Question about strength training

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  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
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    Let me just make sure I've got this right: for building muscle, it is better to do a few reps with heavier weight, even if someone can only do one or two, than to do a lot more reps with a lighter weight?

    1-2 isn't enough, I would say no less than 5...no more than 8. Others say less than 12.
  • Nopedotjpeg
    Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,806 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    Let me just make sure I've got this right: for building muscle, it is better to do a few reps with heavier weight, even if someone can only do one or two, than to do a lot more reps with a lighter weight?

    1-2 isn't enough, I would say no less than 5...no more than 8. Others say less than 12.


    OK ... My goal is to use the highest weight I can without injuring myself. I don't know a lot about weight training, but obviously there is a difference between the burn of pushing your muscles and the pain of injuring yourself. It's good to know I can try fewer reps, and with that in mind, I'll just stick with the same exercises I've been doing, and see how it goes for the next few weeks. Thanks for the advice.
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    Ahhh...that makes more sense.

    The point though is, you don't EVER have to do 15 or 20 reps, it's counter productive!!

    I do ALL my exercises with weight heavy enough I can barely complete 5 reps. I then do 5 sets. If I can't complete the 5 reps at the end of the 4th set...I'll drop 5lbs and complete my 5th set. Other people do 8 reps for 3 sets.

    If I were you, I'd drop ALL your lifting down to either 5x5, or 3x8 (I'm biased to 5x5 lol). Use weights where you struggle to complete 1-2 reps beyond the number required. So for a 5 rep set, you'd pick a weight you could only do perhaps 6 good form reps with on your first set...and do that. For example, I use (post surgery) 75lbs per arm on my dumbbell presses. On my first set I could perhaps do 7 reps (I still do 5). Because of this I know it's a good weight. If I could do 8 or more, I'd need to add weight. If I couldn't even complete 6, I'd need to lighten the weight.

    I hope that makes sense.


    That information is very helpful. Thank you.
  • superstarcassie
    superstarcassie Posts: 296 Member
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    Agree with dropping the reps, lifting heavier weights, adding sets. You have to push yourself each and every time- it should be a struggle at the end of each set.
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    I've read that it's good for burning calories and building muscle to vary the strength training exercises you do -- for example, you may work your biceps with two or three different exercises on different days or in different workouts, and though the exercises are similar, they work the biceps from slightly different angles or in slightly different ways, building a better muscle and challenging your body. At least, that's how I understand it. If you want a better explanation, you'd probably better ask someone else! :)
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
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    Let me just make sure I've got this right: for building muscle, it is better to do a few reps with heavier weight, even if someone can only do one or two, than to do a lot more reps with a lighter weight?

    1-2 isn't enough, I would say no less than 5...no more than 8. Others say less than 12.


    OK ... My goal is to use the highest weight I can without injuring myself. I don't know a lot about weight training, but obviously there is a difference between the burn of pushing your muscles and the pain of injuring yourself. It's good to know I can try fewer reps, and with that in mind, I'll just stick with the same exercises I've been doing, and see how it goes for the next few weeks. Thanks for the advice.

    You're welcome!

    If you want more advice, I'd skip the very complicated workout you've got going, and just do some basic compound lifts. My workouts consist of maybe 5 lifts, 3 days a week. This lost me 40lbs in 3 months, and has helped me put on muscle since.

    Since my injury, I use the leg press machine (used to be weighted squats), dumbbell presses, horizontal row, dips, and ab work for my workout a, and leg press (instead of weighted lunges), dumbbell shoulder press, weighted extensions, lat pulldowns (instead of pullups), and ab work for my workout b. I alternate these 3x a week. I fully believe form follows function...so if I'm strong (compound lifts build strength), I'll look great as a by product.

