Daughter going vegan.....help!!!!!
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Having parented 4 teenagers, 3 of them girls, and 2 who have done the "no meat or animal products because I'm socially concious and it's cruel" thing I found it to be a way for them to express their independance, exert some control over what has previously been out of their control (what food goes on the table) and they're not really serious about it for long. We didn't stop eating meat as a family on the whims of one child, and while we supported them and provided them with other options it didn't last long (6 months, a year) when they weren't eating what the family was eating, and the fridge was full of bacon and left over spag bol.0
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Iffin' I had a daughter, and they pulled that silliness, I'd take them duck hunting with me.-2
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barrypaulm wrote: »Google Dr John McDougall, Dr Neil Bernard, Dr Caldwell Esselstyn, DR Dean Ornish, and T Colin Campbell and watch their lectures on YouTube. They all promote a vegan diet for health.
They do all promote vegan diets, but sadly most of them cherry pick info and disregard other facts. As a vegan, I can't stand Colin Campbell and his book of lies- the china study. His heart may be in the right place, but his cognitive dissonance is strong as anyone I've ever met. Even his own conclusion doesn't support the evidence that he's cherry picked for his book- which is sad since he's the one who picked them…
I would also say stay away from Freelee that idiotic banana girl. Lastly I'll say that being vegan isn't a diet. It's a cruelty free lifestyle. Plant based is a diet. There are plenty of wack jobs in the vegan community just as there are in the animal consuming population as evident from some of these posts.
Don't listen to doctors unless they majored in nutrition- doctors know very little about nutrition. You wouldn't ask your mechanic for advice to fix your laptop, so don't expect proper advice from a doctor when it comes to nutrition- you probably know just as much as they do.0 -
In.... I love vegan threads.......they're fun.0
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Humans have shorter tails though.j/kjjrichard83 wrote: »
Omnivores and carnivores have a much shorter intestine system- 3-6 times the length of their body. Herbivores 8-12 times.. .Guess where humans fall? Roughly 11 times the length of their body.
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Ditto. Well said.Having parented 4 teenagers, 3 of them girls, and 2 who have done the "no meat or animal products because I'm socially concious and it's cruel" thing I found it to be a way for them to express their independance, exert some control over what has previously been out of their control (what food goes on the table) and they're not really serious about it for long. We didn't stop eating meat as a family on the whims of one child, and while we supported them and provided them with other options it didn't last long (6 months, a year) when they weren't eating what the family was eating, and the fridge was full of bacon and left over spag bol.
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A mother is being supportive and reaching out for help and she gets snarky unhelpful responses. Cute.
No steak would ever make me go back to eating meat. Or dairy, which I find to be way more disgusting than meat. Watch Forks over Knives and youll never look at dairy the same again.
In any case, the basics are tofu, tempeh, beans, lentils, split peas. I would imagine she'll want to cook and explore her new wonderful choice.
Ohsheglows.com is a favorite go to blog of mine that you or your daughter may want to check out.
I personally dont purchase fake meats or cheese all that often because just like anything else, processed food is full of crap. It can be a helpful tool to transition until you or her are more comfortable making full meals but vegan junk food is still junk food.
I get all of my vitamins and minerals from my daily diet without supplements, I take b12 twice a week. My calcium is just fine, dont believe the dairy hype that you arent getting enough.
While I do agree its a great idea to talk to a nutritionist, please do a bit of research first to find one that is open to "alternative" diets, hollistic healing etc. Someone not familiar with veganism could completely discourage her from moving forward.
If she wants to ask questions, there are several people on here perhaps she could contact directly, to avoid unwarranted feedback
Cheers to you being open and willing to assist her in this change!0 -
First of all, I applaud you for supporting your daughter in her choice. I also became vegetarian and then vegan as a teenager. My parents were very supportive. That was 20 years ago and I'm still vegan. It is important that she learns to cook her own food. As a vegan that is key. Hopefully you can help her with that.
Now for the list of great food blogs...
http://happyherbivore.com/ (plant based, healthy and you can buy weekly meal plans to make things easier)
http://blog.fatfreevegan.com
http://ohsheglows.com/
http://www.theppk.com/ (but even moreso her cookbooks)
http://www.olivesfordinner.com/
http://www.sarahbakesgfree.com/ (since you are also dealing with gluten intolerance)
http://www.veganricha.com/
There are a million others but those are my current favorites.0 -
Hello. I became a vegetarian when I was 12. I started eating meat again at 21. The reason? My hair was falling out ( I thought I was going bald!), I was lightheaded, my nails were breaking... I went to the doctor who ran some tests and it turned out I was missing iron, biotin and a bunch of other stuff. I was medicated and started eating meat again.
