My protein sources are too filling and too low in calories.
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What about cottage cheese and Greek Yogurt. To get more cals opt for 2% fat or higher, if you can stomach those products. otherwise I would suggest protein shake.0
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Since you are looking to increase calories while maintaining or increasing your protein, you need to eat more and/or shift some of your carbs to fat ( which is 9 cal/g instead of 4 cal/g ).
To help you eat more, I would recommend lowering your fiber intake, which most days is over 2x more then RDA. An easy way you might do this is to switch your protein powered to some other type, since the hemp protein you are using is very high carb/fiber. Look into soy or pea protein, or find another brand/blend of the ones you are currently using. Your satiety level will go down, and you will generally want to eat more and feel less full.
To help you shift to fat / add calories, I would recommend you start using higher/full fat versions of what you're already eating, like your greek yogurt. Incorporate more of the nuts/nut butters you are already using, or try new ones. They tend to be very caloricaly dense for their volume. Since you're already using dairy, I'm gonna assume your not LI, so you may consider at least splitting milk duties between the almonds you already use, and the cow. Use a cream sauce with your rice noodles, instead of Soyaki all the time, add butter or cheese to your vegetables ...
This makes a whole lot of sense. I knew that having so much fiber in my diet was contributing to my feelings of fullness, but I'm really not willing to cut out the fruits and veggies I eat. It'd be very easy for me to switch protein powders, though, and buy full fat Greek yogurt. Thank you!The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
I aim for 1g/kg baseline, with extra on workout days based on MFP calcs from logging exercise. 1g/kg puts me at ~20% of calories from protein, on a non training day.
At your weight, that would be ~ 70g/day baseline.
So are you saying that I only need 70g of protein a day? Or that I actually need more than the .8 multiplier I was using? Unsure if I qualify for the USDA's definition of an 'athlete,' although I am very active.
You would only need that little protein if you were eating maintenance calories and were not active. If you are in a caloric deficit, you need more (protein helps ensure you don't lose as much muscle while you lose fat), Or if you are active (workout, etc) you need more protein, so if you are in a deficit and active you need quite a bit more. I would say you would not need more than 0.7-0.8 grams per lb of goal body weight though. More is fine but that would be adequate.0 -
No, she's right. .8g/kg/day is the recommended amount.The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
0.8 grams per day? that's it?
me thinks you're confused.
A lot of people here strive to get the max. They go for the number that is the highest that can do them any good. Some strive for even more than can do them any good. It maxes out around 1.7 or 1.8/kg/day.
But .8/kg/day is the recommended amount.
For the OP, that's about 56g/day.
again that is for a sedentary individual eating maintenance calories. A deficit and activity increase the amount of protein needed in order to maintain as much of your current muscle as you can.0 -
Since you are looking to increase calories while maintaining or increasing your protein, you need to eat more and/or shift some of your carbs to fat ( which is 9 cal/g instead of 4 cal/g ).
To help you eat more, I would recommend lowering your fiber intake, which most days is over 2x more then RDA. An easy way you might do this is to switch your protein powered to some other type, since the hemp protein you are using is very high carb/fiber. Look into soy or pea protein, or find another brand/blend of the ones you are currently using. Your satiety level will go down, and you will generally want to eat more and feel less full.
To help you shift to fat / add calories, I would recommend you start using higher/full fat versions of what you're already eating, like your greek yogurt. Incorporate more of the nuts/nut butters you are already using, or try new ones. They tend to be very caloricaly dense for their volume. Since you're already using dairy, I'm gonna assume your not LI, so you may consider at least splitting milk duties between the almonds you already use, and the cow. Use a cream sauce with your rice noodles, instead of Soyaki all the time, add butter or cheese to your vegetables ...
This makes a whole lot of sense. I knew that having so much fiber in my diet was contributing to my feelings of fullness, but I'm really not willing to cut out the fruits and veggies I eat. It'd be very easy for me to switch protein powders, though, and buy full fat Greek yogurt. Thank you!The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
I aim for 1g/kg baseline, with extra on workout days based on MFP calcs from logging exercise. 1g/kg puts me at ~20% of calories from protein, on a non training day.
