Not satisfied with physique: lack of thickness/mass
Options
Replies
-
MrElculver2424 wrote: »As far as I know, those are more for pure strength, which I'm not interested in.
i'll just explain up front that i'm 52, a woman, and not heading in the same kind of direction as you, wrt the goals. i'm more just about liking the compound lifts and wanting to get stronger and stronger with them.
with that said though, i do think you might be surprised if you looked into a few of the 'pure strength' programmes, especially the ones that have optional 'hypertrophy' sidecar protocols, like jim wendler's 5/3/1 with the boring-but-big addition. i did bbb for a while about a year ago, after almost a year on the basic programme. nd even though i was adding the 5x10 sets more for form practice and grooving than anything else, i remember noticing some really nice 'infill' sort of effect visually. it was not so much that my muscles grew huge. i was actually trying to lose a little fat or at least not get any fatter at the same time. but the tendons and ligament areas at each end of the muscle belly thickened up pretty nicely, which felt better in addition to giving me a slightly different visual look.
the other similar idea that i know of personally is doug hepburn's routine, which i'm just wetting my feet with rn. it's moderate weight with pretty incremental increase but it starts out with high-ish volume already in very short sets (8x2) and adds additional reps every time until you 'graduate' to the next weight. there's a [stupid word] 'pump' addition which is 3x6 with lighter weight, and the same add-a-rep progression.3 -
Packerjohn wrote: »MrElculver2424 wrote: »I've obviously gained some weight, but it doesn't seem to be going into my big muscle groups (chest, arms, back). It seems to just hang onto my waist, if anything. I'm not fat at all, and the outline of my abs are slightly visible, but the additional calories seem to not be going anywhere.
Since when did legs quit being a big muscle group? If you do work legs, your comments don't make that seem like an area of emphasis. Squats and deadlifts are compound movements that will go a long way to building the mass your're looking for (along with appropriate nutrition).
I didn't mean to leave that one out. LOL. Actually, my legs are in quite good shape...I never skip leg day, always twice a week...I love working out legs, and I'm pretty happy with the size and fitness in my legs. Usually I just do the quad machine, hamstring machine, leg press, and calf raises machine. I just feel like my upper body muscles are lagging a little, which is why that's the topic of my post.0 -
Based on your personal description I was going to suggest following this guy.
http://instagram.com/lankyprogresstv
But then you posted your picture, and I’m speechless.
All this old lady can say is “Thank you”.
Well if this is a compliment, thank YOU, I appreciate it. LOL. Honestly, yeah...new people that I meet who I can tell don't work out at all often make comments to me like "you look like you work out" or "you're making gains."
I guess we are all just harder on ourselves than others are. Yeah, I'm fit an in shape. But I always want to get even better.
1 -
MrElculver2424 wrote: »You are making good progress - I would Deadlift / bench /overhead press & bent over row w/ a barbell - all heavy in the 4-6 rep range. If you are not gaining weight you need to eat more eat some more protein - in a college dorm hardboiled eggs, cheese, or peanut butter sandwiches might work. Eastcoast Jim
Thanks for the comments...although I personally am against deadlifting as well as working out in low-rep ranges. As far as I know, those are more for pure strength, which I'm not interested in. For some people that's good, but I want maximum hypertrophy and endurance, which I've read comes more from the 10-14 range and up. I will try eating even more as well.
The thing is, muscle growth is a result of many factors (tension, damage and stress to the muscles), I think if you aren't happy with the results you are getting but you are putting weight on.. the problem most likely lies with your programming. Instead of focusing only on high rep ranges, I would branch out and hit the muscle fibers from all angles with lower, moderate, and high rep ranges, some people respond differently, and just fatiguing the muscle each time may not be enough. Also keep in mind, if you are over stressing the muscle (excessive muscle damage by too much volume all at once and going to failure each time) you can actually interfere with the muscle building process.
Also you have to have a lot of patience... it can takes years to build your physique, and some muscles are just slower to grow than others.
All of this^^! You also don't say much about your program but a concern that jumped out at me is 6 days per week. If you are doing lots of iso's, maybe. But muscle growth needs recovery time and 6 days may not be giving it enough. Also, hypertrophy occurs in all rep ranges to some degree. Some lower rep range/ higher weight will give you more strength to then up weights in hypertrophy range and progress.
My 3 different muscle groupings per day are:
1: Chest and triceps
2. Back and abs
3. Shoulders and legs
I just stick to that schedule (I don't care what day of the week it is). I just try to hit each group twice a week, so some weeks I work out 6 days a week; others I'll take an extra day off and then technically it's maybe 5 days a week. But yeah, I enjoy working out, so it's something I always get excited to do.0 -
I am throwing this out there, if you started at a higher body fat% perhaps the proportion of fat to muscle gain you are getting is not optimal, calorie partitioning has become an issue.
I am going with what others regarding your program. We all can work 5-6 days a week in the gym and go hard, but if what you are doing is not producing the results you want you should review the program and maybe switch to another one, these will have recovery days built in as well. As mentioned above it can take years to build the physique you want, patience with the process is key. Consider doing several cycles.