So if your daughter is going vegan she should do it properly with a professional's help (which should include blood work) and she probably will have to take vitamin supplements.
To avoid this problem make sure she increases her intake of greens and beans. One way to get in more greens is through green smoothies. There are a lot of recipes online.0 -
Fairly educated.jjrichard83 wrote: »What kind of POS do you have to be to hurt your hypothetical daughter by taking her duck hunting after she's already expressed to you that she's concerned about animal welfare? An uneducated one I bet.
Now hunting is harmful? LOL. Ignorance these days.
No, that's not what was "proven", there hasn't been a single study that's proven anything of the sort, my suggestion would be some research on your part. If those two comments are your opening salvo, I think you'll be hard pressed to have anything relevant to contribute.Dairy has been proven by hundreds of studies- including the Harvard School of Medicine for causing cancer- red meat the same, not to mention both are acid forming in the body.
GL.
LOL, no. Cows are pastured until the last 30-60 days where they are finished on grain. We all know this, how do you not know something so basic? Grass finished means they either went from ranch to slaughter, or their stay at the feedlot was on a grass diet, but that's economically ineffective for the feedlot because the purpose of the feedlot is to increase bulk (namely via intramuscular fat), as these animals are sold on a weight basis. Again, everyone knows this, how do you not?Lets assume you are ignorant and could care less about the animals for a moment- Consuming meat (especially factory farmed meat) from the sickest animals possible that are eating a sub-par diet to keep profits high. Even the "grass fed" ones are usually only grass finished- meaning they eat grass for the last month or two of their lives only.
Why would you eat from the sickest animals you can find? That's just crazy, silly, zealot strawman talk. lol.0 -
jjrichard83 wrote: »
Human use the enzymes in saliva to pre-digest carbohydrates. They also use their incisors/canines to tear meat. We have evolved as omnivores. Vegetarianism/veganism is a choice.0 -
geneticsteacher wrote: »jjrichard83 wrote: »
Human use the enzymes in saliva to pre-digest carbohydrates. They also use their incisors/canines to tear meat. We have evolved as omnivores. Vegetarianism/veganism is a choice.
Unpossible, only herbivores! lol.0 -
The girl is 15, not 6. She's old enough to decide what she prefers to eat. And she is also old enough to prepare her own food, if she doesn't like what is available. So, I am not seeing the problem with her choice to become vegan, like some others do.
My advice would be to teach her about macro nutrients and for the first few months, keep a close eye on her intake until she gets the hang of it. If she has a smart phone, have her download the MFP app so that she can see what she for herself what macros she is getting.0 -
Yes, I guess jjrichard83 has never been slobbered on by a dog (or bear!).geneticsteacher wrote: »jjrichard83 wrote: »
Human use the enzymes in saliva to pre-digest carbohydrates. They also use their incisors/canines to tear meat. We have evolved as omnivores. Vegetarianism/veganism is a choice.
I love idiotic vegan propaganda.0 -
I kind of have a similar situation. Maybe I can help you a little. ?
I am vegetarian...but mostly on a vegan diet. My husband is not vegetarian, but is gluten free. My step-daughter is none of the above, but is a damn picky eater! lol SOOO...I understand the challenges you have! Here's typically some of the things I do:- First of all, I make ONE meal a night. No short order cooking for anyone...myself included. If you don't like what I've cooked, I keep other options on hand all the time that you can cook for yourself.
- To accommodate for my GF hubby, that one has become very simple...it's all about substitutions. I just buy GF pastas, breads, flours, etc. There's a GF alternative for almost all wheat products. Some of them are great (almond flour, coconut flour, GF bread crumbs, etc), some are not so great (GF biscuits were a big fail for us!).
- To accommodate for my vegan diet, it can be a little tricky, but it's worth it IMO. For this, I will typically do one of two things. If it's a meal with meat and veggies combined, I'll just portion out a little for myself in a mini-casserole or mini-skillet and cook mine separately sans meat. If it's not, that's even easier...I'll just make 2-3 veggies on the side and just have those for dinner and leave the meat for the carnivores.
Other tips for vegan cooking:- You had a good list of vegan sources of protein going. Keep some Qrunch or Quorn products on hand in case she'd like to add that to her dinners.
- ALWAYS replace chicken stock with veggie stock in any recipes. Just because there's no solid meat in it, doesn't mean it's ok for a vegetarian/vegan.
- If she is vegan, you'll want to keep almond or coconut or rice milk on hand and replace your milk in recipes with this.
- Butter...please don't sub with margarine (blech!). Get Earth Balance. It's dairy free, all natural, and tastes all as good as butter.
- If a recipe calls for cheese, try to take some out for your daughter before you add it. Otherwise, try some dairy free cheeses (Daiya is really good).