At your weight, that would be ~ 70g/day baseline.
So are you saying that I only need 70g of protein a day? Or that I actually need more than the .8 multiplier I was using? Unsure if I qualify for the USDA's definition of an 'athlete,' although I am very active.
Based on the USDA recommendations, you should eat a minimum of 55.6g/day ( 0.8g/kg), and no more than 118.3g/day ( 1.7g/kg ) for current weight of 153 lbs.
I am sedentary-lightly active most of the time, but exercise 3d/week, which I don't feel qualifies me as an athlete ( I don't train a lot or for long durations ). Because of that, I target the lower end of the range.
Calculating a similar target for you gives the 70g baseline result I stated. You can adjust that up or down based on where you think you fit within the range. There is no reason for you to be setting the target as high as you currently have it, unless you are a competitive athlete in a physical performance based discipline
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Since you are looking to increase calories while maintaining or increasing your protein, you need to eat more and/or shift some of your carbs to fat ( which is 9 cal/g instead of 4 cal/g ).
To help you eat more, I would recommend lowering your fiber intake, which most days is over 2x more then RDA. An easy way you might do this is to switch your protein powered to some other type, since the hemp protein you are using is very high carb/fiber. Look into soy or pea protein, or find another brand/blend of the ones you are currently using. Your satiety level will go down, and you will generally want to eat more and feel less full.
To help you shift to fat / add calories, I would recommend you start using higher/full fat versions of what you're already eating, like your greek yogurt. Incorporate more of the nuts/nut butters you are already using, or try new ones. They tend to be very caloricaly dense for their volume. Since you're already using dairy, I'm gonna assume your not LI, so you may consider at least splitting milk duties between the almonds you already use, and the cow. Use a cream sauce with your rice noodles, instead of Soyaki all the time, add butter or cheese to your vegetables ...
This makes a whole lot of sense. I knew that having so much fiber in my diet was contributing to my feelings of fullness, but I'm really not willing to cut out the fruits and veggies I eat. It'd be very easy for me to switch protein powders, though, and buy full fat Greek yogurt. Thank you!The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
I aim for 1g/kg baseline, with extra on workout days based on MFP calcs from logging exercise. 1g/kg puts me at ~20% of calories from protein, on a non training day.
At your weight, that would be ~ 70g/day baseline.
So are you saying that I only need 70g of protein a day? Or that I actually need more than the .8 multiplier I was using? Unsure if I qualify for the USDA's definition of an 'athlete,' although I am very active.
Based on the USDA recommendations, you should eat a minimum of 55.6g/day ( 0.8g/kg), and no more than 118.3g/day ( 1.7g/kg ) for current weight of 153 lbs.
I am sedentary-lightly active most of the time, but exercise 3d/week, which I don't feel qualifies me as an athlete ( I don't train a lot or for long durations ). Because of that, I target the lower end of the range.
Calculating a similar target for you gives the 70g result I stated. You can adjust that up or down based on where you think you fit within the range. There is no reason for you to be setting the target as high as you currently have it, unless you are a competitive athlete in a physical performance based discipline
ETA: Or are in a caloric deficit.
then you should hover around the high end of that calculation to ensure you don't lose much muscle while you lose fat.0 -
I would see if I could find a different protein powder that gives you more bang for your buck in terms of protein. (I'm also ovo-lacto and love Trader Joe's, but I'm not a fan of their protein powders because they don't give you a lot of protein for your calories). Can you tolerate soy or pea protein? What about an egg-based protein powder? I took a quick look at the non-whey options available from TrueNutrition (not saying they're the only company that sells non-whey -- I just happen to buy from them so I can find things more easily on their site) and found these:
Egg white protein: 120 calories/25g protein
Soy protein isolate: 109 calories/27g protein
Pea protein isolate: 110 calories/24g protein
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My sister is a personal trainer and it gave her that message all the time but she was getting what she needed. If u r getting enough protein and nutrients, ur fine.0
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No, she's right. .8g/kg/day is the recommended amount.The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
0.8 grams per day? that's it?
me thinks you're confused.
