Do you think people are lacking 'class'?
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With regard to technology, I will say that cell phones and social media have definitely crippled our ability to interact with each other as real human beings with thoughts and feelings, rather than just as faceless entities on the other side of the phone or computer.
You've got people having relationships where 90% of their communication is via text message. You've got guys "poking" girls on Facebook instead of picking up the phone, calling them, and saying "I would really like to take you to dinner." You've got girls breaking up with their boyfriends over e-mail or standing up their dates without so much as a phone call to say "Sorry, but I can't make it tonight."
Why? Because this is what we are being taught now ... that it's 2012 and somehow that's a good enough reason not to treat ourselves or anyone else with respect anymore.0 -
As usual, Teachers get treated like crap and aren’t given the credit they are due. Teachers are there to EDUCATE, parents are there to do the rest. Give teachers a break and look INSIDE THE HOME for the problem. Being a parent is a life sentence. If you aren't up to it, don't procreate.0
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we are an angry country right now.0
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Probably not class, but lacking respect. Especially today's kids who don't respect anyone, including theirselves, and are very self-centered.
This exactly. I was in the Cincinnati area, near my home town, doing a tour of book signings when I stopped at a store to pick myself up a few things. I had the sun roof open and I heard a few guys talking about my military plates, how I probably thought I was "all that." They carried on a few moments, having no idea I was actually in the car and I heard one say, "watch this." Um...watch what?? This guy honestly walked over and was going to spit in my sun roof. No respect, whatsoever. I would have gotten the switch to me had I ever treated someone like that.0 -
I can't stand the pj phenomenon...how lazy can someone be?
OMG, ^^^THIS drives me frigging INSANE.0 -
I've noticed a lot more lately--say within the past few years that people are more hostile, angrier, and feel incredibly entitled. Not saying everyone, for when I see great stories such as the plane landing on the Hudson a few years back, it gives me hope that people still have humanity.
Now-a-days you look at someone next to you in the other lane while driving and you get the bird. Even to watch a hockey game (my son plays hockey) one can hear others in the stands throwing the F-bomb around. and yes, there are children present..
When I was growing up I can remember being in the lobby at the rink during the hockey period and there were some young men saying F this, F that while chatting in our midst. My Dad went up to them and said 'Do not talk like that in the presence of women"....I'll never forget that moment. He grew up in an era where a man's handshake was as good as signing your name on the dotted line, where people had character and integrity, where people took care of their own business and didn't get into someone else's uninvited.
So in a nutshell, do you think class is diminshing in our time, and do you think technology plays a big part in it?
I couldn't agree with you more. I try very hard to not be judgmental of people...however I've seen things that make me cringe. There are women I work with that will walk into the ladies room while talking on a cell phone, continue the conversation while they do their business, and then walk out (without washing their hands), younger employees dropping the F bomb casually in the break room in front of upper managment, kids who don't know how to cut up their food or appear to have been taught any table manners so they eat like Barbarians. It's rediculous and hard to watch....0 -
“Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century:
Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others;
Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected;
Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it;
Refusing to set aside trivial preferences;
Neglecting development and refinement of the mind;
Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do.” ~Marcus Tullius Cicero0 -
parents are the enablers. Kids don't appreciate money because they don't have to do anything but wait for their parents next pay day or a holiday/birthday.. OH and I know because I was one of those parents until my kids behaved like they were ungrateful...now ask them what they get for nothing... HUGS AND KISSES!!!!!!!!!!
"I played my *insert game console of choice* for seven hours straight Saturday"
"I don't like my phone, I'm going to make my mom buy me another on" <-- and most times next time I see that kids phone, is the latest and greatest smartphone.
Said when something gets broken: "it doesn't matter, my parents will get me another one."
It really shows (in a good way) when a kid is taught responsibility at home. It's amazing what a little parent involvement does!
JM0 -
It's because these days children are all taught in school that they're entitled to get what they want. They're not allowed to fail, they're not allowed to excel, they aren't taught manners, and they aren't punished when they're obnoxious or disrespectful to others.
Exactly! ^^^0 -
Sometimes yes. Online it's easy to be anonymous and says inflammatory things without feeling guilty or taking blame, so maybe that is a part of it. I think the best thing to do is to lead by example, so we classy folk better get a move on!0
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I believe we have lost not only class, but civility. And it's a shame, because it doesn't have to be that way. Regardless of technology or velocity of life, we need to treat each other better. Even a simple "please" and "thank you". Not in a sniveling, permission-seeking way, but as acknowledgement of humanity (from one important person to another). Best summed up in the Sanskrit word "Namaste", which has no real equivalent in the West. But it's a great word with a great intention--
"That which is Highest and Finest in me greets that which is Highest and finest in you".