    Additionally, there are further compound lifts you can get into...but often the simple workout above is less intimidating than the bigtime barbell stuff for beginners or people without spotters (like me).
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    I've read that it's good for burning calories and building muscle to vary the strength training exercises you do -- for example, you may work your biceps with two or three different exercises on different days or in different workouts, and though the exercises are similar, they work the biceps from slightly different angles or in slightly different ways, building a better muscle and challenging your body. At least, that's how I understand it. If you want a better explanation, you'd probably better ask someone else! :)

    No matter how good your program is, it won't work forever. To keep progressing and achieving results, you have to change your program periodically. Imagine you're doing 3x8 of, say, chest press. You keep working and adding weight over a few weeks or up to a couple months, but there will come a point where you can't add any more weight. What do you do? Do you continue to lift 3x8 of that last weight forever? It would be boring and unproductive. You need to switch your strategy.
  • Nopedotjpeg
    Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,806 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    I've read that it's good for burning calories and building muscle to vary the strength training exercises you do -- for example, you may work your biceps with two or three different exercises on different days or in different workouts, and though the exercises are similar, they work the biceps from slightly different angles or in slightly different ways, building a better muscle and challenging your body. At least, that's how I understand it. If you want a better explanation, you'd probably better ask someone else! :)

    No matter how good your program is, it won't work forever. To keep progressing and achieving results, you have to change your program periodically. Imagine you're doing 3x8 of, say, chest press. You keep working and adding weight over a few weeks or up to a couple months, but there will come a point where you can't add any more weight. What do you do? Do you continue to lift 3x8 of that last weight forever? It would be boring and unproductive. You need to switch your strategy.

    I've read many people who use linear progression just do a 10% deload and then make smaller jumps in weight. I know you do need to eventually switch up programs, but 4-6 weeks seems pretty premature.
  • moochachip
    moochachip Posts: 237 Member
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    I suggest reading The New Rules of Lifting for Women. I've been on the program for over 3 months - I went from 85 pound dead-lifts to 105.

    It should work for you as well as long as you stick to the program (that has great directions along with it.)
  • taso42
    taso42 Posts: 8,980 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    I've read that it's good for burning calories and building muscle to vary the strength training exercises you do -- for example, you may work your biceps with two or three different exercises on different days or in different workouts, and though the exercises are similar, they work the biceps from slightly different angles or in slightly different ways, building a better muscle and challenging your body. At least, that's how I understand it. If you want a better explanation, you'd probably better ask someone else! :)

    No matter how good your program is, it won't work forever. To keep progressing and achieving results, you have to change your program periodically. Imagine you're doing 3x8 of, say, chest press. You keep working and adding weight over a few weeks or up to a couple months, but there will come a point where you can't add any more weight. What do you do? Do you continue to lift 3x8 of that last weight forever? It would be boring and unproductive. You need to switch your strategy.

    I've read many people who use linear progression just do a 10% deload and then make smaller jumps in weight. I know you do need to eventually switch up programs, but 4-6 weeks seems pretty premature.

    Yes on the deload. And once you're really stuck you can add assistance exercises. Nothing wrong with switching programs, but the major lifts - squat, bench, overhead press, deadlift - are forever.
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    I've read that it's good for burning calories and building muscle to vary the strength training exercises you do -- for example, you may work your biceps with two or three different exercises on different days or in different workouts, and though the exercises are similar, they work the biceps from slightly different angles or in slightly different ways, building a better muscle and challenging your body. At least, that's how I understand it. If you want a better explanation, you'd probably better ask someone else! :)

    No matter how good your program is, it won't work forever. To keep progressing and achieving results, you have to change your program periodically. Imagine you're doing 3x8 of, say, chest press. You keep working and adding weight over a few weeks or up to a couple months, but there will come a point where you can't add any more weight. What do you do? Do you continue to lift 3x8 of that last weight forever? It would be boring and unproductive. You need to switch your strategy.

    I've read many people who use linear progression just do a 10% deload and then make smaller jumps in weight. I know you do need to eventually switch up programs, but 4-6 weeks seems pretty premature.

    It was just an example meant to show you will eventually stall- it is finite before you have to change reps, or number of sets, or rest time, or incline or any of a million different adaptations. The time frame will be individual to every person, I was mistaken and shouldn't have given any time frame references.
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    If you want more advice, I'd skip the very complicated workout you've got going, and just do some basic compound lifts. My workouts consist of maybe 5 lifts, 3 days a week. This lost me 40lbs in 3 months, and has helped me put on muscle since.

