Is calorie counting really a lifetime/long term solution?
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It's really no different than somebody saying there is no need for someone to stop eating junk food or any other food that tastes good and that is not sustainable long term (because the person saying it doesn't find it sustainable for them). If you are of a certain mindset, you could interpret that as them implying that there is some defect in a person who has trouble eating small quantities of certain foods.DeguelloTex wrote: »
My guess is that implies some sort of defect or problem, when those doing it don't necessarily see doing so as a defect or problem. It's implicit condescension and it's fairly easy, for me, to understand how some people would find that offensive.DeguelloTex wrote: »
How does logging food relate to having a broken leg?mamapeach910 wrote: »Is it so awful to feel bad for a person who has to count calories forever? I don't see how saying that is insulting.
It's as awful to me personally as it was when this guy I went on a date with asked me how it felt to be handicapped because I wore glasses.
People are entitled to think how they want, of course, but it's pretty judgmental to place moral value on some people's need to use a tool to keep them in line with meeting a goal they'd like to meet.
I look at calorie counting as a means of implementing an instinctive behavior that I should have that I don't. Just as I need an aide to implement normal vision, I need an aid to implement a calorie intake that maintains normal body weight for my height and age. I'm choosing to use calorie counting for that. I shouldn't be judged for it.
Not everyone is able to develop intuitive behavior. What's wrong with admitting that and knowing it about yourself?
Well the glasses guy sounds a bit off but I guess I don't see the calorie counting comment as placing a moral value on anything. A man I know broke his leg recently and is supposed to go to Italy on vacation next week. I feel bad for him that he has to deal with a broken leg while on vacation. It's an awful thing for me to think that?
I'm just trying to figure out how saying "I feel bad that a person has to XYZ" is a bad thing. I'm not trying to be argumentative or contrary. People seem very offended by that phrasing. I recognize that I am not a very emotion-driven person so I'm trying to understand.
"I feel sorry for people who are short," for example.
The point is, except for people who have always been thin due to a naturally high metabolism or good habits formed in childhood, everybody needs to sacrifice something or do some extra work to get to or stay at a healthy weight. Either you have to eat less of everything and give up eating as much as you want whenever you want it (the IIFYM crowd) , or you have to stop eating certain foods you used to eat on a regular basis (the restriction/elimination crowd) or you have to give up some of your free time and greatly increase your cooking instead of ordering takeout, or you must greatly increase your exercise. Or you have to constantly weigh and measure every bite of food that goes into your mouth for eternity. Many people choose some combination. The key is to choose the option(s) that are least onerous to you so that you can make it sustainable. If you choose correctly for your personality and genetics, with time these things will stop seeming like work and just become habit... although I think it still requires vigilance.
That is the reality. People should just accept that and stop being so thin skinned and constantly seeing judgement where there really is none. It's just that when someone chooses a path that seems unnecessaryily onerous to you, you can't help feeling like they are making it harder than it needs to be. In reality, perhaps that path is somewhat easier for them than the alternatives even if it would be much harder for you. We ALL have our biases, and it is hard to step back and not look at these things through our own lense.
FYI, every time I am on a crowded subway and see a short person with their face pressed into a tall strager's armpit, I DO feel sorry for them. I am not judging them though.
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
My guess is that implies some sort of defect or problem, when those doing it don't necessarily see doing so as a defect or problem. It's implicit condescension and it's fairly easy, for me, to understand how some people would find that offensive.DeguelloTex wrote: »
How does logging food relate to having a broken leg?mamapeach910 wrote: »Is it so awful to feel bad for a person who has to count calories forever? I don't see how saying that is insulting.
It's as awful to me personally as it was when this guy I went on a date with asked me how it felt to be handicapped because I wore glasses.
People are entitled to think how they want, of course, but it's pretty judgmental to place moral value on some people's need to use a tool to keep them in line with meeting a goal they'd like to meet.
I look at calorie counting as a means of implementing an instinctive behavior that I should have that I don't. Just as I need an aide to implement normal vision, I need an aid to implement a calorie intake that maintains normal body weight for my height and age. I'm choosing to use calorie counting for that. I shouldn't be judged for it.
