What is Natural Food Anyway?

bcattoes

Not sure how you got there from here. I'm saying that humans adding enzymes to sugar water is no LESS "natural" than bees doing it.

And I'm saying common sense tells me it is.

And I'm saying common sense tells me that it isn't. Adding enzymes to sugar water to convert about 50% of it to Fructose, is adding enzymes to sugar water to convert about 50% of it to Fructose, is adding enzymes to sugar water to convert about 50% of it to Fructose ....

And since humans are just as naturally occurring as bees ....

I think you are being ridiculous just for the sake of argument.

Nope. I believe my own bull****.

Here's the point. Honey and HCFS have extremely similar chemical composition, and are made (processed, engineered, I dont care) basically the same way.

However, Honey is touted as a "good sweetener" because it's "natural". Processed foods are bad .. honey is highly processed, but it's good anyway.

The OP's point was that words like processed and natural create different reactions to similar foods based on perceptions of what these words imply to people.

Honey and HCFS are, chemically, nearly identical. Sure honey has some pollen and bee legs in it, but the 2 liquids are not significantly different from each other.

But here we are with people saying one is better than the other because of how it is sourced. Your body can not tell the difference between the fructose in HFCS and Honey. Your body treats HFCS and honey the same way. But one's good for you, and one's bad for you, because people, or whatever. It's a pretty clear demonstartion of the OP's point.

You are now mixing apples and oranges. Saying it's "better" or "healthier" is not the same as saying it's "natural". Honey straight from the hive is not processed any more than a stalk of broccoli is processed because it starts as a seed and is processed by the sun, soil, rain, etc. and is made of chemicals.

sullus

Nope. I believe my own bull****.

Here's the point. Honey and HCFS have extremely similar chemical composition, and are made (processed, engineered, I dont care) basically the same way.

However, Honey is touted as a "good sweetener" because it's "natural". Processed foods are bad .. honey is highly processed, but it's good anyway.

The OP's point was that words like processed and natural create different reactions to similar foods based on perceptions of what these words imply to people.

Honey and HCFS are, chemically, nearly identical. Sure honey has some pollen and bee legs in it, but the 2 liquids are not significantly different from each other.

But here we are with people saying one is better than the other because of how it is sourced. Your body can not tell the difference between the fructose in HFCS and Honey. Your body treats HFCS and honey the same way. But one's good for you, and one's bad for you, because people, or whatever. It's a pretty clear demonstartion of the OP's point.

You are now mixing apples and oranges. Saying it's "better" or "healthier" is not the same as saying it's "natural". Honey straight from the hive is not processed any more than a stalk of broccoli is processed because it starts as a seed and is processed by the sun, soil, rain, etc. and is made of chemicals.

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

Ok, so .. are hothouse tomatoes less natural than ones grown outdoors? They're in a human created "unnatural" environment being forced to unnaturally grow out of season. They don't get rained on, but humans must water them. and onward ...

What about hydroponic tomatoes? That gell looks cool, but it sure ain't "natural" ... Are these less natural than the ones in your garden?

jennifershoo

Indeed, lots of people are dumb. Surprised? Sadly, no.

jennifershoo

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

Pasteurized honey is processed. Raw honey is not. Buy raw honey.

jennifershoo

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

This^
I think it makes a big difference whether bees or humans add the enzymes. That's like asking whether it matters if humans add a bunch of chemicals to food or mother nature does. Sure it's all chemicals, but all chemicals in food are equal.

Honey from a bee hive is a far cry from HFCS. So is pure maple syrup, even though it is cooked to turn it from sap to syrup.

Sometimes it's necesary to not look just at words like enzymes and chemicals and use a little comon sense.

sullus

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

Pasteurized honey is processed. Raw honey is not. Buy raw honey.

Raw honey is chemically processed by bees.

bcattoes

Nope. I believe my own bull****.

Here's the point. Honey and HCFS have extremely similar chemical composition, and are made (processed, engineered, I dont care) basically the same way.

However, Honey is touted as a "good sweetener" because it's "natural". Processed foods are bad .. honey is highly processed, but it's good anyway.

The OP's point was that words like processed and natural create different reactions to similar foods based on perceptions of what these words imply to people.

Honey and HCFS are, chemically, nearly identical. Sure honey has some pollen and bee legs in it, but the 2 liquids are not significantly different from each other.

But here we are with people saying one is better than the other because of how it is sourced. Your body can not tell the difference between the fructose in HFCS and Honey. Your body treats HFCS and honey the same way. But one's good for you, and one's bad for you, because people, or whatever. It's a pretty clear demonstartion of the OP's point.

You are now mixing apples and oranges. Saying it's "better" or "healthier" is not the same as saying it's "natural". Honey straight from the hive is not processed any more than a stalk of broccoli is processed because it starts as a seed and is processed by the sun, soil, rain, etc. and is made of chemicals.

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

Processing has nothing to do with it. The post is about what is natural. Seriously, I do not believe you can't see the difference between bees gathering nectar and partially digesting it and men in lab coats creating HFCS. You keep jumping subjects, but I still think you are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

jwdieter

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

One ingredient cannot exist without a chemistry set. One you can walk out and grab with your hand. It's fine to consider them similar in sugar components, but it's mildly insane to think they were processed equally.

The functional difference between the two, aside from a slightly different ratio of fructose, is one gets injected into everything while the other doesn't.

sullus

Nope. I believe my own bull****.

Here's the point. Honey and HCFS have extremely similar chemical composition, and are made (processed, engineered, I dont care) basically the same way.

However, Honey is touted as a "good sweetener" because it's "natural". Processed foods are bad .. honey is highly processed, but it's good anyway.

