Is it okay to workout with a heart rate of 160?
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Or just run a hard 5K and sprint as hard as you can the last 400 meters.
All of scottb81's advice is spot on. My personal preference for estimating my max HR is this one here. Mainly because I can't make myself actually do one of the tests, but I can push at the end of a 5k no problem.
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You should be able to run 2 hours at a higher heartrate than is best for training aerobically.EatWholeFoods wrote: »I can do 2 hours at 150 to 160 and I don't get sore. Maybe its OK but I think my Dr should stress test me. I don't sweat a lot but its not comfortable but not uncomfortable enough to want to slow down.
How often do you run? If its only 3 times a week then it doesn't matter much since there is so much recovery time built in. If you are running consecutive days or more than once a day then running too hard in training will lead to your improvement stopping because your body will not be able to recover sufficiently for supercompensation. Instead you will stay the same or even get worse.
Recovery from an easy run should only take 6 to 12 hours. For an easy long run 12 to 24 hours. So you can run easy and run every day, or more than once a day and still improve. Once you start running harder than that recovery times get longer. For example, complete recovery and supercompensation from a lactate threshold run or anaerobic intervals at around 90% max heartrate and above takes around 32 to 48 hours.
Running too many harder runs close together causes you never to get stronger. Running harder than easy and not as hard as lactate threshold isn't necessary and if you are running every day will be counterproductive in the long term.
Are you getting faster and stronger from month to month? If yes then what you are doing is probably ok. If your improvement is not moving along then you are either running too fast in training, or not enough in training, or both.
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Recovery from an easy run should only take 6 to 12 hours. For an easy long run 12 to 24 hours. So you can run easy and run every day, or more than once a day and still improve. Once you start running harder than that recovery times get longer. For example, complete recovery and supercompensation from a lactate threshold run or anaerobic intervals at around 90% max heartrate and above takes around 32 to 48 hours.
Running too many harder runs close together causes you never to get stronger. Running harder than easy and not as hard as lactate threshold isn't necessary and if you are running every day will be counterproductive in the long term.
Emphasis mine, but it's all good stuff.
Most runners that have received little or no coaching or haven't investigated this stuff on their own ... run too hard for their own good for most of their training. It's easy to understand how the new runner gets caught in this trap when PRs seem to be the focus and thus speed is king. That's only true on race day. For the other 80+% of the time, speed isn't king.0 -
EatWholeFoods wrote: »Thanks everyone. Also I don't feel weird unless it reaches 181.
then that's all you really need to worry about it.0 -
EatWholeFoods wrote: »How do I field test for my max heart rate? Also I have a garmin forerunner heart rate monitor. I care enough to even pay for a stress test etc. I think my max heart rate nay be higher than the equation and that's why I don't get sore or a lot of lactic acid build up.
That equation is crap in my opinion. If I went by that, I should have had a heart attack a long time ago. I think there are many variables involved that the equations don't take into consideration. My HRM (also a garmin FR) regularly says I'm at 160-170 while I run. And my perceived exersion is moderate-I can talk, I'm breathing but not maxed out...trust how you feel. It's the best gauge.0 -
I just started C25K, I have never been a runner, but want to give it a go. By the end of the 30 mins I am hitting 180-183 usually during the jogging portions and the mid 150's during the walking portions (age 32, CW 158). I don't feel dizzy or anything. I had a stress test done a few years back when I did my first round of weight loss and started to work out and got scared that my HR got up to 200+ (age then 26ish, SW then 157) just walking with an incline sometimes. Everything was normal, and nothing weird was found so my doc told me at that time to maybe not push myself too hard and just listen to my body. I am curious to see where my HR is when I complete C25K.0
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I'm 40 and routinely my HR will get to 160-165 while running. I know my max is MUCH higher than the formula. It gets over 200 on really hard efforts (around 204 I start feeling icky - and I don't stay at that intensity).0
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I have supra-ventricular tachycardia so a HR of 160 is not worrisome to me. However, if you feel dizzy, faint, or experience chest pain when your HR is 160+, you need to see your PCP and ask for a referral to a cardiologist.
They will conduct tests like an EKG and possibly a stress test to determine the amount of stress your heart can handle.0 -
My recovery heart rate is really good. It drops 30 to 40 beats within a minute. I don't always do a super hard heart beating run. Many days are slower runs with 144 for the heart rate and 155 max. I just wonder if 160 is safe to keep fpr an hour or so. Thanks everyone lots of good info. I google many hours a day tips and running info lol. It is true if you run slowly for a month or 2, you can go a bit faster and your heart rate is lower. Eventually you can push a little faster and hear rate is similar. So maybe I shouldn't do the fast heart rate runs and just do slowly and slowly improve time once I see my heart rate lower. Plus the heat is bad. I try to run at sunset now.0
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I run 5 to 7 days a week. I rest if I do a super long run. I can feel if I need rest. I improved my time per mile by 1:30 min in 2 months. Sometimes I rest 2 days. I do a long run per week, pretty slow, then 3 to 4 mile easy runs, then once or twice a week a faster 5k test, intervals once a week or hills, and sometimes 1 to 2 mile tempo run or race pace run pushing time at goal pace.0
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The heart gets fast on the tempo runs, race pace runs, and sometimes end of long run.0
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htimpaired wrote: »EatWholeFoods wrote: »How do I field test for my max heart rate? Also I have a garmin forerunner heart rate monitor. I care enough to even pay for a stress test etc. I think my max heart rate nay be higher than the equation and that's why I don't get sore or a lot of lactic acid build up.