    Since my injury, I use the leg press machine (used to be weighted squats), dumbbell presses, horizontal row, dips, and ab work for my workout a, and leg press (instead of weighted lunges), dumbbell shoulder press, weighted extensions, lat pulldowns (instead of pullups), and ab work for my workout b. I alternate these 3x a week. I fully believe form follows function...so if I'm strong (compound lifts build strength), I'll look great as a by product.

    Additionally, there are further compound lifts you can get into...but often the simple workout above is less intimidating than the bigtime barbell stuff for beginners or people without spotters (like me).


    I should have mentioned that I am working out at home, so I don't have access to weight machines. Sorry for the dumbed down recap, but I think you're saying that it would be a better use of time to do fewer exercises that target more than one muscle group at a time? That sounds like a good idea. I'm going to look into it. I need to do some more reading to familiarize myself with specific exercises and which muscles they target.
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    I suggest reading The New Rules of Lifting for Women. I've been on the program for over 3 months - I went from 85 pound dead-lifts to 105.

    It should work for you as well as long as you stick to the program (that has great directions along with it.)

    Thank you, and also thanks Annavt09 for suggesting Jamie Eason. I may look into these when I am able.
  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    Can someone explain to me why you think you need to switch the exercises every workout or every month?

    MUSCLE CONFUSION!


    ...lol
  • shimmer_glo
    shimmer_glo Posts: 103 Member
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    Oh. Another question, while I'm thinking of it -- if your wrists hurt during weight lifting, is that an indication that your weights are too heavy?
  • LJC44
    LJC44 Posts: 221
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    I am just getting started with weight loss and improving my fitness. I have been doing the same strength training routine for about one month, at least 3x a week. I am challenged by the exercises, and can still only do 5lb weights with some of my upper body. I could probably spend another few weeks working on upping the weights with lower reps. In your opinion, is it better for me to strength train with the same routine for 2 months and then switch to a different one (working the same muscles), or vary similar exercises each time I work out?


    VARIETY! Every few weeks change exercises, routines, or reps/sets. If you feel that you could push out a few more reps than def increase the weight!
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
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    If you want more advice, I'd skip the very complicated workout you've got going, and just do some basic compound lifts. My workouts consist of maybe 5 lifts, 3 days a week. This lost me 40lbs in 3 months, and has helped me put on muscle since.

    Since my injury, I use the leg press machine (used to be weighted squats), dumbbell presses, horizontal row, dips, and ab work for my workout a, and leg press (instead of weighted lunges), dumbbell shoulder press, weighted extensions, lat pulldowns (instead of pullups), and ab work for my workout b. I alternate these 3x a week. I fully believe form follows function...so if I'm strong (compound lifts build strength), I'll look great as a by product.

    Additionally, there are further compound lifts you can get into...but often the simple workout above is less intimidating than the bigtime barbell stuff for beginners or people without spotters (like me).


    I should have mentioned that I am working out at home, so I don't have access to weight machines. Sorry for the dumbed down recap, but I think you're saying that it would be a better use of time to do fewer exercises that target more than one muscle group at a time? That sounds like a good idea. I'm going to look into it. I need to do some more reading to familiarize myself with specific exercises and which muscles they target.

    Here, I'll give you a perfect example!
    Some of you have been curious about my workout that I used to lose the initial 35+lbs at home. Well, it was 100% bodyweight based, no weights. I'll lay it out here:

    This is your basic 5 x 5 template. (To clarify, 5x5 is 5 reps x 5 sets. The idea is to work at a difficulty level where you could only do maybe 7-8 reps on the first set, and are struggling to finish 5 reps on the last set). You would do strength training 3 times a week, say Monday-Wednesday-Friday with the weekends off. These are done "lazy circuits" style, with about 1 minute rest between each set (I use a FT7 HRM and keep my heart rate over 140). The explanations of the exercises you'll use for each group are farther below.

