Watching TV...and eating "clean"

2

Replies

  • Kalikel
    Kalikel Posts: 9,603 Member
    Ok, I think I get it.

    I like shows with layers and deeper meanings, but not every show has to be Buffy.

    TV is a distraction, not part of our health. You like what you like and one show isn't better for everyone than another.

  • Kalikel
    Kalikel Posts: 9,603 Member
    edited June 2015
    Ok, I think I get it.

    I like shows with layers and deeper meanings, but not every show has to be Buffy.

    TV is a distraction, not part of our health. You like what you like and one show isn't better for everyone than another.

    The only real comparison between TV and food would be matters of taste.
  • Qskim
    Qskim Posts: 1,145 Member
    edited June 2015
    Watching TV can have consequences regardless of the content you watch. (I don't have an opinion on this, just sorting OP's comment). You aren't going to negate the effects of too much screen time by just watching David Attenborough or rather, intellectually superior programs over intellectually inferior programs like Bold and the Beautiful.

    Ergo, similarly with diet. You aren't going to negate the effects of too much food (ie too much "screen time") simply by eating what you believe to be superior clean foods (ie David Attenborough). And you aren't necessarily going to be healthier than the next person who eats from a larger pool of foods (Bold and Beautiful plus David Attenborough lol). Both can overeat (ie screen time too much) both need to moderate their intake to lose weight regardless of their perception of quality of foods (or analogy...quality of programs) for weight loss to happen.

    In short...regardless of whether or not it's B&B or David, you can have too much screen time...

    Regardless of whether or not its clean eating or otherwise, you can still eat too much of anything and not lose weight.

    Amirite? :smile:

  • jennifer_417
    jennifer_417 Posts: 12,344 Member
    What does any of this have to do with "General Diet and Weight Loss Help?"
  • Qskim
    Qskim Posts: 1,145 Member
    Analogy...
  • professionalHobbyist
    professionalHobbyist Posts: 1,316 Member
    This is funny for me

    My main screen time is in the morning

    Soon I will get out of bed, put on coffee, get my dark chocolate fix, and do an hour on the treadmill

    I wake up and relax walking at 3 mph. TV will be on music videos or surfing channels.

    I quit evening TV snacking. I blindly added too many calories grazing. I used to polish off a bag of Doritos and cheese dip. An easy 1500 calories.

    Just no....
  • PneumaVision
    PneumaVision Posts: 44 Member
    Technology has made it much easier to live in a fantasy world, putting a fantasy social media profile out there, charging around heroically in a video game universe collecting magical implements or slaying bad guys, watching the fantasy TV news or even less real 'reality programs', and in general cultivating a mental life alienated from anything authentic or genuine. So at last the daydream life of Walter Mitty has been automated, packaged and commodified, and made available to everyone 24/7 from a variety of convenient devices. When in human history has an entire population needed to be passively entertained for one-third of its waking hours? The teaching about moderation is not "everything in moderation." Rather, it is that we should enjoy good things in moderation while abstaining from those things which are harmful.
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html
  • Laurend224
    Laurend224 Posts: 1,748 Member
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html

    Mama must have watched too much tv while baby was in utero. -_- ;)
  • Alluminati
    Alluminati Posts: 6,208 Member
    This is funny for me

    My main screen time is in the morning

    Soon I will get out of bed, put on coffee, get my dark chocolate fix, and do an hour on the treadmill

    I wake up and relax walking at 3 mph. TV will be on music videos or surfing channels.

    I quit evening TV snacking. I blindly added too many calories grazing. I used to polish off a bag of Doritos and cheese dip. An easy 1500 calories.

    Just no....

    Dark chocolate and coffee for breakfast sounds amazing right now. Thanks for the idea!
  • kgeyser
    kgeyser Posts: 22,505 Member
    Laurend224 wrote: »
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html

    Mama must have watched too much tv while baby was in utero. -_- ;)

    Whew! Glad we cleared that up. Now I can sue Dick Wolf for all those L&O marathons.

    tumblr_n2jzfsRrV21tvyxvwo1_500.gif
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    Laurend224 wrote: »
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html

    Mama must have watched too much tv while baby was in utero. -_- ;)

    You can't see it, but imma givin you the side-eye
  • Laurend224
    Laurend224 Posts: 1,748 Member
    Laurend224 wrote: »
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html

    Mama must have watched too much tv while baby was in utero. -_- ;)

    You can't see it, but imma givin you the side-eye


    Sorry, my sarcasm was broken this morning. 4 cups of coffee and binge watching Sabrina the Teenage Witch with my daughter have fixed me right up. Carry on.
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    Laurend224 wrote: »
    Laurend224 wrote: »
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    How exactly does television cause autism when signs of autism can be seen in 2mo babies?


    http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/actearly/index.html?mobile=nocontent

    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7480/full/nature12715.html

    Mama must have watched too much tv while baby was in utero. -_- ;)

    You can't see it, but imma givin you the side-eye


    Sorry, my sarcasm was broken this morning. 4 cups of coffee and binge watching Sabrina the Teenage Witch with my daughter have fixed me right up. Carry on.

    Oh, no worries, I knew you were being silly, my sarcasm is busted too!
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?

    Jersey Shore or anything with a Kardashian.
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?