That equation is crap in my opinion. If I went by that, I should have had a heart attack a long time ago. I think there are many variables involved that the equations don't take into consideration. My HRM (also a garmin FR) regularly says I'm at 160-170 while I run. And my perceived exersion is moderate-I can talk, I'm breathing but not maxed out...trust how you feel. It's the best gauge.
This is me too. My Polar H7 HRM says 170-180 on average for a 1hr15 run at around a 10.5 min mile but this is perfectly comfortable for me and my heart rate slows down quickly once I'm done. I'm 34.0 -
Good to know and hear everyone's info. My resting rate is low too like 60 to 64 watching tv and had my heart rate monitor say 54 sometimes if I leave it on watching tv. So I guess its ok just we shouldn't get dehydrated and die out there lol in the heat. I read sodium can help you in heat retain water if you have the sodium before the run and water and can help keep your heart rate down a little.0
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Yes, maximum heart rate is very individual and related to how fast your specific heart can beat - not how fast you should let it beat. The formulas are only moderately helpful if someone is setting initial target zones for exercise. If you want to know your individual max heart rate, they are of no use. If someone wants to do heart rate training (as opposed to using perceived exertion) they at some point need to determine their own max HR and resting HR (which is much easier - LOL!)
FWIW, the formulas would say my HR would max out in the upper 160s. (53 year old male). My 5k in June I pushed hard the last stretch and hit 183 at the end. As it was still increasing I'd estimate there are a few more beats per minute in there.0 -
A good way to see if your heart is ok with 160 is when you stop your cardio see how long it takes for your heart rate to drop under 120. Should be there within about 2 minutes or so. The problem would be if your heart rate stayed up near 160 after completing cardio. Hope this helps.0
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I generally get pretty high heart rates when I run, especially in the summer if I am running in 80F temperatures. I don't run a huge number of miles - about 12 a week - so I am probably not as conditioned as some of you. I get heart rates up to 170-175 going up hills and 160ish running a decent pace on flats. Once it cools down my heart rates will dip down to about 150-155 on flats if I don't push faster.0
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The goal of training is to develop the ability to run faster at a lower heartrate, not to see how high you can push your heartrate every day.0
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When I was in my early 30's and not in stellar shape, my heart rate got up to a sustained 180 while hiking up art of Tuckerman's trail with a pack full of camera gear and a heavy Bogan tripod
Get up to about 140 pushing hard in a spin class. Hard being 400W+ on the meter.0 -
lporter229 wrote: »lporter229 wrote: »The Maffetone 180 formula may be a better way of estimating your target heart rate zone.
http://philmaffetone.com/180-formula/
I'm 43 years old and have been running for a long while. I use 142 as my target ceiling based on the Maffetone formula.
That seems wrong and gives me a max HR of 137
I generally train at around 145-150 and HIIT will bring me peaks of 165-168
I just focus on "can I talk" and does it come down quickly when I slow down
It's not intended to give you your max HR. It's intended to give you your optimal training zone for developing aerobic fitness.
I've always been perplexed by this TBH and am open to being educated
Why is under 137 my aerobic training zone when I don't really feel the effort around there and feel as though I'm improving at higher rates ...I might be overthinking it, but it's genuine ignorance and interest in the science / source bit0 -
This book explains it very well. I highly recommend it if you are interested in endurance training:
http://www.amazon.com/80-20-Running-Stronger-Training-ebook/dp/B00IIVFAEY
Basically, it's all about the recovery. You may not feel like the exertion on your body at HR=137 is enough to gain improvements in fitness, it definitely is. But not so much that you have a difficult time recovering. If you constantly train at a higher HR, you are gaining no additional benefits, but it takes more time to recover. Then when you actually do higher intensity workouts, you are unable to reach your max potential.
The idea is to create a solid aerobic foundation through low intensity training. You are able to run much longer at this level. You can run 6-7 days per week without fatigue. All of this goes toward strengthening your aerobic base. Once you have a solid foundation you can add speed work/ tempo runs up to 20% of your training time and you will really start to reap the benefits.
I don't know what you current level of training is so you may be fine doing speed work already. You just don't want to push yourself too hard on every run. If you shoot for your target zone of 137 for 80% of your running, you will see drastic improvements in your overall pace. I was very skeptical and struggled with this concept at first, but once I was able to grasp the concept and actually train this way, my half marathon and marathon times plummeted.
