The Beginner's Guide To Bulking : How to Develop Quality Mass the CORRECT Way
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FromHereOnOut wrote: »
despite the fact I didn't agree with the opening- I have to agree- he was speaking to a specific audience- and it is the gaining weight section.
I just didn't care of that opener- but- as it has been pointed out- most of his stuff is solid.
For women- specifically- I wouldn't bulk at anything over 25%- it's just to much work to cut- and you deal with significantly more mental side impacts of "I'm fat" that feeling is stronger- and more pronounced.
You point out the 25% cutoff b/c it's too much work to cut after, but what would you say to someone who just can't seem to lose fat? I've tried and tried but am getting nowhere except for the occasional 2 lbs lost then gained again shortly. I've dieted much of my life due mostly to the fact that I didn't understand that I was skinny fat and it was "lean" that I was seeking, not "skinny". So naturally I did it on very low cal dieting and barely getting out of bed because I was so wrecked. If I had known better, I would never have done that, but there was no internet, just stupid magazines telling me to eat 1200 and me being an overachiever and thus going for 800. Sigh. So now, I'm hitting the gym with a muscle-growing workout while trying to lose fat and just spinning my wheels. I finally decided this week that I just can't do it any longer and I'd rather eat at maintenance and above, to try to build some muscle. And I know it won't be easy, but neither has what I've been doing with no results. I don't know what my bf% is, only that I have muffintop, belly, thighs, and back fat that I can grab and squish and I hate it, but I love my biceps which have somehow grown since training, and I'd like to have that same feeling about my legs and chest, etc, but I don't think those larger muscles will grow accidentally, so I need to feed them. The hope is that I can add some muscle that will help make cutting easier. I know as a woman I can't expect too much muscle gain, but I always had twigs for arms and legs in my skinny fat quest (the skinny was limbs, the fat was trunk), so I think I have a lot of untapped potential that might help me gain well in those areas.
Tl;dr, I might be part of that "90%" he was talking to, having been skinny fat most of my life. Is bulking "worth a try" for a HUnGRY overfat female who is totally stuck in her weight Loss, going nowhere fast?
P.s. Also I am recovering from ankle, calf problem, so I can't run right now either (which I love), so with no chance of cardio (even jumping jacks etc bother calves), might make it a good time to focus on muscle building too, right??
What would someone say to you? Depends on your stats. What's your exact bf%, weight, height etc.
I have bulked at well over optimal bf (30ish) with great results and am doing so again now (I'm in the high 20s whereas for optimal results I should wait till sub 24%). It's about personal goals, how you feel, if you can mentally cope with gaining some fat too etc.
Regardless of your stats, I don't think eating at maintenance while lifting heavy is going to do anyone any harm. It'd get your metabolism back on track (although I find tales of metabolic damage to be over exaggerated, at best), let you gain some strength in the weight room and put a halt to any deterioration you're causing to bone density with such low cals (in the past, I understand) and cardio.
However, it's very unlikely that you'd gain much in the way of muscle eating at maintenance (even less with a 'muscle-growing' while still at deficit plan). You can't do both (except maybe for a few months if you're new to strength training or very overweight).
Do a bit more research and decide what your short term and long term goals are. The link to waldo's site, Jo provided is a good one, there's also great points in the OP here and the 'women who bulk' group has great threads if you have time to go through them.
I would agree that women have a harder time cutting but it's not impossible. If your eating at deficit and not losing then you have to go over what you're doing with a fine tooth comb - get the food scales back out, log EVERYTHING and if that isn't working then it's a visit to the doctors because if you are truly at deficit then you should be losing.
Good luck with it. ^ doesn't sound like it from my post! but bulking is great fun if you decide to give it a shot.
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Thanks for the replies. I wasn't trying to thread jack, but when I saw the 90% comment, I thought "yes! That's me!", then all the criticism about that comment later just burst my bubble, so I felt lost again. I will post my own thread after I can collect my thoughts and perhaps take some pics or measurements. Thanks, and sorry for the thread jack.0
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The 90% criticism, I feel, was justified because most of us coming in here are trying to gain or have gained in the past.
