Keto diets, your opinion please!

RonRoff

Anyone tried it in comparison with very intensive sporting?

I sport daily, did a high carb, low fat diet for a while and that worked "reasonably" well.

Want to switch to a keto diet (less than 50 carbs per day, 60% fats), to see the change in results.

I've red in several sources that science actually proved keto diets work over 50% better.

I'm a bit worried because keto diets use a bit of your aminos to create glucose, leaving less of it for your muscles, but several documents i read comforted me that it's actually a small acceptable loss and that your muscles will not suffer under the influences of ketosis.

Shoot, what do you think or what is your experience?

pedidiva

There are some very good videos on youtube that address this. Dr. Tim Noakes has information on this topic.

I am happy that you have found something that works for you.

Pedi

SezxyStef

I think that a special diet isn't required for weight loss, just a calorie deficit.

Based on my understanding keto can be hard to maintain...and if you are doing it just for weight loss rethink that...

Sabine_Stroehm

Some folks here have had great success on Keto. Others have, as stef said, found it too restrictive.

The Tim Noakes videos (and others that you'll find on youtube) could be helpful as you make your decision.

ndj1979

assuming same deficit and you are keeping protein intake pretty consistent between Keto and high carb/low fat your results should be about the same.

did those studies that you reference control for protein?

RonRoff

@ndj1979 they have indeed, they restrict it to about 30% of the total macros.

One of the sites that i ended up reading was this one containing studies:

http://authoritynutrition.com/23-studies-on-low-carb-and-low-fat-diets/

I've only recently started a study to become a weight consultant myself, yet my own studies imply that, when you are a vivid sporter, a keto diet can not only be a pain, but also the restriction in proteines can cause deficiencies, making it harder for your muscles to recover for example.

However i have 0 field experience in this, i'd like to see what people who actually are doing both, extensive training and keto diets, are achieving. And if they notice any changes in muscularity (recovery, build up?)

Next to this, 90% of the keto diets i see, are ridiculous, because they take almost 0 factors besides the macros into consideration. Micro nutritions are usually taken in very imbalanced proportions, especially when it comes down to natrium...

@pedidiva and @Sabine_Stroehm thanks for the input on the videos, i'll certainly take a look at them!

ndj1979

RonRoff wrote: »

@ndj1979 they have indeed, they restrict it to about 30% of the total macros.

One of the sites that i ended up reading was this one containing studies:

http://authoritynutrition.com/23-studies-on-low-carb-and-low-fat-diets/

I've only recently started a study to become a weight consultant myself, yet my own studies imply that, when you are a vivid sporter, a keto diet can not only be a pain, but also the restriction in proteines can cause deficiencies, making it harder for your muscles to recover for example.

However i have 0 field experience in this, i'd like to see what people who actually are doing both, extensive training and keto diets, are achieving. And if they notice any changes in muscularity (recovery, build up?)

Next to this, 90% of the keto diets i see, are ridiculous, because they take almost 0 factors besides the macros into consideration. Micro nutritions are usually taken in very imbalanced proportions, especially when it comes down to natrium...

thanks for the link ..

the first study said weight loss was greater at three months and six months but not over a year. I am guessing because initially with keto/low carb you get a big drop of water weight/glycogen which you would not get with a standard high protein/low fat diet.

second study says this in the conclusion "This finding should be interpreted with caution, given the small magnitude of overall and between-group differences in weight loss in these markedly obese subjects and the short duration of the study. "

I don't see whereat they controlled for protein…

I know there are some studies that have shown the opposite, which is that High protein/low fat is better than low carb/keto …but I don't have access to them right now.

I would go with which method you think will work for you over the long run.

I know for me that I with my lifting regimen I could not do low carb as my gym performance would go in the tank.

RonRoff

@ndj1979 thanks for the detailed answer!

In this one they didnt mention it, but as i said, i've read a couple more, that are aimed to setting up your own keto diet, mentioning that the proteine intake should be restricted.

Here is for example a calculater with information about the diet, that mentioned it: http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/

Don't get me wrong, i'm getting good results with weight loss on low fat diets (40/40/20), so my goal is not to change diet to get better results, as i'm perfectly happy with the way its going at the moment.

Yet i wanted to find out if all the claims about the keto diet are true and if its worth it going thru that difficult way of eating for people who are booking remarkably less results with low fat diets.