A lot of people here strive to get the max. They go for the number that is the highest that can do them any good. Some strive for even more than can do them any good. It maxes out around 1.7 or 1.8/kg/day.
But .8/kg/day is the recommended amount.
For the OP, that's about 56g/day.
That's the minimum recommended for health (or avoiding negative effects). OP is interested in maintaining/building muscle, if I'm understanding correctly, and that calls for more, especially if you are eating at a deficit. There are benefits up to at least .8 g/lb of LBM. (And I've seen studies that suggest that there may be benefits from even more, potentially depending on timing and especially if you are above 40, which is not OP, if one is seeking to build muscle. I am skeptical but not ruling it out.)0 -
Okay, to give you guys an idea of how active I am when I say that I am very active:
- I run at least five days a week/25 miles a week (on my good weeks, I do 6 days, 30 miles)
- I do strength training before or after every run (planks, pushups, lunges (with weight), squats (with weight), all kinds of ab work)
- I go to CrossFit three times a week in addition to everything else
I am a little conflicted because 70g of protein, though it would be a RELIEF in terms of diet, seems low. I don't want to lose too much muscle.0 -
Since you are looking to increase calories while maintaining or increasing your protein, you need to eat more and/or shift some of your carbs to fat ( which is 9 cal/g instead of 4 cal/g ).
To help you eat more, I would recommend lowering your fiber intake, which most days is over 2x more then RDA. An easy way you might do this is to switch your protein powered to some other type, since the hemp protein you are using is very high carb/fiber. Look into soy or pea protein, or find another brand/blend of the ones you are currently using. Your satiety level will go down, and you will generally want to eat more and feel less full.
To help you shift to fat / add calories, I would recommend you start using higher/full fat versions of what you're already eating, like your greek yogurt. Incorporate more of the nuts/nut butters you are already using, or try new ones. They tend to be very caloricaly dense for their volume. Since you're already using dairy, I'm gonna assume your not LI, so you may consider at least splitting milk duties between the almonds you already use, and the cow. Use a cream sauce with your rice noodles, instead of Soyaki all the time, add butter or cheese to your vegetables ...
This makes a whole lot of sense. I knew that having so much fiber in my diet was contributing to my feelings of fullness, but I'm really not willing to cut out the fruits and veggies I eat. It'd be very easy for me to switch protein powders, though, and buy full fat Greek yogurt. Thank you!The USDA recommends 0.8g/kg/day for protein, for the general public. For athletes their recommendation is anywhere from 1.2 to 1.7, depending on type. You'll get recommendations all over the place for how much you should or shouldn't try to eat from other sources.
I aim for 1g/kg baseline, with extra on workout days based on MFP calcs from logging exercise. 1g/kg puts me at ~20% of calories from protein, on a non training day.
At your weight, that would be ~ 70g/day baseline.
So are you saying that I only need 70g of protein a day? Or that I actually need more than the .8 multiplier I was using? Unsure if I qualify for the USDA's definition of an 'athlete,' although I am very active.
Based on the USDA recommendations, you should eat a minimum of 55.6g/day ( 0.8g/kg), and no more than 118.3g/day ( 1.7g/kg ) for current weight of 153 lbs.
I am sedentary-lightly active most of the time, but exercise 3d/week, which I don't feel qualifies me as an athlete ( I don't train a lot or for long durations ). Because of that, I target the lower end of the range.
Calculating a similar target for you gives the 70g result I stated. You can adjust that up or down based on where you think you fit within the range. There is no reason for you to be setting the target as high as you currently have it, unless you are a competitive athlete in a physical performance based discipline
ETA: Or are in a caloric deficit.
then you should hover around the high end of that calculation to ensure you don't lose much muscle while you lose fat.
Yes I agree with this - when in a deficit, it makes a lot of sense to push protein towards the upper (beneficial) limit, even for non-athletes (although OP is an athlete).
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70 seems a little low given your goals.
