trainers or professional bodybuilders opinion needed
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ScottJTyler wrote: »If you don't believe the pictures and dismiss the BIA data then there's not much more I can do for you. Like I said, I'm aware that it can give crappy results sometimes but it seems to be showing what I expect it to for now so I'm convinced by it.
Well, there you have it. Like I said earlier: it's the "I want to believe" method.0 -
At no point did I say the 13.2lbs was all muscle. I said I gained that weight and got leaner. But it is too large a gain in weight to attribute it to water/food/glycogen in order to get it to fit into your absolute scientific certainty of 0.5lbs of muscle gain/week. Yes I gained weight partly in food/water/glycogen/bone density/whatever but not 8.2lbs worth or 62% of it. Seems like too much. I lost fat as well so my FFM most likely increased by more than 13.2lbs. But I thought I wouldn't even mention that.
Sounds legit!
How are you making the categorical assumption that its muscle - what are your assumptions? The BIA device?. Also, that would imply that you lost muscle and gained muscle in the degree of lbs daily? Really? How does that even make sense to you?
BTW: additional glycogen, water etc etc can easily account for 8lbs. But you do not want to believe that.
Also, you seem to have missed my point about newb gains. It is possible for some to gain more than 0.5lb of muscle a week, particularly when returning back to lifting (like newb gains), but posting as if people are their own limiting factor and you can sustain a higher than average muscle gain is disingenuous and just not true - it also totally ignores genetics. Your results more recently do not exactly make the argument for you. The 0.5lb is not a hard number, but people claiming results way outside that will be called into question, especially when they do not have a single piece of credible data to back it up.
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ScottJTyler wrote: »If you don't believe the pictures and dismiss the BIA data then there's not much more I can do for you. Like I said, I'm aware that it can give crappy results sometimes but it seems to be showing what I expect it to for now so I'm convinced by it.
Well, there you have it. Like I said earlier: it's the "I want to believe" method.
No confirmation bias there...nope...none whatsoever0 -
At no point did I say the 13.2lbs was all muscle. I said I gained that weight and got leaner. But it is too large a gain in weight to attribute it to water/food/glycogen in order to get it to fit into your absolute scientific certainty of 0.5lbs of muscle gain/week. Yes I gained weight partly in food/water/glycogen/bone density/whatever but not 8.2lbs worth or 62% of it. Seems like too much. I lost fat as well so my FFM most likely increased by more than 13.2lbs. But I thought I wouldn't even mention that.
Sounds legit!
How are you making the categorical assumption that its muscle - what are your assumptions? The BIA device?. Also, that would imply that you lost muscle and gained muscle in the degree of lbs daily? Really? How does that even make sense to you?
BTW: additional glycogen, water etc etc can easily account for 8lbs. But you do not want to believe that.
Also, you seem to have missed my point about newb gains. It is possible for some to gain more than 0.5lb of muscle a week, particularly when returning back to lifting (like newb gains), but posting as if people are their own limiting factor and you can sustain a higher than average muscle gain is disingenuous and just not true - it also totally ignores genetics. Your results more recently do not exactly make the argument for you. The 0.5lb is not a hard number, but people claiming results way outside that will be called into question, especially when they do not have a single piece of credible data to back it up.
Right there is the biggest problem, IMO. We know the data is inaccurate, as evidenced by the wild daily swings in what you think is total muscle mass. With inaccurate data, no meaningful conclusions can be drawn - because you/we don't actually know what the real values are at any particular point.
eta: Just to reiterate what others have mentioned - you've obviously done a good job at getting and maintaining your physique. Nobody is saying otherwise. In fact, that part I'd say is admirable. But the numbers you're throwing about don't make any lick of sense and the data you've shown is - quite simply - bad.0 -
My scale does BIA. This morning I weighed 195 pounds with 28.4% body fat. After breakfast and lunch I weighed 198 pounds with 26.6% body fat. That means I gained 5.7 pounds of lean mass since I woke up.0
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The fact that your numbers are all over the place - from day to day - should tell you right away your method is utter crap
Seriously - look at the last entry for "Muscle lbs." You really think you gained 1.9 lbs of muscle overnight?
He seems to think LBM = muscle and place too much reliance on the accuracy of BIAs that are notoriously inaccurate.