Not everyone is able to develop intuitive behavior. What's wrong with admitting that and knowing it about yourself?
Well the glasses guy sounds a bit off but I guess I don't see the calorie counting comment as placing a moral value on anything. A man I know broke his leg recently and is supposed to go to Italy on vacation next week. I feel bad for him that he has to deal with a broken leg while on vacation. It's an awful thing for me to think that?
I'm just trying to figure out how saying "I feel bad that a person has to XYZ" is a bad thing. I'm not trying to be argumentative or contrary. People seem very offended by that phrasing. I recognize that I am not a very emotion-driven person so I'm trying to understand.
"I feel sorry for people who are short," for example.
I feel sorry for short people too. Especially when I put things above their heads and they have to ask for help getting them down.0 -
I am getting good at estimating and calorie counting after three years. On some days, I enter my foods into the log and I am no more than 1-200 calories of my guestimate. The way I look at it I am resetting the internal clock that was broken and said I could consume 4500 calories a day before. I will probably count calories in some capacity for the rest of my very long, happy, fulfilled life.0
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I agree that people should stop being so sensitive about every slight, real or perceived, in the world. I'm just saying what I perceive their issue with the wording to be.MoiAussi93 wrote: »That is the reality. People should just accept that and stop being so thin skinned and constantly seeing judgement where there really is none. It's just that when someone chooses a path that seems unnecessaryily onerous to you, you can't help feeling like they are making it harder than it needs to be. In reality, perhaps that path is somewhat easier for them than the alternatives even if it would be much harder for you. We ALL have our biases, and it is hard to step back and not look at these things through our own lense.
I don't give a pair of fetid dingo's kidneys whether some random guy on the internet feels sorry for me if I count calories for the rest of my life, even if the tone appears to be less about actually feeling sorry for someone who counts and more about expressing a sense of smug superiority.
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
I agree that people should stop being so sensitive about every slight, real or perceived, in the world. I'm just saying what I perceive their issue with the wording to be.MoiAussi93 wrote: »That is the reality. People should just accept that and stop being so thin skinned and constantly seeing judgement where there really is none. It's just that when someone chooses a path that seems unnecessaryily onerous to you, you can't help feeling like they are making it harder than it needs to be. In reality, perhaps that path is somewhat easier for them than the alternatives even if it would be much harder for you. We ALL have our biases, and it is hard to step back and not look at these things through our own lense.
I don't give a pair of fetid dingo's kidneys whether some random guy on the internet feels sorry for me if I count calories for the rest of my life, even if the tone appears to be less about actually feeling sorry for someone who counts and more about expressing a sense of smug superiority.
Cosigned
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I think this is dependent on the individual. I find it invaluable to losing weight and it's never triggered any sort of binging in me.
As for continuing once I reach my UGW? I plan to keep track for a few months in maintenance and then switch to keeping a close eye on the scale and how my clothes fit so I can keep from reverting.
I maintained a 20lb loss for five years by checking the scale on a regular basis. If I noticed I'd gained a few pounds then I wouldn't count calories; I would eat less and skip desserts until I was back in my ideal range.
It only came back (over another few years) when I went through a lot of personal upheaval (traveling for six months with no access to a reliable scale, stress, new job, etc.) and stopped paying attention to my weight and how my clothes fit. My fault. I had plenty of excuses.
I feel to maintain our health we all have to be vigilant in some way. How we do that is up to us and there is no wrong way.0 -
I'm already feeling sorry for myself about counting calories forever. I sure hope that will not be necessary.
I'll admit that weighing and logging is not difficult or time consuming. It's just that it turns my focus toward food and it changes my attitude toward eating.
Neighbor says "We're grillin' ribs tonight. Come on over and y'all bring the beer."
My husband thinks "Oh boy, ribs and beer!"
I think "Damn, I already ate xxx calories today and only have xxx calories left. If I have ribs and beer I'll be overdrawn. Sigh." Of course I have the ribs and beer anyway, but calorie thoughts kind of impose on the fun.
