Why Aren't Japanese People Fat?
Replies
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Its shameful on them to be fat and overweight
They are actually quite proud of their sumo wrestlers.0 -
Really interesting article! I liken it to French people, who eat a lot of white bread, cheese and regularly drink wine, and still tend to be thinner than most Americans. No one is arguing that this diet is better for you from a nutritional standpoint, but it is interesting when you consider how many people are looking for a "quick fix" to getting thin and think that cutting out [insert any given food group here] is the way to go.
The point is that, even with nutritionally poor foods, you can still be very thin if you just consume less. And I also think it's interesting that the article points out that it is a choice. When people here are overly conscious of their weight, people think they have an eating disorder. Maybe being at least somewhat conscious about weight is not a bad thing!0 -
Interesting article - and certainly helps the argument that a calorie is a calorie!
Not that it excuses ignoring your macros and micros.
Just something to throw in the face of people who want to know if I'm "going to eat THAT! I thought you were on a diet??"
What argument? Fine you eat crap below your calorie intake that doesn't mean that those who advocate quality food are some how wrong. Also a calorie of sugar affects your body differently than a calorie of protein. You might want to0 -
I've spent a lot of time in Japan and I think there is truth in the article. A lot of self-discipline there and expectation to meet cultural norms.
DID YOU KNOW THAT THE GOVERNMENT MANDATES YOU TO GET PSYCHOLOGICAL HELP THERE IF YOUR BMI GETS TOO HIGH? Actually, I guess this is a good thing. I think most folks who are overweight could benefit from some therapy, though having it mandated by the governments is pretty Orwellian.
I find this hypocritical though considering their tolerance of smoking and no psycho help for that addiction. Smoking is rampant there. Seems like everyone smokes.0 -
The Japanese diet focuses on plant based foods, rice and meat/fish as a condiment. And, no dairy. Little flour.
Japanese meals as aesthetically balanced to include several different colors (I think it is 5) and those are usually vegetables of some sort.
Finally, the Japanese culture emphasizes community rather than individuality. There is a social pressure to be thin reinforced by penalties on medical professionals if their patients BMI goes above a certain range.
Not only are they thin, they are among the longest lived populations in the world (I think they are number 1 or 2.)
If anyone wants to read more about this topic, there's a great book titled "The Okinawan Way"...about this population who are the longest lived people in the world. Part of their "secret" is an emphasize on social interaction and having a purpose...so that eating from emotional needs (loneliness, feeling that your life is directionless) may be lessen.0 -
But in line with the cultural thing, perhaps there is a difference with how weight control is approached; Americans are very prone to diet fads and nutritional nonsense. I mean, how many American's actually believe that simply eating smaller portions of what they are currently eating will cause them to lose weight? I would wager that in fact only a minority believes that.
Yanno, that's a good point.
Ever since Jane Fonda's goofy work out tapes, the whole 80's 'stop the INSANITY' BS and fat makes you fat, LOTS of common sense seemed to go by the wayside.
Something else odd, I remember thinking John Belushi was treee-mendous in Animal House when I was a kid....upon seeing the movie recently, I find my perception of his weight at the time, compared to now, way off. Even Chunk!!!...remember him from the Goonies?....he was NO WHERE'S near as fat as I thought he was.
I also recall there may have been only one overweight kid, but the majority were of normal size.
edited for typos0 -
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The statistics indicate: long life and fewer disease (particularly cardiovascular) than Western societies.0
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The Japanese diet focuses on plant based foods, rice and meat/fish as a condiment. And, no dairy. Little flour.
Japanese meals as aesthetically balanced to include several different colors (I think it is 5) and those are usually vegetables of some sort.
Finally, the Japanese culture emphasizes community rather than individuality. There is a social pressure to be thin reinforced by penalties on medical professionals if their patients BMI goes above a certain range.
Not only are they thin, they are among the longest lived populations in the world (I think they are number 1 or 2.)
If anyone wants to read more about this topic, there's a great book titled "The Okinawan Way"...about this population who are the longest lived people in the world. Part of their "secret" is an emphasize on social interaction and having a purpose...so that eating from emotional needs (loneliness, feeling that your life is directionless) may be lessen.
The Japanese eat a TON of fish and eggs. Meat (red meat like beef) sure, is more of condiment, but mainly because of the expense.
Okinawans aren't mainline Japanese, they were their own country until relatively recently, and they've got different traditions and culture than those on the main Japanese islands. They live in a subtropical climate with less stress compared to mainland Japan.0 -
The Japanese diet focuses on plant based foods, rice and meat/fish as a condiment. And, no dairy. Little flour.