Don't be put off coming in this section - there's great advice to be had if you decide to go that way.0 -
Yes, I stalk this board and the women bulking group often because of the quality of people and information relative to my own goals (for strength and muscles...but also leanness).0
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FromHereOnOut wrote: »
despite the fact I didn't agree with the opening- I have to agree- he was speaking to a specific audience- and it is the gaining weight section.
I just didn't care of that opener- but- as it has been pointed out- most of his stuff is solid.
For women- specifically- I wouldn't bulk at anything over 25%- it's just to much work to cut- and you deal with significantly more mental side impacts of "I'm fat" that feeling is stronger- and more pronounced.
You point out the 25% cutoff b/c it's too much work to cut after, but what would you say to someone who just can't seem to lose fat? I've tried and tried but am getting nowhere except for the occasional 2 lbs lost then gained again shortly. I've dieted much of my life due mostly to the fact that I didn't understand that I was skinny fat and it was "lean" that I was seeking, not "skinny". So naturally I did it on very low cal dieting and barely getting out of bed because I was so wrecked. If I had known better, I would never have done that, but there was no internet, just stupid magazines telling me to eat 1200 and me being an overachiever and thus going for 800. Sigh. So now, I'm hitting the gym with a muscle-growing workout while trying to lose fat and just spinning my wheels. I finally decided this week that I just can't do it any longer and I'd rather eat at maintenance and above, to try to build some muscle. And I know it won't be easy, but neither has what I've been doing with no results. I don't know what my bf% is, only that I have muffintop, belly, thighs, and back fat that I can grab and squish and I hate it, but I love my biceps which have somehow grown since training, and I'd like to have that same feeling about my legs and chest, etc, but I don't think those larger muscles will grow accidentally, so I need to feed them. The hope is that I can add some muscle that will help make cutting easier. I know as a woman I can't expect too much muscle gain, but I always had twigs for arms and legs in my skinny fat quest (the skinny was limbs, the fat was trunk), so I think I have a lot of untapped potential that might help me gain well in those areas.
Tl;dr, I might be part of that "90%" he was talking to, having been skinny fat most of my life. Is bulking "worth a try" for a HUnGRY overfat female who is totally stuck in her weight Loss, going nowhere fast?
P.s. Also I am recovering from ankle, calf problem, so I can't run right now either (which I love), so with no chance of cardio (even jumping jacks etc bother calves), might make it a good time to focus on muscle building too, right??
What would someone say to you? Depends on your stats. What's your exact bf%, weight, height etc.
I have bulked at well over optimal bf (30ish) with great results and am doing so again now (I'm in the high 20s whereas for optimal results I should wait till sub 24%). It's about personal goals, how you feel, if you can mentally cope with gaining some fat too etc.
Regardless of your stats, I don't think eating at maintenance while lifting heavy is going to do anyone any harm. It'd get your metabolism back on track (although I find tales of metabolic damage to be over exaggerated, at best), let you gain some strength in the weight room and put a halt to any deterioration you're causing to bone density with such low cals (in the past, I understand) and cardio.
However, it's very unlikely that you'd gain much in the way of muscle eating at maintenance (even less with a 'muscle-growing' while still at deficit plan). You can't do both (except maybe for a few months if you're new to strength training or very overweight).
Do a bit more research and decide what your short term and long term goals are. The link to waldo's site, Jo provided is a good one, there's also great points in the OP here and the 'women who bulk' group has great threads if you have time to go through them.
I would agree that women have a harder time cutting but it's not impossible. If your eating at deficit and not losing then you have to go over what you're doing with a fine tooth comb - get the food scales back out, log EVERYTHING and if that isn't working then it's a visit to the doctors because if you are truly at deficit then you should be losing.
Good luck with it. ^ doesn't sound like it from my post! but bulking is great fun if you decide to give it a shot.
This.
I would say the same thing-
> give more details
> visuals
> goals
but really -it's personal choice.
There is nothing to say you CANNOT bulk above 25%- but you have to be aware of the downsides to that.
elaine bulked high- as did I. And like I said the difficulties exists.
I chose to bulk on the high side because I wanted to hit certain weight goals- meaning I was trying to pull 300 pound dead lift. I'm now back down to pre-bulk weight- I'm certainly bigger- I do not look nearly as cut as I did at this weight last year- but I'm having a devil of a time trying to get below this weight now.