So far, when i tried to plan a keto diet, i noticed that i'd end up very very high in proteines, low in fibers, high in natrium. And to consider that you want to eat your fat energy (for me it was 60% in my test setup), in healthy fats, it's quite the pain to get it done.

I also noticed, the healthier i go (for example, i tried with mackrell, salmon, red meat, almonds, walnuts), the more expensive my diet became. Whereas my high carb diet costs me about 150 euros per month, this would end up being doubled.

yarwell

ndj1979 wrote: »

the first study said weight loss was greater at three months and six months but not over a year.

I have seen this when
a) The carb intake, serum ketones etc at month 6 is the same in both groups, so the diets have converged
b) Last Observation Carried Forward analysis is used and the back end of the study is messed up by data from dropouts and non-compliants. Analysis of completers or adherents may tell a different story.

pedidiva

This may interest you.

http://www.dietdoctor.com/do-all-diets-fail

ihatetodietalways

Dr. Jeff Volek has written extensively about keto and exercise. He wrote a book on it. You have to spend a few weeks getting adjusted to be burning fat instead of glucose. I have heard that once this is achieved, the diet is protein sparing. It is restrictive, but give it a shot! Experiment on yourself.
On a different note, about fat consumption and bodybuilding, do you guys who restrict your fat have hormonal problems?

pedidiva

The problem may be that as with any diet, people do not continue to maintain the eating plan and the weight returns. It has to be a permanent lifestyle change to keep the weight off. Many long term maintainers utilize the same eating plan as they did while losing to maintain their weight loss. Per the Nat'l weight loss registry.

pedidiva

For my own health, I will have to keep my carb macronutrient %age lower.

YMMV.

RonRoff

@ihatetodietalways i do notice slight changes in my hormonal behaviour.

I tend to be aggitated easier and i sometimes really need to workout to have an output.

SLLRunner

It depends on what works for you. I have not tried it, but being a weight lifter and runner, I know I need my carbs- serious carbs.

elize7

I am doing very low carbs. I do high intensity cardio almost daily for one hour. This diet works very well for me with losing weight, feeling good. I've lost significant weight. Not doing strength training. I rarely feel hungry at very low calories. Have more energy than I do with a carb diet. I take the recommended supplements for this diet as well. Good luck, with whatever plan you choose.

JPW1990

I've been keto 15 years, maintained for 13 of them, gained for two of them when I got lazy and stopped tracking and weighing, down 65 again since November. Prior to when I got sick (the 2 years), I was actively training cardio and resistance with no issue. I am slowly working back up to where I was since being cleared by the physical therapist a few months ago. I've never had any of the energy issues some people complain about, but I was also fully keto-adapted before I started working out. It takes a few weeks to a month for that to happen.

You will find a lot of info here: http://www.reddit.com/r/ketogains
Some of them do standard keto, and some do CKD/TKD, which involves brief carb loads immediately prior to or after training, but in amounts that don't knock them out of ketosis.

cwolfman13

outside of medical conditions, I hardly see the point. I don't know why anyone who didn't need to do this would. I'm all for people eating anything resembling the SAD making better decisions in RE to the kinds of carbs they consume...and I'm all for moderating carb consumption in an effort to better balance one's diet...but I really see no value in keto outside of a medical condition that would require it.

I don't know...I like my lentils and legumes and quinoa and brown rice and potatoes and oats way too much to get rid of them for absolutely no valid reason. Keto people always go to the, "well, you're burning fat for fuel" card...well yeah...you also burn fat for fuel simply being in an energy deficit. Keto isn't necessary for burning fat for fuel.

Carol_

Question: Are you less hungry on a Keto Diet? I have heard this is true.

JPW1990

Carol_ wrote: »

Question: Are you less hungry on a Keto Diet? I have heard this is true.

A lot of people are, mainly because the combination of foods they're eating is more satiating and doesn't give them a sugar spike. I, personally, don't ever feel hungry, but I'm not typical. I'll get dizzy before I feel actual hunger unless I go over 60g/day, and I don't do that intentionally because of the other medical side effects that come with it. It's great when I'm working at a deficit, not always fun when I'm in maintenance.

WeddedBliss1992

well actually i am considering starting monday. heard it was good for mental health. my husband has done it in the past (hard to stick to when the rest of the family doesn't) so he is on board for doing it with me. i am going to do it until we leave for Disney which will be end august. will let you know my results!