Japanese meals as aesthetically balanced to include several different colors (I think it is 5) and those are usually vegetables of some sort.
Finally, the Japanese culture emphasizes community rather than individuality. There is a social pressure to be thin reinforced by penalties on medical professionals if their patients BMI goes above a certain range.
Not only are they thin, they are among the longest lived populations in the world (I think they are number 1 or 2.)
If anyone wants to read more about this topic, there's a great book titled "The Okinawan Way"...about this population who are the longest lived people in the world. Part of their "secret" is an emphasize on social interaction and having a purpose...so that eating from emotional needs (loneliness, feeling that your life is directionless) may be lessen.
While we're at it, please tell me about the ninjas and geisha roaming the countryside.0 -
The Japanese diet focuses on plant based foods, rice and meat/fish as a condiment. And, no dairy. Little flour.
Japanese meals as aesthetically balanced to include several different colors (I think it is 5) and those are usually vegetables of some sort.
Finally, the Japanese culture emphasizes community rather than individuality. There is a social pressure to be thin reinforced by penalties on medical professionals if their patients BMI goes above a certain range.
Not only are they thin, they are among the longest lived populations in the world (I think they are number 1 or 2.)
If anyone wants to read more about this topic, there's a great book titled "The Okinawan Way"...about this population who are the longest lived people in the world. Part of their "secret" is an emphasize on social interaction and having a purpose...so that eating from emotional needs (loneliness, feeling that your life is directionless) may be lessen.
The Japanese eat a TON of fish and eggs. Meat (red meat like beef) sure, is more of condiment, but mainly because of the expense.
Okinawans aren't mainline Japanese, they were their own country until relatively recently, and they've got different traditions and culture than those on the main Japanese islands. They live in a subtropical climate with less stress compared to mainland Japan.
The "Okinawan Way" isn't actually the Okinawan main diet but is just a diet book written by some caucasians who visited the island and interviewed a couple really old people from a small village somewhere up on a mountain. Pork is a huge staple of the real Okinawan diet, so unless pork is a vegetable, the book is not accurate.
Okinawan food might be the most delicious, yummiest, tastiest and sweetest cuisine I've ever had in my entire existence. Yes, they eat vegetables, but it's a lot of pork, potatoes, and those bitter melons that everybody but me seems to not like. I love those.
Japanese don't eat meat in the same quantities we do, but to say it isn't a staple part of the diet is not correct. They have so many different types of cuisine dedicated solely to meat it would make your head spin with delight. Shabu shabu, nabe, yakiniku, teppanyaki, yakitori, teriyaki, yaki soba, tempura, don buri, sushi, tonkatsu, restaurants devoted entirely to crab, and most izakaya. Most of the restaurants there are some sort of meat restaurant. For what it's worth, it's harder to eat as a vegetarian or vegan in Japan that you'd imagine because fish stock is in everything. Absolutely everything.0 -
Love me some okonomiyaki with extra mayo!
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Love me some okonomiyaki with extra mayo!
Just wanted to say I hate you.
I really, really hate you. :sad:0 -
Just to mix it up a little.
It would seem that the article makes a strong argument that less calories is more important than food choice if you don't want to be fat.
Unfortunately you could just as easily have the argument that Japan's culture of eating small portions of nutritionally poor food, whilst keeping them skinny, actually leaves them 'skinny fat' (I hate the saying too but you guys will know what I mean!!) with a propensity for osteoporosis and rickets.
So shouldn't we 'ideally' be comparing diets with the healthiest nations rather than the skinniest one's and, if we do, is their success down to calorie intake or food choice or activity level etc
Could it be that (in a horribly oversimplified way)
Less calories = slimmer
Macro management = healthier
Exercise = fitter
Pick your favourite combination!!
This article is in no way arguing that the Japanese have the ideal diet, and if you read it you'll see that it's pretty much the opposite. That is the point. It is a counter to those that want to put up certain national diets as the end all be all to why certain nations are fat and others are not. The entire point is that fewer calories = lower weight.
The article and my post also weren't meant to criticize the Japanese diet or the Japanese. They clearly have figured out a very important lesson, and when you compare their health statistics to other wealthy nations, they come out quite well. Simply not being fat goes a long way towards making people healthier.
After several years of living there it became very hard to rationalize why I wasn't eating white rice, or worried about getting my meals perfect. I couldn't even bring myself to argue such silliness when I was out with Japanese friends drinking into the wee hours of the night and slurping down ramen as the sun came up. None of these guys were anywhere near fat, and several were in rather good shape. The issue comes in missing the obvious (fewer calories, and yes, moving more). And no, the Japanese are not afraid to point out that "foreigners" are fatter and frankly I can't blame them. You can only hear so many times about how white rice is going to kill you before pointing out the obvious.