My intention, when I get to maintenance, is to keep counting and logging for a while. Then try not counting for while and weigh myself regularly and see how I do. Kind of like letting go of the bicycle handlebars. It's entirely possible that I'll have to keep counting at least periodically and I have to say, I'm a little sad about that.
Edit: Spelling
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Isn't not letting calories impose on the fun kinda what got you into this in the first place?lthames0810 wrote: »Neighbor says "We're grillin' ribs tonight. Come on over and y'all bring the beer."
My husband thinks "Oh boy, ribs and beer!"
I think "Damn, I already ate xxx calories today and only have xxx calories left. If I have ribs and beer I'll be overdrawn. Sigh." Of course I have the ribs and beer anyway, but calorie thoughts kind of impose on the fun.
The calorie thoughts need to impose somewhere. Maybe not on the ribs and beer, but somewhere.
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
Isn't not letting calories impose on the fun kinda what got you into this in the first place?lthames0810 wrote: »Neighbor says "We're grillin' ribs tonight. Come on over and y'all bring the beer."
My husband thinks "Oh boy, ribs and beer!"
I think "Damn, I already ate xxx calories today and only have xxx calories left. If I have ribs and beer I'll be overdrawn. Sigh." Of course I have the ribs and beer anyway, but calorie thoughts kind of impose on the fun.
The calorie thoughts need to impose somewhere. Maybe not on the ribs and beer, but somewhere.
Yes, not thinking about calories is what got me here. I was shocked when I looked up how many calories are in a typical rib dinner in a restaurant and I would often ignorantly order that and a pitcher not giving a single thought to the calories. Ah, those were the days. I'm a little nostalgic.
You're right. I'll always have to pay attention to this in some manner and set some priorities. I guess I'm just pouting.
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Welcome to the club.lthames0810 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Isn't not letting calories impose on the fun kinda what got you into this in the first place?lthames0810 wrote: »Neighbor says "We're grillin' ribs tonight. Come on over and y'all bring the beer."
My husband thinks "Oh boy, ribs and beer!"
I think "Damn, I already ate xxx calories today and only have xxx calories left. If I have ribs and beer I'll be overdrawn. Sigh." Of course I have the ribs and beer anyway, but calorie thoughts kind of impose on the fun.
The calorie thoughts need to impose somewhere. Maybe not on the ribs and beer, but somewhere.
Yes, not thinking about calories is what got me here. I was shocked when I looked up how many calories are in a typical rib dinner in a restaurant and I would often ignorantly order that and a pitcher not giving a single thought to the calories. Ah, those were the days. I'm a little nostalgic.
You're right. I'll always have to pay attention to this in some manner and set some priorities. I guess I'm just pouting.
Also, that's one of the many reasons I prefer brisket to ribs. I don't have to worry about the calories in a sauce, I can get a crapton and eat less potato salad and whatever else, and all the retained water eventually goes away. Also, burnt ends.
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Ok the whole 'feeling sorry' thing... I think it's rude and just makes you look like you feel superior because you don't have to count calories or you're not short.
But anyway.lthames0810 wrote: »I'm already feeling sorry for myself about counting calories forever. I sure hope that will not be necessary.
I'll admit that weighing and logging is not difficult or time consuming. It's just that it turns my focus toward food and it changes my attitude toward eating.
Neighbor says "We're grillin' ribs tonight. Come on over and y'all bring the beer."
My husband thinks "Oh boy, ribs and beer!"
I think "Damn, I already ate xxx calories today and only have xxx calories left. If I have ribs and beer I'll be overdrawn. Sigh." Of course I have the ribs and beer anyway, but calorie thoughts kind of impose on the fun.
My intention, when I get to maintenance, is to keep counting and logging for a while. Then try not counting for while and weigh myself regularly and see how I do. Kind of like letting go of the bicycle handlebars. It's entirely possible that I'll have to keep counting at least periodically and I have to say, I'm a little sad about that.
Edit: Spelling
Sure, but before I cared about calories I was also 210 pounds. I'm sure someone who doesn't count calories but watches what they're eating would just think 'oh damn, had I known I wouldn't have had that donut for breakfast' or 'I'll just eat less tomorrow'. Counting calories just helps with that process.