What a world this would be if we would all embrace this concept--Namaste.
--LEWIS
very well put0 -
Yes. I do. But we will raise our boys to be men. Yes mam and No Sir. Thank you and can I help you with that. They know to give up there seat for an adult. Woman are not called names but cherished and respected. There Dad has the last say and money doesn't grow on trees. They know that a day may come where they have to fight for family and or country. And If it does, they won't do it with pants sagging half way down their behinds. A's and b's are expected. As one day hard work will be. Strict? Old fashioned? Yes.
This ^^^^ is what is lacking!! Too many kids being raised without this type of education - teaching and learning aren't things that should only be done in a classroom, and shouldn't be limited to things you can sit exams in.0 -
If teachers have less control, it's because we're not allowed to. I refer a student to the office for disrupting class and from the uproar caused by them and their parents, you'd think I was sentencing them to the federal penitentiary. This lack of control that people perceive that we teachers have is not because of us not doing our jobs, it's because of parents feeling their precious snowflakes can do no wrong.
As a trainee teacher, I strongly agree with this!
Discipline and control in the classroom is also ineffective in terms of secondary socialisation if the parents do not reinforce similar discipline at home. Notice teachers nowadays have dropped the phrase "you wouldn't do that at home, so don't to it here." I heard teachers say that all the time when I was at school, but nowadays you get the response "My mum/dad wouldn't care if I [insert undesirable behaviour]".0 -
absolutley.0
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It's because these days children are all taught in school that they're entitled to get what they want. They're not allowed to fail, they're not allowed to excel, they aren't taught manners, and they aren't punished when they're obnoxious or disrespectful to others.
I think teachers have less control these days...
If teachers have less control, it's because we're not allowed to. I refer a student to the office for disrupting class and from the uproar caused by them and their parents, you'd think I was sentencing them to the federal penitentiary. This lack of control that people perceive that we teachers have is not because of us not doing our jobs, it's because of parents feeling their precious snowflakes can do no wrong.
AMEN! Unless we want to lose our jobs, we can't discipline kids in any way. You can tell kids that come from a well-rounded home where they were brought up to be respectful. Unfortunately our society has changed so much. It is not just kids, either. It blows my mind how adults just don't have the common courtesy to say "Please" or "thank you" anymore!0 -
i notice it in certain places.
especially the entitlement attitude. i live in a very poor very rural area..and the people here just dont care. they honesty purposely will try to swerve to hit an animal on the road. they dont use turn signals. they dont say excuse me when they need past you, they just push.
but just a few mins down the road there is a town full of the bohemian hippy types.. worldly and they are kind and actually thoughtful and polite.
Wow, I'd love to know where that first place is so I can avoid it. Perhaps you should move to the hippy place!
I used to live in Northern Virginia and it was exactly the same, except that it's a very affluent suburban area. I would do my grocery shopping late at night, to avoid people shoving me out of the way when I spent a second too long picking out apples or whatever. Most people there have long, brutal commutes, which I think contributes to their impatient and impersonal behavior. Incidentally, according to the Virginia driving test you're actually supposed to speed up and hit animals in the road!0 -
Yes yes yes! People have no "coof" what my grandmother calls it. Ladies have forgotten how to be ladies. Men no longer feel the need to respect or show chivalry. People just say whatever comes to mind sometimes with no regards to people's feeling. They're cursing, fighting, shooting, and stabbing for sensless reasons and are teaching the next generation to do the same. It's just horrible! I pray for the next generation
Love the Ladies have forgotten to be ladies and men no longer feel the need to respect or show chivalry. Totally agree. People just need to stop and think about the golden rule .. do unto others. It solves everything really. Treat someone how you want to be treated.0 -
It's because these days children are all taught in school that they're entitled to get what they want. They're not allowed to fail, they're not allowed to excel, they aren't taught manners, and they aren't punished when they're obnoxious or disrespectful to others.
The above paragraph is a result of using schools as the scapegoat for problems that originate AT HOME
Discipline?
