifest things you want to happen. We f you believe that you will get something done with your body and go out believing that then it will transpire. It might take awhile but it does. Problem is many of us are impatient and begin to believe that it’s not worth it to put in the work, also if you are in a toxic work environment, that can affect you mentally and this cause it to manifest ph Socially. I have been a victim for f this one. I have had to up the dosage of my anxiety med and I have not been able to not be sick or injured myself sr of this past year. Just got over an issue with 👋 bursitis and I get sick and now dealing with pain in my left side. It seems never ending at times but we jhave at have to keep believers no 👎 t is all worth it and try to ignore the toxicity of our environments ronmwnt ancle concentrate on the good:0
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?
Because it was the obverse or some other high-falutin' logical term of what you enumerated.
My post was specifically about the importance of adding action to the idea of manifesting. Those 2 things together I think are important. Your response didn’t include someone combining manifesting (belief) with action (work).
Unfortunately I was never able to discuss that with the OP which would have been nice. I see so much positivity, optimism, and progressive thinking in his train of thought. It would have been really interesting to dive deeper into the philosophy of manifesting, action, and from some later responses, training the body and mind. I’m hoping to hear more about that from others. If you’re not talking about that, then we aren’t talking about the same thing.2 -
I believe that the mind is very powerful. It can help you manifest things you want to happen. We f you believe that you will get something done with your body and go out believing that then it will transpire. It might take awhile but it does. Problem is many of us are impatient and begin to believe that it’s not worth it to put in the work, :
Sure, impatience may sometimes be the problem - but, no, believing and that being able to make things that you want to happen transpire is not always possible, no matter how much work you put into it.
The thing has to be realistically obtainable too,. The point several of us made upthread.
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?
Because it was the obverse or some other high-falutin' logical term of what you enumerated.
My post was specifically about the importance of adding action to the idea of manifesting. Those 2 things together I think are important. Your response didn’t include someone combining manifesting (belief) with action (work).
Unfortunately I was never able to discuss that with the OP which would have been nice. I see so much positivity, optimism, and progressive thinking in his train of thought. It would have been really interesting to dive deeper into the philosophy of manifesting, action, and from some later responses, training the body and mind. I’m hoping to hear more about that from others. If you’re not talking about that, then we aren’t talking about the same thing.
From the OP:I want to know how other people feel or think about this.
I wrote about what I felt and thought about this issue.3 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?
Because it was the obverse or some other high-falutin' logical term of what you enumerated.
My post was specifically about the importance of adding action to the idea of manifesting. Those 2 things together I think are important. Your response didn’t include someone combining manifesting (belief) with action (work).
Unfortunately I was never able to discuss that with the OP which would have been nice. I see so much positivity, optimism, and progressive thinking in his train of thought. It would have been really interesting to dive deeper into the philosophy of manifesting, action, and from some later responses, training the body and mind. I’m hoping to hear more about that from others. If you’re not talking about that, then we aren’t talking about the same thing.
@ddsb1111 I will post back here later today and we can talk more about this. Because I think you and I are on the same page on this.....I think.
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I tend to lean towards what @ddsb1111 is saying in that I think Manifesting something into existence involves two components.......1. Having the thought/dream/wish......and then 2. Putting a plan/steps into action to attain said dream. A previous poster had also said something about setting small achievable goals and meeting those. I think the two kinds of go hand in hand as you can set small goals on the way to that big dream.
Example......its suggested here a lot when it comes to weight loss. As to not necessarily look at the whole amount you have to lose but break it up and take it 5/10 pounds at a time as to not overwhelm yourself or get discouraged.
I think that everybody can agree that you cant just sit on the couch and wish/hope for something and expect it to happen (it would be nice though). And that if you want something you have to be willing to put in the work/sacrifice to get it.
Also side note here.......I do think that some people are just wired in a way that they are predisposed to look at the world/life as the glass half empty or through pessimistic eyes. But I truly do believe that we can change that about ourselves my making the time to choose to try and look at things from a more positive point of view.
Now with that said, I know that not all things are positive no matter how you look at them. But I would say that 90% of the time you could find something in your day to be happy/positive about no matter how small.
