The way people think.
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These message boards along with a few real life experiences with people have convinced me that western civilization has completely lost the basic human function of how to eat. It's quite a sad sign for the human race.
I sort of feel that way. It's like I'm onto some secret that nobody else knows about. They keep going after drugs and surgeries to treat the effects of their weight gain, but never really go after the weight aspect of it, or have been convinced that they "can't" lose, because they have a thyroid problem, or a bad back that stops them from being active. Have their doctors really not told them that if they get their diet under control, they can get their weight under control? Have they not googled the issue? If they did, did they just wind up on a bunch of bogus "calories don't count!" blogs and decided it's too complicated? I'm not judging. I was there. I just wish they realized how much easier life could be, but it's not my place to tell them.0 -
I agree that many people have little understanding of what constitutes a weight-loss/maintenance strategy that is sane & workable - as they're used hearing about lunatic "diets" for weight loss, magic formulas, etc. , and watching "Biggest Loser". Many have no concept of exercise's role - how few calories it really burns in practice (one of my relatives asked me if my recent weight loss, then about 30 pounds, was because of my rowing . . . which she knows I've been doing for more than a decade. Jeesh). Some of this may be willful ignorance.
But I think it's also a special case of a general inability for many folks to wrap their minds around others' very different lives. Because I'm a vegetarian, people used to ask me whether I cooked two meals for me and my late husband (a meat-eater & even a hunter). Um, no. They asked whether we worried that we might pull out that ol' hunting rifle and shoot each other sometime during an argument. Um, no. (Do they stab each other with their butcher knives??!?) I could go on & on. If they don't live something like it, they don't get it.
A significant fraction of people have no idea how to put themselves in someone else's shoes, metaphorically. I used to run a telephone help desk for computer users; it's hard to train staff people to understand what the caller does/doesn't know or has/hasn't done - most want to implicitly assume the other person knows all & only the stuff they themselves know, and will behave similarly. Uh-uh.
I think the "weight loss" bafflement is just another example of this general issue.0 -
I guess I just don't know that many people who are struggling with their weight. I know a lot of people who make it a part of their lives, I just don't know a lot who are lost about it.0
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withaflourish wrote: »I guess I just don't know that many people who are struggling with their weight. I know a lot of people who make it a part of their lives, I just don't know a lot who are lost about it.
I know a lot of people (mostly married or long-term coupled, sedentary office types in their 30s-40s) who are 15 to 40 lbs over their comfort zone and what would have been an "average" size/body a couple of decades ago. They basically know what's involved, they're just not prepared to give up weekend consumption, restaurant dinners, takeout, or mid-day treats. Because they're also tired a lot of the time from working stupid hours, and they have long commutes, and they like those mid-day treats because they keep them conscious enough to do their officey jobs.
^^ not a criticism, that was me too, lol.0 -
I'm one of those people - but I'm the only one in my group who is in that situtation. Most everyone else we socialize with in this age group and social bracket are in a really awesome place. And hell, I'm not even THAT far off, so I'm wondering why there's this notion that EVERYONE seems to veer into this outerworld at some point.0
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Mostly, the people "out there" I see dieting are those who've had to go on special diets due to diabetes and high blood pressure caused by obesity.
So it's no wonder that the rest of the people think dieting is complicated and dread it.
Hmm, I must make that a plan... post elsewhere more about how gaining caloric awareness is a skill for life.0 -
I suppose it's not all that unusual considering this is a forum especially for people who are focusing on weight loss. But it is narrow to suggest that "society" doesn't get it.0
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In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life0 -
Protranser wrote: »In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
Why do you have to explain anything to anyone? Honestly... I don't understand firstly why you'd even be discussing your "diet" with anyone, but then certainly not justifying it to them afterward?
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Liftng4Lis wrote: »First, I don't diet, I have a lifestyle change.
YES, the majority of people think there is a magic pill or something drastic has to go on for weight loss to occur.