This paragraph is a result of the lack of options for discipline we have as teachers. I remember being paddled by my first grade teacher. Now, we can't even touch a kid. If I pull a kid away from a fight, I can loose my job or get sued. Discipline now is just silent lunch, in-school suspension, and out-of-school suspension. The problem is, the students that are constant discipline problems that act the way the OP describes have no consequence AT HOME when they get in trouble at school. The parents behave a certain way, the child feels that is acceptable behavior.
Manners?
Well, we try, but if the child is allowed to use foul language or be disrespectful at home, it won't matter what we teach them at school. We do punish them, get a ear full full from the parents because we're picking on their kid, and the behavior continues. Once again, if it's allowed AT HOME, it doesn't matter that they got ISS or whatever because they are going home to no consequences.
Failing?
They are allowed to fail, I hand out plenty of F grades, BUT students are often still passed on to the next grade when they clearly don't have the knowledge. I can't tell you how many times I get a call from a parent, screaming at me because there's no way their kid could fail, and that I must "have it in" for them since I sent home an F on a report card. What happens on the next report card? The student fails again because it's not addressed AT HOME
Hear! Hear Ebbtime! I work in middle school!!!
JM
I wasn't blaming teachers.0 -
Definitely, I went to a restaurant the other day, kids where running around everywhere screaming, & other kids where fighting, the parents of the kids didn't care, then one woman shouts "Oi, there's toddlers in here, if you want to fight, piss off & do it outside"... it would have all been well if she didn't swear as well.
If I ever acted like that as a child I would have been grounded for my entire life! I wouldn't dare act like that, I obey my parents, I'm polite & respectful to everyone, some kids & adults these days just put me at a loss for words at how loud, obnoxious & toxic they are.
I agree. My brother & I would have got spanked for acting like that.
Now I have a 4 year old son who for the most part acts great in public but if he does act up, I just leave. I can't stand it & I know other people can't stand it either. Solves the problem & my son knows he did bad. This happened to us 1 time.0 -
Pajama pants in public. Nuff said.0
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There have always been jerks in society, but I think it has to do with children are being raised by adults who never wanted to grow up, so they are children themselves. Also, reality TV is so acceptable at such a young age, kids think it is okay to act trashy or be a jerk to get ahead in life, because they see the cast of Jersey Shore or even the cast of Survivor doing it to get ahead.0
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People have always been like this. It's just the fact that there are a lot more people now, so you have more opportunities to see it.
Do you really think the flappers in the Roaring 20's were all about class, dignity, and respect? Oh, and the Old West, they were real classy thieves and murderers.
People haven't changed, we're just a lot closer together and have access to more people than we used to.
Kinda like how everyone is paranoid about violent crimes because of all the stuff we see on the news on TV and think things are so much worse than they were back in the idealized 50's. There's actually less violent crime now than there was in the 1950's according to statistics, but back then, you don't know about these crimes unless they happened in your local community.
I think you're absolutely right. People like to talk about how we're more violent as well, but to use your analogy again, in the Old West, they settled arguments with guns, not courtrooms. In the past, the community used to turn out, with their children, to watch people hang or get beheaded. We're just a smaller world, in a manner of speaking, thanks to the power of television and the internet.0 -
This reminds me of what happened when I went to Petco last weekend. We were early for dinner and decided to look at the fish until the restaurant opened. This girl/young woman (not a day over 19 or 20) came down the aisle and started yelling across the store to her boyfriend about "f---ing b---- wouldn't get out of my way!" And continued to loudly complain about f---ing b---- this and f---ing b---- that. Loudly. And there were children around. She was incredibly rude. And most likely wanted someone to tell her to shut up and quit acting like a spoiled brat. She was trashy, self-important, self-entitled. It was obvious that she was doing it for attention. It didn't work. I don't think anyone in the store bothered to even look at her, which is exactly the way you should react to a child having a tantrum. Her parents should be ashamed.0
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People have DEFINITELY changed. Talk to some older folks who were adults in the '50s and have witnessed the changes firsthand.
And I actually think people were a LOT more aware of what was going on in the world around them back then because they were affected much more acutely by it. These days, as long as McDonald's is still serving cheeseburgers and American Idol is still on TV, nobody knows or cares what is happening. Go on YouTube and watch these videos of COLLEGE STUDENTS who can't tell you who the Vice President of the United States is and tell me people haven't changed.0 -
Yes. I do. But we will raise our boys to be men. Yes mam and No Sir. Thank you and can I help you with that. They know to give up there seat for an adult. Woman are not called names but cherished and respected. There Dad has the last say and money doesn't grow on trees. They know that a day may come where they have to fight for family and or country. And If it does, they won't do it with pants sagging half way down their behinds. A's and b's are expected. As one day hard work will be. Strict? Old fashioned? Yes.