The best studies I've seen recommend .8-1 gram per lb of lean body mass as the max you will likely benefit from.
I don't know your lean body mass, but since you want to lose some weight, 25% might be a good estimate, but let's do a range of 20%-25% to be safe: that would make your lean body mass 115-123. So a conservative estimate would be that you should try and get at least 98 (.8 of 123), and don't need to get more. (Edit: I tend to prefer more, but it's not burdensome for me, and that's a significant consideration.)0 -
The only medical studies ( not bro science articles on bodybuilding sites ) I have read that mention protein intake values at the top end of the range are short duration and highly restrictive calorie diets. Most of them picked a target of about twice the standard RDA, so around 1.5-1.6 g/kg. Some of those studies also did a comparative to a 3rd higher level, around 3x the base RDA. None of them ran trials at less than 2x the RDA, or with less restrictive calories.
From my recollection, there was no measurable difference in the results exceeding 2x, such that it was believed to not be beneficial to increase beyond that point. There is no clinical evidence that 2x is the optimal or maximally useful intake level, because they didn't test intermediate levels. Therefore, it is reasonable to conjecture that level could in fact be anywhere within the 1-2x RDA range. That gives a maximal result ( @1.5g/kg ) of ~ 104.3g/day for her body weight, and the actually necessary value could be much lower.
Regardless, I think we can both agree that she doesn't need to be trying to eat 140g+/day, as some of her diary logs suggest, which is nearly 1g/lb.0 -
There are also some questions about whether or not non-animal protein sources are digestible to the same degree as animal-based protein sources. I would err on the side of too much vegetarian protein vs. too little to be safe (to a reasonable degree, of course. 100-125g should be a very safe ballpark for you; 70g seems low).0
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Here's a good summary of the research on protein to date: examine.com/faq/how-much-protein-do-i-need-every-day (it has footnotes to studies).
"If you are an athlete or highly active person currently attempting to lose body fat while preserving lean muscle mass, a daily intake of 1.5-2.2g/kg bodyweight (0.68-1g/lb bodyweight) would be a good target.
* * *
The US Recommended Daily Allowance for protein[1] ranges between 46-56g for adults, depending on gender. Sometimes this number is also defined as 0.8g/kg bodyweight, if relative to weight.
This is usually the lowest recommended estimate as it does not assume any extraneous conditions....
* * *
According to the International Society of Sports Nutrition, protein intakes of 1.4-2.0 g/kg of bodyweight (0.6-0.9g/lb of bodyweight) for physically active individuals is not only safe, but may improve the training adaptations to exercise training. The American Dietetic Association, Dietitians of Canada, and the American College of Sports Medicine also support high protein intake for active individuals[8] in the range of 1.2-1.7 g/kg of bodyweight (0.5-0.8 g/lb of bodyweight).
The reasons for the above tend to be increased leucine oxidation (a marker for amino acids being used for fuel, by being turned into glucose) that requires a higher intake of amino acids to negate and preserve nitrogen balance. Additionally, increasing protein intake above the previously defined RDA 'daily allowance' will increase protein synthesis and, at levels higher than double this total, decrease protein breakdown. Increased muscular hypertrophy is seen as beneficial to sports performance.
During Weight Loss
High protein diets have been found to preserve lean body mass when dieting in both obese people and athletes and has also been shown to improve overall body composition. A doubling of protein intake from 0.9g/kg (near the daily recommended intake for the general population) to 1.8g/kg is able to preserve lean muscle mass during short-term and relatively drastic drops in calories."0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Here's a good summary of the research on protein to date: examine.com/faq/how-much-protein-do-i-need-every-day (it has footnotes to studies).
"If you are an athlete or highly active person currently attempting to lose body fat while preserving lean muscle mass, a daily intake of 1.5-2.2g/kg bodyweight (0.68-1g/lb bodyweight) would be a good target.
* * *
The US Recommended Daily Allowance for protein[1] ranges between 46-56g for adults, depending on gender. Sometimes this number is also defined as 0.8g/kg bodyweight, if relative to weight.