I have recently started to make a habit of every day on my walk home from the gym to stop and think, really think about my day and find that one thing that went right, or that one thing that was good. Example....yesterday was a crappy day at work, and I got a flat tire on my way home from work. But last night on my walk home from the gym I really thought about my day, and one of the positive things was my youngest (2 year old) son just wanted to sit on my lap and snuggle with me after dinner. So that thought alone put me in a better mood. And because of it I didn't dwell on the fact that I need new tires on my truck, or that work was probably going to suck today as well. And that helped me go to bed in a better place mentally and wake up in that place this morning.2 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »To be clear, the part I'm disputing is the implication that if something doesn't think they can get better, they won't get help. IME, often, despite despair, they will get help, follow a course of treatment . . . and some do get better.
I didn’t say if they don’t think they will get better then they won’t get help, so let me clarify.
There’s people that don’t think they’ll get better and do get help. And there’s also people that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help. I’m speaking to the latter.
For those that don’t think they’ll get better and don’t get help, likely won’t get better unfortunately. That’s why it’s worth trying. That’s the ENTIRE point of everything I’m saying. Whether you believe it or not, it’s worth trying.
And there are people who think that they will get better and that thinking that will make it happen so they don't get help.
Yep. But why is this directed at me?
Because it was the obverse or some other high-falutin' logical term of what you enumerated.
My post was specifically about the importance of adding action to the idea of manifesting. Those 2 things together I think are important. Your response didn’t include someone combining manifesting (belief) with action (work).
Unfortunately I was never able to discuss that with the OP which would have been nice. I see so much positivity, optimism, and progressive thinking in his train of thought. It would have been really interesting to dive deeper into the philosophy of manifesting, action, and from some later responses, training the body and mind. I’m hoping to hear more about that from others. If you’re not talking about that, then we aren’t talking about the same thing.
From the OP:I want to know how other people feel or think about this.
I wrote about what I felt and thought about this issue.
Thanks for clarifying. I would reply to the OP then to avoid confusion. What you were saying had nothing to do with what I was saying.0 -
collinsje1 wrote: »I tend to lean towards what @ddsb1111 is saying in that I think Manifesting something into existence involves two components.......1. Having the thought/dream/wish......and then 2. Putting a plan/steps into action to attain said dream. A previous poster had also said something about setting small achievable goals and meeting those. I think the two kinds of go hand in hand as you can set small goals on the way to that big dream.
Example......its suggested here a lot when it comes to weight loss. As to not necessarily look at the whole amount you have to lose but break it up and take it 5/10 pounds at a time as to not overwhelm yourself or get discouraged.
I think that everybody can agree that you cant just sit on the couch and wish/hope for something and expect it to happen (it would be nice though). And that if you want something you have to be willing to put in the work/sacrifice to get it.
Also side note here.......I do think that some people are just wired in a way that they are predisposed to look at the world/life as the glass half empty or through pessimistic eyes. But I truly do believe that we can change that about ourselves my making the time to choose to try and look at things from a more positive point of view.
Now with that said, I know that not all things are positive no matter how you look at them. But I would say that 90% of the time you could find something in your day to be happy/positive about no matter how small.
I have recently started to make a habit of every day on my walk home from the gym to stop and think, really think about my day and find that one thing that went right, or that one thing that was good. Example....yesterday was a crappy day at work, and I got a flat tire on my way home from work. But last night on my walk home from the gym I really thought about my day, and one of the positive things was my youngest (2 year old) son just wanted to sit on my lap and snuggle with me after dinner. So that thought alone put me in a better mood. And because of it I didn't dwell on the fact that I need new tires on my truck, or that work was probably going to suck today as well. And that helped me go to bed in a better place mentally and wake up in that place this morning.
Agreed on all accounts. Not to say that there’s only 2 components, but it’s a good start. And also not to say that 100% of the time if you do these 2 things it will work. In fact, I said “when it does work” it’s likely that the intentional thinking and action contributed to it working. Do people do things even if they think it won’t work? Yes. Do people that manifest things always make their dreams come true? No, especially if there’s no action behind it.
I really enjoy this topic because it has a direct correlation to my life and it can change the feelings of despair and helplessness into something empowering. Like, “I can change my controllable circumstances, this isn’t the only option”. I know good and even great things can be accomplished when the mental and physical components line up. Nothing is guaranteed so we look for improvement not perfection. ETA: not to be confused with toxic positivity. This isn’t what I’m saying.
We have a similar attitude and disposition. I don’t see myself as someone who necessarily manifests my life, but I do a lot of positive self talk and make plans on how I want to move forward when I’m met with obstacles, which can be considered the same thing. Other people find different ways that work for them in their lives, and that’s great. There is no one size fits all. But on this topic, I’m speaking directly about those who are using manifesting to change their life and how I believe action is a big piece of that. Thanks for seeing me.
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