- If your daughter is full vegan, she probably will not eat eggs. Eggs are the one non-vegan thing I do eat, so I can't help with that...they could be some kind of egg substitute on the market. ?
- Honey...most vegans don't eat it, but some are ok with it. Check with your daughter. Good replacements are agave nectar and molasses and pure maple syrup.
- NEVER EVER EVER try to *sneak* an animal product into your daughter's food. Respect her feelings about it (it sounds like you are) and never ever ever try to talk her out of it.
That's about all I can think of off the top of my head. Good for you for helping your daughter with her dietary choices!
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Beans, nuts, lentils.0
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AlyRoseNYC wrote: »The girl is 15, not 6. She's old enough to decide what she prefers to eat. And she is also old enough to prepare her own food, if she doesn't like what is available. So, I am not seeing the problem with her choice to become vegan, like some others do.
My advice would be to teach her about macro nutrients and for the first few months, keep a close eye on her intake until she gets the hang of it. If she has a smart phone, have her download the MFP app so that she can see what she for herself what macros she is getting.
She's too young to be on MFP.
Maybe Sparkteens?0 -
You have already received excellent information and I do not know what else to add.
I just want to applaud you for being such a caring, responsible mum. There is nothing more cruel than forcing a child/teenager to eat something they don't want to.
I've been vegetarian since I was 6 years old, vegan since age 18.
Both of my parents grew up on farms and are omnivores who will never change their mind. However, they have always supported my choices, though they did not care about whether I met my nutritional goals or not. (They didn't care about their nutritional needs either.)
If they had told me I had to eat meat or nothing at all, I would have eaten as little as possible - don't think that's healthy for a growing person.
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Show a keen interest in your daughter's knowledge. Let her teach you what she knows. She will listen when you listen. Veggies have lots of proteins....how else could gorillas be so strong? Atkins have low sugar protein drinks than can be sitting in your refrigerator with no hints about them. Perhaps she will take advantage of that based on her studies of the veggie diet. I eat lots of veggies as an 82 yr. old male, but occasionally (like last night) bake swai fish (budget), YELLOW PEPPERS, onions, and sliced sweet potatoes in garlic and coconut oil, along with some cooked frozen veggie mix. Verly healthy and I got those Omega 3 essentials. Be patient with those girls.0
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Yes, I guess jjrichard83 has never been slobbered on by a dog (or bear!).geneticsteacher wrote: »jjrichard83 wrote: »
Human use the enzymes in saliva to pre-digest carbohydrates. They also use their incisors/canines to tear meat. We have evolved as omnivores. Vegetarianism/veganism is a choice.
I love idiotic vegan propaganda.
Watch out, he'll call you a POS too! lol.
If ever there was a question the mods are asleep at the wheel.0 -
Evolution. Physiological adaptation. Size. Omnivorous diets.warriorguy wrote: »how else could gorillas be so strong?
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My daughter is 15 and still growing and I'm concerned about protein and other nutrients she will need. How do I (as the mom) provide well balanced meals/food options for her?
I also have a daughter who is 21 who is gluten free (celiacs)....it's definitely a challenge to meet everyone's needs. Fortunately my older daughter pretty much manages her own food (purchasing/preparing etc). But I will be the one to oversee my 15 year old's diet. She is doing it by choice and I have decided to support her choice best I can. I know that I will continue to eat meat/poultry/dairy/fish but she is choosing not to. The rest of the family (husband, son, and other daughter) all will be eating those things too.
Suggestions for other ways to get the nutrients she should have? Quinoa, nuts, avocado, peanut butter, soy products (soy beans/tofu), beans/legumes are some things I can think of she will eat. Obviously lots of fruits and veggies as well.
Thanks in advance!!
I would suggest going with her to buy some books in it together so you can both learn. I wouldn't rec a nutritionist because most are antivegan/vegetarian and receive little to no training on those diets. The nutritionist at my work saw me eating a bowl of quinoa with pea an and asked where I was getting protein smh
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I don't think children can "go vegan" unless their parents choose to support it. After all, you are the one that buys the food.0
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Some of these comments are so strange!! She can be PERFECTLY healthy being vegan. Good for you for supporting her. Getting protein is not hard as a vegetarian/vegan, getting iron is not hard, getting all the nutrients you need is not hard! With a little bit of research (no more than you'd need for eating healthy normally) she can figure out what is high in protein (I recommend lots of beans, almonds, etc.). Her hair will not fall out and she doesn't need to see a nutritionist (although most 15 year olds living on pizza and hamburger helper probably should).0
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tracyannk28 wrote: »Pedal_Pusher2point0 wrote: »Tell her to make her own food. Problem solved.
^^^^ and tell her she is responsible for purchasing her vegan food. Let me just tell you - vegan food is wicked expensive. Your grocery bill is going to skyrocket.