Do I wish that I didn't have to watch what I eat forever? You bet. But I love food too much and I don't always do so well with moderation so calorie counting is a great tool to help me stay on track. That's really the thing though... what bothers me sometimes is having to watch what I eat, not counting calories specifically, and unfortunately that's not something that's going to change, so I might as well make it easier for me by counting calories. I don't see it as a crutch at all.. just a tool.0 -
[/quote]Also, burnt ends.
[/quote]
Too late - I snagged them already!
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DeguelloTex wrote: »She is saying, as I understand it, if used for a lifetime then calorie counting can be a solution.
And I've agreed with that.Or, worded differently, even if it needs to be used for a lifetime, it can be a solution.
I've agreed with that, too.
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MoiAussi93 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »Is it so awful to feel bad for a person who has to count calories forever? I don't see how saying that is insulting.
I don't see anything awful about that at all. I too feel sorry for people who have to count calories forever. For that matter, I feel sorry for people who weight their food. Is that sorrow misplaced? Could be. Some people get pleasure out of journaling and recording everything that happens in their lives. I don't. But saying that I feel sorry for them isn't an insult, it just expresses that I would find it very difficult if I was forced to do the same thing.
I agree. It just seems like unnecessary work to me. I think of it as a training tool...something I am using temporarily to figure out the best way to eat long term. A good thing to use to teach me the fine points of portion sizes and macros. But I do find it to be a bit of an annoyance. I have never even used a food scale...I can't even imagine weighing everything I eat.
Now, if other people don't find this annoying and plan to use it forever, then I'm happy it works for them and wish them long term success. But I don't think it's awful to say I wish they didn't have to.
I'm not totally sure what all counts as calorie counting. From my perspective it could include everything from someone weighing food and trying to hit specific macros and other goals to someone who generally knows the calorie count of the foods she eats mindfully choosing to eat according to certain patterns--MyPlate, for example.
The latter is what I did when maintaining for some time, and it's similar to what I do now except now I happen to know the calorie counts and log them. Currently I think having the calorie information in a detailed way makes it more fun (as mamapeach expressed), but I'm sure I could manage to maintain (or even lose) again by being mindful in the other way.
I don't think I'll ever be a person who can just graze all day and eat to hunger, but I don't particularly feel like that's a loss. In theory, I suppose I'd like never to want to eat something that I felt like I shouldn't at that time, but if the trade off is maybe not enjoying certain foods I enjoy as much as I do, not sure it's worth it. But of course if I were someone who'd never had to worry about my diet or food and never thought about food (like my sister's former bf who was happy to just eat plain rice unless someone reminded him to eat something else), I'd not miss being some other way anyway.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »...telling someone you pity them...
Now hold on a second - you're the only person in this thread to use the word "pity".
Feeling sorry for someone - feeling empathy for their situation - is not the same as pitying someone.
I interpret "I feel sorry for you" as meaning "pity," and most definitely not "empathize."0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »...telling someone you pity them...
Now hold on a second - you're the only person in this thread to use the word "pity".
Feeling sorry for someone - feeling empathy for their situation - is not the same as pitying someone.
I interpret "I feel sorry for you" as meaning "pity," and most definitely not "empathize."
Totally this.0 -
Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.0 -
beemerphile1 wrote: »Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.
That too. I know that for me, the day I stop calorie counting is the day I'm giving up and gaining weight back because I will have stopped caring.
But by logging the food, I force myself to calorie count to prevent that from happening.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »...telling someone you pity them...
Now hold on a second - you're the only person in this thread to use the word "pity".
Feeling sorry for someone - feeling empathy for their situation - is not the same as pitying someone.
I interpret "I feel sorry for you" as meaning "pity," and most definitely not "empathize."
Well that's your choice - but it doesn't strike me as a particularly neighbourly one. Why jump right away to such a negative assumption about someone?0 -
It is there for me to fall back on when things get rough, but I don't need to count to stay fit. When I am fully on my game, I stop counting. When I feel myself slipping, I get back to it and get myself back on track. Absent some illness, I will do whatever necessary to stay fit.0
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beemerphile1 wrote: »Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.
