Moderation
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Well, when you use the term millions of foods, it changes what it means to eliminate one food. For example, eliminating cupcakes isn't eliminating one food, it is eliminating vanilla ones, chocolate ones, ones from Walmart, ones from your local bakery, etc. Now suddenly it isn't really one out of millions.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
Not must, can. You can eat all the foods you enjoy. If you tried to eat all the foods you enjoy, you would quickly exceed your calorie goal, which would not be moderation.
Eliminating one food out of the millions of foods out there is not extreme, no matter what my reason.
it is typically one entire macro ..like Carbs, or those evil sugars...or an entire group of food like "processed" which pretty much eliminates all foods...0 -
Matt200goal wrote: »After only 18 pages,
combination of both ...
Well so long as we haven't eliminated either from this thread.0 -
You joke, but that's it. It's a theory of eating that involves avoiding extremes. Extremes cannot be defined as anything but "not in moderation." Everyone gets to apply this theory to their own WOE as they see fit.
You sure? I thought moderation was a hypothesis or a law.DeguelloTex wrote: »
Who said that? You can choose to eat or not to eat. The moderate way of eating doesn't proscribe foods as clean eating, paleo, etc. do.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
As has been pointed out ten million times in this thread, "moderation" is NOT a way of eating. It's a theory.
I think that's a fine definition.
An extreme is also defined by the nutritional guidelines. A diet of 0% fat might not feel extreme for you but it still would be because it's way out of acceptable healthy eating patterns.0 -
tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
Because while an upper extreme limit cannot be defined, the lower extreme limit is always zero. You can't get more extreme than nothing.
It doesn't seem to fit the dictionary defintion of moderation at all. It seems a very hard line.
Well, I don't understand how you would eat less than zero of something, so a line has to be drawn somewhere. You were the one asking for definitions of an extreme. Zero is an extreme.
Making any hard and fast rule about food seems extreme rather than moderate. You MUST not eliminate a food. That one food is all that is keeping you moderate. If you eat a completely balanced and vaired but decide to give up soda because you think it's not good for you, then you are not eating in moderation. You MUST have a soda!!!
I could eat a completely healthy, balanced and varied diet as a vegetarian. But if I eat meat, I will not be a vegetarian so my diet is extreme?
Moderation most certainly should not mean everything. Everything is as extreme as nothing.
It isn't that a person practicing moderation won't eat certain foods, it is the reasoning behind why they won't eat certain food. If it comes down to preference, that's moderation. If you aren't eating something because that's a rule in a diet, you're not practicing moderation.
So we both eat the exact same diet, you because you don't like meat, me because I'm vegetarian. Your diet is moderate but mine is not? That's silly.
No, vegetarianism can absolutely be a diet of moderation. Both are based on personal preference, not adherence to a way of eating. I feel like this is something that has been pointed out repeatedly (along with the rest of the questions from the non-acute participants in this thread).
Vegetarianism is absolutely based on adherence to a way of eating. If I eat meat, I'm not vegetarian. How is that different than following a paleo diet and it's rules if I prefer to eat paleo? If preference decides "extreme" then it decides moderation meaning anything can be moderate.0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »
Definiton of extreme: eating zero of a food. Eating only a food.
You joke, but that's it. It's a theory of eating that involves avoiding extremes. Extremes cannot be defined as anything but "not in moderation." Everyone gets to apply this theory to their own WOE as they see fit.
You sure? I thought moderation was a hypothesis or a law.DeguelloTex wrote: »
Who said that? You can choose to eat or not to eat. The moderate way of eating doesn't proscribe foods as clean eating, paleo, etc. do.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
As has been pointed out ten million times in this thread, "moderation" is NOT a way of eating. It's a theory.
I think that's a fine definition.
You are the lone dissenter here. PLENTY of people defining "moderation" have said that foods or food groups can be eliminated based on personal tastes, dietary preferences, ways of eating, etc.
It is up to the individual to decide how to apply moderation.Moderation is the absence of extremes...
Extremes exceeding the bounds of moderation
Those are the definitions that have been agreed upon.0 -
Well, when you use the term millions of foods, it changes what it means to eliminate one food. For example, eliminating cupcakes isn't eliminating one food, it is eliminating vanilla ones, chocolate ones, ones from Walmart, ones from your local bakery, etc. Now suddenly it isn't really one out of millions.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
Not must, can. You can eat all the foods you enjoy. If you tried to eat all the foods you enjoy, you would quickly exceed your calorie goal, which would not be moderation.