    Workout A
    1A. Knee dominant - 5 x 5
    1B. Horizontal push - 5 x 5
    1C. Horizontal pull - 5 x 5
    2A. Ab - flexion - 3 x 5
    2B. Ab - static 3 x 30 seconds

    Workout B
    1A. Knee dominant - 5 x 5
    1B. Vertical push - 5 x 5
    1C. Hip dominant - 5 x 5
    1D. Vertical pull - 5 x 5
    2A. Ab - rotation - 3 x 5
    2B. Grip and neck training - 3 x varies

    Exercise Progressions - with regular weight training you can just add weight to the bar. With bodyweight progression is mostly about changing your leverage. These are just a few examples, I'm sure we could come up with dozens more if needed. You can always add resistance in the form of a weighted vest or backpack or resistance bands.

    Explanations of exercise in order of difficulty (easy-hard)
    1. Knee Dominant -- squats, lunges, step-ups, bulgarian split squats, unilateral bent leg deadlift, partial one leg squat, one leg squat, box or stair pistols, full pistols.
    2. Horizontal Push -- pushups, decline pushups, resistance pushups, side to side pushups, stair one arm pushups, negative one arm pushups, full one arm pushups.
    3. Horizontal Pull -- body row, resistance body row, negative one hand row, incline one hand row, full one hand row.
    4. Ab - flexion -- crunches, situps, resistance or incline situps, reverse situp, resistance or incline reverse situps, hanging knee or leg raise, hanging pikes, rollout from knees, rollout from feet, dragon flag. Also included are oblique moves like side lying crunches with or without resistance and side lying two leg raise.
    5. Abs- static -- 4 point prone bridge, 3 point prone bridge, 2 point prone bridge, 4 point supine bridge, 3 point supine bridge.
    6. Vertical Push -- pike pushup, hindu pushup, divebomber pushup, decline pike pushup, decline hindu pushup, decline divebomber pushup, one arm pike pushup, negative handstand pushup, handstand pushup with head touching floor, full handstand pushup.
    7. Hip Dominant -- supine hip extension, good morning, one leg stiff leg deadlift, split one leg good morning, one leg supine hip extension, hyperextension, one leg hyperextension, natural glute-ham raise.
    8. Vertical Pull -- jumping or assisted pullups, pullups, resistance pullups, side to side pullups, negative one hand pullups, one hand pullups. All these can refer to chinups or neutral grip pullups as well.
    9. Ab - rotation -- twist crunches or situps, resistance or incline twist crunches or situps, russian twists, lying windshield wipers, standing rope rotations, hanging windshield wipers.
    10. Grip and Neck Training -- for grip you can use handgrippers, deadhangs from a pullup bar (especially a fatbar or gripping a towel). For neck nothing beats wrestlers bridges. If you are involved in a striking martial art or sport, finger and fist pushups are very important also.

    None of these lists have to end here. If you get strong enough you can always add resistance to your full range of motion one limb exercise. Or if you can do more than 5 one hand pushups do decline one hand pushups, or start working on one hand hindu and then eventually one hand dive bombers, and so on.

    The nice thing about this routine is it scales dramatically depending on your fitness level. If you can't do even ONE regular pull up, you can scale it down and do assisted pull ups (legs on a chair), or ballistic pullups (where you jump to provide the initial momentum). It's actually easier to do properly when you're very unfit...because once you're healthy and strong...you're going to be searching for challenging enough exercises to only allow you 5 reps max by the finish of the 5 sets.

    I used that workout to drop 40lbs of bodyfat in 3mos...while putting on a slight amount of muscle in the process from what I could tell. When I switched to the gym (because I wanted more muscle, and it was getting difficult to improve my leverage at home...I was doing 25 handstand pushups lol)...I used this workout to devise the weighted workout I initially explained.
  • Effy826
    Effy826 Posts: 33 Member
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    bump
  • spazofthedead
    spazofthedead Posts: 175 Member
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    Oh. Another question, while I'm thinking of it -- if your wrists hurt during weight lifting, is that an indication that your weights are too heavy?

    Probably means you aren't holding the dumbbell quite right. Adjust your grip a bit and see if that helps.