Also, when returning to lifting, I can easily gain 5lb in water/glycogen and I have less muscle mass so someone with more could easily gain more.
When I switch to a bulk from maintenance - I gain almost exactly 7lbs in the first week or so. This appears to be how much water I retain, so your 5lbs sounds right.0 -
At no point did I say the 13.2lbs was all muscle. I said I gained that weight and got leaner. But it is too large a gain in weight to attribute it to water/food/glycogen in order to get it to fit into your absolute scientific certainty of 0.5lbs of muscle gain/week. Yes I gained weight partly in food/water/glycogen/bone density/whatever but not 8.2lbs worth or 62% of it. Seems like too much. I lost fat as well so my FFM most likely increased by more than 13.2lbs. But I thought I wouldn't even mention that.
Sounds legit!
How are you making the categorical assumption that its muscle - what are your assumptions? The BIA device?. Also, that would imply that you lost muscle and gained muscle in the degree of lbs daily? Really? How does that even make sense to you?
BTW: additional glycogen, water etc etc can easily account for 8lbs. But you do not want to believe that.
Also, you seem to have missed my point about newb gains. It is possible for some to gain more than 0.5lb of muscle a week, particularly when returning back to lifting (like newb gains), but posting as if people are their own limiting factor and you can sustain a higher than average muscle gain is disingenuous and just not true - it also totally ignores genetics. Your results more recently do not exactly make the argument for you. The 0.5lb is not a hard number, but people claiming results way outside that will be called into question, especially when they do not have a single piece of credible data to back it up.
Right there is the biggest problem, IMO. We know the data is inaccurate, as evidenced by the wild daily swings in what you think is total muscle mass. With inaccurate data, no meaningful conclusions can be drawn - because you/we don't actually know what the real values are at any particular point.
eta: Just to reiterate what others have mentioned - you've obviously done a good job at getting and maintaining your physique. Nobody is saying otherwise. In fact, that part I'd say is admirable. But the numbers you're throwing about don't make any lick of sense and the data you've shown is - quite simply - bad.
It would not be so bad but 1) he has none of the data he is showing for the time he says he gained all this muscle 2) his data actually contradicts what he is saying. He is saying that 8lb/13lb (ratio of muscle:weight gain of 0.46:1) is assuming too large of an amount as non muscle LBM yet his 'stats' for the recent period show it to be too low. FFM gained on the chart = 3.3kg. Muscle gaines = 1kg. That is a 0.30:1 ratio. It is even worse than the number he is trying to argue is too low. His interpretation of the data (even if it were assumed as accurate) is faulty in the extreme. I realize that he is going to tell us to use his cherry picked data points where he 'gained muscle' - the last month - the period where on the last day he apparently gained 1.9lb of muscle in 24 hours however.
If the data does not make sense when looked at in detail, then you probably should not be using it to make claims, particularly when they are outside the norm. Also, when trying to prove a point, you do not take a period of time (2 1/2 months) that equates to that period which you are using to prove said point (2 1/2 months) and cherry pick the best numbers from a one month period because the data from the 2 1/2 month period does not support, and actually counteracts your assertion. It just does not fly.0 -
Mmmmmm.....anabolic dreams.
Like wet dreams, only better. You get GAINZZZZ!!!!!!0 -
My scale does BIA. This morning I weighed 195 pounds with 28.4% body fat. After breakfast and lunch I weighed 198 pounds with 26.6% body fat. That means I gained 5.7 pounds of lean mass since I woke up.
You apparently found the secret for turning BF directly to LBM, too. I smell a book on the way.0 -
Lol, I gain muscle after I do a number 2 according to BIA scale.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Look out 'bro science'ScottJTyler wrote: »You're being assumptive and slanderous.
These two pictures were taken in June and then August last Year. Sadly I don't have the data to show you as I wasn't as meticulous then. For context: the first picture was at the end of a 3 month break from weights and the second was after going straight back into 2 hours a day training for around 10 weeks.
The guy who gained two stone was previously athletic but had been sedentary for about a year prior to starting. He was naturally lean and skinny but when I got him simply eating more his strength and size shot up. The weight gain is self-reported so can be treated with a little skepticism but the rapid gain in size is visually apparent.
*kitten* shredded,
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