Coffee as water?

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  • CanuckLove
    CanuckLove Posts: 673 Member
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    No... coffee is coffee. water is water...


    ^^^^^^^^Exactly
  • PeachyKeene
    PeachyKeene Posts: 1,645 Member
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    Not water, but is countable as daily fluid intake. Water is still the best, but not the only.

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661
  • Mindful_Trent
    Mindful_Trent Posts: 3,954 Member
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    Regarding the whole "Caffeine is a diuretic" thing - while this is true to a certain extent, it's not like one cup of coffee causes you to lose more water than what you just drank in the coffee. In reality, caffeine only has a diuretic effect if you drink more than 500-600 mg of it in a day. This is more than just a few cups of coffee. (It's about 4-7 cups, depending on the type of coffee.) Tea has even less caffeine than coffee and you'd have to drink quite a bit of tea to hit that threshhold. While I wholeheartedly agree that drinking adequate water is important (I've been known to drink 20 cups in a day), the fact is that water does *not* have to come just from plain water. You get water from almost any beverage you drink, from fruits and vegetables and foods like yogurt. Assuming you keep caffeine at reasonable levels, there's no reason to not count caffeinated beverages as water - just make sure you log the calories if they've got calories!

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661
  • ATT949
    ATT949 Posts: 1,245 Member
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    I have not been counting the coffee I drink in the morning as part of my daily intake. Should I and if so, do I count it all? I usually drink 2 cups a day. Should I count 2 cups as 2 cups of water? Thanks!
    I count my coffee as water. Tea as well.



    Though I have a variety of reasons for this, the main driver was this article (and others that I can't cite at the moment)


    http://ajpregu.physiology.org/content/283/5/R993.full


    From the Abstract:

    "Despite the seemingly ubiquitous admonition to “drink at least eight 8-oz glasses of water a day” (with an accompanying reminder that beverages containing caffeine and alcohol do not count), rigorous proof for this counsel appears to be lacking."

    and

    "This review sought to find the origin of this advice (called “8 × 8” for short) and to examine the scientific evidence, if any, that might support it. The search included not only electronic modes but also a cursory examination of the older literature that is not covered in electronic databases and, most importantly and fruitfully, extensive consultation with several nutritionists who specialize in the field of thirst and drinking fluids. No scientific studies were found in support of 8 × 8. "


    The author concludes:

    "Having found no evidence in support of 8 × 8 has placed me in the awkward position of having to prove a negative. It is conceivable that a further search will unearth work that disproves my conclusion, in support of which I have cited peer-reviewed publications. I hope, therefore, that anyone who knows of contrary scientific evidence will bring it to my attention. "



    The author is on the staff at Dartmouth and, IIRC, has written a book on "nehprology" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nephrology)

    It's a thoughtful, carefully written, dogma-free article that includes 100 footnotes as well as links to other articles.


    I don't know if he touches on the issue of caffeine being a diuretic (i haven't read the article in some time). If not, I'll share my understanding from doing some research. The amount of coffee that one ingests from coffee (a few cups a day) has a slight diuretic effect. After consuming coffee for about a week, there is no significant diuretic effect. That comports with the idea of the body working to bring about "stasis" - keeping things in balance.

    My diet is unusual - I eat a lot of salad so my body gets a lot of water there but I pretty much only drink water in the evening or when I'm thirsty.

    And do I drink "enough" water? There's no indication that I don't. I've been losing weight very quickly and regularly, and I void regularly and in sufficient volume to lose, at times, two pounds between pre- and post-voiding weigh-ins.
  • spottedlee
    spottedlee Posts: 372
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    I was curious so had to find out. I am sure other would like to know.

    BTW, I drink my coffee black, so that why I wanted to be sure.

    Lee
  • tapaul50
    tapaul50 Posts: 5 Member
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    This was something I wanted to ask.... I guess next step is google...
  • MissMaryMac33
    MissMaryMac33 Posts: 1,433 Member
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    Good lord... of course it counts as fluids for the day -- so does milk, juice, soda, crystal light. The difference is, if it has calories you have to track it there too.

    Read the link in my signature. MFP needs to change the flipping thing to say FLUIDS instead of water and this stupid argument might end someday.