This is usually the lowest recommended estimate as it does not assume any extraneous conditions....
* * *
According to the International Society of Sports Nutrition, protein intakes of 1.4-2.0 g/kg of bodyweight (0.6-0.9g/lb of bodyweight) for physically active individuals is not only safe, but may improve the training adaptations to exercise training. The American Dietetic Association, Dietitians of Canada, and the American College of Sports Medicine also support high protein intake for active individuals[8] in the range of 1.2-1.7 g/kg of bodyweight (0.5-0.8 g/lb of bodyweight).
The reasons for the above tend to be increased leucine oxidation (a marker for amino acids being used for fuel, by being turned into glucose) that requires a higher intake of amino acids to negate and preserve nitrogen balance. Additionally, increasing protein intake above the previously defined RDA 'daily allowance' will increase protein synthesis and, at levels higher than double this total, decrease protein breakdown. Increased muscular hypertrophy is seen as beneficial to sports performance.
During Weight Loss
High protein diets have been found to preserve lean body mass when dieting in both obese people and athletes and has also been shown to improve overall body composition. A doubling of protein intake from 0.9g/kg (near the daily recommended intake for the general population) to 1.8g/kg is able to preserve lean muscle mass during short-term and relatively drastic drops in calories."
I can agree with all of this. I am not trying to support a position it is unsafe to be at the high end of the range, and I've seen similar information about leucine. I gave her the full range recommendation, the calculated values at the extremes, a rational for why I chose 1g/kg, and the value for her at that same rate. I didn't claim it was optimal, just that it was sufficient to support health.
I was and am trying to alleviate her concern that she is somehow causing herself great harm because she was only able to hit 125g of a 145g target for a particular day, by giving her the math for minimal protein intake to support metabolic protein synthesis, which is sufficient for 97%+ of the population.
The 1g/lb ( which is 2.2g/kg )mantra that everyone likes to throw around on here is, at best, borderline dangerous, and potentialy harmful, based on studies of showing increase risk of kidney disease from excessive intake. And, that level of intake has been shown to be no more effective than 1.5g/kg in clinical studies with much higher levels of calorie restriction that she is likely to experience, unless following a medically supervised plan.
I never made a judgement of her status as an athlete or not, I simply said I do not consider myself to be one, when explaining my target. I also mentioned she can adjust based on where she fits on the scale.
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Current recommendations from the academy of dietetics
http://www.eatright.org/resource/fitness/sports-and-performance/fueling-your-workout/protein-and-the-athlete
Just add fat to your diet to up the calories0 -
The 1g/lb ( which is 2.2g/kg )mantra that everyone likes to throw around on here
I don't believe this is dangerous, but am responding more to say that I don't think it's what's normally recommended on MFP. It's common to see recommendations of .8-1 g per lb of LBM (similar to what I said above) or .6-.8 g per lb of bodyweight IF you are not obese. I like to recommend basing this on goal weight if you don't know your LBM.
I think the OP expressed concern about losing/maintaining muscle, not simply health.0 -
Thanks everyone for taking the time to respond!
Even though eating this much protein has been a pain, it's had positive effects, too: I'm never ever hungry, I sleep like a brick at night, my blood sugar feels more stable. But ironically, the changes it's had on my appetite are what I'm having difficulty managing.
On days that I really work out, getting my net calories over 1200 while keeping my protein percentage in the 'correct' range (the range that MFP suggests for me) makes me feel SO bloated. I have to eat so much. I'm usually only barely able to get my net over 1300, MUCH less the 1800ish that MFP suggests for me. I am worried about the effect this will have on my body. I don't want my muscles eaten up to compensate for this deficit! (plus I'm burning so many more cals than MFP thinks I am...) And I get really nervous when I see people on here saying that the percentage of protein I eat in a day should actually be 30%!!!!! ACK!
But for now, with the information y'all have provided me, I am going to continue as I am, while trying to lower my fiber levels, and increasing the percentage of fat that I eat in a day, and pray that my body adapts to this new diet. I feel hopeful!0
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