Are children a right?

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  • Hellbent_Heidi
    Hellbent_Heidi Posts: 3,669 Member
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    Sure, you all have the RIGHT to have children, that's what's beautiful about America...we have the right to do pretty much anything we want (within legal limits). However, with that comes the RESPONSIBILITY to take care of the children you create. Just because you want them, or are too lazy to prevent unplanned pregnancy, doesn't mean the government should be obligated to take care of them....plain & simple. I don't have (and don't want) kids, so I've been on b/c for a long, long time, and when used properly, its pretty dang effective. I've always been responsible about using it, and have never had a scare...not once.
  • dragonbait0126
    dragonbait0126 Posts: 568 Member
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    Some poor people are really excellent parents even though they have to be on welfare, and some really rich people are crappy parents and I don't think THEY should be having children.

    +1


    If only perfect people were allowed to procreate, none of us would be here.

    ^^^^THIS. Aside from the fact that unless you are super wealthy you're never really financially prepared to have kids. Yes, they can be supported until 18 without using benefits but there's so much more financially to having children than being able to provide food, clothes, and shelter. I want kids. My husband and I decided that we would wait until we were stable. That does NOT mean that we will be fully financially able. It also does NOT mean that I'm going to apply for or receive benefits. It does mean that we will be in a better situation (i.e. I was not going to have a kid while my husband was unemployed) and that we will do everything in our power to provide for our kids and provide them with a warm and loving home. I can say this...my parents were never financially ready to have kids but if they had waited until they were then I wouldn't be here, neither would my brother, and I'm willing to bet many of you or someone you know. My parents did provide us with food, shelter, and clothing in a loving home. Yes, my mom was on WIC with both my brother and I and no my parents didn't help with our college bills or my wedding but I'm grateful my parents had kids even on their lower income because it meant I got a chance at life.
  • killerqueen17
    killerqueen17 Posts: 536 Member
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    My parents did provide us with food, shelter, and clothing in a loving home. Yes, my mom was on WIC with both my brother and I and no my parents didn't help with our college bills or my wedding but I'm grateful my parents had kids even on their lower income because it meant I got a chance at life.

    Good point. Thanks for sharing this perspective. :)
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
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    No. Children are not a right.
  • mommared53
    mommared53 Posts: 9,543 Member
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    Sure, you all have the RIGHT to have children, that's what's beautiful about America...we have the right to do pretty much anything we want (within legal limits). However, with that comes the RESPONSIBILITY to take care of the children you create. Just because you want them, or are too lazy to prevent unplanned pregnancy, doesn't mean the government should be obligated to take care of them....plain & simple. I don't have (and don't want) kids, so I've been on b/c for a long, long time, and when used properly, its pretty dang effective. I've always been responsible about using it, and have never had a scare...not once.

    Not everybody who gets pregnant unexpectedly does so because they're too lazy to prevent it. I was very conscientious about using birth control when I got pregnant with my daughter. I'll admit not so much with my son but in both cases I accepted responsibility for my actions and raised my kids to the best of my ability. Congratulations to you for not getting pregnant. I hope for your sake it doesn't happen since you don't want kids. I'm sorry to anyone who in the past had to support my kids with their tax dollars. Unfortunately there are lots of things my tax dollars get used for that I don't like but I have no choice about. If I did have a choice I'd rather my tax dollars go to support children on assistance and not to some other things.
  • Hellbent_Heidi
    Hellbent_Heidi Posts: 3,669 Member
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    Sure, you all have the RIGHT to have children, that's what's beautiful about America...we have the right to do pretty much anything we want (within legal limits). However, with that comes the RESPONSIBILITY to take care of the children you create. Just because you want them, or are too lazy to prevent unplanned pregnancy, doesn't mean the government should be obligated to take care of them....plain & simple. I don't have (and don't want) kids, so I've been on b/c for a long, long time, and when used properly, its pretty dang effective. I've always been responsible about using it, and have never had a scare...not once.

    Not everybody who gets pregnant unexpectedly does so because they're too lazy to prevent it. I was very conscientious about using birth control when I got pregnant with my daughter. I'll admit not so much with my son but in both cases I accepted responsibility for my actions and raised my kids to the best of my ability. Congratulations to you for not getting pregnant. I hope for your sake it doesn't happen since you don't want kids. I'm sorry to anyone who in the past had to support my kids with their tax dollars. Unfortunately there are lots of things my tax dollars get used for that I don't like but I have to choice about. If I did have a choice I'd rather my tax dollars go to support children on assistance.

    OK, sorry if you took this personally. I never said ALL people with kids on welfare were 'too lazy" (but you can't deny that a lot of people are careless and have kids without considering the cost to raise and support them). The point I'm trying to make is that people should be responsible for their own actions and lifestyle choices, and having children is a lifestyle choice.
  • meggers123
    meggers123 Posts: 711 Member
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    My 2 cents?