This is what I did once I transitioned into maintenance and for a while it worked. However, doing the mental cico thing leaves a lot of room for error, and I did creep up above my maintenance range earlier this year. After realizing that the creep wasn't a temporary bounce and was actual weight gain I came back here, re-signed up, and I corrected the bounce within two weeks with tracking on MFP. Now I'm back in my maintenance range, and after evaluating what happened, I've decided that I need to be more diligent at keeping an actual daily diary of my calorie intake. A minor nuisance but for me at least, it needs to be done. I've come way to far to go backwards 0 -
If left to my own devices, without logging, I would probably overindulge my inner toddler who wants cream of wheat cooked with milk, and two whole milk lattes, and fettucine carbonara every day. That's certainly how I got where I started. Now I tell my inner toddler I can have one of those, but not all three, and I can have it once a week, not every day.
But I also have learned healthier choices, and that I like certain nutrient dense foods, and that I don't care for certain energy-dense foods as much as their calorie content reflects on my healthy goals.
I started with an expectation of logging as long as I am in control of my choices, and (while some take issue with the method), I make nutrient dense choices, energy dense choices that carry a sufficient "bang" for the "calorie buck" and take care to drink more water and exercise more (which adds a certain calorie "cushion" for my energy dense choices).
It works for me, and I expect to continue as I have been.0 -
The condescension is strong in this thread...0
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lemurcat12 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »...telling someone you pity them...
Now hold on a second - you're the only person in this thread to use the word "pity".
Feeling sorry for someone - feeling empathy for their situation - is not the same as pitying someone.
I interpret "I feel sorry for you" as meaning "pity," and most definitely not "empathize."
Well that's your choice - but it doesn't strike me as a particularly neighbourly one. Why jump right away to such a negative assumption about someone?
I'm not making assumptions about anyone. "I feel sorry for you"="I pity you," not "I feel for you" or even "oh, I am sorry that happened to you."
However, sure I'd normally ask the follow-up question. For example, if someone were to say that to me about calorie counting I'd probably laugh and say "is that really what you mean, you pity me?" If the person wanted to clarify, he or she could.
However, it appears that your view saying that pitying someone is so obviously condescending or insulting that believing that someone is doing that (should there be any ambiguity at all) means that you must believe they are doing something bad or unkind. Is that so?0 -
beemerphile1 wrote: »Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.
To me, not calorie counting means that if you weigh and see you're a little heavier than you'd like, you skip desert for a few days. You don't have to know how much you've cut your calories by, because you're just trimming back a little and the scale will tell you if it is working or not. If you're in the habit of eating the amount you should every day anyway, then the amount you need to cut back is likely to be the amount you over ate due to some holiday or some party or not putting in as much exercise as normal.0 -
Calorie counting in the long term helps relearn portion sizes and and helping make balanced choices, essentially relearning to eat more intuitively. Many of us have become accustomed to eating far more than we should, and calorie counting is a very factual way to keep track and help moderate that. Yes, you'll probably glance at the serving sizes and calories/macros in foods for the rest of your life. Will you waffle on how much raw broccoli you can have in ten years? Probably not, since after ten years you will have a pretty good idea of how much fits your needs.
Yes. This.0 -
TimothyFish wrote: »beemerphile1 wrote: »Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.
To me, not calorie counting means that if you weigh and see you're a little heavier than you'd like, you skip desert for a few days. You don't have to know how much you've cut your calories by, because you're just trimming back a little and the scale will tell you if it is working or not. If you're in the habit of eating the amount you should every day anyway, then the amount you need to cut back is likely to be the amount you over ate due to some holiday or some party or not putting in as much exercise as normal.
See, that's why I have to calorie count. Because the first thing I can think of reading this is that if I've gained enough for the scale to show it (even half a pound), 'skipping dessert' for a few days is just not going to cut it, because 'dessert' for me is maybe 200-250 calories, and a few days of that is 1000 calories... so that's 1000 less calories than what I was eating... so I'll stop gaining, but will it be enough to make me lose the weight I've just gained? Probably not. I'll just maintain my new higher weight, and I won't be able to have dessert anymore, which would suck (or I could have less sure, but if I'm not weighing my food, how can I be sure that I'm actually eating less now?).