She just described my kids.
. Honestly, if more people still raised their kids this way, the lack of class you're talking about wouldn't be as prevalent as it is.
I remember when I was nine months pregnant with my little boy. I went to my OBGYN appointment. All the chairs in the waiting room were taken. One lady had her five kids with her, all of them in chairs, saw me looking around to find a place to sit, and did nothing but just stare at me. She never once told her kids to move, and I ended up struggling to sit on the floor, struggling to get back up. No one else in the room offered to give up their seat, either (not even the men who were there with their pregnant women). Seriously?
My children are taught to give up their seat for ANY adult, female or male, young or old. Regardless, they OFFER. It all comes down to respect, and as a society (in general) yes, I would agree that we've lost that.
P.S. There's nothing that makes me more proud that when a total stranger compliments my children on their manners and politeness. Even my five year old little boy knows (and does) open doors for a lady and says 'Yes ma'am, No Sir", etc.0 -
I used to think people have changed in a few generations. But I honestly don't think significant changes to society happen in a few decades. Changes just don't happen that fast. I think we have more access, more information, more people, less room, less quiet.
I believe we have more disposable time, people working from home, people simply out of work, people living off investments, trust funds, etc. I think the human brain needs to worry about stuff - our DNA is wired for survival, but most of us (at least in developed countries) don't really have to worry about survival any more. None of my friends are getting chased by wooly mammoths. So we fret and we worry and we obsess. And we complain. It's easier and more satisfying (quicker) to talk about how civility is lost than to focus on being civil myself. I'm not saying those ideas are mutually exclusive. But I have to realize that the energy I spend talking about the moral/civil/class decay of society doesn't really address the problem.
I think that whatever perceived societal changes we are talking about in this thread are actually pretty small compared to the talking about, complaining about, writing about, and analysis of those changes.0 -
People have always been like this. It's just the fact that there are a lot more people now, so you have more opportunities to see it.
Do you really think the flappers in the Roaring 20's were all about class, dignity, and respect? Oh, and the Old West, they were real classy thieves and murderers.
People haven't changed, we're just a lot closer together and have access to more people than we used to.
Kinda like how everyone is paranoid about violent crimes because of all the stuff we see on the news on TV and think things are so much worse than they were back in the idealized 50's. There's actually less violent crime now than there was in the 1950's according to statistics, but back then, you don't know about these crimes unless they happened in your local community.
Smartest thing I've read here.0 -
Yes. Some people have the social graces of a goat.0
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I've noticed a lot more lately--say within the past few years that people are more hostile, angrier, and feel incredibly entitled. Not saying everyone, for when I see great stories such as the plane landing on the Hudson a few years back, it gives me hope that people still have humanity.
Now-a-days you look at someone next to you in the other lane while driving and you get the bird. Even to watch a hockey game (my son plays hockey) one can hear others in the stands throwing the F-bomb around. and yes, there are children present..
When I was growing up I can remember being in the lobby at the rink during the hockey period and there were some young men saying F this, F that while chatting in our midst. My Dad went up to them and said 'Do not talk like that in the presence of women"....I'll never forget that moment. He grew up in an era where a man's handshake was as good as signing your name on the dotted line, where people had character and integrity, where people took care of their own business and didn't get into someone else's uninvited.
So in a nutshell, do you think class is diminshing in our time, and do you think technology plays a big part in it?
I do find it a little sad. I still open doors for women. Watch my language around women. Still call men sir and women ma'am. My word is my bond. It's how I was raised.
When my daughters were still at home and dating, boys came to the house and met me and their mom, before going out.
A couple months ago, my oldest's daughter's boyfriend (She's 30) called me to say he wanted my blessing to ask Nikki to marry him. He wasn't asking permission, but he was showing respect. I appreciated it. Showed character.
Don't get me wrong. I believe in equality of the sexes, but I am always going to treat the women in my life as if they are special and deserve it, because they do. And the men in their lives are going to do the same.0 -
It's because these days children are all taught in school that they're entitled to get what they want. They're not allowed to fail, they're not allowed to excel, they aren't taught manners, and they aren't punished when they're obnoxious or disrespectful to others.
This!0
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