Anyone use a TENS machine?
For context, nearly 50, train 4x a week for 2.5hrs (Olympic weightlifting), hypermobile, and incredibly static during the day. Pain is starting to annoy me!
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I have a TENS and EMS device: I use the TENS functionality for period pains and for that I would recommend it - when the cramps are really bad, it doesn't always eliminate the pain, but it certainly does help. No experience with it for joint/muscle pain though.
The device you're thinking of buying is expensive? Mine was a cheaper one from Amazon (50 euros) - I'm not sure the expensive ones are necessarily better.0 -
The one I’m looking at is in the sale! 😀 purely considering that brand on recommendation from someone, but I can see Amazon have tonnes. Interesting that it helps with period pains - hadn’t considered that.I have a TENS and EMS device: I use the TENS functionality for period pains and for that I would recommend it - when the cramps are really bad, it doesn't always eliminate the pain, but it certainly does help. No experience with it for joint/muscle pain though.
The device you're thinking of buying is expensive? Mine was a cheaper one from Amazon (50 euros) - I'm not sure the expensive ones are necessarily better.
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Note, everyone is different. Hypermobile sea sheep here. I'm about your age. My muscles are chronically tight, and that's perfect for me. Once I start relaxing them my joint and muscle problems start. Meaning I keep stretching, massages and all the lot to an absolute minimum and focus on the smaller, deeper muscles with exercise to stabilize my body, not put the priority on the big muscle groups because it's easier to create imbalances.0
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I used one briefly when I was powerlifting. It seemed effective the few times I used it. I’m just weird about electricity and would get more stressed dealing with electrodes and stuff than the benefit I received. Pity you aren’t closer, I just cleared out a drawer and the TENS is now in my donation bin!1
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Ohhh I hadn’t thought of that. Drat it. I’m struggling with bad knee pain at the moment and it’s due to my quads. I also end up being really stiff - yet still flexible - which is really irritating. I’ve only realised recently I’m hypermobile so I hadn’t thought about what would happen if I actually relax my muscles!Note, everyone is different. Hypermobile sea sheep here. I'm about your age. My muscles are chronically tight, and that's perfect for me. Once I start relaxing them my joint and muscle problems start. Meaning I keep stretching, massages and all the lot to an absolute minimum and focus on the smaller, deeper muscles with exercise to stabilize my body, not put the priority on the big muscle groups because it's easier to create imbalances.
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claireychn074 wrote: »
Ohhh I hadn’t thought of that. Drat it. I’m struggling with bad knee pain at the moment and it’s due to my quads. I also end up being really stiff - yet still flexible - which is really irritating. I’ve only realised recently I’m hypermobile so I hadn’t thought about what would happen if I actually relax my muscles!Note, everyone is different. Hypermobile sea sheep here. I'm about your age. My muscles are chronically tight, and that's perfect for me. Once I start relaxing them my joint and muscle problems start. Meaning I keep stretching, massages and all the lot to an absolute minimum and focus on the smaller, deeper muscles with exercise to stabilize my body, not put the priority on the big muscle groups because it's easier to create imbalances.
Hey, try it. Maybe it works for you. I just shared my perspective, which might not be typical. Maybe get a cheap one, or see if you can rent a TENS machine somewhere for a few weeks.0 -
I use a TENS. I have one knee that acts up now and then and it works like a charm, 10 minutes and it feels brand new. But everyone is different in every pain is different. I got mine cheap on Amazon.1
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In this particular case, I would say it depends a great deal on what is causing the primary issue. If it is fact joint pain probably less likely to help in my opinion. If the problem is primarily with the muscles surrounding the joint it may help, and may help quite a lot.
@yirara brings up a great point in regard to strengthening supporting muscles and not being too limber or relaxed when hypermobile, so that might apply well here. But with @claireychn074 being a well versed lifter, chances are the muscles are there for support already.
I have a severely herniated disc in my lower back, and in my case a TENS helps greatly if I overdo it and get my back too tight. I am far from hypermobile and have never had great flexibility, so for me the magic combo is to stay loose enough to allow some flexibility yet work my back enough to allow more support for the essentially gone disc. If I reach a point where I'm getting muscle spasms of any sort, I find that the TENS helps me work my way out of it.
I have one of the lower cost ones, and even it has more than enough range and settings to suit what you might find works for you. There is very little money to lose in trying one.
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Uh yeah, I definitely don’t need to worry about building up my quads or hammies! There’s always room to improve but those are pretty stacked already! 🤣robertw486 wrote: »In this particular case, I would say it depends a great deal on what is causing the primary issue. If it is fact joint pain probably less likely to help in my opinion. If the problem is primarily with the muscles surrounding the joint it may help, and may help quite a lot.
@yirara brings up a great point in regard to strengthening supporting muscles and not being too limber or relaxed when hypermobile, so that might apply well here. But with @claireychn074 being a well versed lifter, chances are the muscles are there for support already.
I have a severely herniated disc in my lower back, and in my case a TENS helps greatly if I overdo it and get my back too tight. I am far from hypermobile and have never had great flexibility, so for me the magic combo is to stay loose enough to allow some flexibility yet work my back enough to allow more support for the essentially gone disc. If I reach a point where I'm getting muscle spasms of any sort, I find that the TENS helps me work my way out of it.
I have one of the lower cost ones, and even it has more than enough range and settings to suit what you might find works for you. There is very little money to lose in trying one.
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For anyone interested / also considering one - I’ve borrowed an EMS from a department at work. It’s a medical device often used to support patients following leg surgery so it has tonnes of options. Using it for a month on an agreed setting to see if it has any impact. It’s free (unless I want one) and will be v interesting to see what benefit, if any, it gives to recovery after training.1
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TENS and EMS aren't precisely the same thing: TENS works on the nerves and EMS contracts the muscles.
https://dunwoodychiropracticcenter.com/blog/526171-tens-vs-ems-whats-the-difference-and-how-can-they-help-me-manage-my-pain
My device has both options, but I've only ever used the TENS function (since I use it for period pain).