    Coffee is coffee but it's also about 99.9% water --- *pulls out hair*
  • tapaul50
    tapaul50 Posts: 5 Member
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    I found this...

    http://www.livestrong.com/article/466085-can-you-substiture-green-tea-for-the-8-glasses-of-water-a-day/
  • MissMaryMac33
    MissMaryMac33 Posts: 1,433 Member
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    Definitely put it in your log, but not as water. Like the other people said, caffeine is a natural diuretic (it's actually the main ingredient in some OTC water-weight loss pills such as Diurex). Plus 8 oz. of BLACK coffee has about 2.2 calories. If you drank more than you do, this could really add up. If you put cream and/or sugar in it, you absolutely should put it in your log.
    Every little morsel counts!
    Good luck!

    -Victoria

    OMG the amount of caffeine is so minute -- this is another myth that just own't die.

    It should be in your LOG and also counts as fluids/water.
  • maidentl
    maidentl Posts: 3,203 Member
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    From the link that tapaul50 just shared:

    "Your body needs a certain amount of fluid a day to replenish water lost through normal body function. While some beverage choices are healthier than others, your body uses the fluid to meet its needs, regardless of the source. Up to 20 percent of the liquid your body uses comes from food sources, such as fruits and vegetables. However, beverages such as water, milk, coffee and tea provide the other 80 percent."
  • erintumbridge
    erintumbridge Posts: 23 Member
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    Regarding the whole "Caffeine is a diuretic" thing - while this is true to a certain extent, it's not like one cup of coffee causes you to lose more water than what you just drank in the coffee. In reality, caffeine only has a diuretic effect if you drink more than 500-600 mg of it in a day. This is more than just a few cups of coffee. (It's about 4-7 cups, depending on the type of coffee.) Tea has even less caffeine than coffee and you'd have to drink quite a bit of tea to hit that threshhold. While I wholeheartedly agree that drinking adequate water is important (I've been known to drink 20 cups in a day), the fact is that water does *not* have to come just from plain water. You get water from almost any beverage you drink, from fruits and vegetables and foods like yogurt. Assuming you keep caffeine at reasonable levels, there's no reason to not count caffeinated beverages as water - just make sure you log the calories if they've got calories!

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661


    Wow this is very informative, one of the best answers i have heard so far. Thank you for sharing, im sure it will help her and others, it did for me : ) :drinker:
  • HMonsterX
    HMonsterX Posts: 3,000 Member
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    I've missed this.....

    The diuretic effect of caffeine is far, far outweighed by the actual fluid in the drink. Don't forget water is a diuretic too. The caffeine myth has been around for so long people just take it as red without actually reading up on it. I've even seen people who say their doctor told them to drink an extra glass of water for each coffee they drink. They need to get up to date with their research...

    http://www.divinecaroline.com/22178/46361-coffee-makes-dehydrated-say-what

    Also, if you are a regular caffeine drinker your body gets used to it, and the diuretic effect is all but eradicated.
  • Thomasm198
    Thomasm198 Posts: 3,189 Member
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    Tea and Coffee will not dehydrate you.

    http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/drinking-enough-water-topic-overview

    An extract from that article:

    Do you have to drink only water to stay hydrated?
    All liquids help you stay hydrated. Water is usually the best choice, because it’s free (if you’re drinking tap water) and has no sugar or calories. But most healthy people can get enough fluid through the beverages they consume every day. These can include water, fruit juices, coffee, sodas, iced tea, and other drinks.

    Experts say that it's not true that beverages that have caffeine-such as coffee, tea, and cola drinks-always dehydrate you. Healthy people who consume moderate amounts of caffeine don't lose more fluid than people who don't have any caffeine.1 A moderate amount of caffeine is about 200 to 300 milligrams a day. That's about two to four 8-ounce cups of coffee.

    So basically, I would put tea and coffee in my diary as a food to record the few calories that's in them. But tea and coffee do count towards your daily intake of water.
  • stanvoodoo
    stanvoodoo Posts: 1,023 Member
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    Coffee can be counted as water as long as it is decafienated.

    Water = No Cafeine, No Carbonation and No Sugar

    So decaf coffee and tea are fine, so is Crystal Light, Mio, Propel 0, VitaminWater Zero, Powerade Zero and Sobe Lifewater 0 just to mention a few.