That's why I'd just rather log... not having to wonder. Just doing the math.0 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »
It's really no different than somebody saying there is no need for someone to stop eating junk food or any other food that tastes good and that is not sustainable long term (because the person saying it doesn't find it sustainable for them). If you are of a certain mindset, you could interpret that as them implying that there is some defect in a person who has trouble eating small quantities of certain foods.DeguelloTex wrote: »
My guess is that implies some sort of defect or problem, when those doing it don't necessarily see doing so as a defect or problem. It's implicit condescension and it's fairly easy, for me, to understand how some people would find that offensive.DeguelloTex wrote: »
How does logging food relate to having a broken leg?mamapeach910 wrote: »Is it so awful to feel bad for a person who has to count calories forever? I don't see how saying that is insulting.
It's as awful to me personally as it was when this guy I went on a date with asked me how it felt to be handicapped because I wore glasses.
People are entitled to think how they want, of course, but it's pretty judgmental to place moral value on some people's need to use a tool to keep them in line with meeting a goal they'd like to meet.
I look at calorie counting as a means of implementing an instinctive behavior that I should have that I don't. Just as I need an aide to implement normal vision, I need an aid to implement a calorie intake that maintains normal body weight for my height and age. I'm choosing to use calorie counting for that. I shouldn't be judged for it.
Not everyone is able to develop intuitive behavior. What's wrong with admitting that and knowing it about yourself?
Well the glasses guy sounds a bit off but I guess I don't see the calorie counting comment as placing a moral value on anything. A man I know broke his leg recently and is supposed to go to Italy on vacation next week. I feel bad for him that he has to deal with a broken leg while on vacation. It's an awful thing for me to think that?
I'm just trying to figure out how saying "I feel bad that a person has to XYZ" is a bad thing. I'm not trying to be argumentative or contrary. People seem very offended by that phrasing. I recognize that I am not a very emotion-driven person so I'm trying to understand.
"I feel sorry for people who are short," for example.
More directly, it would be like someone saying "I feel sorry for you that you believe you can't eat chocolate."
Which would be a pretty obnoxious thing to say, IMO, even if it is also true. (I wouldn't pity someone for that reason, though.)
I really hate the idea that people pity me, though.* When I was fat it bugged me more that people might feel sorry for me or think I was powerless or helpless in the face of it, vs. even thinking I was just lazy or a glutton or foolish not to mind enough to do what was necessary. One thing that scared me about trying to lose weight was that if I let people know I'd tried and failed I'd be playing into that.
Which might say something weird about me, of course.
*Well, not about calorie counting or that I must be mindful about my eating. I think that's such a silly reason to pity someone that I wouldn't take it seriously. About being fat, yes, because I of course cared more than I wanted to let on.
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TimothyFish wrote: »beemerphile1 wrote: »Don't confuse calorie counting with calorie/food logging.
One can learn their needs/limits, learn the basic calorie contents of foods, and then keep a loose tally in their head throughout the day. That person is calorie counting but may not be logging.
To me, not calorie counting means that if you weigh and see you're a little heavier than you'd like, you skip desert for a few days. You don't have to know how much you've cut your calories by, because you're just trimming back a little and the scale will tell you if it is working or not. If you're in the habit of eating the amount you should every day anyway, then the amount you need to cut back is likely to be the amount you over ate due to some holiday or some party or not putting in as much exercise as normal.
Agreed, assuming you are eating in a generally mindful way.0 -
TimothyFish wrote: »I don't see calorie counting as a sustainable solution. I think people need to check their weight occasionally (once a week?) and make sure they aren't allowing their weight to creep up. The problem I see with calorie counting is that it causes me to eat more. Granted, there were some days when I wasn't counting that I would eat much more than I should've eaten, but I find that when I reach the end of a day and have calories left over, I go find something to eat. If I weren't counting calories, I would stop eating sooner and that would help make up for those days when I ate too much.
That makes no sense to me. But whatevs.0
This discussion has been closed.
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