I thought it might be good to point out that they are different things, I'm not sure every one knows
You're interested in EMS rather than TENS?0 -
Valid points, thanks for picking it up! 😀.TENS and EMS aren't precisely the same thing: TENS works on the nerves and EMS contracts the muscles.
https://dunwoodychiropracticcenter.com/blog/526171-tens-vs-ems-whats-the-difference-and-how-can-they-help-me-manage-my-pain
My device has both options, but I've only ever used the TENS function (since I use it for period pain).
I thought it might be good to point out that they are different things, I'm not sure every one knows
You're interested in EMS rather than TENS?
I was originally looking at TENS for pain relief and many of the gizmos on Amazon have both TENS and EMS. I reached out to a physio I know at work to ask if he had any advice / knew of any papers about using TENS for pain relief - particularly in those who are hypermobile. He suggested EMS might be better as the increased blood flow generated would help doms, but not reduce hypertrophy. Apparently there is some early evidence that TENS can worsen hypermobility pain as it reduces the inflammatory response.
So, given that the work EMS device was offered free for a month I thought I’d give it a go and see what happens. If it doesn’t work, then they can show me how to change the frequencies and move to TENS cautiously to see what that does.
At the end of the day, I’m a middle aged woman in a sedentary job, who then does a fairly challenging sport. So it’s not really surprising that I have aches and pains!
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I have one and use it occasionally on my elbows. I have both tennis and golfer's elbow.
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I used to use a TENS machine for pain in my shoulder after I tore my rotator cuff. It helped quite a bit. I got turned onto it by my physical therapist, who used to use it during our sessions.0
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I have one, I've used it some. It seems to help a bit. I've always thought it could be a placebo effect but that doesn't really matter to me.
Personally, I wouldn't buy a medical device on Amazon, but I would bet it's fine to the vast majority of the time.0 -
I used a tens machine in labour. It was useless! On the other hand my daughter has one for period pain and she thinks it helps a bit0
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Update for those interested: used the EMS twice for 20 mins on the peroneal high up near knee (directed by the physio), straight after two heavy lifting sessions. It may be a placebo but the knee pain was greatly eased the next day and my legs didn’t feel as tired. I can’t believe it would work that quickly but I’m taking the placebo effect if that is what it is!2
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So what happened after this? @claireychn074
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Ahah! As long as I use it on my quads after heavy lifting (so 3-4x a week) I have no knee pain or lower leg swelling 🤗 massive difference, and I wish I’d got this years ago. I can drive for hours without my knees seizing up and I don’t have to wear compression socks every day now. Can’t recommend it enough.
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I just got a tens/ems machine. I don't know what I'm doing. I used the ems on my tummy. I've had pain since surgery nearly 3 years ago. I've only used it twice. The pain is gone. I've eaten everything in sight since the first time. I ate about 1000 calories over tdee the first day. All healthy food, no junk. Just hungry. And food tastes better.
I just wondered what to expect long term. Thanks for the answer. I'll keep using it. Maybe start with twice a week. And I'll try to get better control of the appetite. But I suspect that will get better. It was just such a shock to my body to eat without nausea and to actually feel better after eating. I'll probably get used to that quickly, since it was the norm until the surgery.
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I got mine from someone I used to work with (a prof in medical tech). He developed it and advised me on what settings to use. So the frequencies and pulse rate do slightly different things, but they ultimately increase blood flow and improve muscle texture (through contractions). The EMS setting mostly works on veinous return and the TENS on pain signals. I don’t get any side effects (not the most comfortable sensation but it’s better than pain), it’s better than ibuprofen to reduce swelling as it doesn’t have the risks of NSAIDs, and it has good solid medical evidence behind it. (The setting I use on my legs was shown to increase veinous blood flow from the ankle to the groin by 400% in people with compromised veins.) it’s now recommended in the UK following knee surgery in addition to movement and mobility. The one I have isn’t the cheapest, but then sports massages aren’t either!
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Wow! That all sounds great! I had some swelling in my ankles, but didn't think about it being connected, other than I didn't move much when in pain. The swelling is down about 70-80%. So it's helping everything. I'm going to Google how to set it now.
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Does yours have frequencies and pulsing? The setting I use is 300us pulse width, 40 Hz. 0.5 second burst then 2 second rest before repeating. Ideally I need to use it for 30 mins at a time but 20 is okay.
Have a look at the manual for mine online as it explains features (which hopefully will translate to yours): Microstim2 - orthopaedic variant (from Salisbury NHS Trust) it’s been tested following hip surgery as well as knee surgery so there’s a load of pubmed data on it.
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Wow! I was fascinated by all the different uses! I can imagine it would help with cerebral palsy. Wonder if it would do anything for bell's palsy? Lou Gehrig?(als). So many thoughts. Frozen shoulder? Chronic fatigue? Help with sleep?
My tummy is calming down. I overate yesterday, but not as much.
Yes, I looked in the box again and found the booklet that explains. I've been using it at 200 pulse, 15-25 hz. It doesn't describe the timing settings, just says choose your favorite. I like the 5 & 6 settings. Don't know exactly, but 6 or 7 fast pings, pause, repeat. 30 minutes.
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Just a warning:
These TENS machines are not recommended and should not be used by people with implanted defibrillators or pacemakers. In addition, if somebody in the family has either of these devices implanted in their chest, they shouldn't be too close to the person using then TENS unit either!
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Really valid point: medical advice should also be sought before use by those who have had DVT 👍
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