Hey...your comment about "starting at a higher body fat %" actually made me realize something totally different than most of us are talking about...
I personally have never had a very high body fat %...I've always been skinny and underweight. Looking at pictures of %, I probably have never been over 12-14% in my entire life.
But that second picture I posted of the physique I kind of want...that guy actually has always had a higher body fat % than me. He actually borderlined on "chubby" before working out and getting to that physique in the picture.
So perhaps it's just as simple as he went from higher body fat % to lower, whereas I'm going from lower to higher? What do you think the body fat % of the second picture is? Higher than me, right?
0 -
The two pictures you posted look pretty much the same to me.
In fact I thought they were the same person.
Working out 6 days a week is too much unless you are purposely trying to over train to lose weight.
2 -
So maybe I missed it, but I couldn't really get from your posts. You MUST barbell squat and deadlift. Combined with excess calories, those are the two biggest mass builders which will put muscle on all over your body. Also incorporate variety of rep ranges. Getting stronger in the 1 - 3 rep range will mean you can move more weight in the 10 - 12 rep range.3
-
Mycophilia wrote: »If you're doing your own programming I'd suggest you read some books on the subject.
"The Muscle and strength Nutrition/Training pyramid" books by Eric Helms, Andrea Valdez and Andy Morgan are really great.
"The Scientific Principles of Strength Training" by Mike Israetel, James Hoffmann and Chad Wesley Smith is a bit more technical but is also really good.
Also, "Practical Programming for Strength Training" by Mark Rippetoe.0 -
The two pictures you posted look pretty much the same to me.
In fact I thought they were the same person.
Working out 6 days a week is too much unless you are purposely trying to over train to lose weight.
I'm sure I overanalyze myself more than others, that's natural. But the second picture seems thicker to me...thicker in the upper arms and chest. Maybe it's just because that person is taller/larger than me. I don't know.
I created a new plan for myself today and cut it down to 4 days a week. Still hitting each muscle group twice, but combined more together and included compound movements.1 -
So maybe I missed it, but I couldn't really get from your posts. You MUST barbell squat and deadlift. Combined with excess calories, those are the two biggest mass builders which will put muscle on all over your body. Also incorporate variety of rep ranges. Getting stronger in the 1 - 3 rep range will mean you can move more weight in the 10 - 12 rep range.
Ok, I created a new workout plan today, cutting my schedule down to 4 workout days per week instead of 6. Still hit each muscle group twice a week, but I combined more together.
I'll do more compound movements like squats, *real* bench press (I normally just do isolation chest machines), pull-ups, and maybe I'll try deadlifts. If I do, I can't ever go too heavy on deadlifts because I know several people who screwed up their backs by going too seriously with deadlifts.1 -
Hey, man! I will chime in. Regarding deadlifts - get over the fear! I speak from experience.
I am 50 and have been very athletic all my life (with a five year period of not so much!). I started doing squats and dead lifts last December, 2016. I never did dead lifts before. As in - never! I had not done squats since high school (so, 35 years ago) and I have a messed up left knee.
Anyway, squats have been a God-send. The knee is not some painful. I live in Winston-Salem, NC and it gets cold here. And, the knee used to lock up and just plain hurt. I was always afraid of doing squats because of the injury way back when (I can tell you stories about that - but I digress). I watched someone on youtube - wanna say that it was Athlean X - and he was, "Dude, do squats.....if you do them with the proper form then your legs will get so much stronger and your knee will be in much better shape!". Well, he was correct.
Now, let me tell you about my journey with squats. My form was horrible. I mean, like really bad. I hurt myself a few times. I would reach a weight that I just could not get past (180lbs was one of them) and it was all due to form. Well, the blessing there was that from each injury (one was really bad, one was just annoying) I improved. Big time. Learned all of the queues. Learned all about bracing and breathing. BAM! Way better. Not bragging, but now everyone compliments me on my form (pretty sure that they are talking about my *kitten*! LOL!). I go deep and I just get it.
My journey with Dead Lifts is the same. Had never done them until roughly a year ago. And made all the horrible mistakes that someone can make. I am strong enough to really do stupid to myself. And, I have. But, it was all form-related. I learned all of the queues along the way (for the same reasons as with squats). And, now, I do okay for an old man! LOL!
There are lots and lots and lots of "this is how you squat" and "this is how you deadlift" videos out there. I really like a dude from Maryland - Brian Alsruhe. He has a three-part series for each: deadlift, squat, bench press. He gives you all of the queues and he gives you all of the "this is where the issue is, this is how you fix it" information.
Anyway, I really like squats. I LOVE dead lifts. If the good Lord where to tell me that I could do only one exercise for the rest of my life, then my training program would be dead lifts.
So, watch those Brian Alsruhe youtube videos (or, find someone you like) and just go slow and light and get your form down and then go heavier. It is a mental thing.....
