Any raw milk drinkers out there? Which would you prefer...
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Pop quiz hotshot!FunkyTobias wrote: »FYI 148>30.
And even if sprouts were just as dangerous as raw milk, this would be a reason to avoid sprouts, not consume raw milk.
When is 30>148?
When you look at magnitude of infection.
It's not even close. Again, FUD. Without actionable data.
Fine. What is the magnitude of infection from sprouts? And like I said before, if sprouts are more dangerous, this means you should avoid sprouts.
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Avoiding things because they are "possibly dangerous" isn't a healthy way to approach life. Everything comes with an element of risk.FunkyTobias wrote: »
Pop quiz hotshot!FunkyTobias wrote: »FYI 148>30.
And even if sprouts were just as dangerous as raw milk, this would be a reason to avoid sprouts, not consume raw milk.
When is 30>148?
When you look at magnitude of infection.
It's not even close. Again, FUD. Without actionable data.
Fine. What is the magnitude of infection from sprouts? And like I said before, if sprouts are more dangerous, this means you should avoid sprouts.
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Nestle Quick. Strawberry.0
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We have 2 deaths over a span of 13 years according to the CDC.
Avoiding things because they are "possibly dangerous" isn't a healthy way to approach life. Everything comes with an element of risk.FunkyTobias wrote: »
Pop quiz hotshot!FunkyTobias wrote: »FYI 148>30.
And even if sprouts were just as dangerous as raw milk, this would be a reason to avoid sprouts, not consume raw milk.
When is 30>148?
When you look at magnitude of infection.
It's not even close. Again, FUD. Without actionable data.
Fine. What is the magnitude of infection from sprouts? And like I said before, if sprouts are more dangerous, this means you should avoid sprouts.
Yes, and we need to weigh those risks carefully.
Can you die skydiving? Yes, but it's certainly a rush and a great way to say you've lived an adventurous and exciting life.
Can you die from raw milk? Yes. And...um...well some people say it tastes better? I guess...
Take risks, but be smart about it. Dying over the taste of milk is pretty stupid in my eyes.
Granted, they provide incomplete data, however 2 deaths in 13 years is essentially statistically insignificant in frequency. However, compared to bagged spinach, the 2006 bagged spinach recall was due to e.coli, that claimed 3 lives.
http://www.fda.gov/newsevents/newsroom/pressannouncements/2007/ucm108873.htm
That was just one occurrence, how many deaths would we see over the same period of time? If we're talking dangerous foodstuffs here, raw milk isn't the one to villify.
there's also incomplete data as to whether the illnesses and deaths from raw milk were from actual raw milk, or raw milk products. There are far more raw milk based products available than raw milk.
We're focusing on margins here, being concerned about something that isn't statistically significant.
Dying over the taste of spinach is pretty stupid in my eyes. 0 -
SherryTeach wrote: »I would never consume raw milk.
http://www.cdc.gov/foodsafety/rawmilk/raw-milk-questions-and-answers.html
My thought exactly. We started pasteurizing it for a reason.
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13 years of data show 2 deaths.
2. That's not statistically significant of anything. I mean hey, all you want, focus on the extreme dangers of those 2 deaths, when there is far "more dangerous" other foodstuffs out there. In the grand scheme of things though, it's wholly irrelevant.
I eat foie gras, sushi, undercooked beef. All risky undertakings, yet we don't have people deucing in their pants over it, is just that raw milk is a convenient novelty to hand wring and focus on.
Hell, just to throw this in the mix for the laughs is this:
http://www.realrawmilkfacts.com/PDFs/pasteurized-dairy-outbreak-table.pdf
Even pasteurized dairy isn't wholly safe, again, we're looking at statisically insignificant levels of sickness or death. It really is a non-issue. However, by all means, avoid it.
As for flavor, yeah, it tastes better. Just like eggs from hand raised chickens, and meat from non-industrial ag. Regardless of the increased risk trade off for all those things. I'm just glad there are choices. Even if there is a ton of FUD associated.0 -
13 years of data show 2 deaths.
2. That's not statistically significant of anything. I mean hey, all you want, focus on the extreme dangers of those 2 deaths, when there is far "more dangerous" other foodstuffs out there. In the grand scheme of things though, it's wholly irrelevant.
I eat foie gras, sushi, undercooked beef. All risky undertakings, yet we don't have people deucing in their pants over it, is just that raw milk is a convenient novelty to hand wring and focus on.
Hell, just to throw this in the mix for the laughs is this:
http://www.realrawmilkfacts.com/PDFs/pasteurized-dairy-outbreak-table.pdf
Even pasteurized dairy isn't wholly safe, again, we're looking at statisically insignificant levels of sickness or death. It really is a non-issue. However, by all means, avoid it.
As for flavor, yeah, it tastes better. Just like eggs from hand raised chickens, and meat from non-industrial ag. Regardless of the increased risk trade off for all those things. I'm just glad there are choices. Even if there is a ton of FUD associated.
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I'll look for the CDC report...
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/raw-milk-illness-rates-in-u-s-prompt-cdc-warning-1.11408450 -
I would prefer my milk pasteurized, please-and-thank-you.0
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I'll look for the CDC report...
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/raw-milk-illness-rates-in-u-s-prompt-cdc-warning-1.1140845
Unfortunately, lacks data. As in rate of death per 100k.
Hell, even rate of illness per 100k. So you can at least make a coherent comparison to other things.
Also, the 2 deaths that I got were from the CDC's own page on milk, nothing was said of 3.
Again, the FUD looks great, but we're not getting actual actionable data. It's really no different from the folks that say you shouldn't use raw eggs in cocktails. I've still never found quality, actionable data showing it's dangerous.
*shrug*0 -
Long time advocate of raw milk. If you have time and are interested, search out the history of milk pasteurization in the US. It's quite interesting.
Also of historical interest: You are more likely to die from pasturized milk than raw milk.
http://realrawmilkfacts.com/PDFs/pasteurized-dairy-outbreak-table.pdf
The largest recorded outbreak of food borne illness caused by milk is pasteurize milk in 1985....20, 000 confirmed cases of salmonella--over 200,000 people ill, 10 people died.
That is just one outbreak, in one month of one year. That same year 47 people died from eating pasteurized queso fresco.....and the list goes on.
Of the 2 deaths from raw milk? Both deaths are from raw cheese...associated with raw milk. What is interesting to me is that you won't find statistics on the CDC website warning of the dangers of pasturized milk--but of raw milk. Interesting to say the least!0 -
Posters are hung up on dearths from raw milk. Usually only the very young or old or those with compromised immune systems are at highest risk of death from any pathogen. Let's look at illnesses. I'm not interested in getting ill from something which was preventable since ages ago. The problem doesn't stem from users who know the source farmer or buy a share in their own animal, it's the fact that milk needs to be mass produced therefore certain regulations like pasteurization need to be in place.
I'm pretty sure the regulations for hormone content are more stringent in Canada as well so I can't speak to US milk production.0 -
Wow so much hate on raw milk, I LOVE my milk shares.0
This discussion has been closed.
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