Eliminating one food out of the millions of foods out there is not extreme, no matter what my reason.
it is typically one entire macro ..like Carbs, or those evil sugars...or an entire group of food like "processed" which pretty much eliminates all foods...
I know, I know.
That's the thing, who eliminates one food for a purely diet reason? Usually even the silly attention grabbing ads on the internet set at least 7 foods you can't eat because belly fat or whatever.
I guess people that have their "trigger foods". I'd not define anyone having one of those as moderating.0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »It looks like this thread is getting the unspoken treatment of not rising to the top when someone responds. Disappoint.
I had to dig to find it again. It's a sure way of making sure the thread goes in circles since only those with a vested interest in the argument will find it now.
this thread proves that some people are unable to grasp and apply simple concepts, and want to overcomplicate things, which is why the diet industry is able to make hundreds of millions of dollars peddling pseudoscience and cleanses...0 -
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??0 -
Well, when you use the term millions of foods, it changes what it means to eliminate one food. For example, eliminating cupcakes isn't eliminating one food, it is eliminating vanilla ones, chocolate ones, ones from Walmart, ones from your local bakery, etc. Now suddenly it isn't really one out of millions.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
Not must, can. You can eat all the foods you enjoy. If you tried to eat all the foods you enjoy, you would quickly exceed your calorie goal, which would not be moderation.
Eliminating one food out of the millions of foods out there is not extreme, no matter what my reason.
it is typically one entire macro ..like Carbs, or those evil sugars...or an entire group of food like "processed" which pretty much eliminates all foods...
I know, I know.
That's the thing, who eliminates one food for a purely diet reason? Usually even the silly attention grabbing ads on the internet set at least 7 foods you can't eat because belly fat or whatever.
once you eliminate sugar you are probably eliminating thousand, if not hundreds of thousands of foods...so not really sure what that other posters point is.0 -
Well, when you use the term millions of foods, it changes what it means to eliminate one food. For example, eliminating cupcakes isn't eliminating one food, it is eliminating vanilla ones, chocolate ones, ones from Walmart, ones from your local bakery, etc. Now suddenly it isn't really one out of millions.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
Not must, can. You can eat all the foods you enjoy. If you tried to eat all the foods you enjoy, you would quickly exceed your calorie goal, which would not be moderation.
Eliminating one food out of the millions of foods out there is not extreme, no matter what my reason.
That's not what the post to which I replied said though. It said "a particular food".0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??
So, if I'm not intentionally eating clean, but all of my food diet ends up matching some arbitrary definition of eating clean, am I eating clean? What if I've eat that way for 1 year, but if tomorrow I'd eat a sugar encrusted bacon hotdog with extra preservatives? Am I eating clean up until the moment it touches my lips?0 -
Well, when you use the term millions of foods, it changes what it means to eliminate one food. For example, eliminating cupcakes isn't eliminating one food, it is eliminating vanilla ones, chocolate ones, ones from Walmart, ones from your local bakery, etc. Now suddenly it isn't really one out of millions.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
Not must, can. You can eat all the foods you enjoy. If you tried to eat all the foods you enjoy, you would quickly exceed your calorie goal, which would not be moderation.
Eliminating one food out of the millions of foods out there is not extreme, no matter what my reason.
it is typically one entire macro ..like Carbs, or those evil sugars...or an entire group of food like "processed" which pretty much eliminates all foods...
But nobody eliminates an entire macros (as you know).
They may limit their consumption of it, like low carb or low fat but its not an elimination. So therefore it's still moderation, right????
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What is WOD? "Way of dieting?"
If you could clarify the bolded part for me, it would help me understand what you're saying. When you say "diet", do you mean "way of eating" or "foods you eat" or what?tennisdude2004 wrote: »If you are eliminating food that you otherwise enjoy in hopes of getting a certain dietary goal....then it isn't moderation. This couldn't be more simple and people here have made 17 pages trying to make it super complicated.
But a lot of people change their tastes. I would suggest that a lot of people (myself included) on life style change diets no longer enjoy or want.