Hope that this helps!3 -
You might also want to consider a simple break - both from diet and from the gym. Consider three or four days....maybe even a week.
Eat at maintenance. Keep the NEAT up (take a walk every day, walk the dog, take the stairs, et al) and then come back refreshed. If you have been doing this for two years non-stop then your body is really in need. And, your brain as well.
Consider that....2 -
MrElculver2424 wrote: »So maybe I missed it, but I couldn't really get from your posts. You MUST barbell squat and deadlift. Combined with excess calories, those are the two biggest mass builders which will put muscle on all over your body. Also incorporate variety of rep ranges. Getting stronger in the 1 - 3 rep range will mean you can move more weight in the 10 - 12 rep range.
Ok, I created a new workout plan today, cutting my schedule down to 4 workout days per week instead of 6. Still hit each muscle group twice a week, but I combined more together.
I'll do more compound movements like squats, *real* bench press (I normally just do isolation chest machines), pull-ups, and maybe I'll try deadlifts. If I do, I can't ever go too heavy on deadlifts because I know several people who screwed up their backs by going too seriously with deadlifts.
There could be 2 reasons someone screws up their back doing deads. Either poor form. Form is critical on deads so that you are not depending on your back but using your legs and hips and the primary lift muscles. (yes, your back gets a little work too) Or, letting your ego get the best of you and pulling far too much weight. My 1rm is over 300 for deads but my work sets are 225 for 8 reps if I'm doing hypertrophy and 260 for 3 or 4 if I'm doing strength. I don't feel the need to pull my 1rm ever unless I've been working on strength and I want to test it.
Bottom line, done safely and with good form, no issues with injury. Get a form consult if unsure. They are a regular part of my programming and there are no issues with back injuries. I am much older than you at 66 BTW.2 -
Thanks for all the help guys! Really appreciate it. I will try to change my workouts so they gear more towards what we've talked about. And, take more rest days.2
-
MrElculver2424 wrote: »So maybe I missed it, but I couldn't really get from your posts. You MUST barbell squat and deadlift. Combined with excess calories, those are the two biggest mass builders which will put muscle on all over your body. Also incorporate variety of rep ranges. Getting stronger in the 1 - 3 rep range will mean you can move more weight in the 10 - 12 rep range.
Ok, I created a new workout plan today, cutting my schedule down to 4 workout days per week instead of 6. Still hit each muscle group twice a week, but I combined more together.
I'll do more compound movements like squats, *real* bench press (I normally just do isolation chest machines), pull-ups, and maybe I'll try deadlifts. If I do, I can't ever go too heavy on deadlifts because I know several people who screwed up their backs by going too seriously with deadlifts.
I fixed my back by deadlifting That was how I originally got into the gym, weak lower back from my desk job. That was 20 years ago! Haven't looked back. 2 -
... one of the biggest most aesthetic bodybuilders I know has never done deads or squats because of a permanent injury to his lower vertebrae. He's huge and thick and well proportioned.
Anyhow, OP - it's been touched on a couple of times but considering how long you have been lifting and how little weight you have gained (you never did a bulk/cut cycle) it seems that you settled on the slowest possible way to build mass - a super "lean" bulk or most likely a lot of time in a recomp. Probably not trying to progess your lifts either from what you are saying... progressive overload and all. PPL's also usually involve a LOT of volume and because of that volume you need rest. Now, I'd assume since you are doing that PPL x2 a week that you lowered the volume on the individual days? Eat more, get enough rest, and dial in your program. You are 21... this is the time of your life that gains should be easiest. You are nowhere near your genetic limits yet and should be able to pack on a lot of mass if you want.2 -
I read" not satisfied with thickness"
and thought- heh- you and most women out there.
#struggleisreal
7 -
^^^^^^^^^^^^ I think that you might have thought that we were in a different forum! The "chit chat" forum or so....LOL!0
-
I've done one bulk/cut cycle, but I must have high metabolism because I have to eat like a pig in order to gain just a little weight. So I didn't want to throw up every day from eating, so I settled on a "slow bulk" if you will. It's also hard when you're out and about and have to go several hours and hours without eating sometimes.
I'll try to up the calories even more, but it'll be difficult to accomplish day in and day out.0 -
What is your maintenance? And how much of a caloric surplus are you enjoying at the moment (he asks, sarcastically)?
EDIT - 3:18PM.....I missed your maintenance numbers in an earlier post. Maintenance is important to know as you go up (or down) from there. Is it super important? Well, kinda. Yes. Nutrition is going to take care of a lot of things for you - assuming that you get it right. If you get it "not so right", well, you know the saying....you can not out workout of a bad diet!
Also, consider taking a break! From both (nutrition and training). If you have been doing this for two years then you might just be amazed at what happens to you when you take three or four days (maybe even a week) off.....0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.3K Introduce Yourself
- 43.4K Getting Started
- 259.6K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 387 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.2K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.2K MyFitnessPal Information
- 22 News and Announcements
- 911 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions