Leaky gut
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Gut permeability is a very complex thing. It can come about because the digestive system is disrupted by the use of antibiotics not always for an extended period, repeated "regular", doses can do it too by eliminating the most useful segment of our digestive flora. Generally it is expected the body will recover without any intervention. A diet containing too much added sugar, certain medications such as pain relief and contraception can also predispose the digestive system or even a combination of all the above. Basically it comes about because the balance of our digestive flora is tilted towards the less helpful yeasts which can set up inflammation within tissues. From personal experience I know this disruption can predispose the "sensitive" to pain in joints, dietary and chemical sensitivities and more which radically restrict the quality of life. There are expensive tests which will indicate ones which are out of control and direct a person to the best way for them to rectify their specific issues.
Avoiding added sugar and foods containing yeast as well as alcohol (most contain yeast) and fruits such as grapes, fresh and dried which attract yeast to their skins from the environment and pineapple which is very high in natural sugar, could help. Constipation is often a consequence of yeasts being out of balance too. Increasing fiber and fluids may help. Using ground psyllium husks from the health food store, 15 g (max dose) in a tumbler of liquid at night has helped me. (it lines the intestines and eased elimination will probably take a few days to clear, its kinder, more gentle working best over night than most other products on the market)
Many people find relief from any of the carb reduction lifestyles. FODMAPS if you can work your way through which of the combinations are pertinent to yourself are helpful. The guidance of a practitioner in all of this is in my view essential. Its a question of discovering what is right for you and its quicker with help and so much more is known now ad against even 20 years ago. Not everyone has gluten problems, nor dairy but it is worthwhile having tests to identify your issue. Lactose is often put up as a reason to give up dairy but casein a protein in milk is more probably the true issue it is far more common. Many more health issues are now being added to the list of problems which stem from disrupted digestion, more and more is being discovered to be problematic with the common western diet.
One poster above mentioned the curative properties of coconut oil it like olive oil and cider vinegar have curative properties often overlooked by "Big Pharma". At one stage coconut oil was disparaged by the purveyors of more modern oils such as sunflower, flax and soy. Butter was also disparaged and is now being rehabilitated.
Being healthy can be complicated no two people are the same. I recommend seeking help to discover what works best for you is personal to you other combinations work better for someone else. Try things and work out what is best for you.0 -
I have a leaky gut and suffer terribly from stomach pain and constipation. So now the scale showed a 4 lb gain and I know it's bloat. I feel so frustrated and feel like giving up. Anyone had a similar experience and pulled through?
If you do not have a diagnosis, talk to your dr and explain your symptoms . Or ask a reference to a specialist (gastroenterologist I would guess). If you have a diagnosis, follow the dr's advice. Do not try to self diagnose over the internet, the amount of nonsense you will end up reading has no limit. And even if the truth is somewhere among the ton of nonsense, how will you recognise it?0 -
May I just also note, as an aside? If you have a degenerative autoimmune condition and your doctor wants to prescribe a biologic?
Take it.
The risks are minimal.
The rewards are great.
Signed,
Grateful Humira User0 -
PeachyCarol wrote: »May I just also note, as an aside? If you have a degenerative autoimmune condition and your doctor wants to prescribe a biologic?
Take it.
The risks are minimal.
The rewards are great.
Signed,
Grateful Humira User
I second this! I would be a hot mess without it.0 -
I have a leaky gut and suffer terribly from stomach pain and constipation. So now the scale showed a 4 lb gain and I know it's bloat. I feel so frustrated and feel like giving up. Anyone had a similar experience and pulled through?
If you do not have a diagnosis, talk to your dr and explain your symptoms . Or ask a reference to a specialist (gastroenterologist I would guess). If you have a diagnosis, follow the dr's advice. Do not try to self diagnose over the internet, the amount of nonsense you will end up reading has no limit. And even if the truth is somewhere among the ton of nonsense, how will you recognise it?
@aggelikik when one is talking about self treating congestive heart failure or an aneurysm I see the point of your warning. To assume a person can not go grocery shopping to fix health issues like any food induced gut disease without a doctor being involved may be assuming a bit much.
Many of us with health issues have been made worse by the advice of the medical community.
The doctors said I should go on Enbrel for my pain. Google showed me scientific research on its side effects. Google lead me to sources talking about autoimmune health conditions being made worse by grains and sugars in many cases. The doctors said I could not cut my pain by going grocery shopping and was stressed that I would not start the Enbrel injections. These two doctors are well trained to write Rx's but not trained in how to act in the best interest of the patients that do not need a Rx to regain their health in the short run and the long run.
Cold turkey I stopped eating all grains and most all foods containing sugar over a year ago to prevent the need to take Enbrel that I a sure would have been deadly in my then state of health. I cut out all processed foods by default because they seem to all contain grains and/or sugars.
30 days later my pain was down from levels of 7-8 to 2-3 and still is a year later only eating mainly plant based foods but do eat some wild salmon and bacon from time to time. If it has grains and/or sugar I do not eat it and no longer have a physiological craving for such foods.
To date I have not found many diseases that are not at some stage food induced directly or indirectly.
If one changes their Way of Eating and they feel better with time and if obese their weight starts to lower without 'dieting', their blood lipid tests move from the red zone to the green zone, etc I see that as a good thing and lowers the healthcare cost placed on those paying the taxes.
Most people I expect that can use a computer can make a list of Pros and Cons on most any healthcare issue and wade through the BS out there with some degree of success. I give you that there are some who never go with their own judgement be it about education, marriage, health related issues, etc.
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Your autoimmune condition is not just about pain. Your autoimmune condition is about progressive damage.
People take biologics to help curb further damage AND deal with pain.
Time is not kind to those with degenerative conditions, Gale.
You think what you're doing is working for you, and that is fine, but please stop posting incomplete medical information. It's not helpful to those reading these threads.0 -
PeachyCarol wrote: »May I just also note, as an aside? If you have a degenerative autoimmune condition and your doctor wants to prescribe a biologic?
Take it.
The risks are minimal.
The rewards are great.
Signed,
Grateful Humira User
@PeachyCarol I agree the short term rewards can be great. It was the short/long range risks of this class of Rx drugs that got my attention and stopped me in my tracks. Then there was my wife saying NO to Enbrel who is a practicing pharmacist.
In my case when I got the pain management that one may get with Humira/Enbrel like drugs by just stopping eating all grains and most all sugars within just 30 days and a year later is is still working well for pain management, curing leaky gut/IBS, cutting weight and improving my blood lipid test scores without increasing my risk of dying from the drug side effects makes me pro on grocery shopping vs going to the pharmacy. The $3,000.00 monthly cost for Enbrel is a lot for someone to pay for the drug as well.
If one can think destroying one's natural immune system is positive for their long term health then this class of drug may be acceptable. I can not even stay at home and prevent being around sick people which is required if taking this class of drugs.
rxlist.com/humira-drug/patient-images-side-effects.htm
"Some people using adalimumab have developed a rare fast-growing type of lymphoma (cancer). This condition affects the liver, spleen, and bone marrow, and it can be fatal. This has occurred mainly in teenagers and young adults using adalimumab or similar medicines to treat Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis......
Adalimumab can lower blood cells that help your body fight infections and help your blood to clot. Your blood may need to be tested often. Avoid being near people who are sick or have infections. Avoid activities that may increase your risk of bleeding injury. Serious and sometimes fatal infections may occur during treatment with adalimumab. Tell your doctor at once if you develop signs of infection.
Do not receive a "live" vaccine while you are being treated with adalimumab."
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GaleHawkins wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »May I just also note, as an aside? If you have a degenerative autoimmune condition and your doctor wants to prescribe a biologic?
Take it.
The risks are minimal.
The rewards are great.
Signed,
Grateful Humira User
@PeachyCarol I agree the short term rewards can be great. It was the short/long range risks of this class of Rx drugs that got my attention and stopped me in my tracks. Then there was my wife saying NO to Enbrel who is a practicing pharmacist.
In my case when I got the pain management that one may get with Humira/Enbrel like drugs by just stopping eating all grains and most all sugars within just 30 days and a year later is is still working well for pain management, curing leaky gut/IBS, cutting weight and improving my blood lipid test scores without increasing my risk of dying from the drug side effects makes me pro on grocery shopping vs going to the pharmacy. The $3,000.00 monthly cost for Enbrel is a lot for someone to pay for the drug as well.
If one can think destroying one's natural immune system is positive for their long term health then this class of drug may be acceptable. I can not even stay at home and prevent being around sick people which is required if taking this class of drugs.
rxlist.com/humira-drug/patient-images-side-effects.htm
"Some people using adalimumab have developed a rare fast-growing type of lymphoma (cancer). This condition affects the liver, spleen, and bone marrow, and it can be fatal. This has occurred mainly in teenagers and young adults using adalimumab or similar medicines to treat Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis......
Adalimumab can lower blood cells that help your body fight infections and help your blood to clot. Your blood may need to be tested often. Avoid being near people who are sick or have infections. Avoid activities that may increase your risk of bleeding injury. Serious and sometimes fatal infections may occur during treatment with adalimumab. Tell your doctor at once if you develop signs of infection.
Do not receive a "live" vaccine while you are being treated with adalimumab."
Please stop. You are fear mongering.0 -
Gale, the risk of cancer is a small fraction of 1%. A fraction of a fraction.
I also don't call not receiving live vaccines for things a burden.
As far as not going out into the world, or my whole immune system being shot? You misunderstand the drug and so does your wife.
I go out into the world. I function. Last year, when my kids got sick, so did I. And, my immune system fought it off. It took me just 2 days longer than them to recover. Then again, I'm older so who knows if it was the Humira or just me being older? I've always taken a long time to recover. It mildly suppresses your immune system, it does not destroy it entirely.
Now shall we talk about the benefits of Humira? Before starting it, I walked with a cane. I walked 1/4 a mile with that cane when I first started exercising.
Now I can run 5k and routinely walk 5.5 miles just about daily. I also strength train and water jog.
I'll take that quality of life over a very small risk any day.0 -
Oh, I should add that 5.5 miles is at about 4 miles an hour. That's purposeful exercise. I usually get more distance than that in with a generally active lifestyle. My Fitbit tells me I get in, on average 17K steps daily.0
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My story is the same as @PeachyCarol. I could not even lift my hand to eat because the RA settled into my right shoulder. I had to almost lower my head close to my plate to eat or eat left handed. I also couldn't wash my hair or even brush it. I was walking with a limp because both knees and my ankles were over the top inflamed. I was crying in the Rheumatologist's office for help. Humira has made the biggest difference in my life, I got my life back. So stop with fear mongering, please. I don't need the constant reminder of side effects. There is enough of it on the TV.0
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This discussion is of great interest to me. My doctor wanted me on Humira several years ago, but when I read the literature I got scared and didn't go on it. At the time I worked in a building that included a nursery school, and sick little kids were always showing up in my office. And of course the cancer risk is there.
I never knew anyone who was on it, so it's nice to read accounts from people here who are having success. I'm willing to reconsider. Is anyone who's currently taking it willing to give me more details of why and how long they've been on it, and what to expect? Private message is just fine if you don't want to post it here.
Does anyone know of anyone who's actually gotten cancer from Humira or Enbrel?0 -
@64crayons I sent you a PM.0
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Thanks @queenliz990
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@PeachyCarol and @queenliz99 I think my approach to managing Lupus is in a similar vein to you both.
I take multiple drugs to combat the symptoms, including the introduction of Mycophenolate there are similar possible side effects from both DMARDS and the use of Biologics and yes of course they can be serious but as you have sagely pointed out Carol the risk has to be countered with the benefit and the long term consequences of leaving auto-immune diseases to continue on their merry way causing harm when they are left untreated.
@GaleHawkins I have read your story on the forums a lot. I am happy that you have found the relief you have through changing your diet but I am deeply concerned that the continuance of warning around Enbrel may cause others to not take a life changing drug that could really be of benefit to them.
You made a personal choice and that is your right.....but I must ask whether you feel it really necessary to list the worst case scenario every single post is beneficial....I certainly DON'T enjoy being reminded as often as I am and in all honesty I have wondered if there are lurkers around who decide to follow you and NOT take the medication their Doctor prescribes them and their quality of life is then significantly impacted.....and not for the better.
My life would suck more than it does without the supportive therapy I receive...I guess bottom line is there would be no quality to my life at all give the severity of my symptoms....I am ever hopeful that with time this last line of defence treatment helps me to the point where I too can get out in the World like @PeachyCarol has as she is my personal hero and role model for continuing to strive and thrive under the most difficult of health circumstances.
Op - gut problems and diet is a tricky beast to get a handle on. As you have seen in this thread it is seems impossible to get consensus as to whether it is a 'real' condition or not. Nevertheless, the symptoms described I have are they are made worse or better through diet for me.
I have to be very vigilant about not indulging in trigger foods namely grains, avoiding gluten in particular, I have found that lactose free milk in small quantities tolerable and I am able to eat cheese and home-made greek yoghurt but I have to be careful about the amount and frequency. Too much seems to be a problem for me....I have found that my days of eating a large steak are completely over and stick to smaller serves of chicken, lamb, and pork with occasional fish but week to week we maintain a semi-vegetarian lifestyle. Too many brassicas, mushrooms and capsicums are also a problem...