So at what point does that become a moderation style diet?
So eventually your restriction turns into moderation because you adopt new tastes. Congratulations!
Simple discernment, if you honestly say "I'm not eating that because I don't feel like eating that", your eating is in moderation. If you honestly confess "I can't eat that because my diet doesn't allow it", your eating is not in moderation.
Some people believe differently. Some have argued that you absolutely can eliminate foods or food groups you enjoy and still be eating in moderation, depending on your reason. And the reason may be different for everyone because everyone can apply this theory differently.
For some, medical or ethical reasons for eliminating things still count as moderation. For some, eating healthier items is still included because eating a mostly (or entirely) healthy diet can be part of moderation. For others, those things are considered extreme.
Everyone gets to apply it in their own way. As long as they aren't hitting extremes (which cannot be defined, per the concept of moderation), they're eating in moderation.
The bolded is exactly what I've said. If you're eliminating it for something that isn't because it is your diet plan, it absolutely is moderation. When I say diet, I mean diet as in a set of rules for eating that have to be obeyed because they are the diet. If you don't eat gluten because you have celiac, that isn't because of diet. If you don't eat meat because you're ethically opposed to it, that isn't your diet. Now if you don't eat gluten because paleo tells you not to, you're doing it because of diet. If you're not eating meat because Freelee the Banana Girl has promised you immortality and magical health powers as a frugivore, you're restricting meat because of your diet.
I'm honestly a little confused because the "diet" word has "because they are the diet" as part of the definition and m not sure if the word "diet" is being used in two different ways or if the word "diet" is being used as part of the explanation of "diet."
Diet as not simply a WOD but as rules for eating.
If you have something you must not do, you have rules and you have a diet.
If you have things you'd rather not do, you probably have moderation.
Unless someone is holding a gun to your head, there is nothing that you must not do. It's all a matter of choice. Everyone is eating what they'd rather eat. Everyone is eliminating things they don't want to eat...and there are ten million reasons for it.
I hope that we aren't going to get this all confused again, because we really had a good definition of moderation.
I was just thinking the same thing - no one is being forced to be vegetarian, or eat paleo, or go gluten-free; it's a choice to eat that way. How is the choice to follow a certain WOE any different from the choice to eat or not a food in a non-labeled WOE?
These diet labels don't exist to pigeon-hole people into situations where they have to eat that way or else, it's just a way of conveying one's dietary choices to others. People keep saying "you can't or must not eat that" in keeping with a diet - if the person really wanted to eat it, then they probably wouldn't have made the choice to adhere to that eating style. And if they do want to eat something, they need to figure out for themselves whether or not a WOE truly works for them, or if they would be better off with a different approach. This goes back to what the blog says about dietary choices being a matter of preference and taste - all easily fitting into moderation.
Everything related to what we eat is a choice. I eat a very (very very) low-fat diet. I don't particularly enjoy it, but it's what I've been told to do for my health, so I do it. Even though the doctors tell me to do it, it's still my choice. I could say, "Screw that. I love ice cream! Life is not worth living if I can't have it! I'd rather die young than eat low-fat!" and make myself some, but I don't. I'd love to have ice cream, but choose not to eat it.
Plenty of people do eschew doctors' orders in favor of what they like to eat (also a valid choice.)
It's ALWAYS a choice.0 -
Extreme is "outside of moderation" and everyone applies moderation as they see fit.stevencloser wrote: »
You joke, but that's it. It's a theory of eating that involves avoiding extremes. Extremes cannot be defined as anything but "not in moderation." Everyone gets to apply this theory to their own WOE as they see fit.
You sure? I thought moderation was a hypothesis or a law.DeguelloTex wrote: »
Who said that? You can choose to eat or not to eat. The moderate way of eating doesn't proscribe foods as clean eating, paleo, etc. do.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Well, the opposite of eating zero of a food would be eating only that food, wouldn't it?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Becaue 0 of a food as an inherent part of a way of eating is, by definition, extreme. You can't eat any less. If is is, by definition, extreme, it is, by definition, not moderate.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »Given a framework that doesn't include unlimited calories...
Does a moderate way of eating ever say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
What other ways of eating don't say that if one eats a particular food one will not be adhering to that way of eating?