Had I waited lost some more weight- I suspect I wouldn't' be in these same shoes this year. But it is what it is- I hit 305 and was happy. And I got bigger. WIN.
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+1 to all of this ^^^
The key take-away with this whole guide/outline should be that it is nothing other than that...a guideline. It is not set in stone, it is not the be-all, end-all of bulking and the rules you HAVE to follow to be successful.
It's simply an outline I've constructed based on personal experience partnered with a bit of research adn science based data.
Does it mean it is the only option? Absolutley not.
At the end of the day you have to pick the route you are going to be happiest with, because if you aren't happy doing what you're doing, you're much less likely to be successful.
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LolBroScience wrote: »
He did claim 90% of people don't have enough muscle to justify losing weight. I'm allowed to be a little facetious in this case.
LMFAO. You're a big dude, I'm sure you're part of the elusive 10%
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LolBroScience wrote: »
He did claim 90% of people don't have enough muscle to justify losing weight. I'm allowed to be a little facetious in this case.
Why take it personally though? Are you intent on bulking now?0 -
I'm 226lbs. Should I bulk? Because another shredded dude said to lose weight first and bulk after I get to 10%. Could a third shredded dude chime in and I'll do a 2/3 majority thing?
I'm sorry- Every time I see you're new picture it looks like a girl *kitten* raping a dude bent over.
I'm sorry. I laugh.
Ever.
Time.
please post more- my coworker is on the rag it seems- and he's dreadful when he's like that.0 -
beastcompany wrote: »Introduction
Why?
Because 9/10 of you starting your fitness journey do not have any reasonable amount of muscle mass that would justify you cutting or losing weight.
Could you cite your source for this please?0 -
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we have a machine for it at my gym- so after I clicked and saw what it was- I figured it out. But still.
the thumbnail doesn't look like weighted calve raises- at all.
So I chuckle quiet a bit.
Would be have been funnier if you left off the calf raise part of that... because if it was Ahhhhnold and a some other guy doing "it" as previously posted.. would be funny.
Just because that for some reason would amuse me. I'm effed up- I know.0 -
madrose0715 wrote: »beastcompany wrote: »your rather good advice is lost when you open with bullsh!t crap like this
it's insulting and insipid.
"you should bulk because you don't have any muscle- because 90%of you are muscle-less"
I highly doubt that 90% of the people here are at a place where they need to bulk.
There is no insult intent behind the post, it's more the simple truth that the large majority of new trainees do not have the sufficient base of lean mass that would justify them cutting to start their training career.
If yourself, or others, are offended by the statement I apologize it comes across in that manner, but in no way does it discredit the legitimacy of the information provided.
The post will stand as I've created it and if others are offended, well that sucks but at the end of the day you're not going to make everyone happy.
I'm here to share information and assist others on getting off on the right foot, not baby feelings and worry if I've upset someone.
The problem with:
""you should bulk because you don't have any muscle- because 90%of you are muscle-less"
is it tells the readers that you do not know the audience who is reading this thread. You are in essence, telling men and women who are obese and morbidly obese that they should not cut but bulk because they are muscle-less. Wrong.
For what you are calling a beginner's guide to bulking, you have alienated alot of people with that comment because until someone who is obese, morbidly obese and even some classified as overweight, has done their cut to a more appropriate body fat level doing a bulk first would be likely medically unadvisable at best and physchologically and physically damaging at worst.
I don't think that obese people are going to be browsing the "gaining weight" section for advice....0 -
OP - this is a good beginner guide and is similar to advice that I have been given when asking about a first bulk. I agree with LOLBro that some additional information on psychological affects would be nice, but that would make this post even longer. I was going to do a bulk a year ago but totally chickened out because of fear of too much fat gain, which I now realize is stupid. I am about 8 weeks into my bulk and have been adding about .5 pound per week ..however, came down with stomach virus last week which has slowed me down a bit...0
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Not sure if trolling, or just total lack of ability to comprehend sarcasm...either way, you're failing.I'm 226lbs. Should I bulk? Because another shredded dude said to lose weight first and bulk after I get to 10%. Could a third shredded dude chime in and I'll do a 2/3 majority thing?
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This discussion has been closed.
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