is it impossible to do this?

rainbowbow

You CAN do it!


Here's my outlook on the whole thing.


1.) You are morbidly obese which puts you at severly higher risk of poor healing and complications as far as surgery goes. Going into an ELECTIVE surgery like this should only be done as an absolute last resort.

2.) Once you have the surgery you will be FORCED for the rest of your life PERMANENTLY to consume small portions of food. It is PERMANENTLY altering your body to consume less calories; when you could be eating less calories WITHOUT it.

3.) It can cause vitamin deficiencies and you can only eat small portions for the rest of your life. Worth it when you could just eat less now and develop healthier habits?


I dont know.... for me... i would just rather eat less (you'll have to anyway), lose the weight, and elect to spend my money on skin removal once i'd reach my goal than spend thousands of dollars to have someone surgically and permanently remove my ability to enjoy certain foods later in life (especially because you're my age! we're young, come on!) . Lastly, i see no reason to risk having a potentially dangerous surgery unless it's NECESSARY.

Zedeff

@stevencloser and @jenncornelsen

stevencloser wrote: »

People who do get surgery face the same failure rate, maybe even higher.

jenncornelsen wrote: »

this totally depends on the study. i have seen some where the percentage who regain the weight is 90%. 20% is the most positive i have ever heard!

[citation needed]

jenncornelsen

Average Weight Gain After Gastric Bypass Surgery

The average excess weight lost following laparoscopic gastric bypass surgery is almost 70% (in other words, at 100 pounds overweight the average patient loses almost 70 pounds). And many patients have seen results of well over 80%.

"Most patients keep at least 50% of their excess weight off after 10 years."
But once you reach your low point (called your “nadir”), will you start heading in the opposite direction? Unfortunately, it's very likely.

As many as 80% of patients eventually gain a little weight back after hitting their nadir.1 In addition, the more time that passes following surgery, the more likely patients are to gain some weight back.2

On average, patients who gain weight back see about 8% of their old weight return within 5 years of surgery.3 So if a patient is one of the 80% who gains weight back, was 100 pounds overweight and lost 70 pounds from surgery, on average she can expect to gain back about 8 pounds.

The good news is that most patients (about 80% of morbidly obese and 65% of super obese) keep at least 50% of their excess weight off after 10 years.2

- See more at: http://www.bariatric-surgery-source.com/weight-gain-after-gastric-bypass.html#sthash.lLasEYrA.dpuf

jenncornelsen

so they almost all gain. but not much. they source i had seen before did not state that it might only be like 10lb. it simply stated 80% gain. so its actually quite positive the numbers i suppose!

Zedeff

What you posted does not in any way support your earlier comment. Gaining 8% of weight loss back is not the same as saying that "90% of people regain the weight they lost."

Here's a fun fact: 100% of people who don't have surgery weigh more than they did at their nadir.

jenncornelsen

Zedeff wrote: »

What you posted does not in any way support your earlier comment. Gaining 8% of weight loss back is not the same as saying that "90% of people regain the weight they lost."

Here's a fun fact: 100% of people who don't have surgery weigh more than they did at their nadir.

if they don't diet or exercise right? or are u agreeing with her dr?

rainbowbow

Zedeff wrote: »

@stevencloser and @jenncornelsen

stevencloser wrote: »

People who do get surgery face the same failure rate, maybe even higher.

jenncornelsen wrote: »

this totally depends on the study. i have seen some where the percentage who regain the weight is 90%. 20% is the most positive i have ever heard!

[citation needed]

"Long Term Weight Regain after Gastric Bypass: A 5 year prospective Study"
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18392907

"Weight regain was observed within 24 months after surgery in approximately 50% of patients. Both weight regain and surgical failure were higher in the superobese group. Studies in regard to metabolic and hormonal mechanisms underlying weight regain might elucidate the causes of this finding. "


"Long-Term Results of Primary Vertical Banded Gastroplasty"
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25519773

"One hundred fifty-two patients (39 %) out of 227 patients (58 %) with long-term complaints underwent revisional surgery. Main reasons for revision were weight regain and vomiting/food intolerance."


"Long-term results after laparoscopic adjustable gastric banding: a mean fourteen year follow-up study"
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25066440

"Average follow-up was 13.6 (± 2.0) years (163 mo) and 99% of patients with complete follow-up. Two thirds of patients reached an excess weight loss (EWL)>50% at some point after LAGB placement. However, due to insufficient weight loss or complications in 53% of patients, the LAGB had to be removed or converted to a Roux-en-Y gastric bypass."



these are just a few i've read. But it seems like most weight loss surgeries require revisions because the patients did not maintain weight loss or suffered complications such as vomiting, nutritional deficiencies, device failures, etc.