    Jersey Shore or anything with a Kardashian.

    ohhhh...the TOXINS!!!! Can the chemicals in their hair products be transmitted electronically??? ;)
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?

    Jersey Shore or anything with a Kardashian.

    ohhhh...the TOXINS!!!! Can the chemicals in their hair products be transmitted electronically??? ;)

    I dunno, I'm already from NJ so I'm probably doomed to big hair either way. If keep back a few feet just to be safe though.
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?

    Jersey Shore or anything with a Kardashian.

    ohhhh...the TOXINS!!!! Can the chemicals in their hair products be transmitted electronically??? ;)

    I dunno, I'm already from NJ so I'm probably doomed to big hair either way. If keep back a few feet just to be safe though.

    I'm sure the Kardashians contain enough silicone to kill a mortal human.
  • zoeysasha37
    zoeysasha37 Posts: 7,088 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    So, what is the TV equivalent of "eating dirty"?

    Jersey Shore or anything with a Kardashian.

    ohhhh...the TOXINS!!!! Can the chemicals in their hair products be transmitted electronically??? ;)

    I dunno, I'm already from NJ so I'm probably doomed to big hair either way. If keep back a few feet just to be safe though.

    Im from Jersey too so yes we're doomed from the start to have big hair and extreme tans. Lol !! Maybe we need a special detox or cleanse to take care of this issue! :smile: lol
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
    Hmmm...a Jersey Shore Cleanse....I think I could market that. ;)
  • Alyssa_Is_LosingIt
    Alyssa_Is_LosingIt Posts: 4,696 Member
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    trumanshow.gif

    I'm currently eating lunch and watching a "My Cat From Hell" marathon. Am I going to die?
  • zoeysasha37
    zoeysasha37 Posts: 7,088 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    Hmmm...a Jersey Shore Cleanse....I think I could market that. ;)

    A million dollar idea !! Lol people think that show is just an isolated group of idiot kids but dont realize that there's tons of others just like that here. Living here, Im at the epicenter of spray tanned drunks wearing neon clothes !
  • zoeysasha37
    zoeysasha37 Posts: 7,088 Member
    Not stirring the pot. Had a thought that maybe would help people understand.

    A lot of people get interested in this idea of the BEST MOST PERFECT DIET EVER. Let's ignore the details--half the time they're contradictory, anyway. Instead, let's talk about screen time and certain foods.

    Like eating immoderately, too much screen time has been linked to a TON of bad things. Sedentary behavior, bad grades, sleep disturbance--even autism (not kidding--it's one of the more credible CAUSATIVE links, actually) and ADHD.

    To say, I'm going to eat clean is a lot like saying I'm not going to have any bad screen time.

    First, there's the definition of "bad." Which screen time is good? Which is bad?

    Okay, so you can argue that some shows on the Discovery Channel--some--might be a bit better for you intellectually than most shows on MTV. And of course you need to do your work on your computer. So video games on your PC aren't as important or "good" as your 9 to 5.

    But the fact is...if you sit and watch nothing but David Attenborough documentaries or do nothing but work, you're still going to get the effects of too much screen time. It will still be bad.

    And there's no reason to not play a first-person shooter for a couple of hours a couple of times a week or to bond over a sports game or to watch the trashiest reality TV show ever just to unwind if it's not part of a 5-hour daily marathon of TV viewing.

    Sure, there are people who watch little to no TV. But there lives are not necessarily better or healthier than people who watch a moderate amount of TV or have other screen time, up to and including "junk" TV. And once you start labeling some screen time as junk and other screen time as good, you are going to have a huge fight on your hands no matter what. The video game players will yell about reflexes and camaraderie. The cinephiles will shout about art. Writers will lecture you sternly about good story-telling. And it will go on and on and on.

    Because what actually matters at the end of the day, more than the content of the screens, is that it's done in moderation. That's more important than anything else.

    I hope this starts making SOME sense!

    trumanshow.gif

    I'm currently eating lunch and watching a "My Cat From Hell" marathon. Am I going to die?

    Prolly..maybe the op can enlighten you as to what other shows will be better for ya health .
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
    Now I'm wondering what would happen if Ron Jeremy co-hosted a show with Guy Fieri on the Food Network.
  • Alyssa_Is_LosingIt
    Alyssa_Is_LosingIt Posts: 4,696 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    Now I'm wondering what would happen if Ron Jeremy co-hosted a show with Guy Fieri on the Food Network.

    Dear god.
  • zoeysasha37
    zoeysasha37 Posts: 7,088 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    Now I'm wondering what would happen if Ron Jeremy co-hosted a show with Guy Fieri on the Food Network.

    It'd be pretty awesome
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    Now I'm wondering what would happen if Ron Jeremy co-hosted a show with Guy Fieri on the Food Network.

    About Jersey Diners. *kitten* black hole
  • crazyjerseygirl
    crazyjerseygirl Posts: 1,252 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    Now I'm wondering what would happen if Ron Jeremy co-hosted a show with Guy Fieri on the Food Network.

    About Jersey Diners. *kitten* black hole

    Really? I can't say *kitten*? Fine. DB black hole
  • Ang108
    Ang108 Posts: 1,711 Member
    Excuse me, but what are you talking about ?
This discussion has been closed.