For the record, I am guessing that scottb81 and others will be able to offer you a better explanation behind the physiology, so feel free to chime in 0 -
I use a Polar H7 and their associated algorithm to help time my recovery periods, but I push my HR at least once a week. I've never felt any adverse effects from this and this is your real concern. As long as you are healthy pushing your boundaries is a necessary tool for growth.0
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I use a Polar H7 and their associated algorithm to help time my recovery periods, but I push my HR at least once a week. I've never felt any adverse effects from this and this is your real concern. As long as you are healthy pushing your boundaries is a necessary tool for growth.
I agree. And I don't think anyone intended to imply otherwise. It just shouldn't be pushed too high every time you run. At least, that's not the best way to increase your overall aerobic endurance. For someone with different goals, 20-30 minutes of HIIT twice a week might be appropriate. Sometimes the intent of these threads tends to get derailed.0 -
EatWholeFoods wrote: »I have been working out for 4 years, but kept my hwart rate 120-145 for workouts. I started running again which I used to do for 10 years but 10 years ago. I have a heart rate monitor and feel great. I just feel pushing like its hard but not too hard, but my heart rate gets to 160 and stays there for awhile when I run. Is that okay if I feel fine during and after workouts?
I sure hope so, because my average heart rate was 173 during my last 5K race. For the last mile it was 178.
However, you shouldn't be doing most of your workouts at a hard intensity. Most of them should be moderate. Rather than heart rate, I suggest the "talk test": can you talk in complete sentences? If not, slow down until you can.0 -
lporter229 wrote: »This book explains it very well. I highly recommend it if you are interested in endurance training:
http://www.amazon.com/80-20-Running-Stronger-Training-ebook/dp/B00IIVFAEY
Basically, it's all about the recovery. You may not feel like the exertion on your body at HR=137 is enough to gain improvements in fitness, it definitely is. But not so much that you have a difficult time recovering. If you constantly train at a higher HR, you are gaining no additional benefits, but it takes more time to recover. Then when you actually do higher intensity workouts, you are unable to reach your max potential.
The idea is to create a solid aerobic foundation through low intensity training. You are able to run much longer at this level. You can run 6-7 days per week without fatigue. All of this goes toward strengthening your aerobic base. Once you have a solid foundation you can add speed work/ tempo runs up to 20% of your training time and you will really start to reap the benefits.
I don't know what you current level of training is so you may be fine doing speed work already. You just don't want to push yourself too hard on every run. If you shoot for your target zone of 137 for 80% of your running, you will see drastic improvements in your overall pace. I was very skeptical and struggled with this concept at first, but once I was able to grasp the concept and actually train this way, my half marathon and marathon times plummeted.
For the record, I am guessing that scottb81 and others will be able to offer you a better explanation behind the physiology, so feel free to chime in
Thanks for that
That might be the difference as I'm not a runner, I'm more a cardio for warm-up and HIIT type
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xtremefitness123 wrote: »A good way to see if your heart is ok with 160 is when you stop your cardio see how long it takes for your heart rate to drop under 120. Should be there within about 2 minutes or so. The problem would be if your heart rate stayed up near 160 after completing cardio. Hope this helps.
This helps answer my question. I would like to ask a stupid question though-in people that it stays high-what would that mean, or why would that happen?
I'm new to exercise and I notice with my fitbit hr it shows my heart rate drops down quite quickly when I stop. Wasn't sure if this was good/bad.0 -
My workouts are mostly in anaerobic zone (MHR found by noted the maximum ever recorded with my HRM, 5 bpm higher than 220-age). The goal of my workouts are cardio vascular health, calories burned, other health benefits of exercise (stress, etc.) and the enjoyment of mountain biking. I'm not training for a race or to improve my time.
Any negatives to working out mostly in this zone keeping these goals in mind?
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MakePeasNotWar wrote: »I hit 180 fairly often, which would theoretically be 100% of max (I'm 40), but clearly isn't. I got up to 204 during HIIT last year and nothing bad happened.
My doctor said as long as I feel fine and don't get dizzy or have chest pain I'm ok at 170-180bpm. You might want to double check with your doctor to see what he or she says.
Exactly the same here. During normal runs I average 145 to 165, depending on pace. I've gone up over 190 during HIIT, but that was pretty much gasping. My average working rate is 155bpm
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If you are really at 85 to 90% for most runs then yes that is too hard. You are running a Lactate Threshold effort every day. You should only run that hard once or twice a week and the rest of the time run at less than about 77% max. These guidelines are for best improving performance.
OP has been doing it multiple times a week for months - I suspect the typical equation isn't right and OP is running below LT.To be sure you need to do a max HR test or run a hard 5k and see how high it gets in the last 400m sprint.
I'll second that.
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Recovery heart rate is a big part of it too. After stopping exercise for 1 min, my heart drops 40 bpm so I think I am fine and after 2 min it returns to my starting heart rate or almost starting speed prior to working out. Thanks everyone. Good input...I guess my max is somewhere above 181 since I hit 181 sprinting on a hot day.0
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If it stays high then your heart is not doing well and you should take it easy. If it deops after stopping that is good. Google recovery heart rate. @ Bbontheb0
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