As i stated above, if diet/exercise can be controlled and maintained, why even go through the surgery? Or... why not atleast try? If surgery is NEEDED, fine. But i'm not convinced it is in most people. It's a business, and i see no reason why they would try and recommend the methods above first. After all, it's cutting into their salary.

akiba254

Do you have a specific medical condition? If its just metabolic syndrome or something then definitely diet and exercise will work.

Zedeff

@rainbowbow thank you for posting actual studies but these aren't exactly compelling.

For starters, the lap band (Laparoscopic Adjustable Gastric Banding) is not a conventional bariatric surgery. When we consent patients for lap bands we tell them that >33% of people won't lose weight and >33% of people will have a complication resulting in band failure. So you wonder why anyone would have it? The answer is that it's safe and easily reversible. It's an expensive non-commital option, but at the expense of higher failure rates.

Regarding the second link (vertical banded gastroplasty), this is an old surgical technique that is abandoned in many parts of the world. I don't think anyone in my country (Canada) performs VBG surgery any longer; hence it's not a great result to argue against bariatric surgery.

The first study you linked pertains to gastric bypass which is a common and conventional bariatric surgery. It says that a half of patients regain some weight with a mean weight regain of 8% of their loss after 5 years. I think you will find that this is actually far superior to weight maintenance after losses from diet and exercise.

kodijhill

Ok so

kodijhill wrote: »

So is it really impossible to lose weight without surgery? That's what my doctor tells me they say because the stomach sends out hormones that make u stay fat over a extended amount of time of being heavy I just don't see why it's impossible all doctors I've gone to say well u can try as hard as you like but you will need the surgery anyway so might as well do it now it's very discouraging

Ok so it's a regular doctor and it's the second one I went to first time ever seeing her I told her how I've been losing weight etc I have my stuff together she just didn't believe me she said I quote it doesn't matter how hard you work you cant loose weight but most likely you will gain it all back so I think you should consider surgery in the near future and she went to say I probably need a sleep study Becuz I most likely have sleep apnea which I no I don't remember this is first time meeting her. She then went going on about how it would take a year to even get surgery etc I heard the word surgery 15 times or more and she didn't care one word about how I exercise 4-5 days a week and she tells me well are u staying away from carbs I said yes and she said what diet to you follow I said I don't it's a life style change I'm changing my eating habits and eating less moving more she didn't like that said I Gould try a diet plan. I've done them all she then said how long have u been overweight I said since I was 3 she then said surgery is only option an that I can try doing what I'm doing but if she doesn't see results in two months she says then we will look at surgeries she almost made me feel like she was In control of me not myself. This is the second doctor in the same building who said surgery and any ailments I went in for was because of my weight which wasn't always true. But it gets discouraging when I'm busting my *kitten* yea it may be coming off slow but it's coming off and all I hear from doctors even relatives is I need surgery the only thing I have is a slow thyroid. Yea I have about 100+ pounds to lose but I know I can do this and I know it's not going to come off over night I'm on the right track but I guess I'm tired of people telling me I'm going to fail unless I take half my stomach out

echmainfit619

Get new doctors. And while you're at it, get new relatives.

PeachyCarol

Don't the hormonal factors mentioned readjust themselves once the weight loss is maintained for a while?

I believe I've read that yes, there's an initial problem with ghrelin, but it's not lasting. The key is to be aware and have strategies for dealing with this, I would think.

chelsy0587

kristalynnep wrote: »

The only person who can determine your success is you.

Seconded.

beachhouse758

Is your doctor a surgeon? if so, that's probably why he is offering surgery as the only option. (surgery = $$$ to him)

I didn't read the entire thread, so I don't know whether you have 75 lbs to lose and have a few health issues as a result; or if you have 400 lbs to lose and have severe health issues that leave no other choice.

At any chance, whenever surgery is a option and death is not eminent, I ask: have you exhausted every sensible, non-surgical option?

Are you willing to do whatever it takes to lose the weight without surgery?

Would you rather have surgery? if so, do your homework in order to make an informed decision. If you decide for surgery you must willing to accept all the possible complications.

But if you don't want to have surgery and your life is not a risk by avoiding it, then why have it?

If you are happy with the progress you are making, then keep at it.

If you are not happy with your progress, then change something: seek the advice a nutritionist, become even more active. If you have emotional issues behind your weight/overeating, then speak to a therapist that can help you overcome those issues.
You mention that you have thyroid issues, so I am assuming that you are under the care of an endocrinologist. See if your endocrinologist can refer you to a good nutritionist.

Make yourself a priority and become your own health advocate.