Over the years I have experimented and failed many times to get a clear enough picture to make a difference, I think, fingers crossed I may have found my sweet spot now I hope you find yours.
All the best.0 -
Thanks for adding your input @HippySkoppy. I too get concerned about lurkers being overworried about the risks of biologics by them constantly being restated.
For some perspective, I'd like to point out that there is a far greater lifetime risk of dying in a fatal car accident (far, far greater in fact) than there is of getting cancer from a biologic.
And yet, somehow, I don't think any of us fear getting into a car.
Food for thought.0 -
PeachyCarol wrote: »Thanks for adding your input @HippySkoppy. I too get concerned about lurkers being overworried about the risks of biologics by them constantly being restated.
For some perspective, I'd like to point out that there is a far greater lifetime risk of dying in a fatal car accident (far, far greater in fact) than there is of getting cancer from a biologic.
And yet, somehow, I don't think any of us fear getting into a car.
Food for thought.
This^^^ Thank you @HippySkoppy0 -
MarziPanda95 wrote: »'Leaky gut' is a complete myth. If your gut leaked you'd be in the hospital with blood poisoning! Sounds like you have a food intolerance. I agree with those that suggested trying an elimination diet to test what triggers it. Might be IBS.snickerscharlie wrote: »Please see a medical doctor about your symptoms. Leaky Gut isn't a recognized ailment and the only people who will tell you otherwise want to sell you 'remedies' for this non-existent 'condition.'
Maybe Wikipedia can help:
Leaky gut syndrome is not a recognized medical diagnosis, the claimed symptoms are generic and there is no medically validated test.[2] According to National Health Service England,
There is little evidence to support this theory, and no evidence that so-called 'treatments' for 'leaky gut syndrome', such as nutritional supplements and a gluten-free diet, have any beneficial effect for most of the conditions they are claimed to help.[2]
Quackwatch calls leaky gut a "fad diagnosis". Stephen Barrett writes that its proponents use the alleged condition as an opportunity to promote a number of alternative health remedies including diets, herbal preparations, and dietary supplements.[6]
Skeptics and mainstream scientists generally agree that most marketing of treatments for leaky gut syndrome is, at best, misguided, and at worst, an instance of deliberate health fraud.[2]
This is a quite rude. Please do some real research - not wikipedia "research." Pubmed is a reliable source for peer-reviewed medical articles
Variations in the level of intestinal permeability (leaky gut) are:
(1) a reason that if you are taking oral vancomycin you MUST be tested regularly for the level of vancomycin in your bloodstream - vancomycin, taken orally, does not reach the bloodstream at all. If you have higher than normal permeability it does, sometimes in levels that are high enough to produce life altering side effects. (My daughter was on vancomycin for a year as part of a study out of Massachusetts General, (a tad more reputable source for medical information than Wikipedia). The study required her to have blood tests every 12 weeks because the underlying disease often involves a higher than normal permeability (i.e. leaky gut).) Had she had significant levels of vancomycin in her bloodstream (as some develop because of leaky gut), she would have been dismissed from the study.
(2) one of the main hypotheses for the known connection between my daughter's first chronic disease and the liver disease that the research study was targeting.
Those are the two I am most familiar with because they are the ones that affect me directly - both of which have been conveyed to me by numerous of the specialists (gastrointestinal and hepatology) across the country with whom we have been in contact in connection with the rare liver disease she has.
I have no idea whether the OP has leaky gut - but to dismiss the concept as fantasy when it is a medically recognized fact, with growing importance as we learn more about the gut microbiome - is offensive.
Do you have any pubmed articles to link?0 -
My pleasure @PeachyCarol and @queenliz99....I couldn't keep silent any longer over this matter.
Just another thought in regards to no no's for me and my gut problems is alcohol...
it just isn't worth the bathroom issues.....and this is long before any drug interactions made it a problem.
Just a thought OP.0 -
I don't have celiac disease or a "leaky gut" but I do have an autoimmune disease called eosinophillic esophagitis. My personal experience has been that removing gluten from my diet was a very good choice. My bloating has gone way, way down and I feel much better overall. Without the bloat I was suffering from I can breathe easier and work harder at the gym and during my runs. I'm not an expert and neither are the people who will tell you that you don't need to avoid gluten unless you've been diagnosed with crone's disease. Talk to your doctor about your symptoms and try it if you think it might work for you. It's actually extremely easy, most foods are gluten free. I don't miss bread very much and I've found a quinoa based pasta that I really like so I'm good with the small sacrifices I've had to make. Good luck!0
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