All of that said, yes, building and maintain muscle mass is an entirely different issue.
Totally see where you are coming from, people who insist that if they can somehow get the right macro balance they will miraculously lose weight even though they are still eating way too many calories, are on a road to nowhere. I absolutely agree that calories in/calories out is the key critical element of weight loss. However, I guess I am also a little wary of sitting too far in the 'eat what you like as long as your calorie count is ok' camp. I think there is a valid balance between the two and macro's do matter. Perhaps not directly for weight loss but certainly for long term health.
Of course the best change that most people can make is to lose the weight in the first instance!!
Thanks for the topic though...good discussion!!0 -
Just to mix it up a little.
It would seem that the article makes a strong argument that less calories is more important than food choice if you don't want to be fat.
Unfortunately you could just as easily have the argument that Japan's culture of eating small portions of nutritionally poor food, whilst keeping them skinny, actually leaves them 'skinny fat' (I hate the saying too but you guys will know what I mean!!) with a propensity for osteoporosis and rickets.
So shouldn't we 'ideally' be comparing diets with the healthiest nations rather than the skinniest one's and, if we do, is their success down to calorie intake or food choice or activity level etc
Could it be that (in a horribly oversimplified way)
Less calories = slimmer
Macro management = healthier
Exercise = fitter
Pick your favourite combination!!
This article is in no way arguing that the Japanese have the ideal diet, and if you read it you'll see that it's pretty much the opposite. That is the point. It is a counter to those that want to put up certain national diets as the end all be all to why certain nations are fat and others are not. The entire point is that fewer calories = lower weight.
The article and my post also weren't meant to criticize the Japanese diet or the Japanese. They clearly have figured out a very important lesson, and when you compare their health statistics to other wealthy nations, they come out quite well. Simply not being fat goes a long way towards making people healthier.
After several years of living there it became very hard to rationalize why I wasn't eating white rice, or worried about getting my meals perfect. I couldn't even bring myself to argue such silliness when I was out with Japanese friends drinking into the wee hours of the night and slurping down ramen as the sun came up. None of these guys were anywhere near fat, and several were in rather good shape. The issue comes in missing the obvious (fewer calories, and yes, moving more). And no, the Japanese are not afraid to point out that "foreigners" are fatter and frankly I can't blame them. You can only hear so many times about how white rice is going to kill you before pointing out the obvious.
All of that said, yes, building and maintain muscle mass is an entirely different issue.
Totally see where you are coming from, people who insist that if they can somehow get the right macro balance they will miraculously lose weight even though they are still eating way too many calories, are on a road to nowhere. I absolutely agree that calories in/calories out is the key critical element of weight loss. However, I guess I am also a little wary of sitting too far in the 'eat what you like as long as your calorie count is ok' camp. I think there is a valid balance between the two and macro's do matter. Perhaps not directly for weight loss but certainly for long term health.
Of course the best change that most people can make is to lose the weight in the first instance!!
Thanks for the topic though...good discussion!!
Thanks. My guess is we've talked past each other a bit. I agree with what you wrote here.0 -
That post reminded me of, when younger, I'd enjoy buying clothes at HongKongnese stores because they had super cute stuff made for short people (I am of Chinese descent) and how I was terrified of having to buy large -or, god forbid, XL!- sized clothes (which would be more like S or M in Western stores) because the cashier would think I was a fattie or something, haha. Oh, man, that was a long time ago.
Girls in the country I grew up in (the ones I know, anyway) are all size (US) 4, tops. I don't know how they do it, because food there is rather indulgent, and quite starchy as well. I think vanity may play a big factor in keeping people's tummies in check, but am not positive, as I haven't lived there for over a decade. My siblings and cousins too seem to eat everything and not get fat., or maybe if they do put on, say, a couple of pounds, they probably get themselves back on track immediately. Must be because in our family, the minute you look a bit fat, everybody is going to give you some live commentary on anything and everything you put in your mouth at meal time!0 -
Maybe we can infect them with our disease? Obesity is officially a disease now according to the AMA. Will power schmill power.0
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That won't keep you from getting fat. Carbs are loaded with calories too, and guess what rice is primarily composed of? Carbs. Fats are necessary for LIFE, by the way- carbs aren't, so don't cut fats out when you can cut carbs if you're trying to save on calories.
Without reading the article I'd chalk it up to high-protein low-calorie fish and seaweed in their diet, and a general cultural attitude toward not overindulging.0 -
There is no fat in there food
Did you read the article? (even better, have you ever eaten in a real Japanese restaurant? )
Love the giant bowl of fat-less butter that they put in my friend rice!