I think you know that by asking a question like that on MFP, the answer is going to be "Yes, you can do it!" It would be a different story if you had asked the same question in a bariatric surgery support forum.

This forum is a great source of support and information. And the payoff is even greater when you take advantage of the features such as the food tracking and the exercise log etc..
Just reading the "Success Stories" section will give you inspiration and show you that it is possible to lose weight even when the road to success may be difficult.

When you know in your heart that you are doing all you can to achieve your goal it becomes a lot easier to ignore the naysayers. Try to surround yourself with people that support your goals and your lifestyle. You can do this.

EmmaFitzwilliam

o.O How much do you want to lose? What are your underlying medical conditions? What medications are you taking? Some medications have weight gain as a side effect, and it can be *really* hard to overcome the effects. I would, as the other posters suggested, check out the "Success Stories" board, and possibly google "extreme weight loss no surgery".

http://healthyeater.com/extreme-weight-loss-no-surgery

There is also a blog "Jim Gettin' Slim".

http://healthyliving.azcentral.com/lose-weight-morbidly-obese-5792.html

Personally, I would skip step 4, but that's just me.

Really, it depends on too many variables for anybody to give you an answer, although "get a new doctor" has a lot of support.


I fell shy of the "morbidly obese" category by 10 pounds - I had 90 to lose. I have lost nearly 65, without surgery, and without an extreme diet plan.

*But* - my issue was almost exclusively poor choices and portion control. I have no underlying medical issues, and no food allergies to limit me.

I choose, every day, to be conscious of my portions and of the nutritional balance of what I eat. I don't manage ideal choices, but I have a really happy day to day relationship with what I eat and what I weigh.

It's *hard*. It's absolutely hard. It requires a certain amount of emotional energy, dedication, careful grocery shopping, and informed choices. But it can be done.

SueInAz

kodijhill wrote: »

Ok so

kodijhill wrote: »

So is it really impossible to lose weight without surgery? That's what my doctor tells me they say because the stomach sends out hormones that make u stay fat over a extended amount of time of being heavy I just don't see why it's impossible all doctors I've gone to say well u can try as hard as you like but you will need the surgery anyway so might as well do it now it's very discouraging

Ok so it's a regular doctor and it's the second one I went to first time ever seeing her I told her how I've been losing weight etc I have my stuff together she just didn't believe me she said I quote it doesn't matter how hard you work you cant loose weight but most likely you will gain it all back so I think you should consider surgery in the near future and she went to say I probably need a sleep study Becuz I most likely have sleep apnea which I no I don't remember this is first time meeting her. She then went going on about how it would take a year to even get surgery etc I heard the word surgery 15 times or more and she didn't care one word about how I exercise 4-5 days a week and she tells me well are u staying away from carbs I said yes and she said what diet to you follow I said I don't it's a life style change I'm changing my eating habits and eating less moving more she didn't like that said I Gould try a diet plan. I've done them all she then said how long have u been overweight I said since I was 3 she then said surgery is only option an that I can try doing what I'm doing but if she doesn't see results in two months she says then we will look at surgeries she almost made me feel like she was In control of me not myself. This is the second doctor in the same building who said surgery and any ailments I went in for was because of my weight which wasn't always true. But it gets discouraging when I'm busting my *kitten* yea it may be coming off slow but it's coming off and all I hear from doctors even relatives is I need surgery the only thing I have is a slow thyroid. Yea I have about 100+ pounds to lose but I know I can do this and I know it's not going to come off over night I'm on the right track but I guess I'm tired of people telling me I'm going to fail unless I take half my stomach out

It sounds to me like you have the right attitude.

My very best friend was in the same place you are about a decade ago. We had just started working together at the time. She's about 5'0" and weighed 291 pounds when she realized it was time to make a change. She was pre-diabetic and had difficulty doing anything physical. Her doctor and her family advised surgery but she knew she could do it herself through diet and exercise. So she did.

Because of the diabetes situation, she started on Atkins, cut her carbs and her calories. She and I went on a diet "together". Although I only needed to lose 10 pounds or so, I knew it would help to have someone who was going through it with her. We walked on our breaks, would take turns bringing in low carb "treats" to share and tracked our progress together. 9 months later she was down to 170 pounds and when I saw her in February (she moved away a few years ago) she's still maintaining that weight. Yes, she's still a bit heavy for her height but she's certainly more healthy and active and, most importantly, happy.

The point is, you can do this if you really want to. From what you're saying you've already made the changes you need to make. Don't get discouraged and just keep insisting to your family, friends and doctor that you can do it on your own. And then do it.

sandryc79

There is a group on my fitness pal called 100 lbs and NO surgery you might find inspiring. They have a comment thread about Dr's going on right now and a lot of people there have lost a lot without surgery.