    If you drink cafeinated coffee, then you should add a little more water to couter act it!!!
  • MissMaryMac33
    MissMaryMac33 Posts: 1,433 Member
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    Regarding the whole "Caffeine is a diuretic" thing - while this is true to a certain extent, it's not like one cup of coffee causes you to lose more water than what you just drank in the coffee. In reality, caffeine only has a diuretic effect if you drink more than 500-600 mg of it in a day. This is more than just a few cups of coffee. (It's about 4-7 cups, depending on the type of coffee.) Tea has even less caffeine than coffee and you'd have to drink quite a bit of tea to hit that threshhold. While I wholeheartedly agree that drinking adequate water is important (I've been known to drink 20 cups in a day), the fact is that water does *not* have to come just from plain water. You get water from almost any beverage you drink, from fruits and vegetables and foods like yogurt. Assuming you keep caffeine at reasonable levels, there's no reason to not count caffeinated beverages as water - just make sure you log the calories if they've got calories!

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661


    Wow this is very informative, one of the best answers i have heard so far. Thank you for sharing, im sure it will help her and others, it did for me : ) :drinker:

    Whew I'm glad someone actually read that! This argument gets so tiring --- and it amazes me that so many think they can only drink plain water--- its not even common sense. Almost every drink you buy is made of primarily water. Why wouldn't it count? The only different is that if you're drinking something with calories or sodium etc. you need to add it to your food diary too.
  • MissMaryMac33
    MissMaryMac33 Posts: 1,433 Member
    Options
    I've missed this.....

    The diuretic effect of caffeine is far, far outweighed by the actual fluid in the drink. Don't forget water is a diuretic too. The caffeine myth has been around for so long people just take it as red without actually reading up on it. I've even seen people who say their doctor told them to drink an extra glass of water for each coffee they drink. They need to get up to date with their research...

    http://www.divinecaroline.com/22178/46361-coffee-makes-dehydrated-say-what

    Also, if you are a regular caffeine drinker your body gets used to it, and the diuretic effect is all but eradicated.

    Another great article -- I'll have to add this one to my growing water vs fluids signature.
  • SueInAz
    SueInAz Posts: 6,592 Member
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    Yes, you can count black coffee, unsweetened tea, and other similar beverages as "water." It doesn't matter at all that it has calories. My nutritionist and doctor both told me you can count any liquid that hasn't been significantly altered, and the only difference between black coffee and water is that it the water is heated and strained through ground coffee beans first.
    I've seen someone else say this and I thought it fitting... if I ate the coffee beans and drank the water, would the water count? The answer is "yes."

    Coffee is made with water, tea is made with water, soda is made with water. Eating a 2000 calorie diet, your body needs 64 ounces of water to effectively process that food, which is where this whole "you must drink at least 8 cups of water every day" has come from. If you're eating less than 2000 calories per day, you need less water to process it, proportionately. In addition, all food has some measure of water in it and that water counts towards the total, too. In reality, you probably only need a couple of cups of fluid every day to effectively process your food. This can vary based on your age, activity level and the climate where you live.

    That said, a little more water is only going to do you some good. You can count your coffee towards your water intake, but make sure you're actually getting some plain water every day, too.
  • MikeSEA
    MikeSEA Posts: 1,074 Member
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    Who wants to sign my petition to stop thread Necromancy?
  • erintumbridge
    erintumbridge Posts: 23 Member
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    Regarding the whole "Caffeine is a diuretic" thing - while this is true to a certain extent, it's not like one cup of coffee causes you to lose more water than what you just drank in the coffee. In reality, caffeine only has a diuretic effect if you drink more than 500-600 mg of it in a day. This is more than just a few cups of coffee. (It's about 4-7 cups, depending on the type of coffee.) Tea has even less caffeine than coffee and you'd have to drink quite a bit of tea to hit that threshhold. While I wholeheartedly agree that drinking adequate water is important (I've been known to drink 20 cups in a day), the fact is that water does *not* have to come just from plain water. You get water from almost any beverage you drink, from fruits and vegetables and foods like yogurt. Assuming you keep caffeine at reasonable levels, there's no reason to not count caffeinated beverages as water - just make sure you log the calories if they've got calories!

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661


    Wow this is very informative, one of the best answers i have heard so far. Thank you for sharing, im sure it will help her and others, it did for me : ) :drinker:

    Whew I'm glad someone actually read that! This argument gets so tiring --- and it amazes me that so many think they can only drink plain water--- its not even common sense. Almost every drink you buy is made of primarily water. Why wouldn't it count? The only different is that if you're drinking something with calories or sodium etc. you need to add it to your food diary too.

    Yes it is indeed. We all have our own opinion based on what information has been given to us in the past. But out of all i wholly agree with your opinion,cit makes a great deal of sense and is based on given facts too. :happy:

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