    I think having children is a privilege. If it was a right, everyone would be able to, right? Yet many couples continue to struggle to have a family (PCOS, infertility, homosexual couples, etc).

    People shouldn't take it for granted.
  • laurad1406
    laurad1406 Posts: 341
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    YES. This is my point. I'm in the same situation as you, and it SUCKS. Honestly, I wish I could "afford" kids. I wish my husband hadn't gotten laid off, and I wish his Bachelor's degree was worth the tuition he paid for it... but for the time being, we're broke.

    And as a side note, just to put my business out there even more, I'm on BC-- but if that were to fail, I'd have my kid and apply for WIC to hold us over until he could get a job again... All a person can do is try their best to get by. The situation may not be ideal, but it is what it is.

    I'm sorry for your circumstances, unfortunately a lot of people are going through this :frown:

    but the OP said NOT in cases such as yours....the example was people who have more kids to receive or stay on assistance, which is a huge difference from the situation you are in. I don't mean this negatively, but there is a difference between keeping a child if an accident were to happen while taking BC, and NOT taking BC at all and "hoping for the best" when you already can't support the children you do have.

    My parents would have loved to have more children, but after I was born my dad lost his job (my mom wasn't working, she was a SAHM for both me and my brother), so they decided they just couldn't have anymore. As much as I'd love a little sister, I think that was the right decision, times were already tough enough as it is.
  • ItsCasey
    ItsCasey Posts: 4,022 Member
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    Okay, here's food for thought-- what about generational poverty/cyclical poverty?
    The cycle of poverty has been defined as a phenomenon where poor families become trapped in poverty for at least three generations. These families have either limited or no resources. There are many disadvantages that collectively work in a circular process making it virtually impossible for individuals to break the cycle. Examples of these disadvantages working in a circular process would be: economic decline, low personal income, no funds for school, which leads to lack of education. The lack of education results in unemployment and lastly low national productivity.
    -‘‘Social Inequality: Patterns and Processes.’’ McGraw Hill publishing. 4th edition

    So, yes, we have established that some people make no efforts to get out of poverty and off govt assistance-- but I'm not talking about these people right now. But, sometimes there are a lot of factors making this process VERY difficult.. For someone who is TRYING to make it, someone who does not want to have to rely on assistance, and yet it still is not working out--- what do you think about a person like this having kids?

    No attacks please... but rationally, what do you think? I'm curious. :)

    If you have to go on public assistance, I think any attempt to get pregnant should cease immediately. The money you are receiving is not yours. It was earned by other people through hard work and time away from their families and their friends and their homes and their hobbies. To take the position that it's okay for you to grab even MORE of their money because you want another kid is incredibly selfish. How much you hate being on said assistance really doesn't factor into the discussion. If you hated it that badly, you wouldn't be making your financial position WORSE OFF by having another kid.
  • cartern1
    cartern1 Posts: 270 Member
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    My 2 cents?

    I think having children is a priveledge. If it was a right, everyone would be able to, right? Yet many couples continue to struggle to have a family (PCOS, infertility, homosexual couples, etc).

    People shouldn't take it for granted.

    I agree, they're a privilege.

    except i'm sotired i read that as homosexual cripples....

    but in any case, who are we to decide? why should we/government/society try and play god?
    Eugenics is scary
  • ItsCasey
    ItsCasey Posts: 4,022 Member
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    I doubt I would ever need government assistance if I lost my job because I have savings (specifically for the unlikely event that I lose my job). I also have family and friends who would help me out. That's the way it used to be in this country. Reaching into the pockets of taxpayers was the last resort, not the first one.

    That is exactly how I was brought up.

    I agree. But I find that friends and family, community, and the general population are less likely to help someone in need nowadays. We are too focused on ourselves, besides "it's not our problem".

    People are less likely to help now because more and more of their money is being forcibly taken from them and given to people who don't deserve it. If I didn't have to give so much of my salary to the government, I'd give a lot more to my church and to charities so they could help people who are truly in need. I'd put more into savings so that if a friend or relative was down on their luck, I'd be able to help out. But when I'm already having 30% of my income taken from me before I even get my hands on it, you're damn right I'm less likely to help out anyone other than immediate family and very close friends with the 70% I do get to keep.
  • nosugarcoating
    nosugarcoating Posts: 194 Member
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    Having children is a right (as in, no one should be allowed to decide you have to get sterilized - anything else would lead us down a very, very dangerous path). I know that not everyone actually can have children (for biological reasons) - as a woman with PCOS I am very aware of that (and hope to God it won't be me). However, I do not think that keeping them is a right, that is a privilege - if you can't look after your kids/care for them properly, the government should (and does) have the right to take them away.
  • killerqueen17
    killerqueen17 Posts: 536 Member
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    Okay, here's food for thought-- what about generational poverty/cyclical poverty?
    The cycle of poverty has been defined as a phenomenon where poor families become trapped in poverty for at least three generations. These families have either limited or no resources. There are many disadvantages that collectively work in a circular process making it virtually impossible for individuals to break the cycle. Examples of these disadvantages working in a circular process would be: economic decline, low personal income, no funds for school, which leads to lack of education. The lack of education results in unemployment and lastly low national productivity.
    -‘‘Social Inequality: Patterns and Processes.’’ McGraw Hill publishing. 4th edition