Well said.0 -
withaflourish wrote: »I'm one of those people - but I'm the only one in my group who is in that situtation. Most everyone else we socialize with in this age group and social bracket are in a really awesome place. And hell, I'm not even THAT far off, so I'm wondering why there's this notion that EVERYONE seems to veer into this outerworld at some point.
Because people ask about wacky diets all the time and demonstrate that they don't know. Or maybe that they wish they didn't have to make big changes.
But it's one thing to kind of have an idea of what you need to do, and totally another to get into the nitty gritty of weighing or measuring your food, leaving some food on your plate at a restaurant, figuring how much of what is going to keep you full & under budget. Etc.0 -
withaflourish wrote: »These message boards along with a few real life experiences with people have convinced me that western civilization has completely lost the basic human function of how to eat. It's quite a sad sign for the human race.
Do you really think that? Is that really what you encounter in your day-to-day life? I'm seriously asking (and removing the "internet forum" aspect)
Yes, absolutely. People know I'm a personal trainer and ask me the dumbest questions about what to eat & have the most bizarre ideas about eating and losing weight.0 -
withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
Why do you have to explain anything to anyone? Honestly... I don't understand firstly why you'd even be discussing your "diet" with anyone, but then certainly not justifying it to them afterward?
I genuinely don't mind discussing my diet with others who ask, especially if it's something they can learn from and apply to their own health maintenance.0 -
To answer OP, the general understanding of nutrition by Joe and Sally public depends how the question is asked:
Few can give a quantitative answer to 'what is a Calorie ?' but
if you asked 'Why do people gain weight ?', I bet almost everybody would say "they eat too much!"
The biggest problem I encounter in talking about weight loss with patients is bridging the gap from 'too much' to 'how much less.' It is non-intuitive that an obese person can continue to eat 95% of their current diet and become thin.
The idea of changing to a new equilibrium is however way belong average comprehension unless it is framed as a lifestyle change.0 -
ericGold15 wrote: »To answer OP, the general understanding of nutrition by Joe and Sally public depends how the question is asked:
Few can give a quantitative answer to 'what is a Calorie ?' but
if you asked 'Why do people gain weight ?', I bet almost everybody would say "they eat too much!"
The biggest problem I encounter in talking about weight loss with patients is bridging the gap from 'too much' to 'how much less.' The idea of changing to a new equilibrium is however way belong average comprehension unless it is framed as a lifestyle change.
I wish you were my doctor. Mine told me to eat less fried food. He didn't know how much fried food I actually ate. He just assumed big fat fatties eat a lot of KFC.
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Protranser wrote: »I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
That's the part that's so puzzling to me. When I see someone who is successful at something, I want to learn from them!
This has happened to me many times - with weight loss and in other areas where I've gotten good at something. People see my success, and ask about it, but then criticize and dismiss anything I say.
It's just so bizarre.0 -
withaflourish wrote: »These message boards along with a few real life experiences with people have convinced me that western civilization has completely lost the basic human function of how to eat. It's quite a sad sign for the human race.
Do you really think that? Is that really what you encounter in your day-to-day life? I'm seriously asking (and removing the "internet forum" aspect)
Yes, absolutely. People know I'm a personal trainer and ask me the dumbest questions about what to eat & have the most bizarre ideas about eating and losing weight.
Huh. I guess maybe that small subset shouldn't give you a sad sign for the human race though?
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Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
Why do you have to explain anything to anyone? Honestly... I don't understand firstly why you'd even be discussing your "diet" with anyone, but then certainly not justifying it to them afterward?
I genuinely don't mind discussing my diet with others who ask, especially if it's something they can learn from and apply to their own health maintenance.
Are you ever in a social situation with grown ups who ask you what you are eating and why?
Please explain this to me. I can't wrap my head around why this would ever happen unless you opened it up for a conversation.
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withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
Why do you have to explain anything to anyone? Honestly... I don't understand firstly why you'd even be discussing your "diet" with anyone, but then certainly not justifying it to them afterward?
I genuinely don't mind discussing my diet with others who ask, especially if it's something they can learn from and apply to their own health maintenance.