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Six pages in and there's STILL no sumo wrestler gif? You people disappoint me......:sad: :laugh:0
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Yes, they do.Don't they ride bikes alot and walk everywhere?0 -
I've been experiencing this first hand. It is terrible! Food is so expensive here so sometimes it is legit cheaper to get McDonalds or Cocos or anything else over cooking (My normal meal at Cocos is a 1/2 order of fried chicken curry for 543 calories and a bajillion milligrams of sodium and costs 493 yen which is 4-5$) Plus, I want to try everything because I'm in another freaking country and it is sooo delicious.
But you will see that Japanese women here don't eat all that often....and if they do, they take the tiniest bites humanly possibly as slow as possible. Even if I manage to hit my goal weight here, I'll still be about 40 lbs bigger than the average Japanese woman and a size L-XL in Japanese clothes. It really makes it hard to stay motivated....0 -
Bumping to read later. Thanks for posting it!0
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Six pages in and there's STILL no sumo wrestler gif? You people disappoint me......:sad: :laugh:
Japan has over 100 million people.
There are 702 sumo in all of Japan.
And the sport is dominated by foreigners.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/25/sports/25iht-sumo25.html?_r=00 -
Yes, I've been to Japan several times and almost everyone is thin, often razor-thin, as well as small. Walking and biking everywhere. And fit? I've seen very old, little ladies jump on a slow-moving bus and amble their way to a seat without any trouble -- I know my mother couldn't do that when she was in her 40s let alone her 80s. I also know Japanese who emigrated to America who admit they became "fat" (their description) while living in America. Presumably eating "American" food.I work in a Japanese company. There are lots and lots of overweight Japanese people.
LOL! Have you been to Japan?
No. I work with Japanese Americans. And, they are fat. Most of them, if not all. The ones that come from Japan on assignment are always razor thin.
I've joked before that when you see a fat-*kitten* in Japan, it's likely a foreigner!0 -
Six pages in and there's STILL no sumo wrestler gif? You people disappoint me......:sad: :laugh:
Japan has over 100 million people.
There are 702 sumo in all of Japan.
And the sport is dominated by foreigners.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/25/sports/25iht-sumo25.html?_r=0
I see your humor gene is inoperative today....but thank you for the stats. :noway: (PS - I used to live in Okinawa........)0 -
Yes, I've been to Japan several times and almost everyone is thin, often razor-thin, as well as small. Walking and biking everywhere. And fit? I've seen very old, little ladies jump on a slow-moving bus and amble their way to a seat without any trouble -- I know my mother couldn't do that when she was in her 40s let alone her 80s. I also know Japanese who emigrated to America who admit they became "fat" (their description) while living in America. Presumably eating "American" food.I work in a Japanese company. There are lots and lots of overweight Japanese people.
LOL! Have you been to Japan?
No. I work with Japanese Americans. And, they are fat. Most of them, if not all. The ones that come from Japan on assignment are always razor thin.
I've joked before that when you see a fat-*kitten* in Japan, it's likely a foreigner!
My friend was stationed at Misawa for 3 years and then had a 3 month deployment to Okinawa and he has counted all the obese people he's seen...it is something like 107....and he frequented Tokyo so that's a lot of people.
I live on Oki now and yesterday I saw a young Japanese man that would be the equivalent of a neck beard...overweight, nerdy...and really quite tall. Poor kid...
Plus, you can probably lower that from foreigner to US woman on Oki. 90% of the overweight people you see are the military wives and they tend to be big by US standards even.0 -
The book I mentioned earlier describes both the Japanese eating patterns and those of Okinawans, but focuses on Okinawans.
If you googled "longest vital years" you'll find a lot of references which will guide you to info. on the correlation between diet/health/longevity.
And, above all 'vital years"...which means living to a great old age still mentally sharp and physically active.
Maybe the simplest explanation: Japanese do not eat the way Americans do.0 -
The book I mentioned earlier describes both the Japanese eating patterns and those of Okinawans, but focuses on Okinawans.
If you googled "longest vital years" you'll find a lot of references which will guide you to info. on the correlation between diet/health/longevity.
And, above all 'vital years"...which means living to a great old age still mentally sharp and physically active.
Maybe the simplest explanation: Japanese do not eat the way Americans do.
I've read it. You'd have to go to Japan (and Okinawa) to understand why I find it nearly comedic. That book is also part of the reason for the post. We tried to explain it above, but meh. More reading something out of date and discredited = "knowledge." Good stuff.0
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