    So, yes, we have established that some people make no efforts to get out of poverty and off govt assistance-- but I'm not talking about these people right now. But, sometimes there are a lot of factors making this process VERY difficult.. For someone who is TRYING to make it, someone who does not want to have to rely on assistance, and yet it still is not working out--- what do you think about a person like this having kids?

    No attacks please... but rationally, what do you think? I'm curious. :)

    If you have to go on public assistance, I think any attempt to get pregnant should cease immediately. The money you are receiving is not yours. It was earned by other people through hard work and time away from their families and their friends and their homes and their hobbies. To take the position that it's okay for you to grab even MORE of their money because you want another kid is incredibly selfish. How much you hate being on said assistance really doesn't factor into the discussion. If you hated it that badly, you wouldn't be making your financial position WORSE OFF by having another kid.

    Okay, good points. What about *a* kid? Should a person on welfare have a single child... ever?

    My opinion is yes. Personally, having previously lived in the "ghetto" and seeing first-hand what a difficult environment it is to leave (even for hard-working people), I may have different views than many others on here, though. It is certainly possible to overcome negative influences in these situations, and to "get out" and live a "successful" life, but it is also possible to have your best efforts thwarted by tragic and unfortunate circumstances.

    My thoughts are probably too complicated to get into on here, because it's something I've thought about a LOT. Maybe I shouldn't even be bringing it up because it's difficult to explain in short posts and quips on a message board. But generational poverty is a real phenomenon, and it is very stifling. However, if one is born into poverty, one should be able to have a child without fear of condemnation. ...In my opinion. *ducks*
  • angryguy77
    angryguy77 Posts: 836 Member
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    Having kids is a right, but it's also the right and duty of society to say we are not going allow anyone to use them as a way to suck money out of the state.

    But not enough people pay attention to this kind of issue. Too many people vote their heart instead of their brain.
  • njean888
    njean888 Posts: 399 Member
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    Wow what a loaded question. I have 2 children which I provide for and save college tuition for, invest in savings accounts for, and pay hefty insurance policys for my spouse and myself so if anything happen to us they would be provided for. I provide for my children 100%, now with that said I would love a third bt will not have one because I cannot provide for 3 the way I have provided for two.
  • MFPAddict
    MFPAddict Posts: 2,303 Member
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    Wow what a loaded question. I have 2 children which I provide for and save college tuition for, invest in savings accounts for, and pay hefty insurance policys for my spouse and myself so if anything happen to us they would be provided for. I provide for my children 100%, now with that said I would love a third bt will not have one because I cannot provide for 3 the way I have provided for two.

    Well said and HOT! :tongue:
  • dragonbait0126
    dragonbait0126 Posts: 568 Member
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    Having children is a right (as in, no one should be allowed to decide you have to get sterilized - anything else would lead us down a very, very dangerous path). I know that not everyone actually can have children (for biological reasons) - as a woman with PCOS I am very aware of that (and hope to God it won't be me). However, I do not think that keeping them is a right, that is a privilege - if you can't look after your kids/care for them properly, the government should (and does) have the right to take them away.

    Well said!!! Keeping your children is the privilege! :flowerforyou:
  • MrsFarrow
    MrsFarrow Posts: 326 Member
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    I think this probably has been said before, but I haven't read every response to be honest.

    Children are a privilege, not a right. End of story.
  • fithealthygirl
    fithealthygirl Posts: 290 Member
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    Having children is a priviledge, not a right.
  • JellyJaks
    JellyJaks Posts: 589 Member
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    I believe that having children is a gift from (insert deity here) We want more children but currently we're in low income housing and trying to get out of debt so there's no way we are purposely having any more. I'm the poster woman for contraception fail (See daughter who is a condom baby and Son #1 who is a pill baby) so we're taking extra precautions because it's already hard enough to make ends meet and I don't want to take more away from the children that I have already been blessed with.

    I try not to judge other people but sometimes it's really hard to listen to them complain about how they don't have much because of their children. The woman that lives next door was screaming at her 4 year old about ruining her life and I was like "she didn't ask you to lay down with her daddy and bring her into the world. That was all you!"

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