Are you ever in a social situation with grown ups who ask you what you are eating and why?
Please explain this to me. I can't wrap my head around why this would ever happen unless you opened it up for a conversation.
I was at a bar (minimum age to enter: 21 years old) and an old friend who met me for drinks said "holy *kitten* did you lose like a ton of weight? What are you doing?"
How would you answer this? I have a feeling there is a very specific answer you want to see0 -
Yeah, I lost weight.
Because you did. Right? That person really doesn't want the nuts and bolts. Why do you think they do?0 -
Because their follow up question was "What are you doing?"withaflourish wrote: »Yeah, I lost weight.
Because you did. Right? That person really doesn't want the nuts and bolts. Why do you think they do?
Why do you think they didn't want to know even though they very clearly asked?
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withaflourish wrote: »Yeah, I lost weight.
Because you did. Right? That person really doesn't want the nuts and bolts. Why do you think they do?
Are you ever in a social situation with grown ups who ask you what you did to achieve something that they found worthy of note but didn't really want to hear your answer?
Please explain this to me. I can't wrap my head around why this would ever happen unless you were being purposefully obtuse.0 -
I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.0
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withaflourish wrote: »I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.
It's not like he was asking me how many inches i can handle before i gag, or if i wanted to top or bottom that night. Asking what i did to lose weight is not a personal question.-2 -
withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »In my RL, ive had colleagues give me a look or make a comment like "oh, you were doing so well! What happened?" when they see me drinking a 24 oz starbucks iced mocha, or if I'm eating chips and/or a burger with fries and/or anything that isn't plain raw vegetables with an un seasoned naked grilled chicken breast.
I have to explain cico to people, which usually gets met with "yeah, i know that, but..." and then the food demonizing begins. There is a lot of conflicting diet and nutritional information that is accepted and summarily rejected by many of the people I've encountered in life
Why do you have to explain anything to anyone? Honestly... I don't understand firstly why you'd even be discussing your "diet" with anyone, but then certainly not justifying it to them afterward?
I genuinely don't mind discussing my diet with others who ask, especially if it's something they can learn from and apply to their own health maintenance.
Are you ever in a social situation with grown ups who ask you what you are eating and why?
Please explain this to me. I can't wrap my head around why this would ever happen unless you opened it up for a conversation.
Really?? It goes like exactly like thisProtranser wrote: »an old friend [or coworker, or acquaintance] who met me for drinks said "holy *kitten* did you lose like a ton of weight? What are you doing?"
And then you go "blah blah"
And they go "well I've just read blah blah, and blah blah" or "I just signed up for blah blah, and blah blah"
And you go "hey that's great!" or "you should check out blah blah" or "blah blah really worked for me, anyway"
If you're a woman talking to women, it goes on for way longer than that.0 -
Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.
It's not like he was asking me how many inches i can handle before i gag, or if i wanted to top or bottom that night. Asking what i did to lose weight is not a personal question.
Nice.
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withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.
It's not like he was asking me how many inches i can handle before i gag, or if i wanted to top or bottom that night. Asking what i did to lose weight is not a personal question.
Nice.
You can't be a woman, actually, if you asked that question. Food and weight talk is unfortunately often a whole lot of what goes on in conversation.0 -
withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.
It's not like he was asking me how many inches i can handle before i gag, or if i wanted to top or bottom that night. Asking what i did to lose weight is not a personal question.
Nice.
Did i give you the answer you were looking for, yet?
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Sorry?? Did you grab the wrong quote?0
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Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »Protranser wrote: »withaflourish wrote: »I can't imagine being in a social situation with grown ups who would be that all up in my business. It wouldn't go farther than 'you've lost weight' at that.
It's not like he was asking me how many inches i can handle before i gag, or if i wanted to top or bottom that night. Asking what i did to lose weight is not a personal question.
Nice.
Did i give you the answer you were looking for, yet?
No, you obfuscated efficiently. We're done. You can move along.0
This discussion has been closed.
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