The OP's point was that words like processed and natural create different reactions to similar foods based on perceptions of what these words imply to people.

Honey and HCFS are, chemically, nearly identical. Sure honey has some pollen and bee legs in it, but the 2 liquids are not significantly different from each other.

But here we are with people saying one is better than the other because of how it is sourced. Your body can not tell the difference between the fructose in HFCS and Honey. Your body treats HFCS and honey the same way. But one's good for you, and one's bad for you, because people, or whatever. It's a pretty clear demonstartion of the OP's point.

You are now mixing apples and oranges. Saying it's "better" or "healthier" is not the same as saying it's "natural". Honey straight from the hive is not processed any more than a stalk of broccoli is processed because it starts as a seed and is processed by the sun, soil, rain, etc. and is made of chemicals.

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

Processing has nothing to do with it. The post is about what is natural. Seriously, I do not believe you can't see the difference between bees gathering nectar and partially digesting it and men in lab coats creating HFCS. You keep jumping subjects, but I still think you are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

This goes back to "natural" .. I find humans just as natural as bees, and therefore their processes are just as natural as the bees. (tip: I dont believe a single thing on this planet is "unnatural")

shannashannabobana

We are talking about FOOD. Are we so screwed up that we can't recognize what food is anymore? But if you think equating food with arsenic is a good argument to justify eating foods that come in a box; well, good for you.

Dude, the hemlock/arsenic thing is a joke. With me it’s generally in response to a ‘natural’ pill or some sort of processed food. The point is ‘natural’ does not equal healthy.

If I am buying premade foods I look at the ingredient list. If it’s short, that’s a good sign. If I can pronounce and identify all of the ingredients, even better.

I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food.

I think you’re buying the wrong kind of honey, then. Although I did look at the ingredient list one what I original thought was honey but was apparently 'honey sauce' from popeyes yesterday. Honey, Corn Syrup, HFCS, and a couple other things including I think one more sugar source. Who adds sugar to honey? Popeyes apparently!

sullus

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

One ingredient cannot exist without a chemistry set. One you can walk out and grab with your hand. It's fine to consider them similar in sugar components, but it's mildly insane to think they were processed equally.

The functional difference between the two, aside from a slightly different ratio of fructose, is one gets injected into everything while the other doesn't.

Ok then. So if a baby cow drinks milk and pukes up cottage cheese, it's more natural cottage cheese than when humans add the same enzymes to milk in a vat?

Shock_Wave

bump for later to read responses

highervibes

Everything on Earth is natural, therefore all food is natural. Eat what you like, because it's natural.

sullus

We are talking about FOOD. Are we so screwed up that we can't recognize what food is anymore? But if you think equating food with arsenic is a good argument to justify eating foods that come in a box; well, good for you.

Dude, the hemlock/arsenic thing is a joke. With me it’s generally in response to a ‘natural’ pill or some sort of processed food. The point is ‘natural’ does not equal healthy.

If I am buying premade foods I look at the ingredient list. If it’s short, that’s a good sign. If I can pronounce and identify all of the ingredients, even better.

I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food.

I think you’re buying the wrong kind of honey, then. Although I did look at the ingredient list one what I original thought was honey but was apparently 'honey sauce' from popeyes yesterday. Honey, Corn Syrup, HFCS, and a couple other things including I think one more sugar source. Who adds sugar to honey? Popeyes apparently!

No. Raw honey straight from the hive is a chemically processed product.

sullus

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

Pasteurized honey is processed. Raw honey is not. Buy raw honey.

Raw honey is chemically processed by bees.

You just want to troll so badly, that's getting ridiculous!

Explain how my statement is inaccurate.

bcattoes

Honey and HCFS are processed the same amount. You care when the chemical processing happens and who does it. I do not. I see them as the same.

One ingredient cannot exist without a chemistry set. One you can walk out and grab with your hand. It's fine to consider them similar in sugar components, but it's mildly insane to think they were processed equally.

The functional difference between the two, aside from a slightly different ratio of fructose, is one gets injected into everything while the other doesn't.

Ok then. So if a baby cow drinks milk and pukes up cottage cheese, it's more natural cottage cheese than when humans add the same enzymes to milk in a vat?

vomit = cottage cheese. That's not ridiculous at all. :huh:

highervibes

the only way to use the word appropriately is if it's used as an adjective to describe something not of this Earth. Argument over. lol

bcattoes

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

Pasteurized honey is processed. Raw honey is not. Buy raw honey.

Raw honey is chemically processed by bees.

You just want to troll so badly, that's getting ridiculous!

Explain how my statement is inaccurate.

Bees don't process honey. They process nectar to make honey.

shannashannabobana

Eat what you like, because it's natural.

Including Hemlock!

No. Raw honey straight from the hive is a chemically processed product.

I think this is dumb but if you believe everything in existence on this earth counts as natural fine, why are you even talking about this?

Functionally Natural does not equal Healthy.

sullus

I always like Honey v HFCS in the "natural" debate. I consider Honey to be a highly processed (with chemicals, no less!!) food. They're basically the same thing - sugar water processed with enzymes, then evaporated to a sugary syrup that contains about 55% fructose.

Yet one's an all-natural wondersweetener, and the other is the most evil, guaranteed to give you the diabetus, sweetener that ever existed.

HFCS is no less "natural" than Honey. Why does it matter if a human or bee adds the enzymes?

Pasteurized honey is processed. Raw honey is not. Buy raw honey.

Raw honey is chemically processed by bees.

You just want to troll so badly, that's getting ridiculous!

Explain how my statement is inaccurate.

Bees don't process honey. They process nectar to make honey.

Excellent semantic point. Should have use "has been" instead of is.