How does eliminating a particular food make a diet not moderate? What is extreme about eliminating a particular food? There are still a whole lot of foods to choose from.
There must be extremes on both ends of the spectrum. If I can't eliminate any food, what is the opposite pole in a moderate diet?
So to be a moderate eater I must eat ALL foods I enjoy but not eat only any single food I enjoy?
ALL is an extreme, no?
As has been pointed out ten million times in this thread, "moderation" is NOT a way of eating. It's a theory.
I think that's a fine definition.
An extreme is also defined by the nutritional guidelines. A diet of 0% fat might not feel extreme for you but it still would be because it's way out of acceptable healthy eating patterns.
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Yes. However you define "clean". "Clean" is a WOE. All the WOEs can be included in moderation. It's about avoiding extremes. If you don't feel that it's extreme, it's moderation.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??
0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??
So, if I'm not intentionally eating clean, but all of my food diet ends up matching some arbitrary definition of eating clean, am I eating clean? What if I've eat that way for 1 year, but if tomorrow I'd eat a sugar encrusted bacon hotdog with extra preservatives? Am I eating clean up until the moment it touches my lips?
Yes you will be eating clean.
But then for that time you have your moment of weakness you are eating a standard diet. Once you have have finished your hot dog and go back to eating healthier again you regain the status of eating a clean diet.
0 -
Yes. People get to pick their own definition of clean. I've never even seen anyone argue to the contrary and hope I never do.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??
So, if I'm not intentionally eating clean, but all of my food diet ends up matching some arbitrary definition of eating clean, am I eating clean? What if I've eat that way for 1 year, but if tomorrow I'd eat a sugar encrusted bacon hotdog with extra preservatives? Am I eating clean up until the moment it touches my lips?
0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »
They're very similar. In fact, sometimes the people who go back and forth over which is better are doing exactly the same thing. It becomes less an argument over How To Eat and more an argument over diction.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
There isn't one, lol. In fact, it has been explicitly stated that "extreme" doesn't have to be defined, either.tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »The lack of rigid definitions and its broad adaptability is a necessary feature of moderation. Trying to apply specific rules violates its very nature.
Moderation seems as difficult to define and agree on, as the term 'clean eating'.
Who knew!!
actually it is not ..there is one definition in the dictionary, just use that.
so the avoidance of extremes! So what can I eat - precisely - to fit into your definition of moderation??
1. get a dictionary
2. look up and read definition of moderation
3. apply the concept to your daily lifestyle
pretty simple….unless you find that too difficult?
I have a dictionary, as you can tell by the fact that I referred to moderation as 'the avoidance of extremes'.
I'm asking for a clear instruction on what is considered extreme?
One person posted that moderation is avoiding extremes and extremes are outside the bounds of moderation. Those two things are the explanation for each other. That's the "Science!"
This is what I've come up with for both words, up to and including this thread:
Moderation: A theory of eating wherein the person avoids extremes (which are undefined and may be defined differently by each individual) unless the person has a good reason for the extremes.
Clean: A way of healthy eating that may or may not include eliminating certain foods or food groups and which may or may not include eating foods that are processed and/or unhealthy, in varying amounts.
Hope that clears it all up.
Still, if you want to know what the person means when they discuss their eating, you're going to have to ask.
So:
Moderation - perimeters different for everyone!
Clean Eating - perimeters different for everyone!
I see the similarity.
if you think clean eating = moderation then your understanding of the concepts is severly flawed....
But what if eating clean is fulfilling all of your food requirements and you do not feel a need any more to eat the processed foods you are avoiding - is that then moderation??
So, if I'm not intentionally eating clean, but all of my food diet ends up matching some arbitrary definition of eating clean, am I eating clean? What if I've eat that way for 1 year, but if tomorrow I'd eat a sugar encrusted bacon hotdog with extra preservatives? Am I eating clean up until the moment it touches my lips?
Yes you will be eating clean.
But then for that moment you have your moment of weakness you are eating a standard diet. Once you have have finished your hot dog and go back to eating healthier again you regain the status of eating a clean diet.
That's your issue right there, "moment of weakness." I already said, the example wasn't intentionally eating clean. So what happened to your "well it is just my preference now"? You betray your own thoughts on clean eating - stopping it means a moment of weakness. It isn't about just having a preference!0 -
This discussion has been closed.
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