ideal calories per day @ 20% bf *noob

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  • Brolympus
    Brolympus Posts: 360 Member
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    Agree with everybody here, you should drop bf before trying to bulk. For dudes, your P-ratio is tilted toward fat storage over muscle production at anything 20% or over. If you don't have much muscle on your frame, even 20% can look skinny (hence your family's comments). You will actually look more muscular as you drop fat. Most of the shredded athletes you see in magazines, TV, etc. look jacked because of super low bf.

    And definitely spend some $ and get a proper body scan done if you are possibly on the fence about what to do. Calipers can be off by 5% or higher, and, for example, if they told you your bf was 15%....well that would leave you very confused what to do next. Comparison pictures are pretty helpful verifying bf, but nothing is foolproof.

    Typically if you aren't sure what to do, a cut is the best answer. Fat loss rate doesn't really slow down until sub 10% for men, so you can drop at an optimal rate from almost any "functional" bf level. Most men that start a fitness program are over 20%, where muscle production is not optimal.
  • AliceDark
    AliceDark Posts: 3,886 Member
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    How recently did you get back into training, and what program are you running? You may still be able to achieve some solid noob gains at maintenance or a small deficit. This is also from Waldo's site (http://strengthunbound.com/bulking-complete-guide-for-beginners/):

    "The body adapts to strength training at first through your nervous system, using the muscle you have more efficiently, and by increasing the number of nuclei in the muscles (which itself does not contribute to size). This initial adaptation acts as a foundation that will eventually allow hypertrophy to occur. [1]

    When you first start strength training, the body just isn’t ready to grow bigger muscles efficiently.

    When you have more than ample capacity for beginner strength gains, training doesn’t produce as much muscle tension or fatigue as the existing muscle is capable of producing. Given the exact same amount of muscle mass, if you compare a person that has been strength training 6 months vs. one that has been training 2 weeks, the more experienced trainee will be much stronger and will gain muscle much more efficiently in a calorie surplus.

    Eventually beginner gains will slow down, once this occurs you will be able to efficiently grow bigger muscles. How will you know you’ve reach this point? Set to set and workout to workout fatigue will begin to increase dramatically, and workout to workout linear strength progression will begin to stall.

    It should take 4-6 months of regular strength training for beginner gains start to slow down. You can definitely begin to bulk before this point, though efficiency will be sacrificed a bit (resulting in greater fat gain). Note however untrained individuals that have just begun strength training should wait a few months before attempting a calorie surplus."
  • draftsman28
    draftsman28 Posts: 98 Member
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    I just got started lifting at home and on a regular schedule. Prior to that I was just doing push-up, pull-up, chair dips, dumbell curls, chest flys on a ball with resistance bands, etc on average once a week. I have no prior sports experience, no prior program and I wasn't serious about really gaining just building strength.
  • AliceDark
    AliceDark Posts: 3,886 Member
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    You could be making some really good noob strength gains, even eating at a small deficit, because you're basically untrained. Max those out first, then think about bulking if/when you need to. Look into programs like Starting Strength or Stronglifts. Do you have a barbell and plates at home, or just dumbbells?
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    OP - if you are just getting into lifting I would look at running starting strength or strong lifts for about 4-6 months and then graduate from there.
  • draftsman28
    draftsman28 Posts: 98 Member
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    I just bought a used entry level bench, olympic barbell w/ 155# of weight plates. It's not the best but it will due for now. I'll definitely need something better when my lifts increase... I'm going to shed some pounds and continue working out building strength. Once I get the fat (weight) down I can consider bulking to gain muscle mass. The bf is a set back although I'm stoked on loosing it and building muscle. I just found plans online to build a dip station out of pvc pipe! I'm a huge DYI'er.
    Thanks again everyone for your help

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