This is nonsense. Meat is so expensive!! Tofu, lentils, vegetables, etc. are so cheap!0 -
I live with a gluten free person, and I'm a vegetarian. One thing that has helped us all out a lot is to make plenty of rice dishes.
Some other things that work well with both:- Mushrooms - meaty and delicious. Not a lot of protein, but they help satisfy the meat urge.
- TVP - mix some dry tvp up with oil and soy sauce in a pan, heat it up, then put it away in a container in the fridge. Later when you want to use it, add some water and maybe more oil or soy sauce, and you've got a quick ground beef substitute.
- Beans - Beans are cheap, and if you don't have a lot of time there are plenty of canned varieties. If you add the beans to rice, you get a complete protein.
- Tortilla chips/corn tortillas - these are easy to get gluten free, and you can do a lot with them.
- Tofu - if you haven't cooked with it before, it's pretty easy. Either slice it thin and cook it in a frying pan with some sauce, or press it to drain the water from it. It takes on flavor like no one's business. It's chock full of protein, too.
- Soy protein powder - I make protein drinks and bars with this stuff. It's much cheaper than the whey version, and tastes decent too.
I recommend trying visiting your local asian food market, because they are likely to have lots of options that are both wheat and meat free. Thai dishes are also easy to do, lots of rice noodles there.0 -
tracyannk28 wrote: »Pedal_Pusher2point0 wrote: »Tell her to make her own food. Problem solved.
^^^^ and tell her she is responsible for purchasing her vegan food. Let me just tell you - vegan food is wicked expensive. Your grocery bill is going to skyrocket.
This is nonsense. Meat is so expensive!! Tofu, lentils, vegetables, etc. are so cheap!
^^^This.
My grocery bill has been SO low since I've stopped eating meat, and the hubby and kid eat much less of it. That used to be a HUGE expense.0 -
in0
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I had one thought in addition to all the recipe advice: I'd get her tested for celiac disease if she hasn't been in the last few years.
Most doctors either aren't aware of some of the celiac expert recommendations on family, or they just don't pass on the information, so just in case. Experts recommend that the entire family of a celiac get tested for celiac disease - with or without symptoms apparent - and if negative, get retested very 2-5 years. Because you are all in a much higher risk group to develop the disease (1 in 22), it can trigger at any age, and it can do damage for years before symptoms appear.
The reason I mention this is that with a dietary change like this, to veganism, IF your younger daughter happened to have undiagnosed celiac disease, there's more of a risk to her to be aware of. And some of the potential problem might not show symptoms for a few years, after damage has been done.
As an example, in studies, celiacs have less variety, and less numerous, gut bacteria than regular folks. However, vegans need a good level of gut bacteria or they actually can't break down and/or absorb some of the nutrients from plant sources as well as they need to (a good example of this is one of the main bacteria that breaks down oxalates and insures that calcium from plants can be absorbed in high enough amounts). I've known a few life long vegans who developed celiac disease and ended up having to shift to vegetarianism because they couldn't keep their nutrient levels up any more. :-(
Just something I thought might be good to be aware of, you know?0 -
It is possible to get all the nutrients you need on a vegan diet with a couple of things like vitamin B12 supplemented.
For women, iron is another consideration - it's possible to get enough iron on a vegan diet, but not always easy as vegetable sources of iron are not absorbed by the body so easily. Women lose iron every month and need a lot more of it in the diet than men do. Be on the alert for signs of iron deficiency anaemia and be prepared to supplement with iron if necessary. If there are no signs of deficiency, then eating plenty of dark green vegetables and vitamin C, and some vegan foods are fortified with iron so those are a good choice.
Protein's easy so long as you mix and match your vegetables correctly to ensure you get all the essential amino acids - combining whole grains and pulses is good, e.g. brown rice and lentils... hummus has both chickpeas (a pulse) and tahini (a grain)... it's not that hard to get enough protein, it just takes a little planning. Plus there are foods like tofu and quorn that are high in protein.
Just one last thing - what is your daughter's motivation for going vegan? If it's for health reasons, then maybe she needs to reconsider; while it's possible to be healthy on a vegan diet, an omnivorous diet containing plenty of fruits and veggies and not an excessive amount of fat and carbs can also be very healthy and there's no health reason to give up meat or animal products - like everything else, they should be eaten in moderation as part of a balanced diet. If animal welfare is her concern, then respect her decision on that and help her to plan her meals to get adequate nutrition.
Also, with regards planning meals for her and your other daughter - as it's her choice to be vegan, she should take an active role in planning her meals and help out with cooking etc. There's no reason why her decision to eat a particular diet should make more work for you - she's old enough to be helping in the kitchen.0
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